Can we please stop this thought that Mirage is the only thing that makes Synoid Simulor OP?

[Magneu]

On 3/2/2017 at 8:38 PM, ChuckMaverick said:

While the SynSimulor is definitely a very powerful weapon, in the hands of any frame besides Mirage it's merely top-tier, not massively overpowered.

It has limited range (12m travel + 11m blast radius), so you're not killing anything more than 23m from you.

It does no damage on the first shot (unless Mirage), which is actually a big deal if you're moving fast as orbs may not merge at all.

Unless you mod for punch-through, getting quick shots off in close quarters can be tricky if orbs bounce off mobs in different directions.

If it didn't have visual and audio effects that seem to annoy a large number of players, and an amazing synergy with Mirage, you probably wouldn't see anywhere near the number of complaints about it.

True, its synergy with Mirage is the primary reasons it's been popping up in threads so much. However, it still does top-tier damage/CC/energy restore in the largest radius of explosive weapons with practically no effort. Even reducing the merge-damage range to 7-9 meters, or the attraction range of orbs to a smaller amount (necessitating actually aiming near enemies) would be enough to balance it. Hell, even make it so you have to detonate orbs to put more out, that would put a soft cap on spamming (give it a guaranteed electric proc on detonation or something).

That, and for the love of god, reduce the audio/visual FX. Absolutely blinding to play with someone abusing the weapon. 

[Mousarchy]

and here i am with my mirage who likes to shoot her supra in 3 different directions e.e while its cool in low lvl def (being able to shoot down 2 hallways at once) its annoying past that because half my extra shots have a mind of there own e.e

 

[SDGDen]

the thing that is problematic is clone balls merging with normal balls on mirage, and taking on the merge damage of the normal balls, essentially removing the damage cap on the clones which was put there for balance reasons. fix? clone balls no longer merge with normal balls.

 

there isnt realy any way to nerf mirage HoM spam builds without completely removing hall of mirrors. its a bit of a loki situation. its definitely to good, but there is no real way to nerf directly other than just completely reworking/removing it. not to mention the amount of fanboys that will get triggered from such an action..... remember when people used to say that ash bladestorm needed a nerf? once bladestorm got its well deserved nerf. people complained it wasnt p4tw cheese anymore.... same would happen if DE removed hall of mirrors.

[pfoo]

I'm still not understanding the whole "please nerf this as I don't like it" thing.

You need to remember that everyone can build mirage and synoid simulor. If you don't like it, don't use it, but why should you prevent others people from using it ?

The synoid simulor itself is not THE most powerfull weapon. I recently did a Pacifism Defect mission (without mirage) and at some point, I regreted choosing synoid simulor instead of my vaykor hek when I started struggeling with a lots of high level eximus.

Mirage is also one of the lowest health/shield/armor frame. This means move a lot or die. And this require effort, it is nothing like "press 4 to win". Even with the simulor.

To finish with the mirage-simulor case : are you really seeing a lots of them in the game ? I'm not. On both high and low level missions. Maybe there is a reason why most of people are using others guns or frame-gun combo than mirage-simulor.
I'm seeing a lots of ember, frost and nova, maybe they are overpowered and needs a nerf too ?

Let's consider others frame :
* Ember spamming World On Fire with Firequake : perfect for AFKing on defenses missions (and THAT is no effort), but also in others missions type, running around the map doing nothing else. Does it need nerfing ? Nope.
* Banshee spamming Sound Quake (+- Resonating Quake) in defense/mobile def/excavation/interception. Does it needs nerfing ? Nope, apart from some cheaters which are managing to have nearly infinite energy despite a range covering the whole map (even in very large interception map like Pluto/Cerberus).
* Frost spamming their Snow Globe everywhere, making nearly all missions a lot easier ? That is an over-abused frame and power. Does it need nerfing ? Nope.
* Valkyr with Galatine Prime + Berserker + Warcry + eternal war : one of my latest discovery. I think it might be "asked for a nerf" soon.

Launching mission with random people will always be risky for YOUR gameplay type. What about people complaining because there is a slow-nova spamming mprime (making the mission longuer), or a speed-nova (making the mission way quicker but harder) ? Should we nerf nova because you can't play the way you want because of nova ? And I see way more nova than mirage ...

[(XBOX)CannyJack]

With Mirage + Simulor (well, Synoid Simulor at least), isn't it more like "Press 1 to win?" The ones you mention are their 3rd or 4th power; Hall of Mirrors (which is the problem synergy with Simulor) is her 1. Plus, isn't Mirage built for high-speed movement anyway (I don't have her)? 

Of course, they'll either change the weapon and/or the frame, or they'll ignore the whole situation, but it's not quite an apples-to-apples comparison as far as Ember, Frost, and Banshee go in terms of "from the start" capability. 

Edited March 8, 2017 by (XB1)CannyJack

[pfoo]

It's her 1, but I always found it quite useless when mirage is low level (only 1 hologram, duration is bad, ...). Her 2 and 4 are quite useless, and you cannot really count on her 3 due to light inconsistencies and how warframe is built.

That being said, Mirage is an end game frame, not one you should play at level 5 unformated without reactor. Same for Synoid Simulor that need to be formated before being really powerfull. At this level, I don't think there is any more place for "is here 1 supposed to be weaker than her 4 ?" debate.

Mirage is weak but fast (not the fastest, still). But her lack of buffer (quick thinking saves me a lot when I use mirage) makes her a not easy frame to play with, even with simulor.

Should DE consider making hall of mirror her 4 ? Maybe. But remember this ability only works well with a few weapons. This is another weak point of mirage in term of gameplay : you are limited to a few weapons if you want to be effective. If some see this as a strength, I see this as a weakness.

I did not want to compare mirage with ember, frost or nova. I'm just not understanding why all the hatred is focused on a warframe+gun combo that I don't see often in-game. The OP warframes and weapons might not be the one haters are pointing, but the ones they are using every day.

Edited March 8, 2017 by pfoo

[darksithis002]

They're both fine, no need for nerfs at all. Let's get some nerfs on the community calling nerfs!

[(XBOX)CannyJack]

1 hour ago, pfoo said:

I did not want to compare mirage with ember, frost or nova. I'm just not understanding why all the hatred is focused on a warframe+gun combo that I don't see often in-game. The OP warframes and weapons might not be the one haters are pointing, but the ones they are using every day.

It may be the frequency of seeing it. I pretty much play Warframe solo or public matchmaking, and in pubs I see Mirage + Simulor very, very frequently - probably around 1 in 4 missions has one; it's gotten to the point where my wife - who does not play Warframe - will notice and "Oh look, another Mirage with a simulor."

Not as much as I see Frost, certainly, but probably about as frequent as Ember. It's pretty frustrating that around a quarter of my playtime is looking foolish as I try to squeeze in a kill past the lightspeed Mirage player.

(Note: I acknowledge that when you pub, you take what you can get - what I can get often seems to be Miragulor). 

Edited March 8, 2017 by (XB1)CannyJack

[Magneu]

8 hours ago, pfoo said:

 

I'm still not understanding the whole "please nerf this as I don't like it" thing.

 

This alone explains why you don't understand.