Walkampf
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Posts posted by Walkampf
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The part(s) people are missing with Energy Vampire:
The energy pulse is group wide - 100 Energy total per tick
What you are describing here is the ideal case.
But it is quite unlikely to to occur.
The first reason is the positioning.
If any teammember is out of range of the pulse, he doesn't get anything.
The second reason is, any teammember who has already full energy won't get anything.
Those are to thing you, as Trinity, cannot control.
With the old EV however you had enough control to counter these two problems by thinking about which enemy you mark, namely one that is likely to be attacked by a teammate who used a skill moments ago.
Sure, you had to keep a close eye what your teammates were doing, but you had most of the control.
With the new skil you have barely any left.
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First i'd like to start of with something positive, the changes on Trinties other skills were really interesting. Personally i like those a lot, especially the changes on Link.
So, i ran some tests on Trinity, focusing on Energy Vampire (EV), since the changes done to this skill didn't seem to add up and i found two, in my opinion, severe problems with this new skill.
Additionally, i tried to understand why those changes were implemented in this way, while i wrote down the problems.
And last but not least, i thought about ideas to fix the skill.
The Problems:
- The first problem is, when the targeted enemy dies, every pulse left is lost.
This reduces the effect of the skill more often than not by 50%-75%.
If you are grouped up with a trigger happy bunch, or you all have a bunch of Sentinels with potatoed weapons, or your group has massive AoE-clearing potential, the skill becomes next to useless.
Since communication is unfortunatly not the strength of the Warframe community, it next to impossible to make them understand how this mechanic works, if they are not familiar with Trinity themself.
Before the Trinty-player was able to controll who whould get energy by using EV on an enemy which was likely to be targeted by a certain player in the next few seconds.
Fazit:
The mechanic is now extremely counterintuitive.
I suddenly wants people NOT to shoot at the bright glowing enemy.
This get's even more counterintuitive, when you consider that glowing enemies are usually begging to be fired on, like with Banshees Sonar, Novas Molecular Prime or Trinities very own Well of Life.
Sure, you can use Woll of Live to extend the enemies Live, but now you have to use both skills.
EV is now not a single Skill anymore, it's dependent on WoL.
In my opinion this dependence is similar to Rhinos Ground Slam and Stomp, before they were combined into a single Skill.
Sidenote:
Removing the necessety to attack the target makes EV very abusable.
Since you don't have to leave Stealth, when using Shade as your Sentinel, since Skills don't disrupt stealth mode, you can leach up to 100% energy capacity without the risk of being fired at.
- The second Problem is extending the duration of skills now hurts EV immensly.
I think EV is now the only skill, which can actively made less effective, by mods.
It get's even more crazy when you consider that every other skill of Trinity benefits greatly and thus encourages extending duration.
I'm using maxed Continuity, maxed Constitution and the Aura Hemlet.
And right now there are roughly four (4!) seconds between two pulses.
So, usually only the first pulse, which is instantanious on using the skill, get's activated, thus you loose 75% auf the Skills effect.
The Reasons:
So, why whould anybody think that those chages whould be a good idea?
The first thing that comes to mind is the try to give Trinity a more active ability.
Before she didn't have any ability which whould effect an enemy directly.
A good thought.
Of course, this begs for the question, did Trinity-players actually desire such skills?
If you didn't like her style, you had enough other Warframes to choose from.
Sidenote:
Stunning bosses is an incredibly bad idea for several reasons.
1. Players of other Frames will it call OP, and rightfully so.
2. What's the point in having a Bossfight, if the boss doesn't do anything?
This skill defeats the purpose of having Bossfights in the first place.
You could just as well playce a container with several thousand HP in the boss location, which then gives you loot after cracking it open.
Another reason that might be behind the changes could be a bottleneck, to prevent a single Trinity from making Energy Siphon and Energy Orbs absolutly unnecessary.
The old EV was able to recover massive amouts of energy in just a few seconds, if the Trinity player was smart enough to select the right targets.
Solutions:
-The first idea whould be the most simple. Change the way ernergy is gained back to how it was before the patch. That way, even if the stunned enemy is killed early, at least sombebody got back any energy.
-The second idea is, that the pulses go on, even if the enemy dies.
The problems with this solution are, for one, it whouldn't solve the problem that you get punished for using extended duartion. And it whould make the gameplay much slower since you often will have to wait at the corpse to get your energy.
-Idea number three, make the intervals between the pulses a fixed value.
With this is whould behave like other skills with an effect over time, like DoTs.
Extending it's duration whould thus result in additional pulses if the target is left alive.
Also, it reduces the chance of the target being killed before even the second pulse was able to happen.
-The fourth idea is actually based on something, which was said be Steve during a livestream, if i remeber right..
The topic was the new Aura system and the reason why he decided to reverse the mechanic of the Aura-Mods not using Mod-points up, but instead granting additional points.
The same idea could be used here.
Extended duration effect could REDUCE the time between pulses.
This whould greatly reduce the likelyhood of enemies dying before at least a bit of energy was restored.
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So, i ran some quick tests on Trinity, focusing on Energy Vampire, since the chages don't seem to add up and i found two, in my opinion, severe problems with the new skill.
- The first problem is, when the targeted enemy dies, every pulse left is lost.
This reduces the effect of the skill more often than not by 50%-75%.
If you are grouped up with a trigger happy bunch, or you all have a bunch of Sentinels with potatoed weapons, or your group has massive AoE-clearing potential, the skill becomes next to useless.
Since communication is unfortunatly not the strength of the Warframe community, it next to impossible to make them understand how this mechanic works, if they are not familiar with Trinity themself.
Fazit:
The mechanic is now extremely counterintuitive.
I suddenly wants people NOT to shoot at the bright glowing enemy.
This get's even more counterintuitive, when you consider that glowing enemies are usually begging to be fired on, like with Banshees Sonar, Novas Molecular Prime or Trinities very own Well of Life.
- The second Problem is, extending the duration of skills now hurts Energy vampire immensly.
I think EV is now the only skill, which can actively made less effective, by mods.
It get's even more crazy when you consider that every other skill of Trinity benefits greatly and thus encourages extending duration.
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I thought about including rare blueprints, like Forma, Catalyst or rare Warframe Parts, like Vaubans, but i decided to leave them out of my suggestion.
Let me explain:
You can get basically everything that effect the gameplay without spending money.
Even catalysts, reactors and rare Warframes like Vauban.
It might take a while and you might get srewed over if you are not at home, when an alertmission with a specific reward was available, and yes, this can be infuriating.
The thing about those rare blueprints is, i'm pretty sure, that those are what makes people spend the Platinum.
Of course, this is only an assumption based on my own way of thinking, i don't have any real numbers to prove this.
So i might be wrong and customisation items are the big money maschine.
Anyway, if i'm correct, then those rare items should remain rare,
since this is what finances the game.
The more possibilities to get them you add to your game, the lesser people will actually buy those items for platinum.
Whoch is why i think you have to be very, very carefull with adding those options.
This is the reason why i wrote this paragraph.
Also, the Boss could have a guaranteed drop of a blueprint.This way the chance to get the right blueprint raises to 1/3.
So the Hard-Key whould be basically a drop-chance-booster.
What whould make sense to add might be a guarantee for rare resources, stuff like Morphics, Control Modules, Neural Sensors, etc.
With an additional chance to drop a seconds piece of that resource.
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Before you implement something like that, you need to implement a system to choose a difficulty.
Coincidentally, i opend a topic on that subject just a few hours ago.
https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/70831-suggestion-the-hard-mode-key/
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Yes, but having to sell a warframe you farmed so hard... we all know it's a tough decision. If you know you coul dget it back, it is no more so tough.
Yeah, that's exacly the point. You HAVE to decide what you do, you have to think about it.
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A while ago, it was said in one of the live streams, that the Devs will definitly include a way to raise the difficulty of early Missions, but it was stated, that they were yet unsure how to do it.
There were some things said about sliders and the problem to determine the difficulty if everybody whould set their slider to different values and other problems.
So, now let's get to the actual suggestion, the Hard-Mode-Key.
I thought the Void-Key system could be expended to support choosing the difficulty.
Let's take a new Item, the Hard-Key.
It works similar to a Void-Key.
For each boss there whould be a Hard-Key.
Since it's the bosses which are the interesting stuff.
So i can't think of a reason which you whould want to play normal missions.
A player chooses a key and thus the boss he wants to fight, gets to the Lobby where friends and/or clanmembers can join him.
This way everybody in the group is aware of what they got into thus no sliders a needed.
Of course, just like Void-Keys the key is only consumed if the mission is a success and you need only one key for four people.
As i said, the Hard-Key works similar to the Void-Key.
What whould the Hard-Mode be like?
I'd suggest, it's the basically the same Boss assassination mission, but with all enemies set to the same level as on Pluto.
Of course with updated loot tables. (Those tables shouldn't be as good as the tables in the Void in order to prevent Void-Keys from loosing their value)
Also, the Boss could have a guaranteed drop of a blueprint.
This way the chance to get the right blueprint raises to 1/3.
So the Hard-Key whould be basically a drop-chance-booster.
How can you get a Hard-Key?
Again, just like the Void-Key, you should get them as Daily login rewards and as rewards for defense missions, raid missions, capture missions and so on.
Of course those key whould also be sold in the Shop,
but on the contrary to Void-Keys, those should be sold for ingame cr.
This whould then be a great way to spend the cr you don't need.
For example,
A Hard-Key-pack whould contain 5 Hard-Keys.
It whould be randomised for which bosses those keys will be for.
For example a pack could look like this:
- Captain Vor
- Jackal
- Sgt. Nef Anyo
- Sgt. Nef Anyo
- Ambulas
I think a good pricepoint whould be 100.000cr for a Pack.
They shouldn't be to cheap.
This way they still take some effort to get them.
Also it whould engourage sharing them with friends and the clan instead of soloing.
Also, this whould compensate for high level bosses like Ambulas now having a guaranteed chance for a blueprint, while the normal assassination mission whould be just as hard, but without the guarantee of a drop.
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Slots are not a problem, and therefore do not require a "solution".
Well said!
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Seriously... why are people complaining about the slot issue?
1. You have two slots at the beginning.
So you can keep one Warframe, get a new Warframe, play the new one, compare which one you like better, keep one Warframe,get a new Warframe, play the new one, compare which one you like better, keep one Warframe,get a new Warframe, play the new one, compare which one you like better, keep one Warframe,get a new Warframe, play the new one, compare which one you like better, keep one Warframe,get a new Warframe, play the new one, compare which one you like better, keep one Warframe,get a new Warframe, play the new one, compare which one you like better, keep one Warframe,get a new Warframe, play the new one, compare which one you like better, keep one Warframe,get a new Warframe, play the new one, compare which one you like better, keep one Warframe.... noticing a pattern?
2. You are given 50 Platinum for creating your account, which means you chould have gotten more Slot.
If you wasted your Platinum on something, it's really your won fault.
Or let's look at the other side, if you whould get more slots by default some people whould complain about not getting a Reactor or Catalyst at the beginning.
This way, you can choose.
3. The slots are ridiculous cheap!
Just buy some platinum and reward the devs for making a great game.
It's the old discussion of free2play games.
But the fact is, if you aren't paying, but you are using their product, then yes, the devs are totally right to treat you as a second grade customer.
And DE isn't even doing that.
They basically give YOU money in form of the 50 Platinum you get for creating your account.
the sky is falling, i know, League of Legends has nothing that can't be gotten ingame except cosmetics (gasp, same as WF) and they are making a killing.
The horror
You are right, this system works great for League of Legends.
You know what also works?
Monthly subscription for World of Warcraft.
But it's a fact, that those two games are the exception of their respective business model, not the rule.
In the last years we had a boom of monthy subscription MMO's.
Most of them were not able to make a profit.
Instead of pointing out the one lucky case where it actually works, you should take a closer look at all the cases where it didn't work out.
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My point is that you presented the argument as if mods would solve "gameplay styles".
They don't, stop pretending they do.
I'm not pretending that mods can fix gameplay styles,
I'm saying there is a good reason why they can't.
The Devs WANT the frames to have strengths and weaknesses.
Things like the nonstop sliding was an exploit to bypass a certain weakness of certain warframes.
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A Rhino is NEVER going to catch up with an (unmodded) Loki even with maxed Rush, Quick Rest and Marathon because he will have 1.2 sprint while Loki still has 1.6
And a Loki is NEVER going to be able to take as much punishment as a Rhino can take...
So, what's your point?
Different Warframes have different stats....
That's what makes them different from each other.
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To be honest, i don't see a problem here.
Some Frames are slower, OK.
But to counter that, there are enough mods which address just that.
Rush, Marathon, Quickrest...
If you want to move faster, you can.
If you want to be tanky instead, you can with using Redirect, Vitality, Steelfiber instead.
If you want to use a lot of skills, use Flow, Streamline, Focus and so on.
A Warframe has enough Mod slots to improve your stats in two out of these three possible playstyles.
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I really like the idea, especially if it whould have leaderboards for Clan member to compete.
I think a leaderboard whould solve the resouce problem.
This way whouldn't do VR missions in order to farm items, but to beat your clan members time.
The option to try weapons you don't own is also a great idea.
Right now, it's OK to get a new weapon without knowing how it feels, since there aren't that many.
But since Update 8 quite a lot new ones were added, if the dev team keeps this pace up, it whould get confusing very soon.
A rental system is definetly needed in the future and these VR missions seem to be a great place to implement them.
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Well, maybe it doesn't just concern Orthos, but other melee weapons as well, didn't try it, since i'm busy leveling Orthos. xD
So, what is my concern?
The problem i noticed is, when a Vauban lifts enemies in the air with his Bastille Skill, they become very hard to hit with Orthos.
Charge attacks almost never hit.
They tend to connect better, if you step a bit away from your target, but since the attack moves you a step forward you have to move away after your attack in order to hit again.
Normal attacks, at least in Orthos case, seem to connect easier.
Maybe this is because of the over head attack?
I'm not sure, if every single part of Orthos combo has it's own area of effect,
but it seems to me, that the vertical attack hits more reliable.
Another thing i noticed, the bigger Girneer, like Trooper and Lancer seem to be harder to hit than for example Infested Charger or Leaper.
Maybe Grineer get elevated higher since they are taller?
In any case, most attacks tend to go through the enemies feet, but they don't do any damage.
If, what i noticed is actually true, it might already be solved, if the height
P.S.:
Vauban and Orthos are both awesome.
The team did a really great job on both of those.
Just wanted to get that out of the way.
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I agree that Forma should cost less.
Let's compare them to a Orokin Reactor or Catalyst.
In Terms of a Platinum/Additional Power ratio, a Reactor/Catalyst give additional 30 Points for additional mods, while a Forma whould give you ~5 points (depending on the mod) which then can be used to get additional Mods into you Warframe/Weapon.
In addition to improving your existing equipment, Forma can be used to build new weapons from the Dojo research.
And in further addition, you can spend Forma on building your Dojo.
So all things considered, Forma don't just have a worse Platinum/Efficency ratio when used to improve equipment,
they can also be dumped into other things, which means a player needs many more Forma, than he needs Reactors/Catalsts.
In my opinion, Forma should be sold as Bundles,
20 Platinum for 5 Forma.
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OK, i think now it should be possible to invite me to the caln.
Please try again to invite me.
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This clan looks really interesting.
I'd like to join.
IGN: Walkampf
Trinity - Why The New Energy Vampire Doesn't Fit Into The Game!
in Warframes
Posted · Edited by Walkampf
You are right, there are enough other means to get energy.
The same goes for health.
The same goes for damage.
So why not just remove every single Skill from the game and only use Weapons and pickups, since, technically, you do not need any of the skills, since the game has to be designed in a way, so every possible conbination of warframes is able to successfully finish a mission.
The skills, as a matter of fact are nothing but a way to break up the monotony of the gunplay and in a way that they make sense.
The control is neccesary, since using a skill then rewards the player with a feeling of success when he sees that the skill worked out how he intended it.
On the other hand, if you use a skill, which then results in nothing, you just feel bad.
This is the same no matter if the skill you used was Baubans Vortex, which you missed the enemy with,
or if you used EV and nobody cared for it.
The only difference is, in the case of vortex, it's your very own vault for not making it work.
In EVs case, this can even occur if you did everything right.