Metal Auger And Shred

[Lactamid]

So I have both of these mods maxed, and my question is: WHY? is Metal Auger so bad?
15 energy for a pathetic 0.6 m puncture.

Shred at max lvl costs 11 energy and has 1.2 m puncture...it ALSO has 30% increased fire rate.

 

Plz buff Metal Auger to make it viable (again). Puncture is awesome but at that range (1.2 + 0.6) it's kind of lame.

 

*Now if the puncture mod works like below I might change my mind:

The bullet continues to puncture targets in a straight line but may only puncture a total amount of "X m". Meaning: If you shoot an enemy that is 0.3 m wide it will continue and hit any other target behind it untill it runs out of "puncture m".

 

ex:
1.2 + 0.6 = 1.8m

 

shot is fired through grineer dude:

1.8-0.3= 1.5

then hits wall:

1.5-1 = 0.5

the hits grineer dude 2:

0.5-0.3 = 0.2

then hits grineer dude 3:

0.2-0.3 = -0.1

*stops*

 

OR:

 

Bullet will always pass through anything that isn't thicker than "puncture value".

"Untill a 1.8 m wall comes along the bullet will continue".

 

I'm fine with not being able to fire through walls, the thing is that when you have maybe 5 enemies in a line, most of the time you will only get the first and possibly the 2:nd even if you're using both the mods.

Right now I'm using Lanka and having puncture being just a little more awesome would be AWESOME!

[W4RM4CHIN3]

I couldn't agree more. Shred poops all over Metal Augur, I am ashamed to have it in my arsenal.

[austinrelis]

Puncture used to give 5m of puncture with just 1 mod and most puncture mods I had also had dual stats. 

[LordMidnightX]

question does puncture work on armor ignoring weapons?

[CubedOobleck]

Metal auger should max with 11 drain and 1.5m puncture or 13drain/2m or 15drain/2.5m. either of the 3 would be balanced imo.

 

ex:

1.2 + 0.6 = 1.8m

 

shot is fired through grineer dude:

1.8-0.3= 1.5

then hits wall:

1.5-1 = 0.5

the hits grineer dude 2:

0.5-0.3 = 0.2

then hits grineer dude 3:

0.2-0.3 = -0.1

*stops*

This IS how it works Nvm, you are right that's how it should work, I'm kinda unhappy now that I know how it actually works:

Seriously, DE. I always thought this mod was terrible, but the mechanic behind it is so bad it's $&*&*#(%&.

 

question does puncture work on armor ignoring weapons?

It only works with hitscan weapons, which means that any projectile with travel time can't puncture. The only hiscan AP weapons are the regular and vandal snipetron.

Edited August 19, 2013 by CubedOobleck

[VKhaun]

The game isn't meant to be viewed in retrospective from a maxed out account with everything.

 

Dual mods are from a different source and are harder to obtain. They are an upgrade and a bonus for reaching and completing nightmare mode. Higher efficiency and more dramatic effects are going to be normal.

[Lady_Khaos]

The game isn't meant to be viewed in retrospective from a maxed out account with everything.

 

Dual mods are from a different source and are harder to obtain. They are an upgrade and a bonus for reaching and completing nightmare mode. Higher efficiency and more dramatic effects are going to be normal.

 

Doesn't change the fact that puncture is garbage at best. Inefficient garbage at that.

[Cyrosage]

The game isn't meant to be viewed in retrospective from a maxed out account with everything.

 

Dual mods are from a different source and are harder to obtain. They are an upgrade and a bonus for reaching and completing nightmare mode. Higher efficiency and more dramatic effects are going to be normal.

Yeah, seriously.  What is up with all these "this new thing that is more difficult to obtain makes newbie stuff obsolete!" threads.  People complain about prime weapons making others obsolete when you can still take any weapon in the game into anything except high level defense (the current 'end game') and be completely competitive.  You can use metal augur just like you did before and it would still hit multiple enemies.  Now you have a better version for veterans and complain that it's better... 

Do you really expect everything in the game to remain equal?  People complain that there's no end game after playing for hundreds of hours.  It's the diversity and quality coop that kept you in that long.  You might not be a newbie or mid-game anymore, but there are plenty that are.  Without some level or tier to differentiate, everyone would just run around with a braton, because everything would be "equal" and you wouldn't even have to farm!

 

Restart the game and put in 50 or 60 hours and see if metal augur is helpful on your sniper rifle or against hordes of infested.  It is.  When you get to be able to farm nightmare for dual stats, should you not be rewarded or should they just slap another metal augur in the loot table?  It's always been high cost because it leads to more kills from the same amount of shots fired which is a really big deal pre-veteran status.

 

I feel like some of you played too much mario kart and expect anything in last place to get buffed back to the front.

Edited August 18, 2013 by Cyrosage

[VKhaun]

Doesn't change the fact that puncture is garbage at best. Inefficient garbage at that.

 

That's not a fact... that's your opinion. I used to use a non-max puncture all the time, and I still use non-max puncture on other weapon types for harder missions. Shooting through two infested in a hall is only 0.1 to 0.3 but more importantly on nightmare when you have no shield or your HP is gone you only need .1 to shoot through an enemy ducking behind a rail and only a little more to go through the edges of boxes.

 

Assuming you're not being powerleveled and skipping content, you need to actually beat nightmare to get nightmare mods and I find puncture to be key in Grineer and CORPUS missions that I can't brute force, since without it you're either trying to hit the back of their armor, tiny edge-of-helmet or -toe hitboxes, or you have to shoot at them while they shoot back and aren't ducked behind cover.

Edited August 18, 2013 by VKhaun

[Cyrosage]

Doesn't change the fact that puncture is garbage at best. Inefficient garbage at that.

Depending on what you have available to you and at what rank, puncture may be more viable than you imply.  It can still cut down groups of infested which are generally bundled, or groups of grineer bundled in their tight hallways and around corners.  It worked fine before but was used little because of its cost.  If the cost was lower, EVERYONE would use it all the time.  No build diversity or sense of progression would exist.

 

If you have something you feel is better or suits your style, great.  You are stating your opinion as fact.  Check your hours in Steam that you've played and reconsider how interesting the mod could be for a reasonably new guy who just got that mod and doesn't have a rank 10 serration.

[Mastikator2]

Shred is power creep, it should be nerfed.

 

Metal Auger is situationally awesome, but also expensive. Shred should be better since it's one of a kind reward, but 1.2 for 11 points vs 0.6 for 15 is extreme. Maybe 0.15 - 0.3 - 0.45 - 0.6 - 0.75 - 0.9 instead.

[DarcnyssWolfe]

Right now I'm using Lanka and having puncture being just a little more awesome would be AWESOME!

^ This  is your issue. Lanka cannot puncture at all at the moment. If you think it does, remove Split chamber and try again. The Lanka's cleaving kills (split in half) combined with split chamber mimics a weak puncture through enemies. I keep bugging the Devs about lanka and the other projectile travel time weapon's inability to use puncture, as it completely eliminates an amazing game mechanic from those weapons.

[Lilybun]

Shred is power creep, it should be nerfed.

 

Metal Auger is situationally awesome, but also expensive. Shred should be better since it's one of a kind reward, but 1.2 for 11 points vs 0.6 for 15 is extreme. Maybe 0.15 - 0.3 - 0.45 - 0.6 - 0.75 - 0.9 instead.

 

Shred is power creep indeed but why not just make the metal auger better than shred? Devs seem to love powercreep in this game by adding constantly more powerful content so I doubt they'll change their philosophy much even if the current way means that the longevity of this game is drastically reduced

[Numot]

Shred is power creep indeed but why not just make the metal auger better than shred? Devs seem to love powercreep in this game by adding constantly more powerful content so I doubt they'll change their philosophy much even if the current way means that the longevity of this game is drastically reduced

Its not so much a case of power creep as it is the devs like to "fix" old mods by making a better version. Shocking touch is bad, so they gave us focus energy, metal auger is meh, so we get shred (and flux can't make use of fire rate....QQ).

 

Personally, If they don't want to buff auger that's fine, but they should reduce its cost to something like 9 points of mod energy maxed. That balances it out and makes it more attractive to use on other weapons without forma'ing a lot.

[Lactamid]

I still think that 0.6 m is way below what we get from other 15 energy-mods. Adding things that are supposedly lategame/endgame should complement, not just make stuff obsolete. Some of the lvls on Metal auger wont even increase the puncture value.

 

Hmm, so puncture doesn't work on lanka?
Odd, I've gotten quite a few multi-kills with it but i do have multishot. Lankas ultraslow firerate and traveltime on bullet should almost have X m initial puncture IMO (railgun) but anyways it is powerfull.

[Llyssa]

To people wondering about puncture working on weapons, the easiest answer is the "stair test". Stand on one side of a staircase, with an enemy on the other side of the staircase(one above, one below). Fire straight at the step. If you hit, it works.

 

I do think metal auger could use a little buff, but shred isn't(in the long term) going to be widely seen, and is, as said by the devs, a "may show up in nightmare, someday" thing.

 

The fact the two of them stack is quite nice, and the cost efficiency thing isn't so much a big deal, with one caveat--metal auger is on the higher end of the "rare" scale, so it's quite likely that a lot of people currently own shred and do NOT own metal auger.

 

If metal auger was the less-rare of the two(which, someday, I suppose it will be), this would be less of a glaring issue.

[ChaoticVice777]

Doesn't change the fact that puncture is garbage at best. Inefficient garbage at that.

 

Eh, the Flux Rifle really benefits from puncture though...