Ask For Ash First Skill (Replace Or Supplement "shuriken")

[Ganwybas]

Hello to everyone.

 

I love Ash,I love to play it,and this is my favorite character in the game.

 

But, unfortunately as you all know, Ash has trouble with his abilities.

 

Simply put,he's probably the only Frame useless in a team game.

When removed the full invisibility,the case is even more aggravated.

 

But the theme is not to complain and blame everyone.

I want to offer a solution.

 

Under the order. So Ash - Frame for destruction of the strengths of single targets.

And judging by the description Frame for the secretive game and killing without noise.

-But unfortunately Ash does not have the skills to do this.

 

-Therefore, I propose to replace or Supplement the ability  "shuriken ( because entered tools replace this skill) with  ability  "critical strike and give to this ability  following characteristics.

force of blow - 1500 (hit only 1 target) (ignore armor)

attack distance - close range (weapon swing)

the price of energy - 30 

when attack coming from the back - purpose receives 3000 (plus 30% crit chance to 6000) damage.

Animation- instantly

rollback -4 seconds

(for comparison, Excalibur , Sarina and such hit multiple targets , causing a total of about 3000 damage each time)

 

Figures may seem exaggerated,but if you have Fragor or Gramm ,you may well notice a strong crits from guns in 6000-9000 thousand depending on the strength of improvement,and even without damaging to all ,stacking bosses for a couple of strokes,so do not rush to judge.

 

Besides Ash will be able to perform a task quickly remedied strong armoured targets,and to be successful the attacker on the bosses.

Edited July 17, 2013 by JDante

[xBrend]

umm thats skill is way too overpowered for example loki has no damaging skills yet we are still useful to the team and for a first ability that is insane basically 6k damage... wayy too strong and it ignores armor too...

[Ganwybas]

umm thats skill is way too overpowered for example loki has no damaging skills yet we are still useful to the team and for a first ability that is insane basically 6k damage... wayy too strong and it ignores armor too...

30% chanse on 4 level skill, for ich strike .. almost 1 of 3 ..not so big

DPS from this is not overpowered compare to others warframe skill.

 

Loki have tactical skills,and very effective distract abilities. 

[YourFriendlyNoggin]

Basically what sounded balanced in your head didn't pan out as well as you thought in writing. Although the idea of it being a close range attack is interesting, we don't have many of those and it wold fit with the idea of his abilities; melee buff invis, teleport and even the in your face ultimate.

[Gwaiyn]

i am actually ok with this change, as long as it doesn't affect bosses

 

i used to have an ash, at that time i thought that 20 damage per shot was good and 100 damage was godsend, and then i got nova, raised excalibur's slash dash and started using despair, then, suddenly, i realized ash's awsome 100 damage single target attack seemed so pathetic and miniscule that i cringe every time i remember thinking that was actually good

 

so, in a nutshell, i do agree that ash should be reworked into some kind of single target assassin character that's capable of at least one-shotting heavies one at a time

[Numot]

Please leave shuriken alone, its a great skill as it is.

 

i am actually ok with this change, as long as it doesn't affect bosses

 

i used to have an ash, at that time i thought that 20 damage per shot was good and 100 damage was godsend, and then i got nova, raised excalibur's slash dash and started using despair, then, suddenly, i realized ash's awsome 100 damage single target attack seemed so pathetic and miniscule that i cringe every time i remember thinking that was actually good

 

so, in a nutshell, i do agree that ash should be reworked into some kind of single target assassin character that's capable of at least one-shotting heavies one at a time

You do know that maxed it's 500 damage to 2 targets or 1000 to just one with the ability to score headshots, and ignores armor?

[Gwaiyn]

Please leave shuriken alone, its a great skill as it is.

 

You do know that maxed it's 500 damage to 2 targets or 1000 to just one with the ability to score headshots, and ignores armor?

i know, it's still not as good as, say, excalibur's slash that does 500 damage to ANYTHING it hits, and 3x damage to infested

 

the first part alone makes slash dash better in most situations

[Boomstick720]

Slash dash is one of the best 1st abilities in the game.  However, pretty much all of excal's other abilites are kind of S#&$e, so its not like he is OP by any stretch of the imagination.

 

And just because excalibur is a better tank than ash does not mean he is a better warframe.

[Numot]

i know, it's still not as good as, say, excalibur's slash that does 500 damage to ANYTHING it hits, and 3x damage to infested

 

the first part alone makes slash dash better in most situations

 

Shuriken does do 500 damage to targets (yes any target, because of armor ignore), with triple damage to light infested. Slash dash is a melee ability. Shuriken is a ranged skill that supplements gun-play and picks off distant targets. They are different skills with different purposes, that give each frame a unique style of play.

[Ithloniel]

I always wondered why the ability was called 'Shuriken' when Shurikens aren't actually ranged weapons for killing (like Kunai), but usually served as a means of distraction in combat.  They were also used as traps kind of like caltrops.  Lastly, they were primarily a stealth weapon that could be coated with poison, hidden, and used to attack someone before they knew what hit them (maybe they'd never know until they found the cut).

 

Shuriken, as a name, suggests a stealthy ability with utility.  Instead, we have a power that appears to be a rip-off of both the Glaive and Kunai/Despair.  This just strikes me as silly.  Shuriken should be utility first, damage second.

[Numot]

I always wondered why the ability was called 'Shuriken' when Shurikens aren't actually ranged weapons for killing (like Kunai), but usually served as a means of distraction in combat.  They were also used as traps kind of like caltrops.  Lastly, they were primarily a stealth weapon that could be coated with poison, hidden, and used to attack someone before they knew what hit them (maybe they'd never know until they found the cut).

 

Shuriken, as a name, suggests a stealthy ability with utility.  Instead, we have a power that appears to be a rip-off of both the Glaive and Kunai/Despair.  This just strikes me as silly.  Shuriken should be utility first, damage second.

Ash is based off of pop-culture ninjas, not historical. It already has utility in the fact that it causes stagger to what doesn't die to it.

[lautalocos]

i think the ability that needs the most rework would be teleport. it should make you appear behind the enemie, or make an automatic stealth attack even if the enemie detected you.

if bladestorm isn´t silent, it should be. i haven´t tested it yet, so no idea.

 

 

personally, i think that it´s complete crap at teamwork, but it´s a quite good solo warframe.

[IvanLucifer]

I personally prefer Ash over most warframe's for offensive endeavors. I've actually been useful in team play thanks to Shuriken and Blade Storm. Shuriken lets me whittle off health off bosses and only two shots takes out most heavies with it. Blade Storm Will help me clear a room and saves my teammates from using up so much ammo. Teleport is good for getting in and out of situations. Having Ash modded to your play style is important. However he is not a warframe for everyone.

[Ithloniel]

Ash is based off of pop-culture ninjas, not historical. It already has utility in the fact that it causes stagger to what doesn't die to it.

 

I just don't feel that is enough to warrant it's usefulness.  Weapons stagger too, but they, at least, don't cost energy.

 

Also, 9/10 Smoke Screen will stagger better than Shuriken: you don't have to aim it, it is AoE, and it's radius can be expanded very well with mods.

I fully agree that Teleport is a bit flawed at the moment.  The skill was meant to get you into the fray, but instead it just leaves you in the open, unless combined with Smoke Screen, which can really drain your energy when used together.

[ADDpillz]

shuriken is fine

[nYnxoxo]

imo. Shuriken is fine as it is, its a very spamable damage source, its Auto targeting and will most of the time hit and kill. The only thing that I can complain about is, "Deals Headshot damage"... well yea, maybe im dumb, but since its target finding, I cannot "aim" so it will just hit on the body.

 

Also I agree with Teleport, the only time its "effective" is to revive a fallen teammate when hes nearly dead, but even then, running would be faster because of the animation that gets you stucked. Maybe a solution would be to be invulnerable or invisible at the time of teleporting + its animation, and stagger the enemy on arrival so that it stagger him for 1-2 seconds to actually use "Smoke screen" or get a charged attack on him.

[Firetailwolf]

The power is just like NYX but how are you supost to get rid of sentinels easily??? BAM!!! Shuriken!!!!!

[Ganwybas]

I can state more simply. Ability Asha cannot compete with the abilities of other frames.

Why? Compare everyone's favorite - shuriken
Affects 2 targets at a distance of a maximum 600 points of damage,costs 25
Two stars can't hit 1 target together ( check) just flies away in the other direction.
4 skill - Yes beautiful ,attractive but not effective.

Why?

Yes guys well for the same time, the same Excalibur, Reno, Banshee will destroy the crowd mobs in milliseconds.
They can stop the enemy,to restrain it

And The Ashes? Have you tried 4 skill on mobs especially the ancient,the defence or mission? Ashes spends 100 points energy ,damaging 7-10 enemies BUT NOT KILLING THEM
and at the price of 15 seconds on average.
At this time he is not answerable to us.

to finish off the shuriken?, but why if there is despair з asterisk or кунаи Why waste energyз Which now lacks even with modifications.

Know where I'm going?

Ash has 2 skills to attack
Ultimately are not effective for the destruction of multiple targets. But in the destruction of strong armoured targets. The Ashes there is no main, cheap and effective skills as other frames.

here is simply damage without impairments ,without slowing down ,or something else, there is no tactical advantages .


Now imagine if the Ashes give this ability?
For a series of such super strikes simply do not have enough energy. That eats баланс.

 

average ash 300 energy / cost of 30 = 10 possible strikes ( but who will spend all the energy? )

Will likely be available for about 250 - for smart Al 2 without skills and perhaps teleport into the melee does not enter. Now we have in stock in a combat situation 250 energy,

you should ideally hit from the back,but always it won't happen therefore 50% of the available shock will go just the main damage.

So 250/30 = 8 available shock. 4 of them to 1500 damage , 4 shots in the back, of which 1.5 blow give 6000 damage (30% crit chance) and 3.5 for the 3000.

As you might imagine, this is not OP. But good will kill ancient and others.
But put a couple of dangerous ancient ,or armored robot AND do it effectively he can.

[Ganwybas]

sorry for baaad english,but i tried :3

[ASH_PRIME]

You want to get rid of Ashs BEST offensive move?

NO THANKS!  -1

If its weak at end content [which it is] then SCALE Its dmg please DE [along with everyone else :)]

 

[Ganwybas]

You want to get rid of Ashs BEST offensive move?

NO THANKS!  -1

If its weak at end content [which it is] then SCALE Its dmg please DE [along with everyone else :)]

 

so why not add this mod to?) for choise

[Soaron]

I always wondered why the ability was called 'Shuriken' when Shurikens aren't actually ranged weapons for killing (like Kunai), but usually served as a means of distraction in combat.  They were also used as traps kind of like caltrops.  Lastly, they were primarily a stealth weapon that could be coated with poison, hidden, and used to attack someone before they knew what hit them (maybe they'd never know until they found the cut).

 

Finally someone with some historical perspective. It's funny to hear people fantasize about Ash being a true ninja when all we are seeing here are Fantasy/Sci-Fi characters based on all our entertainment archetypes of ninjutsu; all of which are not real (not sayint they are not awesome, though :D). Naruto is not real ninjutsu, nor is Warframe - yeah they get a lot of inspiration from it, but if you did some research, you'd probably find real ninjutsu to not be glamorous or that "exciting" at all.

 

On this note though, I can totally understand why you would not like this ability. Maybe you are expecting something very powerful, or something more to your own personal liking; but that's not how this game works. Almost every Warframe has a weak, kinda useless ability. For example, I Forma'd over my Excalibur's Super Jump and Slash Dash slot, mainly because I found myself never using those abilities in combat. All I needed was Radial Blind to stop enemies, and Radial Javelin. I own an Ash now and I think the one ability I probably will never use is the Teleport to Melee attack thing, but I haven't tried it yet extensively - If it fits my playing style I'll use it, if it doesn't I just Forma or pay the extra price for slots.

 

Here's the thing, not a single Warframe is going to be perfect. If you are personally attached to Ash and want him to be perfect because you have some "true ninja" fetish then it's your fault - not the designers. I've found myself using more of these weaker projectile powers like Ember's fire ball and Ash's shuriken for one reason only: Cause it's FUN! It's fun to throw stuff around that is not part of the general arsenal, and I think using abilities give more XP? (not sure on this one).  And armor-ignoring? Dude, max that out, and use it around paired with the mods that increase the power of your abilities and boom. What is there not to like?

[cheukyi6]

Don't you ever touch Shuriken. It seeks out enemies itself, it hurts, it is very long ranged, it is one of the most useful damaging skills as it ignores armour. Don't use this ability if you do not know how to use. Stop requesting for changes just because of your own ignorance, instead I think you should learn how to properly use Shuriken.

[MasterBacon]

I will also point out given the correct mods you can throw about twenty to thirty shuriken in a row.

[bigbluestage]

can they atleast give you better weapons if there going to **** me...