★[Melee Mode Concept ~ Melee 2.0 Improvement/polishing]

[Aspari]

I'm plussing you bro.

[KARMA2605]

HAHAHA, yea. I'm waiting for Armor 2.0 before I think of some stuff to balance melee and ranged weapons. 1st idea is to make some enemies invulerable to ranged weapons, some enemies to melee. 

 

I kinda like that.

 

Another thought I had yesterday (though I'm sure it's been said before by others) is to make melee ignore shields, and give it a buff versus Infested.  I think that gives a real alternative to using a gun against a lot of units.  It would need to be balanced for bosses is the only thing.

[MofineBovine]

They could just have every weapon do a 3 or 4 swing combo and allow you to "charge up" each attack into a heavy blow by holding the button down for that particular attack. (Pretty much your standard console game melee system). Might sound boring but it would be an improvement

 

Pretty easy to jazz up too. Different attacks if you are sitting still, moving or crouching. Maybe a "charge attack" that means you need to be sprinting for a few seconds and hold down attack to do a heavy swing while you are charging at them.

 

Maybe, allow people to equip mods that grant then new "styles" and animation sets (different attack combos). A cycle active button similar to the cycle active power button no one uses? The thing about adding new buttons is you need to think about how it would fit on a controller. The simpler a system is the more likely it will be implemented.

 

Edit. also: They need to fix the ground slam. Every weapons jump attack shouldn't be a ground slam that knocks enemies over. Its like they made the ground slam, realized that it would be op if you just stun locked every enemy by constant knock downs and some bright spark said "well we could just make enemies immune to it for a few seconds if they have already been knocked down." - Laziest game design ever. Knockdown and stun effects could be something that happens on proc, or consume a large amount of stamina so you can only perform it a limited amount of times. Or both. Builds could be built around CC and others on damage rather then just skill spam CC and everyone does damage.

Edited September 21, 2013 by MofineBovine

[Scherhardt]

They could just have every weapon do a 3 or 4 swing combo and allow you to "charge up" each attack into a heavy blow by holding the button down for that particular attack. (Pretty much your standard console game melee system). Might sound boring but it would be an improvement

 

Pretty easy to jazz up too. Different attacks if you are sitting still, moving or crouching. Maybe a "charge attack" that means you need to be sprinting for a few seconds and hold down attack to do a heavy swing while you are charging at them.

 

Maybe, allow people to equip mods that grant then new "styles" and animation sets (different attack combos). A cycle active button similar to the cycle active power button no one uses? The thing about adding new buttons is you need to think about how it would fit on a controller. The simpler a system is the more likely it will be implemented.

 

Edit. also: They need to fix the ground slam. Every weapons jump attack shouldn't be a ground slam that knocks enemies over. Its like they made the ground slam, realized that it would be op if you just stun locked every enemy by constant knock downs and some bright spark said "well we could just make enemies immune to it for a few seconds if they have already been knocked down." - Laziest game design ever. Knockdown and stun effects could be something that happens on proc, or consume a large amount of stamina so you can only perform it a limited amount of times. Or both. Builds could be built around CC and others on damage rather then just skill spam CC and everyone does damage.

 

Meh, it will feel pretty much the same as we have now.

 

It's not easy. Can't have too much finger gymastics.

 

Very bad idea IMO. Though it would be a good if it we're at seperate slots like the aura system. Read V2...

Agreed. Not a lazy design though, it's the base, it's just not taking enough attention for improvement and progress. Waiting for U11.

[MofineBovine]

Meh, it will feel pretty much the same as we have now.

It's not easy. Can't have too much finger gymastics.

Very bad idea IMO. Though it would be a good if it we're at seperate slots like the aura system. Read V2...

Agreed. Not a lazy design though, it's the base, it's just not taking enough attention for improvement and progress. Waiting for U11.

You know your idea was melee mode button 1 = light attack button 2 is heavy attack. I suggested tap to do light attack hold to do heavy attack... that's hardly a radical difference. I know mele mode special moves is where you were really getting at, but im not so much of an optimist. Im more for hoping for small changes that might happen rather then dreaming up big ideas that are good, but are unlikely to see reality.

pressing w + e is not finger gymnastics. nor is ctrl + e or just pressing e and nothing else.

yeah my 3rd point was something that popped into my head as i was typing and not very well thought out. if anything differnt animations would end up being somthing you paid $$ for and equipped in "appearance"

Edited September 21, 2013 by MofineBovine

[Scherhardt]

You know your idea was melee mode button 1 = light attack button 2 is heavy attack. I suggested tap to do light attack hold to do heavy attack... that's hardly a radical difference.

 

pressing w + e is not finger gymnastics. nor is ctrl + e or just pressing e and nothing else.

 

yeah my 3rd point was something that popped into my head as i was typing and not very well thought out. if anything differnt animations would end up being somthing you paid $$ for and equipped in "appearance"

So basically you want the same current melee system that can charge in between normal hits.. Looks dull to me and like I said before it will feel pretty much the same. Why bother to change something if it won't feel different than it was before.

 

You got me there but why would you do combos while crouching?

 

I have no idea how that will work out. 

 

Edit :

But hey, if DE won't be willing to take big steps that will be a problem. Might as well throw some ideas that people&DE will agree upon and make it happen no matter how hard it is.

+ Be optimistic. I have faith in DE, I know they're trying hard to make WF a better game. 

Edited September 21, 2013 by Scherhardt

[MofineBovine]

Different attacks hit at different angles. So if you crouch and attack you might do a low sweep with the Gram that hits downed opponents or severs legs on kill. A heavy downward slice might split someone down the middle. Maby a crouch + attack with the kogake does an uppercut, then a static attack does a roundhouse kick (lol very mortal kombat inspired). 

 

Really im up for any change at all. Even a small one.

Edited September 21, 2013 by MofineBovine

[KARMA2605]

Different attacks hit at different angles. So if you crouch and attack you might do a low sweep with the Gram that hits downed opponents or severs legs on kill. A heavy downward slice might split somone down the middle. Maby a crouch + attack with the kogake does an uppercut, then a static attack does a roundhouse kick (lol very mortal kombat inspired). 

 

This is actually an interesting idea.  Mainly because a lot of it would involve the Art and Animation teams.  IF DE decides to indulge a lot of users calling for lesser content and more fixes, this could be what the non-coders could work on.  It's really the only hangup I see with your suggestion, is programming a lot more animations.

 

That said, it could be really neat.  Ctrl+E is a trip attack for some weapons, and a "bounce" enemy upwards for others. Ctrl+Space+E is a leaping tackle or something.  It doesn't fix @Scherhardt's issues with wanting to get away from Finger Gymnastics, but it might be the easiest to implement.  A whole separate Melee Mode, while I would love that, would likely involve a lot of coding.

[Scherhardt]

^Agreed to the both of you. Will not update this thread till U11. I want to see how melee will change by then. Thank you both for giving honest feedbacks about this idea.

[Bloodlet]

I've got quite used to the current melle set up now and enjoy playing mostly melee while throwing in a few good weapon shots.

I can only assume the people complaining it's boring are just spamming the E button and not using the surprising amount of varied attacks possible. sliding spin attack/jump spin attack/wall launch attack/flying kick...I swear I pulled off a back sumersault face kick and a different sliding charge attack but have failed to reproduce both so far.

 

I do have one suggestion about something that I find frustrating tho. The basic melee attack "E" can easily queued if over pressed and there's no way to stop it. If you happen to hit E 3 times but need to change your attack after 2 swings you can't.

 

I think basic melee attack needs to be interuptable by jump/block/sumersault/spin attack and switching to primary/secondary weapons.

Or just stop the queueing altogether to allow more timing on each melee attack.

 

Most other moves can be interupted or changed by hitting E, it really needs to be the other way around too.

[MofineBovine]

 

I can only assume the people complaining it's boring are just spamming the E button and not using the surprising amount of varied attacks possible. sliding spin attack/jump spin attack/wall launch attack/flying kick...

 

 

Varied attacks? a weapon is either set up to do heavy attacks or light attacks because of the mod system. Which means 90% of the attacks you are going to do are either spamming e or jump attacks. Melee finishing moves miss most of the time. The wall attack cant be aimed vertically and is plain unusable which leaves only the occasional slide attack to break up the monotony. 

[The_Markie]

I don't think this works, Warframe is a fast-paced game, you need to be both versatile and flexible. No one's gonna wait to get into some "Melee Mode" to do some gimmicks and wait again just to get out to shoot at people then wait to get into that mode again. It just does not work.

[Scherhardt]

I don't think this works, Warframe is a fast-paced game, you need to be both versatile and flexible. No one's gonna wait to get into some "Melee Mode" to do some gimmicks and wait again just to get out to shoot at people then wait to get into that mode again. It just does not work.

 

Oh, you ever played DMC4 man? You know how to use dantes style change right?no?. But I did, mastered it, had fun with it for ages. I say it's the most fast-paced action game I've come across in my life. This suggestion is almost similar to that except it's gun to melee mode.  Do you also read? Switching modes is almost instant... I don't see why it would slow down gameplay.

[The_Markie]

Oh, you ever played DMC4 man? You know how to use dantes style change right?no?. But I did, mastered it, had fun with it for ages. I say it's the most fast-paced action game I've come across in my life. This suggestion is almost similar to that except it's gun to melee mode.  Do you also read? Switching modes is almost instant... I don't see why it would slow down gameplay.

 

Does DMC4 focus on guns more than melee? And also, when you fight stuff, DMC4 rounds up the battlezone so stuff can't runaway or shoot you from AFAR. Do you also brain?

 

PS: Even if the switch is instant, I still see no reason that we can't go creative and simplify it down to just be around 1 button for the sake of versatility.

Edited October 2, 2013 by The_Markie

[Scherhardt]

Does DMC4 focus on guns more than melee? And also, when you fight stuff, DMC4 rounds up the battlezone so stuff can't runaway or shoot you from AFAR. Do you also brain?

 

PS: Even if the switch is instant, I still see no reason that we can't go creative and simplify it down to just be around 1 button for the sake of versatility.

 

Space-ninja is the theme. We have huuuuuuge balance issues with ranged weapons right now. Melee should be used more in this game than guns because we ARE ninjas. 

 

Everything I suggested can be changed that's why it has versions. Again please read this. I have done 2 revisions already, it's impossible for me to not change a thing. I compile ideas from the people who contribute theirs in this thread and make it better. I appreciate your feedback but If you're here to hate the suggestion itself and not give a contructive idea why are you even here commenting? Just leave. I won't argue with you anymore. Make you own thread suggestion about your single button versatility, DE might like it even more because it will require less work and time. 

[gaurdianaq]

Interesting idea, where does dual wielding fit into this?

[blahdenoma]

Melee weapon damage needs to be increased dramatically before most of these other ideas will be anything more than novelties.

[Scherhardt]

Interesting idea, where does dual wielding fit into this?

I don't get your question. Heheh

 

Melee weapon damage needs to be increased dramatically before most of these other ideas will be anything more than novelties.

Hopefully in U11. 

[BladesGenesis]

How about adding an option to dual wield a secondary with a melee (lato/skana etc, nothing like holding a galatine in one hand)?  Other than some things here and there, i agree with you that the melee in warframe is very monotone and needs a big change.  

[Relkin]

Infinite F*** yes's.  An engaging skill based melee system?  Yes please.

 

 "But I'm terribad at fighting games and things that aren't spamming 4 and left holding down the left mouse button on my Flux Rifle"

Then use your guns and leave us alone.  

 

Would love if they could also add feedback to melee like the kogake has - currently it feels like every other weapon in the game is always slicing air, there is no contact feedback when you strike something which makes it feel really....unfinished i guess?  I don't know, it's like animations videos you see of unskinned models sort of, it's like it's still a WIP (which it could be for all I know).

Edited October 15, 2013 by Relkin

[Rade.]

Customise your key bindings to something that works better and use toggle crouch/sprint over hold to crouch/sprint.

 

W+Shift+Ctrl+E=DE already having Finger Gymnastics.

 

Actually, W+Shift+Ctrl for a slide is terrible.

 

W+Shift+Spacebar for a vertical/horizontal wallrun is also pretty heinous.

 

They need to fix Melee and Parkour to not have 'finger gymnastics'.

[Scherhardt]

Customise your key bindings to something that works better and use toggle crouch/sprint over hold to crouch/sprint.

 

Thread will have new ideas after U11, probably ideas that will further polish the melee system. I want to see how the new melee system works first before we try to suggest some more improvements/ideas. 

[Yaerion]

Woah.

That's a lot of cool stuff. I love the idea of combos, and using enemies as "flesh" shields.

The only Cons I see it's the variety of combinations which has nothing familiar with the Shooter mode.

That said, I see a lot of work (that's a compliment) and agree with the melee mode idea, and whatever can give to the melee a true utility ingame. So +1!