Ryster66 Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 The amount of Tenno in this thread arguing is too high. We are one people, we should be respectful to our fellow Tenno. It is possible to have a debate without throwing hurtful words at each other. My opinions on your requests: 1. I don't see why not, as long as DE can handle the pressure of all of them in one chat, sure. 2. Well, I feel like this is just a way for you guys to work the system to help make dojo building faster, but in the end does it really matter to anyone? How does you guys finishing hallways faster affect me? It doesn't. So I don't see why everyone is hating so much on this. DE might want to make it fair and not let this happen, but maybe they could allow you guys to have more expensive building prices above the 1000 to make it fair. Not a big deal really though. 3. This one I disagree with. Say John starts a new clan and has a dream of being the very best. So he recruits and recruits and gets his clan to 1000 people. The next event comes that has a top clan prize. John convinces everyone in his clan to kill 100 units each. They all do that and think they are going to be the top. They look at leader boards and are shocked to be behind an alliance that has 2000 people in it where each person killed 75 units. The amount of effort John's clan would have to put in to beat such an alliance is far too much. Therefore John can never fulfill his dream since some Alliance that counts as a clan exists. It just doesn't make it fair for them, since he is unable to get any bigger of a clan. I mean they could do events that average the kills per member of the clan, but that might actually give the advantage to smaller clans. Just my thoughts, good luck on what ever happens. In the end, this is a game, so try and have fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdxdubin Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 The amount of Tenno in this thread arguing is too high. We are one people, we should be respectful to our fellow Tenno. It is possible to have a debate without throwing hurtful words at each other. My opinions on your requests: 1. I don't see why not, as long as DE can handle the pressure of all of them in one chat, sure. 2. Well, I feel like this is just a way for you guys to work the system to help make dojo building faster, but in the end does it really matter to anyone? How does you guys finishing hallways faster affect me? It doesn't. So I don't see why everyone is hating so much on this. DE might want to make it fair and not let this happen, but maybe they could allow you guys to have more expensive building prices above the 1000 to make it fair. Not a big deal really though. 3. This one I disagree with. Say John starts a new clan and has a dream of being the very best. So he recruits and recruits and gets his clan to 1000 people. The next event comes that has a top clan prize. John convinces everyone in his clan to kill 100 units each. They all do that and think they are going to be the top. They look at leader boards and are shocked to be behind an alliance that has 2000 people in it where each person killed 75 units. The amount of effort John's clan would have to put in to beat such an alliance is far too much. Therefore John can never fulfill his dream since some Alliance that counts as a clan exists. It just doesn't make it fair for them, since he is unable to get any bigger of a clan. I mean they could do events that average the kills per member of the clan, but that might actually give the advantage to smaller clans. Just my thoughts, good luck on what ever happens. In the end, this is a game, so try and have fun! Well I had an idea to remove the idea of beating a clan. Lets do a ranking system for event prizes So that every clan has the chance to earn things, and every member based on how many each clan kills. We should not be competing with each-other in events either :P Lets change that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryster66 Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) Well I had an idea to remove the idea of beating a clan. Lets do a ranking system for event prizes So that every clan has the chance to earn things, and every member based on how many each clan kills. We should not be competing with each-other in events either :P Lets change that Well, myself I wouldn't mind not having a "Top Clan" prize or something. But that is my opinion and I don't think a lot of community would agree with that. Some people do like the competition that events bring, and if they take away that, some people will get upset. I mean this even was both a "everyone work together" and a "prove you are a top clan" event which I think is a good idea. Gives me the small prize I wanted, and it gives others the rare prize they wanted. I don't know, but I think splitting a large clan into a few smaller clans is easier than reworking the events to be competition-less Edited July 10, 2013 by Ryster66 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdxdubin Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Well, myself I wouldn't mind not having a "Top Clan" prize or something. But that is my opinion and I don't think a lot of community would agree with that. Some people do like the competition that events bring, and if they take away that, some people will get upset. I mean this even was both a "everyone work together" and a "prove you are a top clan" event which I think is a good idea. Gives me the small prize I wanted, and it gives others the rare prize they wanted. I don't know, but I think splitting a large clan into a few smaller clans is easier than reworking the events to be competition-less We placed #2 I don't care about being a top clan. Just killling 1000's of stupid generic enemies does not prove anything. There are clans that are super artistic and do great things. Did they win the event? No. But that does not mean they are any better then other clans. DE's event system is separating perfectly good clans into categories for unappealing events. Who knows what there thinking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryster66 Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 We placed #2 I don't care about being a top clan. Just killling 1000's of stupid generic enemies does not prove anything. There are clans that are super artistic and do great things. Did they win the event? No. But that does not mean they are any better then other clans. DE's event system is separating perfectly good clans into categories for unappealing events. Who knows what there thinking I mean yea, all this is fine and dandy of an idea. I am not trying to say your idea on events is bad, but this doesn't deal with the fact that point 3 from the OP talks about making all of your alliance count as a clan for events. If that is for a competitive event like the most recent one, this point would make it unfair. If there was an event like one that you suggest, it would still be unfair since you have more people to complete the required kills for your clan. If the required kills is changed for you clan to be like this: 1000 players need 10000 kills 2000 players need 20000 kills etc... then there is no point in having one giant alliance that counts as a clan, when you can just have 2-3 clans that all complete the task at the 1000 player level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdxdubin Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 I mean yea, all this is fine and dandy of an idea. I am not trying to say your idea on events is bad, but this doesn't deal with the fact that point 3 from the OP talks about making all of your alliance count as a clan for events. If that is for a competitive event like the most recent one, this point would make it unfair. If there was an event like one that you suggest, it would still be unfair since you have more people to complete the required kills for your clan. If the required kills is changed for you clan to be like this: 1000 players need 10000 kills 2000 players need 20000 kills etc... then there is no point in having one giant alliance that counts as a clan, when you can just have 2-3 clans that all complete the task at the 1000 player level. Yea. It would be easier. We earned these members, and people joined our clan willingly. It should be easier for us. You could say the same, about a 1 person clan. Will it be easy for them? Nope. We have more members, and therefore it should be easier. it might sound cocky, But it really is not unfair. its not like our clan magically earned 4000 players. And thats why they can create event brackets. So that clans with 1000+ have to earn a set amount, If we have 4k players, good for us. Clans with 100 players only need to earn a 10th of that amount. And so on. It is a great fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdxdubin Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 I mean yea, all this is fine and dandy of an idea. I am not trying to say your idea on events is bad, but this doesn't deal with the fact that point 3 from the OP talks about making all of your alliance count as a clan for events. If that is for a competitive event like the most recent one, this point would make it unfair. If there was an event like one that you suggest, it would still be unfair since you have more people to complete the required kills for your clan. If the required kills is changed for you clan to be like this: 1000 players need 10000 kills 2000 players need 20000 kills etc... then there is no point in having one giant alliance that counts as a clan, when you can just have 2-3 clans that all complete the task at the 1000 player level. Oh Alliances should not be able to compete in events. Just remove events. And alliances are still a dumb idea in the first place. It should be an optional thing to let small clans band together to compete with the larger clans. not a thing to break down large clans so they can compete with small ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryster66 Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Oh Alliances should not be able to compete in events. Just remove events. And alliances are still a dumb idea in the first place. It should be an optional thing to let small clans band together to compete with the larger clans. not a thing to break down large clans so they can compete with small ones. Well what makes a clan small? 100 is small compared to 1000. 5 is small compared to 300. Can two 700 member clans team up to beat a 1000 member clan? Can GTC and Broframe team up and make an unstoppable force? There are just too many ifs in your proposition. It makes sense to just give a limit to how big clans can be so that it is fair for everyone. I mean 10k would be a fine limit as long as we have the technology, but we don't. That is one reason the bigger clans are getting broken up, because that amount of people in a chat really lags the chat server. The limit just happens to be set at 1000 which is a respectable size for a clan anyway. Just because it means breaking up a couple clans, meaning you guys, is just an unfortunate side effect. This is just a simple fix to a very important problem. And I feel that you guys are just trying to get out of it because you like knowing you have 4000 people and are a huge clan. If you are truly about having fun and being an enjoyable clan, you can still do that in the 4 clans that will be made, it won't feel any different because you still have a ton of people in the clan. 1000 people is nothing to scoff at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdxdubin Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Well what makes a clan small? 100 is small compared to 1000. 5 is small compared to 300. Can two 700 member clans team up to beat a 1000 member clan? Can GTC and Broframe team up and make an unstoppable force? There are just too many ifs in your proposition. It makes sense to just give a limit to how big clans can be so that it is fair for everyone. I mean 10k would be a fine limit as long as we have the technology, but we don't. That is one reason the bigger clans are getting broken up, because that amount of people in a chat really lags the chat server. The limit just happens to be set at 1000 which is a respectable size for a clan anyway. Just because it means breaking up a couple clans, meaning you guys, is just an unfortunate side effect. This is just a simple fix to a very important problem. And I feel that you guys are just trying to get out of it because you like knowing you have 4000 people and are a huge clan. If you are truly about having fun and being an enjoyable clan, you can still do that in the 4 clans that will be made, it won't feel any different because you still have a ton of people in the clan. 1000 people is nothing to scoff at. There will be no alliance chat. This thread is about things. They don't need to break up our clans because we are not lagging, and we are not getting any issues. Hardly. And cutting the clans is just a bandaid fix to ignore the inherent issues. Why not just fix the problems in the first place. This thread is about what these clans need to thrive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arthixxxx Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) ok and what happens if your demands will not happen oh mighty mega clan? ....I'm scurd Edited July 10, 2013 by arthixxxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdxdubin Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) ....I'm scurd We cant force anything, Hopefully DE realizes the people in large clans actually enjoy being there. If not We will adapt But it does not hurt to fight for a game you like. Even if they don't listen to us. If things do go to S#&$, like when rhino got nerfed. DE will realize that and fix the problem. *out of our hands* Edited July 10, 2013 by pdxdubin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venarge Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) There is a specific reason that our clans are so large. Its because were badass and we did the work to make these clans appealing to other people. Sorry but thats just awesomely wrong. You have many members because you are many. Its size is what makes people want to join. The numbers of people who are in it. Otherwise, all you mega clans wouldnt show the numbers in the find a clan thread. People see that. They say: Damn, so many people. I wanna join too. More people in the clan, next guy comes over, sees the people count of the clan, repeats the I wanna join. Its the size itself which is interesting. Nothing else. And as soon as they impliment the "whos online and for how long" thing, I would love to see what´s really left of those "communities" Edited July 10, 2013 by Venarge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notso Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 pdx you really are naive if you thought that most of your members joined for anything else than the clan tech weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatantfool Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 pdx you really are naive if you thought that most of your members joined for anything else than the clan tech weapons. I think it is just a tad unfair to say that. Some people could have joined purely for the numbers. There are people who do actually love the large group feeling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notso Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 I think it is just a tad unfair to say that. Some people could have joined purely for the numbers. There are people who do actually love the large group feeling. In which case it's a self fulfilling prophecy, isn't it? It's still not really due to to fantastic effort or leadership on his part, not nearly as much as he's claiming, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox-Meat Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Huh. Not like DE needs your 'support' if they wish to segment you anyway. Whatever you're gonna do, good luck with your clan I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nod_Off Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 In my opinion: 1. Very likely. 2. Unlikely. 3. I wouldn't bet on it. Same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eisvogel Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Sorry but thats just awesomely wrong. You have many members because you are many. Its size is what makes people want to join. The numbers of people who are in it. Otherwise, all you mega clans wouldnt show the numbers in the find a clan thread. People see that. They say: Damn, so many people. I wanna join too. More people in the clan, next guy comes over, sees the people count of the clan, repeats the I wanna join. Its the size itself which is interesting. Nothing else. And as soon as they impliment the "whos online and for how long" thing, I would love to see what´s really left of those "communities" Exactly what you say, even more so after Update 8.... that's when the bubble got popped and invites went out like crazy. It has nothing to do with some back-story that only a negligible percentage of people read. Mostly people just look at the size and join, no merit whatsoever to the leaders (not to imply they don't do things for their clan, *some* leaders do and put effort into making it better, but the most deciding factor is size). Before leaving pdxdubin in Asuro, i can guarantee that 99% of the members applying like crazy were just there for the numbers/dojo/etc. The activity in the site was negligible compared to clan size. It's not like members were attracted to our values or even had read anything in the thread, but it's not like that is an unknown fact.... we all know how it is, all clan leaders know that too. I am really looking forward to the segmentation. And it's not like the clans have a say on the matter, even if they want to act as if they had DE in their pockets or were some big-shots.... it's laughable really. Also, they knew this was coming.... we all did, if clans decided to keep overgrowing against the advices.... well, no reason to complain now is there? I can't even imagine what happens if you open clan tab in Broframe...... xD..... Back when Asuro was around 2k members..... the clan tab was already impossible..... people getting randomly dropped from the clan...... and we all made our jokes about the "Crash Tab" because if you opened the "Offline" group, your pc would just die...... most crashed... some could get by with ALT F4 ... :P, i can't imagine how is with 4k members or 6k or more.... xD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grayfigure Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Then we won't segment our clan, as simple as that. It's that or we don't segment. .....you do realize that you have NO control over whatever segmenting processes they have...right? and that if they decide to, they can just arbitrarily segment your clan into smaller ones, with absolutely NO input from you...right? and you DO realize that if they decide to go that route, all your complaints and demands are just noise in the wind.....right? Look, I get you want your clan to survive the coming changes and I can understand that. But trying to place some type of ultimatum on something you have NO control over is only going to cause you embarrassment down the road if they do go through with the changes. Best to try gathering enough support around sound ideas and present them to DE for their consideration.....understanding full well that if they decide not to go with your suggestions, its out of your hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sekshunate Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Its unrealistic to have that many people in a clan. Im in Under the Lotus and have been since it was essentially formed and now we have maybe 1k. Ive spoken with maybe 30 people in there. Just speaking to each idvidual member alone would be a full time job. Its breaking the system meant to hold us over as more content is released. As it was said before, we wont have a choice anyways. Whether it is liked or not, it will happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seraphyx Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) Its unrealistic to have that many people in a clan. Im in Under the Lotus and have been since it was essentially formed and now we have maybe 1k. Ive spoken with maybe 30 people in there. Just speaking to each idvidual member alone would be a full time job. Its breaking the system meant to hold us over as more content is released. As it was said before, we wont have a choice anyways. Whether it is liked or not, it will happen. Agree with you. Honestly I don't even know why they are keeping clan sizes so large still (up to 1000). Right now the only thing these massive clans are is a glorified general chat tab and a way to get any clan benefits almost instantly, including future features. I doubt there's any organization or cohesion or anything valuable in having a clan that large apart from rushing through all of the clan content and any future content. ------------------ The fact that they allowed unlimited sizes for clans is pretty insane (in a bad way). They should have added a cap immediately and increased it if necessary because now everyone in one of these clans are going to feel like they've somehow been screwed. Even a 500 limit on clans would be excessive... In my opinion right now there's no reason to even need more than around 100 members for Warframe, what do the 900 other members get you aside from a probably impossible clan to manage? Nothing. There is nothing in Warframe that requires 900 people. There is nothing in Warframe that requires 100 people but that gives you enough room to have a diverse amount of people from different timezones all playing together and communicating. Edited July 10, 2013 by Seraphyx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weezedog Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 An alliance is a group of clans, and as such, a group of clans cannot be recognized as 1. It would be like having a group of people, but instead of recognizing them as individuals, you recognize them as a single person. Tell that to the Borg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatantfool Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Tell that to the Borg Or the Cybermen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seraphyx Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) Or the Cybermen. Daleks > Cybermen http://youtu.be/bX39RDxA9dM?t=1m58s Edited July 10, 2013 by Seraphyx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Law_Abiding_Engineer Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) my face when reading the OP's arguement about "having power and influence" For claiming that he will not split his clan (even though it will eventually happen, whether he likes it or not) For claiming that talking to all members, atleast one time, means that he knows them And for anything else that I left out Edited July 10, 2013 by Law_Abiding_Engineer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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