Allow the use of other Stances on Exalted Weapons

[Nazrethim]

Title.

Would be a nice touch.

[Cyloss]

I agree  
It would also be nice to have the exalted stances give capacity, so the current exalted weapons wouldn't be weaker than prepatch and make them actually usable

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

Um no. You’d lose range for iron staff, DPS for valleys claws, and the energy blades for exalted blade. 

[Nazrethim]

hace 1 hora, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 dijo:

Um no. You’d lose range for iron staff, DPS for valleys claws, and the energy blades for exalted blade. 

Not quite. The stances, as far as we know, have little to no damage modifiers, hence why (sans Wukong) it's usually pointless to do the combos outside of flavor. They could use the damage modifiers of other stances though, and Exalted Blade's waves are tied to it's attacks and not the stance from what it seems. The only downgrade from Exalted Stance to normal Stance would be Wukong, but even if the range perk carried out would still be a downgrade due to bad Staff stances anyway.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

1 hour ago, Nazrethim said:

Not quite. The stances, as far as we know, have little to no damage modifiers, hence why (sans Wukong) it's usually pointless to do the combos outside of flavor. They could use the damage modifiers of other stances though, and Exalted Blade's waves are tied to it's attacks and not the stance from what it seems. The only downgrade from Exalted Stance to normal Stance would be Wukong, but even if the range perk carried out would still be a downgrade due to bad Staff stances anyway.

Check the wiki page once in a while. There are damage multipliers and forced procs.

[Nazrethim]

hace 12 horas, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 dijo:

Check the wiki page once in a while. There are damage multipliers and forced procs.

Let's Compare:

Exalted Blade:

basic combo: a 4-step combo with no multipliers.

pause combo: a 6-step combo with 110% and 150% on the 3rd and 6th attack respectively.

rmb combo: a 7-step combo with 110% (3rd and 4th attack), 125% (5th) and Impact procs (which are pointless in general) on the 6th and 7th.

hold combo: a 4-step combo with 200% on the 3rd and 4th attack.

Slide attack: makes a Radial Blind at the end wich is way weaker than the real thing.

Now Crimsom Dervish:

gives 300% on almost all attacks except the final hit of the block combo.

basic combo: a 3-step combo with a doublestrike on it's final attack

backward combo: same as basic with an extra attack at the end which procs a knockdown and has a triplestrike.

block combo: same as basic with an extra attack at the end, which deals normal damage, performs a triplestrike and opens the target to Finisher attack.

 

Similar thing happens with Swooping Falcon stance, and Vengeful Reveant is roughly on par with Exalted blade. So we have TWO stances that are actually better than the one the ability has.

Let's go with Valkyr:

The Talons, due to the maneuvers it uses (some kicks and acrobatics) could easily fit as Claw or Sparring, so I will compare both posibilities:

Sparring vs Hysteria:

Hysteria has no multipliers whatsoever, long 7step and 9step combos, and some multistrikes, 360º attacks and impact procs spread around.

Sparring has either Brutal Tide (first attack deals 300%, short combos and 'pause' combo features a 300% doublestrike that ragdolls) or..

Grim Fury:

all combos start on a doublestrike followed by a normal attack

basic combo: 4-step combo with  a 250% 3rd attack finishing on a 150% doublestrike 4th attack

hold combo: a 5step combo. 4th attack is a 300% followed by a 600% ragdoll 5th attack.

backward combo: a 5step combo. 4th attack deals 150%. 5th attack deals normal damage but procs a Finisher

And that's for Sparring. What about Claws?

Malicious Raptor: few multipliers, has a Slam on the hold combo and a Slash proc on the triplestrike Block combo.

Four Riders: at least 125% on most attacks. forward combo has a 150% on 5th attack and 300% on 7th. Pause combo has a 540% doublestrike on the 4th attack followed by a Slam. And Block combo has a 230% Slash at the end of it's 5step combo.

Vermillion Storm: it's 1st attack is always 360º, has some decent multipliers thrown in and several doublestrikes.

 

So, clearly Exalted Blade and Valkyr Talons could benefit from this change. Primal Fury couldn't because the stances are slightly inferior to it.

 

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

33 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

Let's Compare:

Exalted Blade:

basic combo: a 4-step combo with no multipliers.

pause combo: a 6-step combo with 110% and 150% on the 3rd and 6th attack respectively.

rmb combo: a 7-step combo with 110% (3rd and 4th attack), 125% (5th) and Impact procs (which are pointless in general) on the 6th and 7th.

hold combo: a 4-step combo with 200% on the 3rd and 4th attack.

Slide attack: makes a Radial Blind at the end wich is way weaker than the real thing.

Now Crimsom Dervish:

gives 300% on almost all attacks except the final hit of the block combo.

basic combo: a 3-step combo with a doublestrike on it's final attack

backward combo: same as basic with an extra attack at the end which procs a knockdown and has a triplestrike.

block combo: same as basic with an extra attack at the end, which deals normal damage, performs a triplestrike and opens the target to Finisher attack.

 

Similar thing happens with Swooping Falcon stance, and Vengeful Reveant is roughly on par with Exalted blade. So we have TWO stances that are actually better than the one the ability has.

Let's go with Valkyr:

The Talons, due to the maneuvers it uses (some kicks and acrobatics) could easily fit as Claw or Sparring, so I will compare both posibilities:

Sparring vs Hysteria:

Hysteria has no multipliers whatsoever, long 7step and 9step combos, and some multistrikes, 360º attacks and impact procs spread around.

Sparring has either Brutal Tide (first attack deals 300%, short combos and 'pause' combo features a 300% doublestrike that ragdolls) or..

Grim Fury:

all combos start on a doublestrike followed by a normal attack

basic combo: 4-step combo with  a 250% 3rd attack finishing on a 150% doublestrike 4th attack

hold combo: a 5step combo. 4th attack is a 300% followed by a 600% ragdoll 5th attack.

backward combo: a 5step combo. 4th attack deals 150%. 5th attack deals normal damage but procs a Finisher

And that's for Sparring. What about Claws?

Malicious Raptor: few multipliers, has a Slam on the hold combo and a Slash proc on the triplestrike Block combo.

Four Riders: at least 125% on most attacks. forward combo has a 150% on 5th attack and 300% on 7th. Pause combo has a 540% doublestrike on the 4th attack followed by a Slam. And Block combo has a 230% Slash at the end of it's 5step combo.

Vermillion Storm: it's 1st attack is always 360º, has some decent multipliers thrown in and several doublestrikes.

 

So, clearly Exalted Blade and Valkyr Talons could benefit from this change. Primal Fury couldn't because the stances are slightly inferior to it.

 

Now here another problem. Exalted are their own unique weapon types. While similar to other weapons. They are not those weapon types.

[Nazrethim]

hace 21 minutos, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 dijo:

Now here another problem. Exalted are their own unique weapon types. While similar to other weapons. They are not those weapon types.

Primal Fury is a staff (can turn into a treetrunk on Slam attacks and extends it's range as it attacks, but otherwise it's a staff). Exalted Blade is obviously a sword. Hysteria is the only dubious there (as I said, it could either be Claw or Sparring) but even in that case we have a precedent of a weapon using two different stances: split swords (which use Dual Sword and, confusingly, Heavy blade stances)