Another Ember Rework Ideas Thread

[eimrun]

Ember's has always been high risk high reward frame with a theme of "nightmare for light armor units". She was one of the first frames created in the alpha years with no utilities in her arsenal but output damage in mind. As the game moves on over the years and damage 2.0 came about and so called "end game" had higher level enemies, her source of heat damage, while neutral all around got overshadowed with status procs. Heat is bad against shield and although neutral for armor its damage reduction made that negligible. So I hope these ideas and many others would come to pass whenever the devs want to take another shot at her. Love the Wukong changes btw, unlike Ember's 2018 rework, like why bother.

I'm not going to dictate which of her current abilities should go or which should stay. I believe she should stay balance regardless. If she can't be top dps queen anymore at least let her be fun to play.

Passive Ignition

"Ember is empowered by flames. Any time Ember suffers a Heat proc, she gains 35% Ability Strength for the duration and regenerates 10 points of Energy for every second she is ablaze."

This passive is shrugged by the community by not making any sense and very situational, I feel that this is very unique and it follows her theme. Also it fills the energy meter faster than zenurik energy drink. Since "Overheat" is not coming back, they could add enemies affected by fire had reduce accuracy at least.

Ability Fire Starter

Ember wrap herself and others with heat proc triggering her passives. Allies within range receives heat proc damage and shares ember's passive. Heat proc triggers panic to enemies in range. Heat proc damage can trigger on damage abilities/arcanes. Useful as support and also potential troll. But she's not the first one.

Ability Back Draft

Ember creates a draft at point zero rag-dolling all enemies within range to her. Enemies pulled had stun effect for a few seconds. Enemies affected by accelerant combust instantly with x fire damage (multiplied with accelerant) damaging nearby enemies. I am really not a fan of her ring of fire. Force pushing enemies away and applying fire proc at the end. Sometimes you just want all in one spot to grill them alive. This move is again quite risky but if you want to nuke them all, there is no better setup (go away equinox)

Guess that's all I have adding upon hundreds of ideas out there. I still enjoy playing her in MOT jumping about and pakouring but with no damage reduction abilities, a small range for damage, unreliable fire proc cc and a short stun, it feels like playing Mozart on my keyboard and could not go on for very long. You need good arcanes, OP weapons and in/out of your operator constantly to stay alive. She really needs some form of damage mitigation of more than 2 seconds I feel. Hope for good tidings on this frame.

 

 

 

 

[AvPCelticPredator]

This is probably 50th idea for ember this month. 🙄

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, AvPCelticPredator said:

This is probably 50th idea for ember this month. 🙄

Shows how desperate people are for a proper rework of her that isn't the stupid charge fireball and the counterintuitive WoF.

[Birdframe_Prime]

What I feel Ember needs most is to function based on mechanics, not on the actual damage numbers, so you're on the right kind of track, but having an ability dedicated to triggering her existing passive won't go very far, because at that point it's just an ability and she could get a new passive.

In addition, DE have said outright that Ember is supposed to be a glass cannon of a frame, with no direct damage reduction, which is why they removed the Overheat ability and made it Accelerant. I'd like to instead give her indirect damage mitigation, 

How about this; because Ember can set things on fire, and her major damage type is Heat to achieve that Ignite proc, let's play off instances of the ignite proc in a mechanical way to achieve more damage.

And... let's see if we can adjust the balance on her kit too, just to make sure that we bring her up to the same kind of quality of rework that frames like Oberon, Nezha and Wukong got (and not a Zephyr, where she's basically the same with some of the negatives removed).

Passive: Ignition.

Setting enemies on fire grants Ember an additional 1% Power Strength, each new enemy set on fire increases this by 1% up to a cap of 35% Power Strength total. This buff then decays again, but can be maintained indefinitely as long as new enemies are set on fire. After the 35% cap is reached, new enemies set on fire will restore a small amount of Energy per enemy instead.

1. Fireball.

Switch the focus of this ability. It still is a directed attack that guarantees one enemy at least is set on fire, however the lingering Napalm ball that is left behind is the reason to cast it strategically. Napalm ball lingers for a duration, extendable by modding, and has a reasonable chance to proc Ignite on enemies, it deals low damage, but the closer the enemies are to the ball itself, the higher the status chance gets, modified by Strength.

Only one Napalm ball at a time can be placed, and this change removes the charge-up time on the ability and simply fires for low damage, the point is the status, not the damage (also, see Accelerant).

2. Fire Blast.

Putting Fire Blast on her 2 means shifting its functions a little, but being more consistent. Fire Blast's wave of damage is now affected by Range, no more 15m cap. Placed ring of fire grants 50% additional Heat damage to all weapons fired through it (as now), affected by Power Strength (new). Fire Blast's wave has 100% chance to proc Ignite, and deals double damage to enemies that are already on fire if recast. Note: This double damage also replaces the existing Ignite proc with a new one, it doesn't just refresh it, so that the tick damage is higher.

Only one ring of fire can be placed at a time to balance out the cheaper cost, better status and adjustable added damage (but also something you'll see in a minute).

3. Accelerant.

Moving Accelerant up here allows us to buff this ability. Place it on a refreshable Duration. Cast, it still stuns everything (so recasting for the stun is still a thing if you want), but it then maintains an aura of the debuff. Rather than having to cast it again, and again, and again, to debuff each new enemy that comes in range, it debuffs all of them as long as they're in range.

While Accelerant is active, placed sources of fire also gain the Heat Distortion effect. While standing on the other side of a placed fire object, enemy projectiles are redirected (like a placed Turbulence cast).

4. World on Fire.

This is the only substantive rework change I would do. With Ember now a little more survivable, and functioning more based on how many enemies she can set on fire and continue to do so, I want this ability to go back to being her real damage cast.

But, I also know that DE don't want it to be the AFK mechanic it used to be.

So, World on Fire now has two stages; the build up, then the burn. Think of it like the damage version of Harrow's 4. 10 seconds of build up, with 15 seconds base of release. The 10 second build-up can't be modified, just like Harrow's, but the 15 seconds can be extended by Duration mods.

Simple action; cast and allies all gain improved casting speed, fire rate and melee attack speed for 10 seconds. During this time, all instances of Heat damage (including procs, damage dealt by weapons, abilities and by enemies) builds a multiplier. After 10 seconds World on Fire triggers at base damage, multiplied by the build-up damage, and then multiplied again by Accelerant if you have it running.

World on Fire portion now gains the range of Accelerant's aura, but is line-of-sight to prevent AFK exploits (the short duration also prevents that, and does it better than the range nerf did).

The ideal strategy, then, is to build up her passive with her 1, 2 and 3, then hit 4 to count all those lovely instances of Heat damage from her abilities and then release massive damage to any enemy in range.

tl;dr?

Shuffle 2 and 3 to make Accelerant better, change World on Fire into a build-and-release to return its high-range functions, but limit it with short duration bursts so it can't be spammed all mission. Also make her passive and abilities function off setting enemies on fire instead of setting herself on fire.

 

[eimrun]

3 hours ago, Datam4ss said:

Shows how desperate people are for a proper rework of her that isn't the stupid charge fireball and the counterintuitive WoF.

Aye Aye!

[eimrun]

1 hour ago, Birdframe_Prime said:

3. Accelerant.

Moving Accelerant up here allows us to buff this ability. Place it on a refreshable Duration. Cast, it still stuns everything (so recasting for the stun is still a thing if you want), but it then maintains an aura of the debuff. Rather than having to cast it again, and again, and again, to debuff each new enemy that comes in range, it debuffs all of them as long as they're in range.

While Accelerant is active, placed sources of fire also gain the Heat Distortion effect. While standing on the other side of a placed fire object, enemy projectiles are redirected (like a placed Turbulence cast).

Good QoL change. Similiar to banshee's silent mechanic but better. This I like.

[Blightkill]

I would like to present a differnt idea for her kit:

Atm her 4 has a penality (overheat) for long cast, that is something i want to change completly while still playing in an active way!!

 

Her 4 should get a heat gauge which increases when u use abilities 1-3 active and decreases to minimum if only 4 is active,

adittionally the damage should decrease with the radius (because we all know if u are closer to a campfire it feels hotter)

The damage of her S4 should greatly increase with a full Heat gauge but also quite low without any heat.

You could also mix this great with 2 tone energy color, color 1 is dominant when ember is cold, color 2 when she is hot.

 

This leads to the next problem her abilities 1-3 could need some work to:

(S3)Merging ability 2 and 3 together would be a great way to create a ability that has a bigger use, while also making room for a new ability 2,

which should focus more about one of the best parts in this game, mobility.

(S2) My idea is a controllable dash (at least as fast as wisps 2 while holding the button) that leaves a aoe field of fire that ignites all enemies

Unfortunately i dont have a good idea for her S1 atm, but with this heat gauge concept it should be changed in a way so we like to use it often

 

With these abilities we could use her in stationary areas with her buffed 3 and her 2 for fast runs through missions.

But what can we use for beefy enemies?

sure her fully heatet 4 in close range could do decent damage but armor is still a thing, fortunately every metal is meltable so why dont we use her passive ability to melt enemy armor with her heat damage ( 1 shoting 150 heavy units is not intended but reducing the armor by 50% in a decent time is ok, while also keeping the range of her 4 in mind. Adittionally it should strip more armor with higher level like hildryn pillage (S2))