tailorchris Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 Hello, i think over the past few Months the whole Riven trading and price development has been getting out of hands. A few select "pro" traders dictate Prices in the 10th of thousands Platinum and when you know and talk to them they tell you that they dont play the Game at all anymore they just try to be the best trader and fight their personal "Battles" against others traders while setting more and more crazy Prices for Rivens. Apart from that the Trade Chat is getting more and more toxic with People being outright insulting and rude while DE does nothing against it even when you report said People with obvious Evidence about their obnoxious behaviour towards others. I wish DE would seriously consider changes to the whole Riven System. More and more People are quiting the Game and from what i gathered a ton of People do it because of frustration about the way Rivens are handled at the Moment. My suggestions. A: make Rivens non tradable - this is by far the harshest Change B: set a price cap on Rivens . For example a Riven with Disposition 1 can be max 200p, 2 -400 p and 5 - 1000p. At least the majority of People would not be the vicitim of those little Trade Wars between Traders that have not even an interest in actually playing the GAME anymore. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sufferot Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) Hey, I'm not a trader and a bit ashamed that I will need to say next. I'm not a fan of things going on with rivens, and RNG on top of more RNG with RNG topping on them. But, here is why DE will not do anything with that. Because of high prices on nearly any meta/usable rivens people feel like they lack platinum. To get that new shiny riven they will either buy it, or wll ty to trade 5-15p items to get to that 2-3k milestone. But here is a funny thing - platinum doesn't just "appear". It's brought by people. And it's spent by people. On either DE's stuff, or rivens, or w/e. High prices on something demand more platinum. So, it's more profitable for DE to keep those prices high, and actually encourage traders to bump prices to certain point, so traders will drive plat sales more. At the end, peopel got spoiled with 50-75% discounts on plat, and DE needs to compensate for that. And thats pretty obvious, understandable and so on - everyone needs to eat. Rivens, after all, were ment as endgame upgrades for your guns, not a mandatory stuff. Edited June 15, 2018 by Olaf_Silvermane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tailorchris Posted June 15, 2018 Author Share Posted June 15, 2018 Hello, then why are there constant reports about People getting their accounts banned because of "illegal" Platinum. Because certain People use credit card fraud to get Platinum and use that on Rivens which they buy for horrendous prices to ruin the Market etc etc. I doubt DE intended that ? And from what i can see. Among several Clans People stop playing exactly because of stuff like this especially the RIVEN ripoff plus toxic People that surrounds them. And i dont think DE is happy when in the end only those "pro" traders are left to battle themself. I think DE is very sensitive about stuff like that and they read our threads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfdaddy Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) I fully agree with the Olafs post! And in addition to that it is more a issue of the community itself and not DE... It is not there fault that everybody is chasing the perfect rivens just to get out 10% more dps out of a weapon. Just the "I wanna be the best" mentality kicking in there increasing the prices like crazy. The both changes would be devestating. Idk if u have ever played mmo's where the marketplace/trades between players get managed by the developer. It creates realy messed up new issues that u r propably not aware of... Furthermore connecting riven disposition with these prices is total non-sense and there is no reason for that at all. Edited June 15, 2018 by Smurfdaddy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfdaddy Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) 15 minutes ago, tailorchris said: Hello, then why are there constant reports about People getting their accounts banned because of "illegal" Platinum. I'm trading quite frequently myself and did atleast 200 riven mod trades (I hope that doesnt make the rest invalid because I am part of the issue ^^). Not a single time I encountered anything like that and non of my clanmates either which are even more engaged in trading. I heared 2 stories like that but that was it. U make that sound much more frequent then it is ^^ In addition to that most veterans I know r only playing rightnow because of rivens either to get plat or get there favourite weapons something realy sweet either by rolling or buying them with their hard earned plat. If u take that away by making everything realy realy cheap (1k is nothing tbh) DE will lose tons of veterans. If u cap the riven price, getting a realy good riven wont be a question of dedication anymore (paying a lot of plat/kuva for something u realy want) but instead one of raw speed because nearly everybody could and will buy a perfect riven for 200-800 plat in trade chat... I personally doubt anyone would even trade high tier rivens anymore at all after such a change. Edited June 15, 2018 by Smurfdaddy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sufferot Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Smurfdaddy said: I heared 2 stories like that but that was it. U make that sound much more frequent then it is ^^ . I heard this 3 times, this one is 4th. Maybe I'm a bit paranoid, but when I sell something, which is a rare thing, I always check who buys, MR and such. MR3 guy, buying opticor riven for roll same second I posted it? Nope, not gonna happen Edited June 15, 2018 by Olaf_Silvermane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfdaddy Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) Exactly ^^ just dont fall for the most obvious stuff 😄 Another thing I think is a big issue that a lot of people try to get into rivens much earlier then needed. I played up until mr 20 without any (they werent there yet that time but still it worked...) and it worked perfectly fine. U gotta get all the standart mods and such befor rivens. Dont try to run befor u can walk 😉 The high end riven market is rough and locked behind a lot of kuva or plat. But that is good that way... If everything is "noob-friendly" there wont be a fealing of progress or being rewarded for hard work anymore and that is what kills a grind game. Edited June 15, 2018 by Smurfdaddy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)NachoZissou Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 Nobody dictates my riven prices. I saw some clown selling a Sweeper riven for 10K but of course I ignored them and instead traded one of my unwanted rivens for one. I just ignore all the silly priced stuff and get on with my own business and it works just fine for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfdaddy Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, tailorchris said: At least the majority of People would not be the vicitim of those little Trade Wars between Traders that have not even an interest in actually playing the GAME anymore. I just cant stop writing sorry XD But u write a lot of weird stuff that needs to be talked about... If u dont wanna get involved in that just dont. Let them do their thing. They propaply played the game much longer then u or most other players and r left with barely anything else to do. Getting into riven trading realy helped me through the content drought and propably a lot of the dedicated long-time players aswell. They are still playing the game perfecly fine just their own way and should by no chance be locked down by DE for no real reason other then some people being salty about not being able to efford a riven they want. Edited June 15, 2018 by Smurfdaddy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tailorchris Posted June 15, 2018 Author Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) I wonder why Riven trading helps you getting through the content drought ? Thats exactly what i mean. People trade Rivens but they just trade for the heck of it. They dont use those Rivens to play the game. Because seriously all the content in the Game does not even need Rivens. From the traders i talked to and those are as you say People that play for a long time, all they do is trade stare at the trade channel, buy a "GOD(this term alone should be banned!) Riven" then try it in the simulacrum (because apart from destroying some level 155 enemy there for show and endurance runs(which actually no one but a few select People ever does) and then put the weapon and riven away and rinse repeat. If that is what you define as playing the game then kudos to you. You still dont get my point. If there would be a price cap on Rivens then everyone could benefit from that. Not only a few select which amassed a ton of Platinum. And i can not follow your argument there is tons of examples where the Game suffers no Problems at all if the market is controlled by the developer. Diablo for example. They even removed that horrible auction house completely. Black Desert also Developer controlled Market a Game that flourishes. You can always argue towards what you actually want. So i dont understand why you call my arguments weird. You might want to reflect your own first :-) And i dont get why you are against a price cap on Rivens. If the max Price of a Riven is 1000p where is the Problem ? If you are a long time player and have over 50k Plat even better for you, you can add 50 top rivens to your collection. The only People who would have a problem with that are those that amass Platinum and sell it for real money to others. And that is the next thing that i highly doubt is in DEs interest. Edited June 15, 2018 by tailorchris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 Let them be. Rivens are not mandatory on weapons and no one's forced to buy their rivens anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tailorchris Posted June 15, 2018 Author Share Posted June 15, 2018 vor 4 Minuten schrieb (PS4)iQuedas: Let them be. Rivens are not mandatory on weapons and no one's forced to buy their rivens anyway. According to DE Rivens are "the Endgame" though. I just personally thing the System should be changed. Recently they changed a lot of things for the better. So i hope they will do some changes regarding Rivens too. People suggested a lot of good stuff, like locking a stat you want to keep after rolling etc. etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfdaddy Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) 17 minutes ago, tailorchris said: If you are a long time player and have over 50k Plat even better for you, you can add 50 top rivens to your collection. Yes I am but everybody will just snipe them away so I wont have a chance to get the cheap godlies anyways... 17 minutes ago, tailorchris said: Black Desert also Developer controlled Market a Game that flourishes. Exactly the bad example I thought about XD everybody is camping marketplace there or using bots because u dont have the time/chance any other way to get ur hands on the realy good stuff (or did u ever get the chance to even see a costume up for sale on there? :P)! If u lock down the price but the demand will keep rising it will #*!% up the system... The resuply wont be able to keep up with the sales and it will seriously harm the economy. Ask ur economics teacher it is the same in real world and a real simple system. Let the free market do its thing 😄 Edited June 15, 2018 by Smurfdaddy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tailorchris Posted June 15, 2018 Author Share Posted June 15, 2018 Gerade eben schrieb Smurfdaddy: Yes I am but everybody will just snipe them away so I wont have a chance to get the cheap godlies anyways... Exactly the bad example I thought about XD everybody is camping marketplace there or using bots because u dont have the time/chance any other way to get ur hands on the realy good stuff! If u lock down the price but the demand will keep rising it will #*!% up the system... The resuply wont be able to keep up with the sales and it will seriously harm the economy. Ask ur economics teacher it is the same in real world and a real simple system 😄 I have a master in International Business, so i guess i can survive without an economics Teacher :-) i still cant follow your logic regarding the price cap. So what you want to say is that if the Rivens would be capped at 1k you would have less chance to buy it because more People can afford it ? So you prefer to offer 10k for a Riven because of that ? I would call that selfish :-) no offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScorpDK Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) I don't quite see how people can even be toxic in trade chat, given how a message is gone within the second, so having a battle with someone in there feels really, really difficult. To be fair, the solution to these prices is, simply put, increase supply and reduce demand, by both making rivens easier to obtain, whether be it via gameplay, or a better trading system. In other words: An Aunction House. List items, set them as fixed sales or auctions with a optional auto-buy price and listing fees. Want to list an item for 2000 plat? be ready to pay a percentage upfront to list the item. If it sells, you get part of that plat back. If it doesn't, you lose that plat. This drives down the incentive to list items at abhorrent prices because you know you'll lose money if nobody can afford it. Similarly, with an AH, the ability to browse, search and sort makes it easier to find the items you're looking for, and make sure you get the best available deal. For vendors, that means undercutting the competition by listing items for cheaper than the other vendors. Of course, this system needs tweaking, but it's a start into a more healthy trading system. Edited June 15, 2018 by ScorpDK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tailorchris Posted June 15, 2018 Author Share Posted June 15, 2018 vor 3 Minuten schrieb ScorpDK: I don't quite see how people can even be toxic in trade chat, given how a message is gone within the second, so having a battle with someone in there feels really, really difficult. To be fair, the solution to these prices is, simply put, increase supply and reduce demand, by both making rivens easier to obtain, whether be it via gameplay, or a better trading system. In other words: An Aunction House. List items, set them as fixed sales or auctions with a optional auto-buy price and listing fees. Want to list an item for 2000 plat? be ready to pay a percentage upfront to list the item. If it sells, you get part of that plat back. If it doesn't, you lose that plat. This drives down the incentive to list items at abhorrent prices because you know you'll lose money if nobody can afford it. Similarly, with an AH, the ability to browse, search and sort makes it easier to find the items you're looking for, and make sure you get the best available deal. For vendors, that means undercutting the competition by listing items for cheaper than the other vendors. Of course, this system needs tweaking, but it's a start into a more healthy trading system. When you want to encounter "toxic" People just talk to some People. Preferable the ones with selling GOD ........ PMO. -) When you make an offer that does not meet their expectations you usually get a Reply like ...depending on the english skills ranging from LOWBALL DEVIL...to....XXXX OFF.... XXX your Mother....XXXX die you poor Person etc etc.. :-) its surprising how People can act in a Game to be honest :-) An Auction House has a lot of disadvantages too from what i have gathered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfdaddy Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) 16 minutes ago, tailorchris said: According to DE Rivens are "the Endgame" though. I just personally thing the System should be changed. Recently they changed a lot of things for the better. So i hope they will do some changes regarding Rivens too. People suggested a lot of good stuff, like locking a stat you want to keep after rolling etc. etc. That is much more reasonable ^^ fix the prices by reducing the RNG and not by regulating the market artificaly. 11 minutes ago, tailorchris said: So what you want to say is that if the Rivens would be capped at 1k you would have less chance to buy it because more People can afford it ? So you prefer to offer 10k for a Riven because of that ? Exactly. I know that it is selfish but I worked my ass of for my plat and will propably appriciate a riven I buy for 10k a lot and not like someone that pays just 1k because he/she kinda likes it. Idk how reducing the prices would make the system less selfish tbh... Also please dont dodge the point I made with BDO because I know tons of people realy not being happy with the marketplace there for a good reason! Edited June 15, 2018 by Smurfdaddy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfdaddy Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 7 minutes ago, ScorpDK said: To be fair, the solution to these prices is, simply put, increase supply and reduce demand, by both making rivens easier to obtain, whether be it via gameplay, or a better trading system. In other words: An Aunction House. Thats more like it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tailorchris Posted June 15, 2018 Author Share Posted June 15, 2018 vor 1 Minute schrieb Smurfdaddy: That is much more reasonable ^^ fix the prices by reducing the RNG and not by regulating the market artificaly. Exactly. Idk how that is selfish because I worked my ass of for my plat and will propably appriciate a riven I buy for 10k a lot and not like someone that pays just 1k because he/she kinda likes it. Idk how reducing the prices would make the system less selfish tbh... Also please dont dodge the point I made with BDO because I know tons of people realy not being happy with the marketplace there fir a good reason! Well i dont dodge anything. I know a lot of People who play BD and are much more happy with a Markeplace like that compared to what happens in Warframe. And the Point of this Forum is to give Feeback to DE about what concerns us players. So i would rather discuss the topic on hand then compare other Trade Systems from different Games. And yes to me your arguments regarding being able to offer 10k for a Riven sounds selfish to me. What is selfish about more People having the chance to buy a Riven and not only a few select ? I really fail to see that sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)TJM99 Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 And meanwhile, I'm just sad to be at max rivens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfdaddy Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) 14 minutes ago, tailorchris said: And yes to me your arguments regarding being able to offer 10k for a Riven sounds selfish to me. What is selfish about more People having the chance to buy a Riven and not only a few select ? I really fail to see that sorry Yeah admit that. I changed the intial comment aswell! I was in a rush and messed up my point a little there ^^ Alright let me say it like this: I cant efford a realy nice car myself irl. But that is fine for me because I never realy tried hard to get a lot of money for one and I am not gonna complain about car prices just because of that. Others can efford that and car dealers can keep their prices on certain brands this high and imo that is perfectly fine... I know rivens are not 100% comparable to cars but I think u can understand what I am trying to say here. Edited June 15, 2018 by Smurfdaddy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tailorchris Posted June 15, 2018 Author Share Posted June 15, 2018 vor 2 Minuten schrieb Smurfdaddy: Yeah admit that I changed the intial comment aswell! I was in a rush and messed up my point a little there ^^ Alright let me say it like this: I cant efford a realy nice car myself irl. But that is fine for me because I never realy tried hard to get a lot of money for one and I am not gonna complain about car prices just because of that. Others can efford that and car dealers can keep their prices on certain brands this high and imo that is perfectly fine... Usually this argument is always used in this kind of discussions. Its called the Ferrari or Porsche example :-) Personally i think we should not compare the Riven Situation to Cars. I can totally understand that we all try to achieve to have the best for ourself and own the best Rivens but i think for the Game as a whole it would be good to change the Riven System. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abnormalize Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 so does smth like WoW players cry when they cant get their item for set because of rng? ffs most people who complain about rivens isnt even in mr20. they didnt even playd game for half year or so. the only I could agree is pricing. it should have cap. but cry about its rng and usefuness is stupid cause there is tons of people with our rivens who carry better then kids who spend 1k plant on 4/5 riven for soma. most interesting thing, for what I know, people leave cause they dont feel endgame. new zone to be grinded for low tier items, booring eidalon fights. nobody ever mentioned riven problem, except low tier players who didnt invested time into game, but wish to be epic endgame player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfdaddy Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) Ofc it gets brought up because it is a valid point (name some differences cause I cant realy find much) 😄 But like I already said I agree that rivens could use some changes. Make them easier to obtain and reduce the RNG that is involved in realy good rivens. Not put price caps on them... Imo a price cap wont change much other then people who camp the trade chat will get most of the nice deals while the casual players will have the same issue as now just like in BDO (I wont bring that up again from now on). Edited June 15, 2018 by Smurfdaddy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abnormalize Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 so real problem lies not in rivens, but in casual players. cause they dont spend that much time in game, which is problem for rest who dedicades time for it? 😄 pointless topic anyways Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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