A Hysteria rework by someone who doesn't like Valkyr

[Aktriaz]

I've never been fond of the idea of true Invincibility (including invisibility) in a game like warframe. It leads to abuse of such abilities and later power nullification by enemies to enforce a standard of difficulty; though it becomes artificial and balanced only towards the most min-maxed of builds.

Just to set things straight, I'm not specifically trying to nerf Valkyr; just make her ult more... interactive.

Now I will start;

First, Hysteria will cost 50 energy and drain 1/sec while active. Hysteria will no longer block all damage. Instead, health will take damage normally, and go into negatives. She will not die as long as the ability is active. Additionally, Lifedrain from melee is increased to 15% and Valkyr gets 20% damage as energy (similar to Rage; which is stacks with).

Going into Negative Health will have advantages and disadvantages; Damage output will be increased by 1% per 1 health below 0. This means having -2500 health gives you +2500% damage. This also affects Lifedrain, meaning health is easier to regain the more damage you take, theoretically making Valkyr's damage scale infinitely with enemies. However, every 1 health below 0 increased energy drain by %2, therefore at -2500 health you will have an energy drain of 50/sec.

If Hysteria is dispelled or Valkyr runs out of energy while under 0 health, she is instantly downed.

The Damage Multiplier and Energy Drain increase is meant to fluctuate and change with the environment; fighting weaker enemies makes Hysteria less rewarding but easy to maintain, while facing high-level enemies Hysteria becomes a desperate struggle to take/avoid damage, and force you to be aggressive to survive, but is a higher risk/reward with stronger enemies.

------------------------

This is just my 2 cents on Valkyr. I haven't player since long before her current rework and I don't plan to return just because she got a pretty gold paint job. Invincibility is just a boring selling point to me, and there's more creative ways to cheese warframe's artificial difficulty.

Naturally, I could see this rework suggestion not working well because of leech eximuses and nullifiers basically being able to kill her instantly, but I'd like to think of a perfect warframe world where power nullification and energy leeching is no longer necessary; where warframe abilities and enemies are balanced enough as to not require such things. After all; the Devs HAVE said that nullifiers are a band-aid solution.

Anyway, this thread is just food for thought. If you like the idea, the that's great. If you think it wouldn't work in the game, I can't really argue with that in it's current state.

Have a good day.

[EyeLaikCheez]

Banshee profile icon - I can already feel the salt.

_{please don't kill me it's a joke}

Edited December 9, 2016 by EyeLaikCheez

[Glitch_Kitten]

This would be awful late game where enemies deal thousands of damage per shot, all her energy would be instantly gone and the bonuses you mentioned would never be useful.

 

Hysteria is fine as it is, it has a risk/reward factor and makes you feel like an indestructible berserker badass. Don't fix what ain't broke.

[(PSN)joshw1400]

3 minutes ago, EyeLaikCheez said:

Banshee profile icon - I can already feel the salt.

_{please don't kill me it's a joke}

Don't trigger them.

[Calwon5]

The idea is very interesting, wouldn't mind if hysteria were changed to this. Although a problem I would see with this, is I would imagine hysteria energy consumption is just going to end up being massive. "Shrug"
 

[Aktriaz]

4 minutes ago, EyeLaikCheez said:

Banshee profile icon - I can already feel the salt.

_{please don't kill me it's a joke}

It's okay; true Banshee players get used to the fact that the devs don't care about her.

[SenorClipClop]

5 minutes ago, Actriaz said:

First, Hysteria will cost 50 energy and drain 1/sec while active. Hysteria will no longer block all damage. Instead, health will take damage normally, and go into negatives. She will not die as long as the ability is active. Additionally, Lifedrain from melee is increased to 15% and Valkyr gets 20% damage as energy (similar to Rage; which is stacks with).

Going into Negative Health will have advantages and disadvantages; Damage output will be increased by 1% per 1 health below 0. This means having -2500 health gives you +2500% damage. This also affects Lifedrain, meaning health is easier to regain the more damage you take, theoretically making Valkyr's damage scale infinitely with enemies. However, every 1 health below 0 increased energy drain by %2, therefore at -2500 health you will have an energy drain of 50/sec.

If Hysteria is dispelled or Valkyr runs out of energy while under 0 health, she is instantly downed.

This an interesting idea, but I can see this immediately turning into Valkyr players gathering Energy, turning on the ult and standing there for several seconds in order to get maximum damage, then healing it all back. If they kill targets while only low in the negatives, there's no health left to steal, so this kind of tactic would definitely become a thing.

Valkyr is... difficult. It's hard designing a character to have any modicum of built-in invincibility, because if you tell players they can take 0 damage, many will try their damndest to ignore everything else and maximize that 0 damage business. Maybe Valkyr's ult should play with health more, maybe it should just reduce incoming damage. Who can say. I like the addition they made recently of ramping up Energy cost the longer Valkyr stays in ult, and at least this is lessening the number of players who try to stay in Hysteria constantly.

[Kalvorax]

23 minutes ago, Actriaz said:

Going into Negative Health will have advantages and disadvantages; Damage output will be increased by 1% per 1 health below 0. This means having -2500 health gives you +2500% damage. This also affects Lifedrain, meaning health is easier to regain the more damage you take, theoretically making Valkyr's damage scale infinitely with enemies. However, every 1 health below 0 increased energy drain by %2, therefore at -2500 health you will have an energy drain of 50/sec.

so your saying you valk has 99999 energy then? with her current energy pool your proposed 'change' would be useless....even with Rage....add a CAP of 10 energy lost per second and that is solved.

[Aktriaz]

1 minute ago, xcynderx said:

so your saying you valk has 99999 energy then? with her current energy pool your proposed 'change' would be useless....even with Rage....add a CAP of 10 energy lost per second and that is solved.

It's meant to be that way. Taking negative damage increase your energy consumption, which means you need to either take MORE damage to get more energy or lifedrain via melee to get to a safe amount of health (which would be easier to do with a higher damage multiplier).

Plus, are you taking into account Duration and Efficiency? That 50/sec CAN be reduced.

I did say going into negative health has advantages and disadvantages...

[Kalvorax]

16 hours ago, Actriaz said:

It's meant to be that way. Taking negative damage increase your energy consumption, which means you need to either take MORE damage to get more energy or lifedrain via melee to get to a safe amount of health (which would be easier to do with a higher damage multiplier).

Plus, are you taking into account Duration and Efficiency? That 50/sec CAN be reduced.

I did say going into negative health has advantages and disadvantages...

true...though a BASE 50/sec is ridiculously high...even something that has a 15 base (looking at banshee or mesa) still drains it like crazy with high duration and efficiency.

[Newnight]

On 12/9/2016 at 4:27 PM, Glitch_Kitten said:

This would be awful late game where enemies deal thousands of damage per shot, all her energy would be instantly gone and the bonuses you mentioned would never be useful.

 

Hysteria is fine as it is, it has a risk/reward factor and makes you feel like an indestructible berserker badass. Don't fix what ain't broke.

They kinda did break it with her last, "touch up".

[Magnar21]

Personally, I would prefer some kind of stacking damage reduction, instead of outright invincibility. Maybe make it so that each hit adds armor or damage reduction.

Outside of that, your idea is very similar to mine, save for one major thing: as it stands, Valkyr's drain is too damn high. Mesa, who also has a 15e/s drain, can kinda get away with this by being able to attack at range. Maximized, her drain is capped at 3.25/s, which is only really manageable by using peacemaker to clear a group and moving on. Not too bad with using Zenurik's passive and a hit-and-run playstyle. For Valkyr, this means that staying in Hysteria exclusively is really hard. You either need an escape method (Naramon Shadow Step, or a max range Paralysis) in order to refresh the duration, or just not rely on Hysteria. And while her armor rating is high as it is, it's not high enough to run sorties unless you're extremely good at melee Valkyr. (A few players in my Clan can go 1hr+ in MOT, I struggle past 45 min. My problem is i randomly get 1-shot and I'm not sure by what or why, despite running with more power str for Warcry than they do.)

Point is, is that capping at too high would mean you could be instantly drained of energy without a chance of recovery, particularly in Endurance missions (April Fools alert, i'm looking at you). Cap it between 15-20/s would likely be just fine, since you'd still be able to heal yourself back, and your rework keeps Rage and Lifestrike integrated.