To Help People Understand The Logic Of Changed In Patch 9.8

[FoxyKabam]

Patch 9.8

Why would they ever do this!?!?!?!?

 

Answer: The game is being changed, they have listened to all of our whines and complaints about the game being too easy and frames not being viable enough for anything. So what they seem to have done is create a method in which add much more value to individual frames.

 

Example: Trinity is now the bread and butter of health and energy regen.

 

ember would like to have a word with you

 

 

either way

gotta wait and see whats going on with update 10 far as armor or damage goes

Edited September 7, 2013 by FoxyKabam

[VKhaun]

You ever tried taking a low-level frame, and unmodded guns to a Grineer Galleon level? Seriously?

 

When do you have TIME to open all of those lockers when you are constantly under fire?

 

Corpus Ships aren't so bad, but My God, the Galleons... you can't take 5 seconds without something shooting at you, especially once you get to Earth. And once you get to Earth, that means Napalms, 5-6 per mission if you're lucky. Nearly 10 of them if you're not. And don't forget, Heavy Gunners are there too! These eat ammo like crazy.

 

On Mercury, you have Sawmen that are harder to kill than Lancers (they take nearly twice as many shots).

 

EDIT: And try to remember: RIFLE DAMAGE MODS DO NOT DROP UNTIL MARS/SATURN/JUPITER unless you get lucky in Vay Hek's level like I did, but once.

 

 

So what you're saying is, the whole game is fine but noobs need to start with Serration, Point Blank, Killing Blow, Pressure Point and Hornet Strike.

[icosta27]

PSA: Hyperbole is not an argument or a substitute for a real point.

 

I have half a mind to just blame this whole derail to whining about ammo/orb drops on the rusher mentality that's taking over public games. I can't imagine placing my shots and using melee on some enemies, while looting lockers and breaking containers and still having ammo problems with normal weapons. I feel like the only way a rational person could say they have ammo problems or that noobies won't be able to craft ammo boxes is if they're skipping all the materials, ammo, and creds in the lockers and breakable containers +/- skipping some of the enemies.

+1

[icosta27]

ember would like to have a word with you

 

 

either way

gotta wait and see whats going on with update 10 far as armor or damage goes

I did 5,687 Damage to a level 60 infested with a 25 power ability with Ember. Please for the love of god don't start complaining about her lmao

[Xylia]

No, you don't. If you put in the effort to learn the builds,

 

Builds? What "Builds" does a newbie have? He's got Excalibur, Mag, or Loki with Vitality. That's it.

 

His Rifle will have nothing but Ammo Drum and Fast Hands.

 

His Pistol? He will choose between Heated Charge, Trick Mag, Convulsion, or the reload mod whose name escapes me at the moment.

 

learn the mods, farm the mods, level the mods,

 

Uh... In Mod Drop 2.0, are you aware of the fact that Rifle Damage Mods will not drop until Vay Hek's level at the very earliest? You can't get a Redirection until Level 20.

 

learn each damage type, armor, elemental resistances & damage.

 

Learning the damage types doesn't help you when you have no mods that do those damage types.

 

You will not be on this forum complaining to me about this right now. Yes the learning curve is steep, I find it to be motivational to learn more and sometimes find things no one else seems to know about. That's what unique about this game. That's like saying in World of Warcraft we should have a potion that gives me MAX MANA at 1 click because my mana runs out when I attack things!!!! (Seeing how noob friendly that game is now i'm quite sure there is something like that) But point being, your complaining over accusations in which only one who doesn't try or puts in any effort would complain about. If you don't want to try, you can purchase everything you want. You don't want to try or purchase anything, then this may not be your game?

 

Stop saying this is about me.

 

I'm trying to make this game better for newbies who this game NEEDS.

 

We need Newbies who join Warframe to see that this is an awesome game, not "OMG WTF IS THIS CRAP?" when he gets killed and keeps running out of ammo constantly.

[Xylia]

So what you're saying is, the whole game is fine but noobs need to start with Serration, Point Blank, Killing Blow, Pressure Point and Hornet Strike.

 

I never said that. Though, I think at the very least, SOME type of Rifle Damage should drop earlier than Vay Hek. When I say Damage, I mean ANY type of damage -- Raw Damage, Ice, Fire, Lightning, or Armor Pierce. SOMETHING that makes the gun do more damage. Face it, trying to keep a Lv15 Napalm doing 20 unmodded damage a shot is ridiculous. With headshots, it takes nearly two clips from a Braton to kill ONE Napalm. That's 90 shots. I've seen missions on Earth that spawned TEN of the damn things.

 

I'm saying that Galleon levels are ridiculous enough without making Ammo and Health drops even more scarce than they were before.

 

They throw way too many mobs at a newbie, to expect them to do it now, with LESS ammo and health than before. It was Ridiculous before (like I said, Scott himself said he tried it and he agrees it needs attention), now it is.... what, even more Ridiculous? Dunno what other word one could use for this.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Xylia

[icosta27]

Are these questions real? I have every frame, Forma'd pretty much all of them, same with weapons meaning I had to level all of those frames, meaning they didn't have any cards on them (sometimes I take them off all the way up to 30 besides powers to make it more interesting) and I still have a fantastic time playing and whoop butt. Are people joining the game, going to outer terminus immediately with level 1's then coming to this forum. I can't comprehend this whatsoever lmao

 

Edited September 7, 2013 by icosta27

[Xylia]

 

Are these questions real? I have every frame, Forma'd pretty much all of them, same with weapons meaning I had to level all of those frames, meaning they didn't have any cards on them (sometimes I take them off all the way up to 30 besides powers to make it more interesting) and I still have a fantastic time playing and whoop butt. Are people joining the game, going to outer terminus immediately with level 1's then coming to this forum. I can't comprehend this whatsoever lmao

 

 

 

You leveled this crap before Update 9. Durrr.

 

Try creating a new account, and take Excalibur, and see how much of a fun time you have trying to get up to Europa.

 

Go ahead, try it. See how awesome that Braton with no damage mods is after you farm the 25,000 credits to buy it. And no cheating, no buying platinum. This isn't Pay-2-Win, the game should be viable even without plat purchases.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Xylia

[icosta27]

Builds? What "Builds" does a newbie have? He's got Excalibur, Mag, or Loki with Vitality. That's it.

 

His Rifle will have nothing but Ammo Drum and Fast Hands.

 

His Pistol? He will choose between Heated Charge, Trick Mag, Convulsion, or the reload mod whose name escapes me at the moment.

 

 

 

 

Uh... In Mod Drop 2.0, are you aware of the fact that Rifle Damage Mods will not drop until Vay Hek's level at the very earliest? You can't get a Redirection until Level 20.

 

 

 

 

Learning the damage types doesn't help you when you have no mods that do those damage types.

 

 

 

 

Stop saying this is about me.

 

I'm trying to make this game better for newbies who this game NEEDS.

 

We need Newbies who join Warframe to see that this is an awesome game, not "OMG WTF IS THIS CRAP?" when he gets killed and keeps running out of ammo constantly.

By acting childish and raging about this stuff creates controversy and strain expecially for the devs. If the issue is noobs not getting the game, they need to up there game and learn it there are PLENTY of ways to learn it such as I have, tutorials i'm sure will be added later. But crying about the game being too hard when it is in fact too easy at the moment is the opposite of what you should be talking about. If the game is too hard right now, that is a GOOD thing and use that as initiative to get better. Once you get to the point where you say the game is too easy then you will know exactly what I'm talking about...

[icosta27]

You leveled this crap before Update 9. Durrr.

 

Try creating a new account, and take Excalibur, and see how much of a fun time you have trying to get up to Europa.

 

Go ahead, try it. See how awesome that Braton with no damage mods is after you farm the 25,000 credits to buy it. And no cheating, no buying platinum. This isn't Pay-2-Win, the game should be viable even without plat purchases.

I joined the game after update 9.. kthx.

[Xylia]

By acting childish and raging about this stuff creates controversy and strain expecially for the devs. If the issue is noobs not getting the game, they need to up there game and learn it there are PLENTY of ways to learn it such as I have, tutorials i'm sure will be added later. But crying about the game being too hard when it is in fact too easy at the moment is the opposite of what you should be talking about. If the game is too hard right now, that is a GOOD thing and use that as initiative to get better. Once you get to the point where you say the game is too easy then you will know exactly what I'm talking about...

 

The game is "Too Easy" For Veterans and those who have awesome mods and guns.

 

Scott himself tried the Newbie Experience recently and he said that it "needs attention".

 

The game is too ridiculous for newbies until they get to Mars and Jupiter.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Xylia

[Xylia]

I joined the game after update 9.. kthx.

 

Before or after Mod Drop 2.0?

 

Because I'm questioning just how fast you're claiming to have procured and leveled every stinking frame, lol.

 

Mod Drop 2.0 is a huge part of why newbies' lives are hell right now. Before, you could get Redirection (one of the most important mods for a newbie) in Lv1 missions. Mod Drop 2.0? Nope, gotta wait until Lv20. Rifle Damage mods... you used to get lots of Piercing Hits on Mercury. You won't, anymore. Gotta wait until Mars.

[icosta27]

 

The game is "Too Easy" For Veterans and those who have awesome mods and guns.

 

Scott himself tried the Newbie Experience recently and he said that it "needs attention".

 

The game is too ridiculous for newbies until they get to Mars and Jupiter.

I haven't spent a dime on a weapon or item that has helped me "win" the game. What the heck is giving you such a hard time. What is your purpose of argument here. Do you want unlimited ammo, invulnerability, 100% regen, 100% speed, 10000% Damage, Full Body Weakspots? Stop being a baby and complaining about it, either put the effort into getting better like all of us have or play something else. Jeeze.

[Xylia]

I haven't spent a dime on a weapon or item that has helped me "win" the game. What the heck is giving you such a hard time. What is your purpose of argument here. Do you want unlimited ammo, invulnerability, 100% regen, 100% speed, 10000% Damage, Full Body Weakspots? Stop being a baby and complaining about it, either put the effort into getting better like all of us have or play something else. Jeeze.

 

Now look at who is throwing hyperbole around.

 

Do this: Strip the mods off your Excalibur except for Ability Mods, grab your Braton, AkLato (or a single Lato, your choice), and some 1-handed sword, strip all the mods off of them.

 

Unequip your Sentinel.

Unequip your Aura Mod.

 

Once you've done so, place the following on your stuff:

 

(Ak)Lato: Heated Charge, rank 2-3. Quickdraw, rank 3.

Braton: Ammo Drum, Rank 3. Fast Hands, rank 2.

1h Sword: Pressure Point, Rank2.

Warframe: Vitality, Rank3.

 

This is a typical newbie setup with Mod Drop 2.0.

 

Go to Earth, and try E Prime, in SOLO mode.

 

If you can, make a video of it!

Edited September 7, 2013 by Xylia

[VKhaun]

You leveled this crap before Update 9. Durrr.

 

Try creating a new account, and take Excalibur, and see how much of a fun time you have trying to get up to Europa.

 

Go ahead, try it. See how awesome that Braton with no damage mods is after you farm the 25,000 credits to buy it. And no cheating, no buying platinum. This isn't Pay-2-Win, the game should be viable even without plat purchases.

 

I just Forma'd ignis and leveled it for a mission on Earth-Eurasia with no mods at all. Every time I forma something I do something like that. In fact, slotting a high level serration mod into a V polarity + potato still takes more points than 0, and even more points than it takes to slot a rank 0 serration mod you just found...

 

It sounds to me like you want to progress from Mercury to Europa way too fast. I'm now about 90% sure I can write you off to the rusher problem one way or another.

[Xylia]

I just Forma'd ignis and leveled it for a mission on Earth-Eurasia with no mods at all. Every time I forma something I do something like that. In fact, slotting a high level serration mod into a V polarity + potato still takes more points than 0, and even more points than it takes to slot a rank 0 serration mod you just found...

 

It sounds to me like you want to progress from Mercury to Europa way too fast. I'm now about 90% sure I can write you off to the rusher problem one way or another.

 

......?

 

"Way too Fast"?

 

Just how slowly do you think a newbie should have to go to get to Europa?

 

And I am by far not a rusher. On Corpus Ships, I scour every room. I know where all the loot rooms are, and by God, I open every dang locker I come across unless doing so puts my life in danger (like when I'm being swarmed by mobs). Heck, tell you what, if this thing ever gets done updating, I'll even Twitch some Abbadon runs (I've been farming Control Mods with my new Ash) to show you I'm not a rusher.

 

And Eurasia? LOL!

 

That's a good one. Lemme guess, you had a modded-out Warframe that you could just "Press 4 to kill everything nearby" (yanno, unlike the starter frames have?) if crap hit the fan? I bet you had a good modded out melee weapon in case you ran out of ammo or something, too.

 

Protip: Infested were never difficult in the first place. Try an Unranked Braton on Grineer. You'll find it a hell of a lot harder.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Xylia

[Jinart]

People seem to be extremely confused here. What I say is not 100% proof nor am I speaking for DE in anyway. But some people, such as I can obviously see what's going on.. and applaud DE for the step on the right direction.

 

Patch 9.8

 

- Ammo Boxes taken out of game.

- Ammo dropping much less in-game.

- Health & Energy dropping much less in game.  (So it seems at least)

 

Why would they ever do this!?!?!?!?

 

Answer: The game is being changed, they have listened to all of our whines and complaints about the game being too easy and frames not being viable enough for anything. So what they seem to have done is create a method in which add much more value to individual frames.

 

Example: Trinity is now the bread and butter of health and energy regen.

 

Ammo drops/Boxes?

 

- Seems to me they have taken this out because it's a much too easy way to regain ammo AND since Necro's new skill increases loot gain, i'm guessing that (plus scavenger/ammo mutation mods) will be as important as they should be instead of just clicking a box and back to full ammo.

 

What they may replace it with? - Could be much smaller ammo boxes? 30-50 bullets? Not sure. But I understand it completely and i'm glad they are making things more difficult as well as making the useless frames useful. Except Volt... He's just a benchwarmer for me at the moment. Nevertheless..

 

Next up Vaubans "Nerf"

 

Bastile Count - People have been stating this has ruined the frame. Now, please before even commenting anymore on it. Get on warframe, get on Vauban, Start using Vortex.. and tell me how many times you even need to use Bastile.. nuff said on that one.

 

This thread is not to complain. If you are confused at a change. Post it and either myself or someone who understands it may reply and answer it. (The complaint / confusion threads I believe have gotten out of hand and can easily be rectified by keeping it in one area. IMO)

 

Thanks.

 

*Update --> (DERebecca Post) - https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/102882-last-chance-gear-faq/

 

1) What does it mean that there is "Last Chance" Gear?

 

We are overhauling the Gear system in Warframe. The current system of getting Gear needs to be updated.

 

2) What happens to my old Gear when the new system comes?

 

You will still be able to use all Gear - it will carry over to the new system.

 

3) Should I stock up on Gear while I can?

 

It's up to you. We will be making this type of content available in a different way in the new system, so it's not like you will never again be able to get Gear!

 

4) What is the new Gear system going to be?

 

We are eying the Foundry as the method of acquiring Gear.

 

^-- They are not taking ammo boxes out of the game. There you go.

 

I played Vauban like you asked, and all I can say is...

 

No, you play a high level infested defense mission and try to last against them, I only got through by spamming vortex since it doesn't annoy others anymore! I no longer enjoy my favorite frame!! This makes me very disappointed in DE for the extreme game changing update that mostly threw our play styles out the window.

[VKhaun]

......?

 

"Way too Fast"?

 

Just how slowly do you think a newbie should have to go to get to Europa?

 

And I am by far not a rusher. On Corpus Ships, I scour every room. I know where all the loot rooms are, and by God, I open every dang locker I come across unless doing so puts my life in danger (like when I'm being swarmed by mobs). Heck, tell you what, if this thing ever gets done updating, I'll even Twitch some Abbadon runs (I've been farming Control Mods with my new Ash) to show you I'm not a rusher.

 

And Eurasia? LOL!

 

That's a good one. Lemme guess, you had a modded-out Warframe that you could just "Press 4 to kill everything nearby" (yanno, unlike the starter frames have?) if crap hit the fan? I bet you had a good modded out melee weapon in case you ran out of ammo or something, too.

 

Protip: Infested were never difficult in the first place. Try an Unranked Braton on Grineer. You'll find it a hell of a lot harder.

 

 

 

You're not arguing anything, you're just spouting hyperbole and hypotheticals. If all you have is a no-mods inaccurate spray rifle, no, you should not be fighting Grineer on earth and no you should not be on Europa yet? Excalibur's #1 isn't a 'Press 1 to kill everything nearby"? 150 serrated blade damage right out of the box after one mission on Mercury?

 

Make a statement or stop quoting me like you're answering something.

Edited September 7, 2013 by VKhaun

[CloudPies]

What happened to you justification of ember's nerf?! I demand to be pacified!!!!

[Xylia]

You're not arguing anything, you're just spouting hyperbole and hypotheticals. If all you have is a no-mods inaccurate spray rifle, no, you should not be fighting Grineer on earth and no you should not be on Europa yet? Excalibur's #1 isn't a 'Press 1 to kill everything nearby"? 150 serrated blade damage right out of the box after one mission on Mercury?

 

Make a statement or stop quoting me like you're answering something.

 

"You should not be fighting Grineer on Earth"

 

Uh.... dude.... are you missing the fact, that...

 

1). Your ONLY choices in Primary Weapons are Strun, Braton, MK1-Braton,

2). You cannot make ANYTHING ELSE until Mars, Saturn, or Jupiter (because ALL Primary Weapons require Salvage, Plastids, or Nano Spores)?

 

If you're not supposed to use an unmodded spray gun on Earth, then praytell what DO you use as a Newbie? And try to remember, NO RIFLE DAMAGE MODS WILL DROP UNTIL AFTER EARTH.

 

Is any of this sinking into your thick skull yet?

 

And yes, Slash Dash is good, but it doesn't instantly kill anything nearby. In fact, sometimes, if there's something standing too close to you, you kill 1-3 mobs in front of you and that's it, because sometimes Slash Dash won't actually Dash. It just Slashes after dashing like 2 feet.

 

And the "Statement" I'm trying to make:

 

The game is too hard for Newbies who have no guns (aside from Latos and Bratons), no mods, and no way to kill the crap they are expected to face on Earth and Saturn before 9.8 and now it is even worse.

 

That is, unless, they get carried. But what fun is being carried? It isn't fun. And that's assuming they can find somebody to carry them.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Xylia

[Valkyrion]

There is thing that is called "Melee"

[VKhaun]

"You should not be fighting Grineer on Earth"

 

Uh.... dude.... are you missing the fact, that...

 

1). Your ONLY choices in Primary Weapons are Strun, Braton, MK1-Braton,

2). You cannot make ANYTHING ELSE until Mars, Saturn, or Jupiter (because ALL Primary Weapons require Salvage, Plastids, or Nano Spores)?

 

If you're not supposed to use an unmodded spray gun on Earth, then praytell what DO you use as a Newbie? And try to remember, NO RIFLE DAMAGE MODS WILL DROP UNTIL AFTER EARTH.

 

Is any of this sinking into your thick skull yet?

 

And yes, Slash Dash is good, but it doesn't instantly kill anything nearby. In fact, sometimes, if there's something standing too close to you, you kill 1-3 mobs in front of you and that's it, because sometimes Slash Dash won't actually Dash. It just Slashes after dashing like 2 feet.

 

You're calling me thick but you're still trying to down play the awesomeness that is slash dash, and you're still trying to say you should bring the regular Braton to shoot at Grineer that are difficult for you...

 

That's all silly and no noobie I've ever met got stuck that way. They all bring the appropriate accurate weapon from your list when they're having trouble with Grineer and they love slash dash.

Edited September 7, 2013 by VKhaun

[Xylia]

There is thing that is called "Melee"

 

There's that thing called "Enemies smack you and stagger you" and also Grineer Heavy Units knock you flat on your butt if you try that and kill you before you stand back up.

 

Oh, and as a newbie... again.... Cronus and Skana? LOL. Right. You're not killing much of anything except Infested without charge attacks. Go ahead and try that with a Skana. Run up to a Grineer and Charge attack him. Guess what? You'll never get to swing at him because he'll elbow smash you before you get it off and it will stagger you and interrupt your charge attack.

 

You can make an Orthos, but how many newbies know that is the 1-and-only weapon you can make pre-Saturn/Mars/Jupiter?

[Xylia]

You're calling me thick but you're still trying to down play the awesomeness that is slash dash, and you're still trying to say you should bring the regular Braton to shoot at Grineer that are difficult for you...

 

WTF else are you supposed to use? Answer that for me.

 

Your choices as a newbie, are Braton, Strun, and MK1-Braton, and that is ALL you have until AFTER Earth.

 

Did you somehow miss that part!?

 

And what if the person took Mag instead of Excalibur?

 

And again with the Slash Dash.... less energy orbs dropping = LESS SLASH DASH.

Edited September 7, 2013 by Xylia

[Wolfstorm18]

Xylia is right. For the last three weeks I've seem more Excas in random teams than before, because of these updates that turns drops more rare, thus making levelling much more difficulty for new players.

 

So when I call randoms from region chat lists, there comes Excas with Bratons and all that starter stuff, and they become more of a burden than of a help if you are going to do a run in Phobos.

 

One solution is to make resources to be sold at the market for credits, not just for platinum. In this way newbies can buy some resources (for example, 100.000 credits for 1.000 ferrite, something like that) to make better guns and then beat higher levels. This will also solve the problem of stacking credits which now will serve for nothing since there will be no more ammo boxes to buy (for me even with the ammo boxes, since I have more than 2 million credits which is used for nothing). In this way a newbie can repeat missions in Mercury, stack credits and then buy the resources that he cant get at Earth or Mars.