Dear DE: Mastery Rank Tests are bugged, and need to be fixed! Or maybe provide an alternative!

[kapn655321]

2 minutes ago, mingnonf said:

...perpetuated...

I say this as lovingly, and with as much good intention as I believe one can.. calling folks out on what makes them irksome, is also irksome.

[mingnonf]

7 minutes ago, kapn655321 said:

I say this as lovingly, and with as much good intention as I believe one can.. calling folks out on what makes them irksome, is also irksome.

😕 It was a knee-jerk response, I suppose. It's just that this mindset is in a lot of places.

But before anyone else decides to justify or continue to justify not fixing the MR tests let alone allowing a skip option, let me ask you all a few questions:

1: When exactly have you done and completed the MR tests that people have been saying are extremely difficult or even impossible?

2: Do you continue to do these tests for fun? Maybe in the current present (around the time of the current patch)?

3: Do you find enjoyment in doing the tests in their current state?

4: What exactly do you think developers adjusting the tests will do?

5: Do you think that these adjustments will affect your enjoyment negatively?

Edited April 16, 2020 by mingnonf

[KitMeHarder]

17 minutes ago, mingnonf said:

Just because you can do it with the greatest ease does not mean that everyone else can.

This isn't being toxic, this is how it is. When something is as objectively trivial as this is, why should you be rewarded for being unable/unwilling to do it? What's even the point of optional rewarding challenge (the "option" is playing video games in the first place).

To put it into perspective, 90.1% of all MR8 players have achieved MR9 on steam. And that's not even accounting for people that lost interest in the game at that point for other reasons besides MR.

[kapn655321]

21 minutes ago, mingnonf said:

5: Do you think that these adjustments will affect your enjoyment negatively?

That's one of the best points to be made here, as with many other changes players request.

Is there a way to recreate the content in a way that is more suited to a diverse player base, having hundreds of options, and thousands of permutations of ways to approach it? Having a handful of methods that work for that, just doesn't sit right with me.

Edited April 16, 2020 by kapn655321

[mingnonf]

2 minutes ago, KitMeHarder said:

This isn't being toxic, this is how it is. When something is as objectively trivial as this is, why should you be rewarded for being unable/unwilling to do it? What's even the point of optional rewarding challenge (the "option" is playing video games in the first place).

To put it into perspective, 90.1% of all MR8 players have achieved MR9 on steam. And that's not even accounting for people that lost interest in the game at that point for other reasons besides MR.

So someone who is unable to complete a challenge due to real physical handicaps, or even personal hangups among other issues, should not have the right.

MR 9 among the other tests are only small levels, small fragments of a much larger game that continues to grow larger. Why do you have to defend against changing them in any way? Does it offend you? Is this the kind of thing you want to crusade for?

[kapn655321]

7 minutes ago, KitMeHarder said:

To put it into perspective, 90.1% of all MR8 players have achieved MR9 on steam. And that's not even accounting for people that lost interest in the game at that point for other reasons besides MR.

You're not wrong here.. mostly because someone comes along and says, "Just cheese it with this."

While that works, it falls short of it's intent to test a player on their stealth mechanics. This is not the kind of mission that players return to to hone their skills, as one might expect from a Stealth Mastery Test. This thread is common enough, that there seems to be an evident lack of acceptance, regardless of how many people brute-force it with an exploit, rather than master it through mechanics that they're told are made to serve this function in game.

[KitMeHarder]

11 minutes ago, mingnonf said:

So someone who is unable to complete a challenge due to real physical handicaps, or even personal hangups among other issues, should not have the right.

No I do not. If you do not have the intelligence/determination to become a doctor, engineer, professor, etc... you don't get to be one. And this scales as large or small as you want. So you either get/do nothing, or you achieve some reduced version. Much like how there's the Olympics, and then there's the Special Olympics for "physical handicaps" (not that you mentioned any if you're referring to yourself).

12 minutes ago, mingnonf said:

Why do you have to defend against changing them in any way?

Because you don't want them changed, you want the ability to circumvent them.

8 minutes ago, kapn655321 said:

You're not wrong here.. mostly because someone comes along and says, "Just cheese it with this."

How do you even cheese the MR9 test? I already said my suggestion was for what I thought was the MR19 test.

9 minutes ago, kapn655321 said:

This is not the kind of mission that players return to to hone their skills, as one might expect from a Stealth Mastery Test.

You don't return to it... because then you already know how utilize those basic skills. And instead you're actually using them in missions that are more difficult than the test. 

Once you take your training wheels off your bike, you don't put them back on when you're already confident without them.

[kapn655321]

2 minutes ago, KitMeHarder said:

You don't return to it... because then you already know how utilize those basic skills. And instead you're actually using them in missions that are more difficult than the test. 

Once you take your training wheels off your bike, you don't put them back on when you're already confident without them.

Last I knew you cheese it with Wisp and a throwing weapon.. since she's stealth while in the air.

I can see your point, but would also suspect players would use those to make sure their kits are to a sufficient standard for stealth mechanics in game.

What players are more often finding, is that their stealth based kits and understanding do not add up to make sense in the context of the test. As with cheesing the mr19, people have a work around. meaning no one's taken off the training wheels at all.. they've just turned it into a, "bike," with 6 wheels.

[mingnonf]

2 minutes ago, KitMeHarder said:

 

This is supposed to be a video game. This is supposed to be something to be enjoyed. More challenging games advertise themselves as such, or others would recommend them.

But I didn't see anything about this being a challenge when the ads said 'Ninjas play free'. I saw 'play as a badass space ninja and cut up baddies'. It's supposed to be a power fantasy, not a trek through the muck. Real life is a trek through the muck as it is.

And I should again point out that the MR tests gate content and the use of stronger weapons. So I shouldn't have the right to access them?

But yes, I want the ability to circumvent these tests, but I also want them done with ease, IF AT ALL, if that's not available.

Why do you want the MR tests to stay as they are? Do you want people to suffer for them? Do you want them to go through the current system, being failed for arbitrary reasons?

[DAnextFAKE]

On 2020-04-15 at 9:07 AM, mingnonf said:

DAnextFAKE - I am complaining because this problem has not been addressed for a very long time. As far as I know, not even forum mods have commented on these threads. As far as I know, the devs' comment on this problem has been "Eh, I don't see a problem with this," and saying absolutely nothing else after that.

And not everyone has the patience to practice a single aspect of the game that is for the most part optional. Spy missions can be done in a group. But this rank test must be done solo, so you currently have no alternative for help. Sure, not very people would want to take on this test, but the option to be able to do it or to skip it should be deemed important.

As far as I care, this is not a problem. Practice and continue trying. It is for the most part optional, but the entire point of MR tests is to check your mastery at all aspects of the game. And in the same time you spend on the forums you could easily have practiced the test enough. I find that it is somewhat refreshing to find a challenging part of the game that tests your skill and not how much time you have to nolife grind the game. Plus, most of the tests up to MR 15 are simple enough and rarely bug, and beyond which point MR doesn't matter anymore

 

 

7 hours ago, mingnonf said:

That is something I hope for, or even a small plat fee. And yes as you've seen in this thread, there are those who are adamant about people having to go through the test like they have. Supposedly, this is something that is done only once unless you choose to take it again. So I fail to see how a skip option would make things worse.

1. With the plat fee, it reeks of pay to win.

2. Without plat fee, it makes the tests irrelevant because who doesn't want a little less work, as you demonstrated? 

 

I want MR tests to stay the way they are because I do not want to fix something that isn't broken, and challenges you based on the skill you have. You would be surprised how many people are begging for that in Warframe. So here is a question for you: do you want to make another part of warframe obsolete? Do you want to reduce warframe to something you turn your brain off while spamming melee, even more so than it is now?

 

Plus, MR tests are hardly near the biggest problems the community is wailing about in Warframe, and it is nowhere near the top of DE's bucket list.

[mingnonf]

2 minutes ago, DAnextFAKE said:

I want MR tests to stay the way they are because I do not want to fix something that isn't broken

But right now some of them are broken. Do you just not want to acknowledge that there could be a problem?

[DAnextFAKE]

Just now, mingnonf said:

But right now some of them are broken. Do you just not want to acknowledge that there could be a problem?

Now I am far from experiencing all the MR tests, but I believe the broken ones are not required for progression, and when you are MR 20+ you should be ready for something difficult. There could be a problem, but it is minor and partly related to the player. Finally, skips are basically cheese. They both circumvent the test, and they both make it easy, so try it if you have that much trouble.

[mingnonf]

Well they are required if you want better weapons. And I am having trouble, otherwise I wouldn't have made this topic in the first place.

I don't know how else to make this problem in this thread clear - that the MR tests are currently broken and that we cannot pass them as they are - so if you can't understand this I don't know what else to tell you:

We are dealing with dead parrots.

There is an epidemic, a disease that is rapidly killing off parrots.

And merchants are going around selling these parrots that have already died.

But hardly anyone is acknowledging this problem, they're just telling us to get a new one.

As if that would somehow override the fact that there are dead parrots.

Edited April 16, 2020 by mingnonf