How To Implement Story/lore In A Win-Win Scenario For De And Players. (Tldr Included)

[Relkin]

Firstly, I want to preface this with a statement that I'm not super confident that this or anything like it will be realistically implemented.  Most of that is due to the fact that it'd require DE to bite the bullet and hire a writer or two which if they haven't done by now, is likely to never happen (unless they did and he/she's been working in secret and they've got some big surprise for us on launch day). 

 

 

We as players, want more things to do in game, lore, and a general purpose for doing the things we do outside of power grinding defense and survival missions.  DE wants us to play gotta catch em' all with frames.  Here's a way we can both get what we want.

 

What if, every single node on the star map had an actual purpose?  What if we were there for an actual reason?  I propose that each node has if not a cutscene (at least to start since they take awhile apparently) then a scrolling text blurb or better yet sound clip played out by the lotus (or somebody else?) that explains what the heck we're doing there.  As we achieve objectives we are met with an in context status update regarding that objective (lets say we gank a data mass, lotus makes a startling discovery about the activities of the boss in that planet).  The trickiest part will be the repetitiveness of the mission types but that can worked around a little bit by just changing some things (like instead of destroying a reactor core we destroy a prototype cloning vat) so that they are in context of the story for that planet.

 

Additionally add a couple 'lotus tapes' or w/e you'd like to call them in the hidden parts of each map that we can collect and give us a roster so that we can 100% area's.  Have these tapes include information about the history of the Tenno and Orokin society.  Many rushers say they rush because they've been doing this for so long the combat is dull and they have most everything so its efficient, give us a reason to explore and reward us for doing it.  

 

Now, if you really want to "Go For The Gold" DE what you do is craft a story for each individual frame so every time somebody gets a new frame they have a reason to do a circuit around the star map.  This means that when players unlock a new frame, they essentially unlock a new story or campaign to go along with it!  How nifty would that be?  Make the tapes contextual to each frame as well.  How to do this per frame?  Simple, just make it so each frame is from a clan (not the player kind) which shouldn't be too hard to do since you already said you would make alternate gender variants of frame themes (male fire frame for example).  So for each frame maybe have the tapes or their frame specific story sections be flashbacks or info about the downfall of the Tenno/Orokin. 

 

So yeah, I think this would be awesome and would definately up player retention quite a bit.  I was on apollodonus today and a newbie asked me "what's this mission about?" and I felt that it was the most depressing thing anybody has ever said in regard to this game :(

 

 

TLDR: A story for every node, preferably frame specific with lore tapes hidden in each level.  This will encourage players to use other frames and play all the missions instead of only power grinding resulting in a double win scenario. 

[Renathy]

From what I understand from the community, they don't want to know the Tenno's identity or background story for each specific character. They like to make up stories about their favorite characters and leave it at that.

 

Also, I don't think tapes would encourage players that much. I'm one of the percentage that dislikes collecting audio/text files.

[notionphil]

From what I understand from the community, they don't want to know the Tenno's identity or background story for each specific character. They like to make up stories about their favorite characters and leave it at that.

 

Also, I don't think tapes would encourage players that much. I'm one of the percentage that dislikes collecting audio/text files.

 

I think that "we like to make our own stories up" is one of those "vocal minority" thing, stemming from its mention in the initial branding/trailers. The game definitely needs a story of some sort, not lore in a database, but lore that you play.

 

One can only run nameless missions with faceless killers for so long without having any idea who, when, what, where, why.

[Relkin]

From what I understand from the community, they don't want to know the Tenno's identity or background story for each specific character. They like to make up stories about their favorite characters and leave it at that.

 

Also, I don't think tapes would encourage players that much. I'm one of the percentage that dislikes collecting audio/text files.

Not really sure if that is or isn't a representation of the community in general tbh.  I do know a lot of people have been hollering for lore+story missions and its a massive turn off for new players and directly contributes to the terrible attrition rate this game has.  Not sure how much recruiting you do but it is damn hard to keep people on board for longer than a few days.  Most people I know aren't big fans of just running around aimlessly slaughtering for power with no apparent reason.  

[Balter]

 Its a good compromise between strictly story based missions and the current map we have now.  It may or may not take a bit of work since they have to program where and how these "tapes" spawn. Possibly even having to go tile by tile and add a new locker/canister type. Maybe a new dead end tile or 2. Really depends how into it they would like to get.

 

 

From what I understand froFrom the community, they don't want to know the Tenno's identity or background story for each specific character. They like to make up stories about their favorite characters and leave it at that.

 

Because we have no lore? People make up stories about well defined characters too. See any fan-fiction(or slash fiction o.O). The lore can be any number of things. Maybe in Mercury we pick up some audio logs of Vor's. Maybe on Eris we find some video footage of a Corpus experiment gone wrong. Void lore would be all the more amazing and give people new reasons to do loot rooms. Since i would expect such "tapes" to be stuck behind them.

 

Also, I don't think tapes would encourage players that much. I'm one of the percentage that dislikes collecting audio/text files.

 

I would assume something along these lines would be optional, no?  Take it like Bioshock: Infinite.  You could blast your way through the game without picking up all of the tapes, but you would be pretty out of the loop or miss a lot of flavor. Granted a lot of them were pretty out and easy to get, a number were out of the way. As much out of the way you can get while traversing a hallway. The only thing they may stick behind a 100% lore completion rate is cosmetics, if anything at all. Maybe a strictly lore based mission?

Edited October 7, 2013 by Balter

[Pyromite]

Wait, are you saying that every warframe is a character?

[Relkin]

Wait, are you saying that every warframe is a character?

Absolutely, each frame has its own vibe/stance.  To me it feels like each one sort of prescribes to a slightly different set of philosophies and martial thinking/practice.   Think like different forms of kung-fu or different sword styles if you'd like a real world comparison.  While they may share some or many core concepts they each have their own distinct flavor.   I think it'd be neat if the Tenno during the Orokin era were split into clans and each clan had a different set of frames that they trained in/with. 

 

Anyways I'm not an official lore guy or anything for WF obviously its just a suggestion on how we can get some story lore while also having it be more than just a one off thing but instead tie directly into us obtaining and building frames. 

[Yaerion]

I love this idea of the Lotus giving unique information per mission (or as a start, for each planet).

 

And I'd love so much to work upon the story of Tennos, Orokin and all other factions and events that are mentioned here and there (infestation by technocyte virus, etc). If DE read this and if there is a possibility to make a group to work on that officially, I'm 200% interested.

[Relkin]

I love this idea of the Lotus giving unique information per mission (or as a start, for each planet).

 

And I'd love so much to work upon the story of Tennos, Orokin and all other factions and events that are mentioned here and there (infestation by technocyte virus, etc). If DE read this and if there is a possibility to make a group to work on that officially, I'm 200% interested.

Don't think they really need a group so to speak, they need a writer.  Maybe two.  Like I said in my preface they just need to bite the bullet and eat the cost of hiring a writer and get this stuff in game.  Can't live on bread alone DE, gotta have some soul in this game. 

[Yaerion]

Relkin> That's what I'm sayin' :)

I'd like to write. Don't even need compensation. It'd be a pleasure for me to work on this.

[Grand-Dozer]

I prefer the idea that Warframes are not individual characters, but suits, and that the Tenno inside; our player characters are "us" (You are one of the last surviving Tenno, not Billy who wears Excalibur, but you wearing your Excalibur)

 

Personally I don't feel like the Tenno are each separate Heroes, for now the gender differentiation is about the only conflict I can see with this idea, but it seems more game-play related than lore grounded as to why that is the case.

[Renathy]

I would assume something along these lines would be optional, no?  Take it like Bioshock: Infinite.  You could blast your way through the game without picking up all of the tapes, but you would be pretty out of the loop or miss a lot of flavor. Granted a lot of them were pretty out and easy to get, a number were out of the way. As much out of the way you can get while traversing a hallway. The only thing they may stick behind a 100% lore completion rate is cosmetics, if anything at all. Maybe a strictly lore based mission?

 

I know this is a faulty excuse but I'm obsessive and even more in a game I actually have grown to love and admire. If I see something that I want to collect, even if I don't want to, I must do so. Take Void weapons for example: Some of them aren't all that good but they're unique and beautiful, so my brain tells me that I must collect them all, regardless.

 

Even if I'd pick the tapes, I'd be willing to listen to them but I'd always wish for something better. A lore strict mission is a better suggestion, though. Campaign, especially with cooperation, has always been the most amazing thing about games.

[Relkin]

I prefer the idea that Warframes are not individual characters, but suits, and that the Tenno inside; our player characters are "us" (You are one of the last surviving Tenno, not Billy who wears Excalibur, but you wearing your Excalibur)

 

Personally I don't feel like the Tenno are each separate Heroes, for now the gender differentiation is about the only conflict I can see with this idea, but it seems more game-play related than lore grounded as to why that is the case.

Well it's easy enough to deal with something trivial like both of those points actually. 

 

1.  We are one of the last surviving Tenno and that is why we have to craft our suits - we are actually pulling a Samurai Jack and learning all the different martial styles of the Tenno which also would explain why it's important to unlock the origins and history that frames clan while playing or training in it. 

 

2. Tenno are genderless and the perceived gender thing is merely aesthetics huehuehue (yeah epic cop out)

[Relkin]

I know this is a faulty excuse but I'm obsessive and even more in a game I actually have grown to love and admire. If I see something that I want to collect, even if I don't want to, I must do so. Take Void weapons for example: Some of them aren't all that good but they're unique and beautiful, so my brain tells me that I must collect them all, regardless.

 

Even if I'd pick the tapes, I'd be willing to listen to them but I'd always wish for something better. A lore strict mission is a better suggestion, though. Campaign, especially with cooperation, has always been the most amazing thing about games.

Lore strict missions would be sweet but also incredibly time and resource consuming to develope.  This idea is a lot better than anything we have currently and should be significantly easier/faster to implement.  Remember we are about to get a lot of new Tenno come November and frankly I'm fearful that this game is going to be a massive flop on the PS4 for a lot of reasons and lack of story is a big one.  DE can always add story specific missions/campaigns after the fact *COUGH COUGH COUGH CELLS CELLS CELLS COUGH COUGH*.

 

p.s. That's a bastard of a trait to have in a game like this and I feel for you man.  Plans on going founder before it's too late?

[Pyromite]

Are you saying that there is currently 15 Tenno fighting a war? If that is the case, I'm sorry to burst your bubble. 

 

Every time you get exp for your warframe, it's "suit item exp"

Vor has many taunts, where he uses word "warframe" for your armor: "Your (warframe) will look great hanging from my wall."

Doesn't Lotus say Sgt. Nef Anyo is a collector of warframes?

[Renathy]

Lore strict missions would be sweet but also incredibly time and resource consuming to develope.  This idea is a lot better than anything we have currently and should be significantly easier/faster to implement.  Remember we are about to get a lot of new Tenno come November and frankly I'm fearful that this game is going to be a massive flop on the PS4 for a lot of reasons and lack of story is a big one.  DE can always add story specific missions/campaigns after the fact *COUGH COUGH COUGH CELLS CELLS CELLS COUGH COUGH*.

 

p.s. That's a bastard of a trait to have in a game like this and I feel for you man.  Plans on going founder before it's too late?

 

I understand. Gaming in general is a lot of development work. In the end, if much is implemented, there are always issues here and there but they're supportive and they know when and how to listen.

 

P.S.: Yep. It's not just in games. I'm obsessive in real life, as well. Not as much as moving furniture 1CM to the right because I didn't like its placement, no, but there are some things that do mess with my head and I follow my brain's ordrs. "I am yours to command, Mr. Brain." No plans on going founder, though. My obsessiveness also hits me on the knee there. I want the Hunter's pack but I also want to collect the other Prime weapons. Sadly, I ain't got no money for both.

[Relkin]

Are you saying that there is currently 15 Tenno fighting a war? If that is the case, I'm sorry to burst your bubble. 

 

Every time you get exp for your warframe, it's "suit item exp"

Vor has many taunts, where he uses word "warframe" for your armor: "Your (warframe) will look great hanging from my wall."

Doesn't Lotus say Sgt. Nef Anyo is a collector of warframes?

1. Read the post above yours - generally good to follow a thread like this through as ideas are mulled over and hammered out (we may have been writing these at the same time for all I know, just saying)

 

2.  Honestly given the complete lack of any real lore in game right now, we just extrapolate our own conclusions but until DE starts writing up some official lore I'd say anything is subject to change.  With that said, I prefer the "Samurai Jack" route I listed above your post anyways :b

 

EDIT: Sorry - two posts above yours >_<

Edited October 7, 2013 by Relkin

[Relkin]

Are you saying that there is currently 15 Tenno fighting a war? If that is the case, I'm sorry to burst your bubble. 

 

Every time you get exp for your warframe, it's "suit item exp"

Vor has many taunts, where he uses word "warframe" for your armor: "Your (warframe) will look great hanging from my wall."

Doesn't Lotus say Sgt. Nef Anyo is a collector of warframes?

It actually occurred to me even if we are gaining suit item exp and he collects frames it doesn't prove us being generic Tenno who change suits at all.  Given that they've been adding a new suit almost every 4 to 6 weeks the number of Tenno battling isn't really static (instead represent Tenno rescued from cryo) and sure, Nef Anyo could collect suits from Tenno who he's slain that we've never met OR just old suits that are unoccupied from before the fall.  Don't see how those two things preclude individuals over faceless masses but it's not super important bc as I said I prefer the samurai jack route. 

 

 

It's not uncommon for MMO's and MP games to have a story line which focuses on you, the protagonist while still acknowledging other players exist.  I think the real question is do we focus on the now treating each frame as a separate individual or do we focus on the past regarding the history of that frames clan as an aside piece to the story of what your doing on that node/planet currently.  (Perhaps what happened in that area during the great war?)

 

And again, every time they add a new frame it could be more than just something to grind for it could be a whole new story to play through as well. 

[Yaerion]

Yep. Warframes are combat uniforms. The war thing, clans and Lotus' words imply this fact. They are not those who wear it. However, they have very strong identities. They make their wearer the kind of fighter he/she is.

 

But nothing prohibit to follow a campaign with a specific "pilote" of warframe who has a story to tell. With each new warframe the player wear for the first time, we could have a vocal flashback of memories of our hero before the holy night of Tennos. :)

Edited October 7, 2013 by Yaer

[Grnd91]

I would love the idea of having a story on many levels. From the large scale here-and-now battling the Grineer, Corpus, Infested, as well as smaller scale individual 'frame stories. Here are some ideas I cooked up while reading all of the comments above.

 

1. Lotus says in the very first tutorial (before Vor got his upgrade) that the cryopod purge would damage your memory. Perhaps the Warframe lore could be your character (or the character of the 'frame) remembering their own past before they went into the pod. This would coincide with the idea of getting information on the downfall of the Orokin and the retreat of the Tenno from the Origin system. 

 

2. In terms of a "story driven mission" perhaps there can be a special event that pops up every once in a while like an alert where when you start it it appears to be more of a training mission but what you are fighting are shadows of the past. Battling a memory in the place of the ancient Tenno during or maybe shortly there after the collapse. Where Lotus or some other mysterious "???" voice is recanting the tale of some ancient battle you are currently participating in. These missions could also have two or three alterations where it starts as an extermination, turns into a survival, and then a mobile defense. 

 

3. I have played two games where the player plays multiple unique characters, first is Sword of the new World where the player can actually play a party of (up to) three characters after yo create a "family" name (example: Family: Builder, characters: Billy, Bob, and Jane) and second is Guild Wars 2 where at the moment of Character creation you have the choice of how to build you character's backstory which will effect how their campaign plays out. The idea of each Warfrme being a unique character sits well in my mind since (I believe) the 'frame itself is built around the users specific innate powers, though I could be wrong. either way if you are going to have 'frame specific lore DE will either have to create some name of a famous Tenno who used that frame and the story could follow them, or make each frame a different character and create stories around that.

[Brasten]

This would be a good start, this game needs its Lore kinda badly. However in the long run this is little more then a theme park attraction and will eventually be completed just like everything else.

No, the only true way to keep things engaging is add a player action driven system where players influence the state of the solar system and the balance of power between different factions in different regions.

To put in simple terms have 'campaign' mode which is influenced by the number of units killed in each faction, and the number of bosses killed. The more Infested are killed the stronger the Corpus get. The more Corpus are killed the stronger the Grineer get. The more Grinner are killed the stronger Infested get.

By stronger I don't mean by stats. I mean they begin appearing in more missions, taking over spots on a planet, becoming more common in Alerts. We get little blurbs of story to go along with this.

Mid-tier 'boss-ish' types appear as part of the dynamic system, planets or even missions can be relocked with semi-randomized fluff accompanying.

Break down an aggregate the results over the course of a 'season' (say 3 to 4 months real time) and use that to roll the story of the Origin system forward. 3 months of player actions, 1 month off season while DE finalizes results and story changes.

Make such a mode optional, so new players can play into the game initially as laid out, but also don't influence the ongoing meta story as played out by the players. Veteran players can opt out of crazy town if they want to do something particular in the 'static' game.

=====

There are currently only 4 million registered Tenno. Assuming that this is the actual number of current Tenno active in the story/setting, this is still no nearly enough to conquers the whole of a solar system and become its masters. The Tenno colony survives by messing with balance of power between existing factions.

Edited October 7, 2013 by Brasten

[Relkin]

 

Yep there are suggestions for things like this but as was mentioned earlier in the topic we have a matter of resources and time to address.  Also, it would be good to establish a foundation - do the quick and easy solution here to set the tables for something big like cells and a dynamic war down the road. 

[Implodingbanana]

Story mode? :D i suggest a story mode for people who want to play with lore and for those who are taking a break from it

[Relkin]

Story mode? :D i suggest a story mode for people who want to play with lore and for those who are taking a break from it

That's the idea; make a thread with an idea, get a bunch of up votes, bring it to DE"s attention, hope they implement something (it'll ofc be nothing remotely similar to the thread but any story is better than what we have now)

Edited October 7, 2013 by Relkin

[Relkin]

There are currently only 4 million registered Tenno. Assuming that this is the actual number of current Tenno active in the story/setting, this is still no nearly enough to conquers the whole of a solar system and become its masters. The Tenno colony survives by messing with balance of power between existing factions.

That's not even remotely close the number of people that play lol the game doesn't even top 20k users during prime times - the attrition rate is atrocious in this game.  Also, it's unheard of to relate the number of IRL people to ongoing lore in a game - something like that is far too unstable/unpredictable to base any real lore off of.