Nezha Tweak

[Renoue]

Just a few tweaks here and there 😉

Passive - Fire Walker
    Nezha's abilities ignite the ground beneath his feet with his Wind Fire Wheels, gaining a 10% movement speed bonus for 5 seconds and leaving behind a trail of fire that lasts for 5 seconds.
    Enemies that walk over the flames are briefly stunned. Against enemies inside the trail, all inflicted Heat damage will be multiplied by 150%.
    Casting another ability while Fire Walker is active will refresh its 5 second timer.

1 - Blazing Chakram (25 energy)
    Nezha throws his Universe Ring which inflicts 100 / 150 / 200 / 250 Heat damage upon impact. The chakram will ricochet off an enemy or object once before returning.
    Tapping the button initiates the ability cast immediately.
    Holding the button for up to 2 seconds allows Nezha to charge Blazing Chakram causing it to ricochet up to 4 more times.
    If Blazing Chakram is activated again by pressing the ability key while the chakram is in flight, Nezha will teleport to its current position.

2 - Righteous Energy (25 energy, 2 energy / 1 second)
    Nezha taps into his Righteous Energy, significantly boosting his spirit and resistance.
    While active, Nezha gains 20% / 25% / 30% / 35% damage reduction and his critical chance is increased by 10% / 15% / 20% / 25%.

3 - Warding Halo (75 energy)
    Nezha summons a fiery ring with 500 / 650 / 750 / 900 base health that encircles himself and provides immunity to damage and status effects.
    Nezha's total Energy multiplied by 500% is also added to the ring's health. Upon activation, Warding Halo is invulnerable for 1.5 / 2 / 3 / 3 seconds.
    While invulnerable, any enemy damage prevented during this time accumulates into a total pool.
    After the invulnerability phase, Nezha receives the Armillary Flame buff which adds Heat damage to his attacks lasting for the full duration of Warding Halo.
    Armillary Flame adds 50% Heat damage to Nezha's attacks, plus extra Heat damage converted from total damage prevented at a rate of 10% per 100 damage points prevented.
    Armillary Flame's Heat damage is capped at 400%.
    Warding Halo will expire when the ring's health is depleted.
    
4 - Divine Spears (100 energy)
    Spears of light burst from the ground, impaling enemies within a radius of 10 / 13 / 16 / 19 meters and inflicting 150 / 300 / 450 / 600 puncture damage.
    Impaled enemies are incapacitated for 6 / 8 / 10 / 12 seconds.
    After the ability duration expires or Divine Spears is deactivated by pressing the ability key again, impaled enemies are dealt 20% of their missing health as Heat damage with a 100% status chance.

Edited August 30, 2018 by Renoue

[Potoryu]

Buff Nezha, Please!

[Syasob]

Righteous Energy's damage resistance doesn't look useful. Ability to charge skill for double buff with limited duration instead of channeling sounds good enough. imho.

[Femuru]

ima be honest after i watched life of rio video recently and DE try to tell him nezha is ok, i died laughing. in all seriousness nezha does need some serious tweaks/buffs, i honestly just think there arent enough nezha players to really complain about him or that at this point no one really just takes the frame seriously no more and just dont really talk about him unless its about a certain joke to get banned in all chat. But seriously DE nezha isnt in a ok spot like at all, ppl tested him in endurance runs ending horribly, and i even see some ppl complaining about him in just normal missions. with the deluxe skin coming soon we can all hope and pray but we will probly all be damned cuz nezha not the only in need of a good rework lol

[Renoue]

It's true that there arent that many Nezha players, but I think DE forgot one important detail.

Nezha isn't just a Chinese god. He is the god damn "Third Lotus Prince". 

He should rank as one of the top 3 Warframes, but instead he is considered by many players as the weakest Warframe in the game to the point where he has become a joke.

[Renoue]

The Third LOTUS Prince!

The original Nezha is the Warframe used by the Lotus's most devoted child.

He should definitely be the second Umbra Warframe in response to what just happened at the end of Sacrifice.

 

 

[Tiltskillet]

Haha, "tweak", yeah.

There's some good ideas here, IMO, but any DE rework that dumped Fire Walker / Pyroclastic Flow would make for a sad Tiltskillet.

[mactrent]

I like the idea of baking Firewalker into his passive, though I'm not sure under what circumstances it's activated.  Would that be whenever he slides?  That said, would be sad to see Pyro Flow go, because, effectiveness aside, it's just plain fun to use, and Nezha is all about fun.  Not sure I have a suggestion for working it in, there.

I also like the damage resistance idea (which, since we can't recast the halo, would at least let us plan for when it goes down), and the crit chance looks nice.  If it's a flat +25% to all weapons, though, that would be pretty powerful.  A "+25% of base" crit chance would be near nothing, with other mods equipped on anything but melee... which actually makes sense.

The spears dealing some kind of scaling damage would be awesome too, and I don't see anything about a de-cast animation here, which is nice.

+1 for reasonable improvements on a solid kit.

5 hours ago, ShenRyujin said:

But seriously DE nezha isnt in a ok spot like at all, ppl tested him in endurance runs ending horribly, and i even see some ppl complaining about him in just normal missions.

Nezha is my most-used frame at MR 25, and I also see quite a few people play him, especially in the Plains.  He doesn't have to be the meta to be awesome at his strengths, nor does he need to be "top-tier" to be a good warframe.  Jack of all trades and all that.  I'd be very glad if we got some improvements, but I'll be playing him regardless, because he's far from useless and he's just plain fun.  There is lots of complaining (or rather just meme-ing) about either his appearance or his "discount Rhino" status, but I can't agree he's not in a good place overall.

He may be on the below-average side when it comes to objective effectiveness, but he has sensible strengths and weaknesses, with plenty of options he can leverage to get past Sortie 3.  Endurance runs are largely irrelevant as an argument - most people don't do them, and not all frames are expected to do all that well on them.  Nezha not being on the "scaling approved" list (though close to it, for his CC) does not mean anything to most players... and for endurance runners, a run simply doesn't "end horribly" unless you're doing some sort of "no operator", "no cc powers" or "limited weapons" challenge.  You can't die with operators around, and our weapons scale better than pretty much any frame.  He's far from useless.

One thing missing from most of these arguments (aside from slide-y-ness that does get mentioned) is that he's just so extremely fun to play.  Movement is power, and his slide alone is a blast to master.  I've taken to adding Maglev to other frames because it's so great.  His abilities provide a unique dimension for melee, real benefits in fairly specific situations (healing & teleport), some first-rate proc/knockdown protection, and pretty strong and portable damage protection.  All of those just feel really good to master.  His 4 is so simple (damage on low levels, CC on higher ones) that design thinking at the time said it needed a second cast animation as a drawback, which is just an annoyance factor.  I'd be glad to see that go away.  That aside, he's just plain fun.

[Femuru]

4 hours ago, mactrent said:

Nezha is my most-used frame at MR 25, and I also see quite a few people play him, especially in the Plains.  He doesn't have to be the meta to be awesome at his strengths, nor does he need to be "top-tier" to be a good warframe.  Jack of all trades and all that.  I'd be very glad if we got some improvements, but I'll be playing him regardless, because he's far from useless and he's just plain fun.  There is lots of complaining (or rather just meme-ing) about either his appearance or his "discount Rhino" status, but I can't agree he's not in a good place overall.

He may be on the below-average side when it comes to objective effectiveness, but he has sensible strengths and weaknesses, with plenty of options he can leverage to get past Sortie 3.  Endurance runs are largely irrelevant as an argument - most people don't do them, and not all frames are expected to do all that well on them.  Nezha not being on the "scaling approved" list (though close to it, for his CC) does not mean anything to most players... and for endurance runners, a run simply doesn't "end horribly" unless you're doing some sort of "no operator", "no cc powers" or "limited weapons" challenge.  You can't die with operators around, and our weapons scale better than pretty much any frame.  He's far from useless.

One thing missing from most of these arguments (aside from slide-y-ness that does get mentioned) is that he's just so extremely fun to play.  Movement is power, and his slide alone is a blast to master.  I've taken to adding Maglev to other frames because it's so great.  His abilities provide a unique dimension for melee, real benefits in fairly specific situations (healing & teleport), some first-rate proc/knockdown protection, and pretty strong and portable damage protection.  All of those just feel really good to master.  His 4 is so simple (damage on low levels, CC on higher ones) that design thinking at the time said it needed a second cast animation as a drawback, which is just an annoyance factor.  I'd be glad to see that go away.  That aside, he's just plain fun.

sorry but mr 25 or any mr dont usually convince me, ive seen ppl stay at mr 16 for a straight year and i seen some ppl rush their mr lvl so fast they go past 20 in like 3 months. im mr 20 but im not gonna go telling ppl i know everything in this game and just show what i tested on myself (not tryna be mean right here im only stating). But of course if you enjoy a frame i will never tell you not to play him (depends if yur on my team for a endurance) if you enjoy yourself thats absolutely fine, however as another player with my own opinion im just saying if i feel a frame is trashy, it tested trashy for me, i want to make trash a treasure hey thats just me.

As for the endurance run argument, ok i know that always a argument players get into but just let me state my point of view for a sec. why i think endurance runs are really important to evaluate a warframe kit is because

1. endurance runs is where ppl test their absolute skill, early lvl never give a challenge and what allow the players to go beyond their limits? because a large amount of warframe allows for it, some frame kits are beyond amazing where it only needs the players skill, some have good scaling so to the place where the weakest enemy can one shot u with a single bullet but some ppl can go thru it show how a frame is really that good. 

2. as i was saying skill, mechanics, and scaling these are what ppl will rely on in a endurance. now say it doesnt matter at all and we never have to worry about that kind of stuff then technically everyone just trolling if they dont have a nuke build. lets face it even sorties or flood kuva are too boring at times since well majority of frames could just nuke the map as it is cause nothing scaled hard enough. if content isnt hard we dont need any cc frames at all because it just slows the mission just like bringing a slowva to hydron. whats the point in having scaling abilities wen all enemies can die in a flat sec? what the point in a mechanic frame like limbo at all in the game when his kit is made for super high lvl with alot of skill needed? the game would be even more boring at this point just nuke everything cuz we shouldnt care about skill, mechanics, or scaling stuff anymore cuz we never have to go against anything hard enough.

3. misconception of what endurance runners want sometimes. some people think endurance runners just wanna make fun of a frame then leave, endurance runners want a full rework getting rid of a frame, endurance runners are too hard core. . . ok the last one ill give in to but let me simply explain. what endurance runners really want is just for some horrible frames to be GOOD we arent trying to argue (even tho that wat some ppl wanna do) we just want maybe a mechanic, buff, or scaling added cuz we literally just want all frames to actually be good. cuz lets face it anything not in endurance is ok because the content isnt hard enough so anything all over the starmap ppl could bring watever i could literally finish the whole starmap with only a mk1 braton. so if everything is ok we should never need to ask for any rework on ANYTHING why? nothing is hard enough and anything works fine, if im only to look at regular missions hell ill add sortie and kuva flood then everything works no frame needs a rework cuz its easily manageable would end up being my argument for anyone wanting a rework/buff/tweak.

I just genuinely think nezha is not ok its just my opinion. your opinion is that he is fun and i respect that but from my point of view i think nezha needs something added, a buff, a rework, anything good really. 

Edited August 30, 2018 by ShenRyujin

[mactrent]

8 minutes ago, ShenRyujin said:

sorry but mr 25 or any mr dont usually convince me

Well, rushing MR may be as it may, but the point is I've tried all the frames, so I at least know somewhat of what I'm talking about.  And I've played long enough to do that, and still have Nezha as most-used, so I've certainly spent a lot of time as him.  I don't need to convince you or anyone of anything but those two statements, and wasn't trying to.

I'm not unsympathetic to your endurance desires, but "not ok" just doesn't fit this frame.  Even without the fun factor he excels in, he's still extremely strong and useful in all the game content up to and including sortie 3.  Asking for more than that would be a bonus (and one I'd like to see), but far, far from a requirement in the current Warframe.

Edited August 30, 2018 by mactrent

[Femuru]

10 minutes ago, mactrent said:

Well, rushing MR may be as it may, but the point is I've tried all the frames, so I at least know somewhat of what I'm talking about.  And I've played long enough to do that, and still have Nezha as most-used, so I've certainly spent a lot of time as him.  I don't need to convince you or anyone of anything but those two statements, and wasn't trying to.  I'm not unsympathetic to your endurance desires, but "not ok" just doesn't fit this frame.  Even without the fun factor he excels in, he's still extremely strong and useful in all the game content up to and including sortie 3.  Asking for more than that would be a bonus (and one I'd like to see), but far, far from a requirement in the current Warframe.

again just different opinions ill respect that you enjoy the frame, have him as most played, or any opinion on him. however nezha currently in my opinion is still not in a good spot and think he needs a good buff or atleast some really good tweaks. i tested him in long runs, done so with a team, few setups and havent found him that useful. also again just my opinion again but i dont think sortie 3 is no where difficult enough to really evaluate a frame, im not saying your wrong and im not saying im right just what i think. plus i feel u dint even bother reading my post lol

Edited August 30, 2018 by ShenRyujin

[Jalen1104]

Nezhas one is actually good cc for survival and I wouldn't change it. I love the speed and turning everything to ash around me but that's where the positives end. His augment is like equinoxs fourth ability except in the form of a tiny strip of bacon. His two is not actually visible usible in time to prevent an enemy at level 100+ from killing what little health you should be surprised to have kept. The teleport is so awesome but the ring cant really travel far enough to matter and in closed spaces it just won't work. His third ability is just a trash version of rhino skin. Rhino can reapply it and its stronger. Nezhas fourth ability is the worst of all. Long casting time (am issue with all of his abilities except his 2), low radius, and that awful second animation you get locked into just slows down what is supposed to be a speedy frame. It should just be turned into a flash of light. Nezha is so dear to me and I want to see him do better.

[mactrent]

1 hour ago, ShenRyujin said:

plus i feel u dint even bother reading my post lol

I didn't quote the whole thing, but I read it twice before responding, and I don't really see how it changes anything I said.  Different opinions, agreed - you and I are talking about entirely different games at this point.  Your Warframe doesn't start until all non- or slow-scaling damage abilities are irrelevant and CC and twitch skill are all that matters.  It takes a lot of time just to get to your game.  Mine is the game the devs build for/around, and the one most of the players play, most of the time.

Even in your game, I'm at a loss as to how you could not find Nezha useful, for any definition of 'useful' that half the other frames would fit.  True, he doesn't have scaling damage, but very few frames do, and most of those hit a hard or soft cap long before level 200, so it's not like he's the worst here.  His CC alone is useful; not the best, but useful.  If you want 100% effective CC, play Limbo - everything else has a trade-off or a weakness just like his does.

If you want to talk about scaling in general, maybe make your own thread about what you'd like end-game (and frames designed towards it) to look like.  I'd be glad to brainstorm and discuss with you on such a thread.  🙂