My Only Real Beef With Forma

[EinRyu]

Why... i mean, really... why xD

Also, if you think that, you are missing the point and what DE claims that the mastery ranking system is. The mastery ranking is supposed to reflect the grade of universal knowledge in combat of the Tenno (one of the few things that has some actual lore about how the Tenno worked as a society). So remastering the same weapon would add nothing to that..... if they gave out more mastery xp for each polarization it would break the ide behind the system (+rank = More experienced Tenno, +knowledge about all gear/the game), people could just abuse it and also that would ignite the Flaming Wars :P.

Too bad this "Universal Knowlege in Combat" Feels more forced down our throats rather then some added fun factor. I love using my Paris, Hek or Sobek. I despise half the other guns as they just don't feel fun to me. I can't use Lanka because it's barred behind a Rank 7 Mastery Wall which would require me to grind out countless Guns/Melee Weps or even Frames just to get too, I don't have that patience and that's saying something considering I could do over 300 runs for Nova. It needs to be changed. I'm not saying allowing us to farm MR via Forma's is the way to go but it sure as hell would be better then trying to max rank the fail Alert only weps and some of the more horrendously UP weps in the game as of now. Not to mention I have to wait 12 hours for each one to build and sometimes 24 hours, that feels more like a waste of time rather then something that feels even somewhat rewarding.

Edited August 17, 2013 by EinRyu

[Operator_Error]

That makes no logical sense.

 

The concept is totaly different. In CoD people prestige to get shinier picture next to their level and to unlock more pictures behind their name. Also its a psychological trap to keep people playing long enough via progression, even if repeated, until the next map pack dlc.

 

Warframe gives you ability to pump in more mods into the weapon/warframe by using forma, which you can get from Void quite easily.

 

Why would you want to get Mastery XP for it? To not use any other weapons and forma your favorite weapon/warframe over and over to get maximum Mastery?

 

 

Because you've committed to demonstrating your mastery, by progressing beyond the normal "end point". Instead of just leveling to 30 and using a different 'Frame or weapon, you're actually MASTERING a single 'Frame or weapon, by putting more than the normal amount of time and energy into it.

Even if you received 50% of the XP for each level beyond the original 30, you're trying to TRULY master the item you're working on, as opposed to becoming competent and moving directly to the next one.

[notlamprey]

We've been told that DE is working on more "meaningful" rewards for Mastery Ranks.

Whether those rewards will work for players, we can't really know yet.

On the question of "Polarization not giving Mastery Rank", I think it should. Even if it's only half as much as leveling a new weapon, it needs to be something. Put diminishing returns on mastery gain from additional Polarizations if you have to. Players are putting time and effort into specializing with a weapon they love using. We shouldn't feel like we have to fight DE's game design to use the weapons we like best.

Yes, gains to weapon performance are the most direct benefits of using Forma. They're good benefits. I want to have more reasons to buy and use Forma than just Achievement Hunting or gluing silver stars all over of my favorite equipment.

What I'm basically saying is that right now, Forma feels to me like something I'm being "pushed" to use. I don't want to be pushed. I want to be tricked. I want to be suckered into loving it with tasty rewards.

Please consider giving players greater aesthetic benefits from the use of Forma.

[K1LLZ0NE]

I'm surprised so many people think you shouldn't get Mastery Rank for leveling a Forma'd weapon.  You get Mastery Rank whenever you level a normal weapon right?  So whats the difference between a Braton and a Braton that's been Forma'd?  Absolutely nothing.  Also, this game is all about playing how YOU want to play.  If you want to go out there and Rank every weapon to 30, good for you!  If you want to rank one weapon up to 30 ten times, then good for you!  Why should we be punished for not wanting to grind weapons/warframes we don't like?  All that matters to DE is time spent playing and enjoying that playtime.  Allowing Forma'd weapons to add to your Mastery Rank will not take any extra time out of the game, and what time you do spend you will enjoy ten times more.  Because you are playing the way YOU want to.  Not how the game forces you to.  

 

I for one won't be Polarizing anything until I hit Rank 7,  And it really ticks me off that it's because a function of the game is FORCING me to make that decision.  I would much rather Forma my Nova or Rhino and continue Ranking up and having fun, but no.  I have to go find more crap to grind.  Yay.

Edited August 18, 2013 by K1LLZ0NE

[shr0ud]

well search me, I didn't even know there was a star when you Forma things.

[magusat999]

I agree that any levelling should be considered part of the Mastery path, and Forma should not be excluded. This would also provide people with more incentive to use Forma, which would increase the chance that people who are prone to purchase will - since there is more of a reason than to make your weapon stronger (only). We have to stop being naive about it - Forma / Potatoes is there to get cash for DE, nothing more. Otherwise the weapons would just continue to level up without need for Forma or Catalysts.

 

When you Forma / Potato your weapon, it doesn't just magically change - you have to go back to the game and grind until it levels up again. I don't see why that shouldn't deserve some recognition or reward. Its not a reward that the weapon is stronger, the weapon is stronger because you levelled it up once again. It doesn't matter if it is the same weapon, its not the same level, is it?

 

An example of a game that continues to reward you as you level up is Skyrim. There are many levels to Mastery, it isn't a one stop shop that closes at one particular level. There are even more categories before you reach total mastery, like Apprentice - there should be tiers like that i Warframe. There should never be a level where you stop achieving some goal - that makes the game stagnant.

[NovaKiller]

So what there has been said, and i understand so far.

 

Using Forma on a weapon or frame just to get the extra polarity is not enough, you would like some kinda visual change that will indicate that you enjoy using this frame or weapon, and you are proud of it ( well so to say ).

I wouldn't mind that at all, it is just a little extra thing that can be added, but ofc it would have to stop at a max of 10 maybe.

 

The part about polarizing stuff and it does not give you mastery. I do see it as if mastery, is a way of mastering frames and weapons, i have not been bothered by it not giving me any mastery experience, and been using a vareity of weapons, and even used some weapons that i do kinda enjoy now, that i would not really have tried to look at before.

 

Getting stuff to 30, basicly means it is masterd. I don't see how you can master something more, than you already masterd it. Though adding a small extra thing, say 50% ( as someone else stated ), wouldn't be too bad. It would not bring you to the fact, that i NEED to use other weapons, that you might not enjoy using, just to get a higher mastery so you can use more weapons, but instead give you the choice.

Should i gain mastery slower, but actually use the weapon i enjoy, and make it stronger, more mod points, at the same time. Or should  i go and try a new weapon.

I do like the idea of that, cause i might have found weapons i enjoy using, BUT also weapons i do kinda wanna stay away from.

[Grulos]

A new polarity is not enough? LOL dude, must be american.

[Operator_Error]

One definition of an expert is someone that has spent 10,000 hours performing and perfecting a process or task; level 30 on a weapon or 'Frame certainly doesn't require 10,000 hours, so how can anyone say that you've "mastered" the item, just because you got it to level 30 a single time?

[CY13ERPUNK]

once you take something to 30, you've "mastered" it

why would you get more "mastery" from doing it all over again? you already mastered it

forma is just modifying it, the reset to lvl one is just a time-sink punishment

no good deed goes unpunished =P

what OP proposes would give the possibility of having ppl with mastery ranks of 20+ who have used less than 50% of the weapons and frames, that makes no sense =/

[K1LLZ0NE]

once you take something to 30, you've "mastered" it

why would you get more "mastery" from doing it all over again? you already mastered it

forma is just modifying it, the reset to lvl one is just a time-sink punishment

no good deed goes unpunished =P

what OP proposes would give the possibility of having ppl with mastery ranks of 20+ who have used less than 50% of the weapons and frames, that makes no sense =/

 

Why does that make no sense?  If I like 5 Weapons why shouldn't I be rewarded for ranking it up over and over again?  How would it affect YOU if others got the same mastery rank as you by using less weapons?  Does this mean they spent less time playing and got the same rank as you?  No.  They spent just as much time leveling and farming for forma as you did leveling and farming your weapons.  I really don't see the big deal.  It seems like people are getting all bent out of shape because they don't want new players to have an easier time of getting mastery rank, which WON'T happen if they implement Mastery Rank from Forma'd weapons.  

[DGwar]

All I'm really saying is that if they wont give mastery xp they should give something. Because as it stands the base reward for re-leveling something over again is very minimal for the work you are putting into it. I mean hell, if they ever make a rhino prime, my rhino will be better than it and there wont be a point in me leveling the prime except for mastery points.

[CriticalVoid1]

Mastery rank is there to encourage players (as others have pointed out) to play with lots of different weapons. And unless you play only on end game high tier content (lvl 100+ enemies with the stupid armor scaling problems) then this is not an issue. As it is now, I think it's a perfectly fine system and I stand by my opinion. That being said, I'm all for a symbol visible to other players showing how may times a player has forma'd a weapon or warframe.

[Ob1Kn00b]

In CoD, you prestige for epenis points.

 

Here, you prestige because it makes your weapons inherently more powerful.

 

Why should you get more credit for leveling things back up, when the reason you're doing so to begin with is further power?

[Sophista]

In CoD, you prestige for epenis points.

 

Here, you prestige because it makes your weapons inherently more powerful.

 

Why should you get more credit for leveling things back up, when the reason you're doing so to begin with is further power?

im thinking the same, and its general explaination from very begining.

You dont get reward for making weapon more powerfull, its reward itself...

and yes, im + for visible mark that weapon/warframe was formaed. Make your ePenises bigger.

 

NO for MORE FREE STUFF.

[Zeke01234]

I don't see why people are saying "it doesn't make sense"...it's "mastery" not "versatility"... It makes perfect sense that if you use something more you master it more...I don't really care either way I'm almost at rank 9 I'm used to the system but I could see an arguement to be made for diminishing mastery returns every time you forma because you have less to learn about a weapon but the OP certainly has a point.

[gallowsCalibrator]

Basically, the answer to your thread (which has been posted already) is that DE needs to make money, and having everyone use the same four or five weapons, only using freely obtainable formas on them, isn't going to make them money. Mastery Rank is probably the main way they do make money, by requiring the acquisition of a wide range of items, and with those items slots/potatoes/formas/materials plat/rushing plat. 

 

I don't really care about having extra visuals on forma'd weapons, but I'm not against that. 

[K1LLZ0NE]

Basically, the answer to your thread (which has been posted already) is that DE needs to make money, and having everyone use the same four or five weapons, only using freely obtainable formas on them, isn't going to make them money. Mastery Rank is probably the main way they do make money, by requiring the acquisition of a wide range of items, and with those items slots/potatoes/formas/materials plat/rushing plat. 

 

I don't really care about having extra visuals on forma'd weapons, but I'm not against that. 

 

I disagree.  I bet very few players buy the mats or rush the build times (except maybe for Warframes).  Forma is obtainable in-game, but not easily.  It only drops in the void and even then it only drops on 2 types of T2/T3 missions.  And what you will most likely get is a BP, which cost materials to make, which means more farming.  There is a LOT of incentive to buy Forma.  If you earned exp from Forma'd weapons I bet a lot more people would be buying Forma.

[Zeke01234]

I would also agree that forma sales would probably go UP if you had some form of mastery exp on formad weapons and frames.

[Pekku]

I also agree that releveling Forma'd weapons should earn exp towards mastery. We should be rewarded as much for investing time and effort in a weapon we love, instead of being forced to craft and level everything for the sake of "trying out different kinds of weapon" when many of them are clearly inferior.

[birdei]

The mastery rank to me, is like a weapons master, who is proficient with every type of weapon. Once you learn how to use the weapon, you already are a master at it so there is no need to re learn what you already know.

 

If you can earn mastery points from forma weapons and keep doing it from only a handful of weapons, then how can you call yourself a weapons master when you don't know how to use everything else?

[__Kanade__]

I only used one forma on Ash to change one of the polarities to a "-" and since Rifle Amp has the right polarity for Ash and supercharged. I have no need to use another Forma for him since he's +20-27 over the limit since I change between a few different mods. And everything on him is maxed so why bother using anoter forma when the Aura does the job for me?

Edited August 20, 2013 by __Kanade__

[Pekku]

The mastery rank to me, is like a weapons master, who is proficient with every type of weapon. Once you learn how to use the weapon, you already are a master at it so there is no need to re learn what you already know.

 

If you can earn mastery points from forma weapons and keep doing it from only a handful of weapons, then how can you call yourself a weapons master when you don't know how to use everything else?

 

In argument to your arbitrary logic, you could also say that Forma'ing and releveling a weapon makes you even more proficient at it, like becoming a master of your chosen weapon, like a samurai who dedicates his life to his sword. It is more reasonable in this sense because the weapon itself does get better by means of attaining a higher mod capacity, whereas leveling every weapon doesn't necessarily mean that you become a better warrior. A sword saint doesn't need to master hammers, forks, or spoons, they're useless to him.

[Won_Doe]

How about letting the new weapon give half xp? Or something less than half?

 

EDIT:  Possibly let it start at 50% xp, then 35% on next Forma, and so on...

Edited August 20, 2013 by Won_Doe

[DGwar]

I love how everyone tries to say that mastery involves using a bunch of different stuff. The very definition of mastery pretty much speaks for a single weapon being able to grant you it.

 

mastery  (ˈmɑːstərɪ)    — n  , pl -teries 1. full command or understanding of a subject 2. outstanding skill; expertise 3. the power of command; control 4. victory or superiority

Edited August 20, 2013 by DGwar