Forma Alert = Too Freaking Ridiculous.

[Rykazz]

I feel that DE has listened too hard to the hardcore shooter community and not enough to the casual community.  This alert nearly crashed my system with the amount of mobs.  How can you call an alert, in good conscience, a reward for the live-stream when it is so difficult that I fail six times.  Until update 9, I had few and reasonable issues with game play.  I would like to see the video of four designers do this alert with excalabers equipped with mk1-bratons, lato, and shana at level 30 with no reactors and catalysts.  I feel that this is a slap in the face.  "Here, thank you for watching the live-stream.  Your reward is a super hard alert."  This is how games loose players by the droves.  Six fails= too hard.

 

Rykazz

[Trylobyte]

I'd wish I used an XP Booster on that mission.  By the time my PUG finally got through it I'd racked up 39K Warframe XP (not doubled) and over 450 personal kills from hosting a Banshee dubstep dance party.  Sure if you're extremely good and have the right frame for the job you can get through it fairly easily, but the newish players I was with?  Not so much.  And ancient disruptors are a terror now - I don't know if it's because of stealth buffs or their new model/animations not lining up right, but they seem to hit me a LOT more than they used to - I've even been hit by ones that were knocked down halfway across the room.  Very, very frustrating all told.

[darksolgamer]

It wasn't bad at all, I had more than enough energy lying around to spam Bastille with my Vauban and just smack everything with Hate.

[Un1ted]

It seems that DE has decided to listen to the hardcores and elitists and develop the game away from solo players and casuals. As a primarily solo player, guess i won't stay long.

 +1

[FateZero]

I feel that DE has listened too hard to the hardcore shooter community and not enough to the casual community.  This alert nearly crashed my system with the amount of mobs.  How can you call an alert, in good conscience, a reward for the live-stream when it is so difficult that I fail six times.  Until update 9, I had few and reasonable issues with game play.  I would like to see the video of four designers do this alert with excalabers equipped with mk1-bratons, lato, and shana at level 30 with no reactors and catalysts.  I feel that this is a slap in the face.  "Here, thank you for watching the live-stream.  Your reward is a super hard alert."  This is how games loose players by the droves.  Six fails= too hard.

 

Rykazz

Why would you be using starting gear in the alert? Your argument is invalid also it's Saturn this isn't close to the harder areas.

Madotsuki, on 17 Jul 2013 - 7:21 PM, said:

It seems that DE has decided to listen to the hardcores and elitists and develop the game away from solo players and casuals. As a primarily solo player, guess i won't stay long.

If everything were soloable especially defense missions, what would be the point of this game? This is meant to be a co-op pve game, not some single player game to roflstomp through everything.

Edited July 18, 2013 by FateZero

[liavalenth]

Why would you be using starting gear in the alert? Your argument is invalid also it's Saturn this isn't close to the harder areas.

Because for multiple people that is all they have. That said Mags and Lokis should also be considered because they are choices to start with. I think that this is completely possible with 2 Mags, a Loki, and an Excal with un-potatoed starter equipment. Would be interesting to try.

[Kaidinah]

Did this alert with two new players (literally, my friend JUST logged on for the first time ever 5 minutes before) and a lagged up connection. What you mean it was too crazy?

[Trylobyte]

Why would you be using starting gear in the alert? Your argument is invalid also it's Saturn this isn't close to the harder areas.

1)  Saturn used to be a starter-level area and was buffed to mid-levels only with the most recent update, so a lot of newer players will have the alert system unlocked.

 

2)  The alert itself has mobs on a level you wouldn't normally see until Sedna/Europa/Eris, which is almost double the levels you'd normally see in the mission the alert is tied to.

[MotherCorpus]

We did it with 3 ash's (all wearing different helmets too :P) and 1 loki. It felt like a murder fest 'cause we had enough energy orbs.

[fishworshipper]

I feel that DE has listened too hard to the hardcore shooter community and not enough to the casual community.  This alert nearly crashed my system with the amount of mobs.  How can you call an alert, in good conscience, a reward for the live-stream when it is so difficult that I fail six times.  Until update 9, I had few and reasonable issues with game play.  I would like to see the video of four designers do this alert with excalabers equipped with mk1-bratons, lato, and shana at level 30 with no reactors and catalysts.  I feel that this is a slap in the face.  "Here, thank you for watching the live-stream.  Your reward is a super hard alert."  This is how games loose players by the droves.  Six fails= too hard.

 

Rykazz

How you failed after 6 tries is beyond me. Were you wading in there without a gun, melee weapon on an unranked Loki or what?

[r0ckwolf]

??? just ran the alert on my crapy laptop without any lags, with a lvl23 rhino (only 1x forma), with 2 low level weapons. This Thread is pointless!

 

Edit: And i was in there Solo!!! If anything you should be complaining about that this game is still way too fraking EASY!!!! 

Edited July 18, 2013 by r0ckwolf

[Frostmire]

Find it hard ? 

 

GET YOUR FRIENDS

 

YOUR CLANMATES

 

THAT GUY WHO STALKS YOU ON REGION CHAT 

 

.... to help you 

 

 

I think some people are uncapable of doing anything but complaining 

[N4F4N]

Vauban worked great for that alert. Had no problems.

[Rykazz]

Hey Frostmire,

 

I got an idea.  How about you do it with me?

 

Rykazz

[Ivonniva]

Just a question but, at what difficulty were you all at?

[gaurdianaq]

did it with myself as rhino and my friend as loki, although i could have probably just done it myself

[Boondorl]

It's funny how so many people think all players must have a Nyx/Rhino/Loki at their disposal.

Come on, the livestream alert is essentially there to celebrate the livestream and give players a little gift, yet now with the all-around level increase, a SATURN alert has enemies with level 40 swarming en masse, which includes Toxic Ancients and Disruptors. How are new players supposed to do the alert without leeching off of veterans with master race frames or near maxed gear? What about soloers who don't have one of the defense master race frames?

It seems that DE has decided to listen to the hardcores and elitists and develop the game away from solo players and casuals. As a primarily solo player, guess i won't stay long.

 

Or you could suck it up and stop acting like this game needs to be catered to the crowd who are too lazy to get good gear. I joined with a bunch of noobs who were barely doing anything and I still had a blast. Carrying has never been more fun with a Sobek with 32 rounds and a Rhino, and I'm sure they enjoyed the free ride for a forma BP.

 

What is with the stupid entitlement in these threads? Those vets had to work for their gear, they didn't just buy max ranked mods or pre-forma'd weapons and frames. If they can do it, you can too. It's called progression. Deal with it.

[Trylobyte]

What is with the stupid entitlement in these threads? Those vets had to work for their gear, they didn't just buy max ranked mods or pre-forma'd weapons and frames. If they can do it, you can too. It's called progression. Deal with it.

My personal take on things...

 

1)  I don't enjoy having to carry, personally.  I like having a cooperative team about on my level that I can count on to cover my weak spots as opposed to 'I have to do everything since nobody else is in a frame that can help me much.'  Carrying, for me, is stressful and frustrating, which is not the reason I play the game.

 

2)  My concern (I don't know if others here share it) is that we're developing into a situation where veterans, who were here for the easy ride to awesome gear, now complain that the game is too easy because they have all that awesome gear and these complaints are making the game harder for players who don't have it yet, IE newbies.  This eventually leads to a game-destroying situation where you have overgeared vets saying everything is too easy but newbies are struggling mightily to get the equipment they need to be relevant because the designers are buffing stuff for the vets who have it all.  I've seen it before and I don't want to see it happen here.

 

3)  Not everyone is as skilled/lucky/bored/persistent as vets are and a lot of 'elite' players forget that.  I'd be willing to bet that the number of 'casual' players outnumbers the hardcore shooter fans by a huge margin.  I'd also wager this isn't true on the forum where most of those hardcore fans tend to lurk but casuals have no real reason to go to.  Sure you can easily do something with X frame with Y ability, but if you only play two hours a day it might take you weeks to get a specific frame (It took me almost 20 hours of game time to get all the Trinity BPs, the first frame I built) let alone modules (I still don't have any multishot mods).  Different people play differently and what's easy for one player isn't necessarily easy for another.

Edited July 18, 2013 by Trylobyte

[Greater_Dullahan]

??? just ran the alert on my crapy laptop without any lags, with a lvl23 rhino (only 1x forma), with 2 low level weapons. This Thread is pointless!

 

Edit: And i was in there Solo!!! If anything you should be complaining about that this game is still way too fraking EASY!!!! 

 

Well, seems you went in there with the right gear. That's it. That's why it was easy for you. If you were a Mag, even after two crushes (maxed level), things wouldn't die (if I remember correctly), while Rhino's ulti can actually clear rooms. And I'm going to assume you have some fire damage mods to fight the infested with, which would be useful despite having "2 low level weapons".

 

If you think this game is "too fraking EASY!!!!" then simply remove your mods. There, difficulty increase, enjoy!

[SoulEchelon]

Okay, everyone else has pretty much said most of what I was going to say. So I'll just add this little bit:

 

The alert wasn't a "reward". They're not GIVING you a Forma. If they wanted to just give you it, then they would've....GIVEN you it. It was a Livestream alert. That is all. It's not a gift. I'm not even sure if they even create the mission type. Seriously, people need to stop being so damned entitled.

 

Oh, and.. They didn't "listen to the hardcore elite". If they did, then....

 

1. Aura mods wouldn't give mod capacity.

 

2. Grineer Elites would've been buffed, not nerfed.

 

3. Rhino probably would still be his old godmode self.

 

4. Nightmare mode wouldn't have been tweaked and wouldn't be given an option to do the normal mission for that node (They said they're working on that one).

 

5. There wouldn't be a tutorial. Why make a tutorial for the "hardcore elites"?

 

6. This game would have pvp all over it.

 

 

I swear there's melodrama on both sides of this forum...

[Yefrign]

It's funny how so many people think all players must have a Nyx/Rhino/Loki at their disposal.

Come on, the livestream alert is essentially there to celebrate the livestream and give players a little gift, yet now with the all-around level increase, a SATURN alert has enemies with level 40 swarming en masse, which includes Toxic Ancients and Disruptors. How are new players supposed to do the alert without leeching off of veterans with master race frames or near maxed gear? What about soloers who don't have one of the defense master race frames?

It seems that DE has decided to listen to the hardcores and elitists and develop the game away from solo players and casuals. As a primarily solo player, guess i won't stay long.

I have to admit, well said sir/madam

[Boondorl]

My personal take on things...

 

1)  I don't enjoy having to carry, personally.  I like having a cooperative team about on my level that I can count on to cover my weak spots as opposed to 'I have to do everything since nobody else is in a frame that can help me much.'  Carrying, for me, is stressful and frustrating, which is not the reason I play the game.

 

2)  My concern (I don't know if others here share it) is that we're developing into a situation where veterans, who were here for the easy ride fo awesome gear, now complain that the game is too easy because they have all that awesome gear and these complaints are making the game harder for players who don't have it yet, IE newbies.  This eventually leads to a game-destroying situation where you have overgeared vets saying everything is too easy but newbies are struggling mightily to get the equipment they need to be relevant because the designers are buffing stuff for the vets who have it all.  I've seen it before and I don't want to see it happen here.

 

1) This is why they're working on the match making system next patch. They specifically said during the stream they were gonna try harder to match you more with people who are on your skill level. This is a match making issue, not a problem with game difficulty being too high.

 

2) This game is like any other MMO. It has multiple areas, each one having a different level than the last. Yes, you may have to stay on Mercury to level a little bit more to get beyond into Venus. This game is the only game I've seen where the users have complained about such a mechanic in a MMO. Farming for better gear (mods, in this case) is not something unique to this game. It's a mechanic as old as WoW, and most likely older.

 

It's like people have yet to realize this game is nothing but a grind fest. That's just the type of game it is. Yes, you WILL have to grind for all your gear. I'm tired of players acting like it should just be given to them because "Oh boo hoo, this is too hard." It's not too hard, you just refuse to be patient and put time into the game. Unless you're running Pluto with unranked gear, I can't see this game being that terribly difficult. They even nerfed the Elite Grineer so they don't hit as hard anymore.

[FateZero]

1) This is why they're working on the match making system next patch. They specifically said during the stream they were gonna try harder to match you more with people who are on your skill level. This is a match making issue, not a problem with game difficulty being too high.

 

2) This game is like any other MMO. It has multiple areas, each one having a different level than the last. Yes, you may have to stay on Mercury to level a little bit more to get beyond into Venus. This game is the only game I've seen where the users have complained about such a mechanic in a MMO. Farming for better gear (mods, in this case) is not something unique to this game. It's a mechanic as old as WoW, and most likely older.

 

It's like people have yet to realize this game is nothing but a grind fest. That's just the type of game it is. Yes, you WILL have to grind for all your gear. I'm tired of players acting like it should just be given to them because "Oh boo hoo, this is too hard." It's not too hard, you just refuse to be patient and put time into the game. Unless you're running Pluto with unranked gear, I can't see this game being that terribly difficult. They even nerfed the Elite Grineer so they don't hit as hard anymore.

What determines "skill?" Cause I currently have between 0 and 30 "skill." I is noob :3

 

[Trylobyte]

2) This game is like any other MMO. It has multiple areas, each one having a different level than the last. Yes, you may have to stay on Mercury to level a little bit more to get beyond into Venus. This game is the only game I've seen where the users have complained about such a mechanic in a MMO. Farming for better gear (mods, in this case) is not something unique to this game. It's a mechanic as old as WoW, and most likely older.

 

It's like people have yet to realize this game is nothing but a grind fest. That's just the type of game it is. Yes, you WILL have to grind for all your gear. I'm tired of players acting like it should just be given to them because "Oh boo hoo, this is too hard." It's not too hard, you just refuse to be patient and put time into the game. Unless you're running Pluto with unranked gear, I can't see this game being that terribly difficult. They even nerfed the Elite Grineer so they don't hit as hard anymore.

The question becomes, how much time is fair?  How much work is fair?  A lot of people don't really have a good perspective on it because they were all aboard the easy train to lootville back when everything really was too easy, when orokin alerts were plentiful, and when the average level of bosses was lower.  People who missed that train are now the ones paying for it while the ones who were there for it still complain about how easy everything is.

 

My concern specifically is that the game is drifting in a direction where, in order for a new player to get the gear (potatoes, warframe BPs, etc) they need to work the mid to late game, they need to already be capable of running it or know people who do.  To illustrate this, imagine you're in a game where a mob drops level 60 gear, but the mob itself requires level 60 gear to kill.  If you don't already have level 60 gear, or know someone who does, you're screwed because you can't get the gear you need to kill the mob that drops the gear.  My worry is that the increase in difficulty will result in a point where in order to get the big mods and items you need you'll need to go through missions where those items are all but required for success or survival.  Does my concern make a little more sense now?

Edited July 18, 2013 by Trylobyte

[Greater_Dullahan]

1) This is why they're working on the match making system next patch. They specifically said during the stream they were gonna try harder to match you more with people who are on your skill level. This is a match making issue, not a problem with game difficulty being too high.

 

Hold up... so you're saying (match making system in effect for this scenario) if a noob had Saturn unlocked prior to U9, and wanted to do that forma alert, then that noob would be paired with other noobs to do such a high level mission? That seems... set up for failure.