Warframe difficulty

[Vapya]

So I wanted to have a talk about warframe difficulty and scaling. 

As we know a load of people just cheese all missions and them complain that game is too easy. Now telling them to restrict their power will be wrong because whats the point then? The answee is definitely not throwing a load of napalms or nullies. And absolutely not "just go over hour on mot". 

My solution would be to throw one hard enemy that requires SKILL to kill. Lets say something like new enemy like big butcher that needs to be parried (yes that exists)  or timely dodged then striked for massive damage or i can throw away dodging and just put a load of bullets into him. Imagine if Lt. Kril wasn't invulnerable just had a load of resistance while in 1st stage. 

What do you guys think? Do you agree? Disagree? Have any other idea? I won't bite but please keep toxicity to a minium. 

Sorry for bad English and have a nice day 

[Sziklamester]

10 minutes ago, Vapya said:

So I wanted to have a talk about warframe difficulty and scaling. 

As we know a load of people just cheese all missions and them complain that game is too easy. Now telling them to restrict their power will be wrong because whats the point then? The answee is definitely not throwing a load of napalms or nullies. And absolutely not "just go over hour on mot". 

My solution would be to throw one hard enemy that requires SKILL to kill. Lets say something like new enemy like big butcher that needs to be parried (yes that exists)  or timely dodged then striked for massive damage or i can throw away dodging and just put a load of bullets into him. Imagine if Lt. Kril wasn't invulnerable just had a load of resistance while in 1st stage. 

What do you guys think? Do you agree? Disagree? Have any other idea? I won't bite but please keep toxicity to a minium. 

Sorry for bad English and have a nice day 

That is what you suggests is a miniboss per mission. If in a mission there are 1 high ranked player and for say 3 newbie then you ruin the 3 newbies and probably the one high rankeds game because alone he cannot deal with that enemy and by nature the lower geared players cannot deal with it.

Much better to ask a tiered system or just a difficulty level changing option which works in every non coop games but in coop games also work a easy-normal-hard-insane level mode. Surprisignly in warframe there is no any similar here have levels behind maps and unbalanced scaling on endless missions. The skill what you say is subjective what you count as skill? Killing an enemy with gear only or with smart ability use? In this game the skill has different meaning and it is not a darksoul like game and it shouldn't be that. There are games which can achieve the insane moments for those whom are hardcores and wanting a hard level content. In warframe this is currently the endless missions and sorties other higher levels will be implemented in time.

 

Edited May 4, 2017 by Sziklamester

[Hemmo67]

yes plox :c

[Vapya]

1 minute ago, Sziklamester said:

If in a mission there are 1 high ranked player and for say 3 newbie then you ruin the 3 newbies and probably the one high rankeds game because alone he cannot deal with that enemy and by nature the lowe geared players cannot deal with it.

Maybe scale enemy to node lvl? Im not suggesting enemy thay can kill us easily. Im suggesting enemy that is tougher to kill if just mindlessly shooting him with god tier weapons. And tutorial for explaining minibosses and mechanic behind killing them would be good. 

 

4 minutes ago, Sziklamester said:

The skill what you say is subjective what you count as skill? Killing an enemy with gear only or with smart ability use?

Little bit of everything so players are not screwed because of their playstyle. For example lets take giant butcher from my post. If you play melee you parry him and the counter. If you play shotter you roll to evade then when he is out of ballance riddle him with bullets. 

[Volinus7]

Nah everything is interconnected, if you want to change the game from horde mode to skill based you have to overhaul the whole game.

[Vapya]

16 minutes ago, Volinus7 said:

Nah everything is interconnected, if you want to change the game from horde mode to skill based you have to overhaul the whole game.

I see what are you saying. But I think that total overhaul will not be needed if if we throw few of these "skill-based" enemies. The whole point of this thread is to see what alternatives can players create to change now a days just throw a bunch of lvl 100 bombards that can rip a new A-hole on squshier frames or are just a nuisance on tankier frames. 

But still

Thanks for the feedback

[Heckzu]

We need more enemies like Lephantus who is only in vulnerable on certain spots when attacking.

[Volinus7]

1 hour ago, Vapya said:

I see what are you saying. But I think that total overhaul will not be needed if if we throw few of these "skill-based" enemies. The whole point of this thread is to see what alternatives can players create to change now a days just throw a bunch of lvl 100 bombards that can rip a new A-hole on squshier frames or are just a nuisance on tankier frames. 

But still

Thanks for the feedback

The main obstacles are abilities that can defense/turn enemies into vegetables indefinitely or immediately ohko them by ultra high multipliers which keep enemies from being relevant or skill based.

Is this skill based enemy supposed to normalize the differences between all frames to create balance? Impervious to all abilities? Even so, people would still complain about the difference in hp shield and armor between each frame.

 

Timing is the epitome of challenge but it got crippled by Internet connection, playing a game that requires you to make 0.5s iframe dodge with 600+ unstable ping is literally....hellish....

The only suitable choice left is real time tactics like positioning or troop management. Again AIs are dumb and procedurally generated stages are not up to the task, it's not like when you play chess against a computer. Hand crafted stages are needed, still have to fix cheesing though.

Edited May 4, 2017 by Volinus7

[SeaUrchins]

I think it was designed not to be challenging, to attract more players. The less skill-spec it is, the more players can play it and spend money on it, just to show their friends the "2EZ" videos of how they pwn enemies that often can't even fight back.

[Sziklamester]

7 hours ago, Heckzu said:

We need more enemies like Lephantus who is only in vulnerable on certain spots when attacking.

This supposed to be added with the weak spot system.

[Kusungphak]

Juggernaut is one example.. Covert legality and fatal teleport vulnerability was removed. Quite hard to take down if you don't have a limbo or an Hysteria Valkyr.

But considering we have so many Warframes which have so many skills ranging from complete disable, time freeze and invulnerability there will always be a way to easily defeat enemies. As a new player, the trials are always a challenge with the environment being more of a hazard and you need to work as a team to succeed. Ofcourse the main enemy in trails is the Lag 

I would really like to have more trails. LOR and JV are nice but I really would like to have more. Maybe a trail which can take even 16 players and ways to host it on a server like PVP. Can have a clan server which hosts these with good rewards and complicated challenges. 

[DarthKadra]

I agree that we need more enemies with mechanics, like the juggernaut. And DE should move away from complete invulnerability, I understand it's easier to implement and is more exploit-proof so to speak, but it's kinda lame, so I like the idea of high resistances. I'd like to have a couple of such enemies per faction with different vulnerabilities, not only the right spot and moment to shoot, but specific damage types, so that you wouldn't always be able to defeat them easily because you don't have the right damage on this loadout.