I Don't Like That Frost Is "required" For Harder Defense Missions

[WhiteCopain]

If you take T3 Defense for example, so many waves of enemies are shot out at you and eventually they kill the defense objective so fast that you /have/ to have a frost or it's basically instant loss if you aren't having everyone guard every possible spawn node. Even with the ridiculously OP skills we have in this game (Have Nova hit 4, stage gets wiped of enemies until really late in T3 def), the fact that enemies kill so fast and hurt so much makes defense in general a pain in the &#! at ANY of the higher levels without a Frost.

 

With a Frost you can get far farther since infinite enemies are basically stunned, can't shoot inside if they're ranged people (while you can shoot out or melee things inside). I'm not calling frost OP before the fanboys attack me. I'm saying that the way it's designed in general heavily punishes a group on something like T3 def for not bringing that one specific frame, which is frustrating.

[SquirmyBurrito]

I solo'd a T3 with my Nyx, Rhino, Excalibur, and my Loki.

[WhiteCopain]

I solo'd a T3 with my Nyx, Rhino, Excalibur, and my Loki.

Show me videos please.

[MetalGerbil]

between chaos, stomp, blind and clever use of decoy+disarm, i dont see how that is so hard to believe.

snowglove is still pretty mandatory for pubs, but for a team that knows what they are doing, not really "required". for a solo run you would need brass balls tho.

Edited November 19, 2013 by MetalGerbil

[PsychedelicSnake]

No frame is required to do anything. Do they make the job easier? Well yes, of course. But not ever required.

[The_Master_Race]

I solo'd a T3 with my Nyx, Rhino, Excalibur, and my Loki.

Ok, that still doesn't take away from the fact that once you start getting into the obviously high levels you'd be stupid to take frost on anything other then infested.

[SquirmyBurrito]

Show me videos please.

 

Sure let me go get my camera and hop in my time machine. Need me to pick anything up for you while I'm away? Maybe a bucket of T-Rex drumsticks?

 

Ok, that still doesn't take away from the fact that once you start getting into the obviously high levels you'd be stupid to take frost on anything other then infested.

 

I wasn't saying Frost isn't all but mandatory for really high level things. But he isn't needed for t3s.

[DiddlyMcGee]

you'd be stupid to take frost on anything other then infested.

i dont know if im reading this wrong but frost against infested isnt the best because they use melee attacks and snowglobe blocks out incoming fire from fire arms. sure the slow effect is pretty good but you can surly take a better frame to an infested defense mission rather than frost.(i know this because i am an experienced frost player as i also own frost prime and frost is my most played frame, and he was the first frame i ever got besides the starter frame) 

[The_Master_Race]

i dont know if im reading this wrong but frost against infested isnt the best because they use melee attacks and snowglobe blocks out incoming fire from fire arms. sure the slow effect is pretty good but you can surly take a better frame to an infested defense mission rather than frost.(i know this because i am an experienced frost player as i also own frost prime and frost is my most played frame, and he was the first frame i ever got besides the starter frame) 

You were reading it wrong.

 

Apologies for the miswritten statement, frost is terrible to use on infested defense most of the time.

Edited November 19, 2013 by The_Master_Race

[WhiteCopain]

Sure let me go get my camera and hop in my time machine. Need me to pick anything up for you while I'm away? Maybe a bucket of T-Rex drumsticks?

 

Why can't you do it right now? You claim to have solo'd it on multiple frames, you can do it again.

[Vandoore]

If in doubt, use chaos

[SquirmyBurrito]

Why can't you do it right now? You claim to have solo'd it on multiple frames, you can do it again.

 

Several reasons, the biggest of which being that I don't really have to prove anything to you. I said I did and if you choose not to believe me that's your decision. The second biggest reason being that I'm in the middle of the third season of Dexter. I will drop you a link to a video of someone soloing a T3 with a rhino. http://youtu.be/rLVMApj-thE <---That isn't my video.

Edited November 19, 2013 by SquirmyBurrito

[Anarties]

Several reasons, the biggest of which being that I don't really have to prove anything to you. I said I did and if you choose not to believe me that's your decision. The second biggest reason being that I'm in the middle of the third season of Dexter. I will drop you a link to a video of someone soloing a T3 with a rhino. http://youtu.be/rLVMApj-thE <---That isn't my video.

That's still not you.

 

Future advice: Don't spout things most people wont believe without proof.

 

Yesterday I had an arm wrestle with God and won.

 

Pictures? Don't be silly I have nothing to prove to you, here is a picture of someone else doing it.

[Kibbols123]

That's still not you.

 

Future advice: Don't spout things most people wont believe without proof.

 

Yesterday I had an arm wrestle with God and won.

 

Pictures? Don't be silly I have nothing to prove to you, here is a picture of someone else doing it.

 

Don't be mean.

Soloing with Nyx, Rhino, Excalibur, or Loki isn't really hard to believe. Rhino for obvious reasons. Nyx for mind control. Excalibur for slash dash. Loki with smart decoy and Radial Disarm. This really isn't that hard to believe...

 

as for OP, you don't need a frost for any defense mission. Does it help? Yes. Is it needed? No.

You could just as easily do it with Loki's Decoy, Nova's M Prime, Vauban's Bastile, etc.

Edited November 19, 2013 by Kibbols123

[SquirmyBurrito]

That's still not you.

 

Future advice: Don't spout things most people wont believe without proof.

 

Yesterday I had an arm wrestle with God and won.

 

Pictures? Don't be silly I have nothing to prove to you, here is a picture of someone else doing it.

 

I didn't say it was me (I even went so far as to point out that it wasn't me) and I don't need your advice. I made a claim and I provided proof that the subject of my claim wasn't impossible. That's one step further than I needed to go. If you choose not to believe me that is on you. 

[WhiteCopain]

I didn't say it was me (I even went so far as to point out that it wasn't me) and I don't need your advice. I made a claim and I provided proof that the subject of my claim wasn't impossible. That's one step further than I needed to go. If you choose not to believe me that is on you. 

Actually when you're proving a statement the burden is on you >_>;

[Regierung]

Well, this thread derailed fast.

 

Point is, in relation to the original topic of discussion, Frost is not mandatory as you assert for strictly all "hard" defense missions. As others have pointed out, it is very much possible for skilled players to get away on higher-level defense missions without a Frost. Ignoring the case of doing a high-level Infested defense mission (Xini as prime example), any group with adequate experience in the game or good team coordination can effectively start and complete any and all defense missions. Yes, Frost will make defense missions significantly easier, but by no means will they always be mandatory or heavily punishing to the team if not present; there are substitutes (which is what you).

 

Let's take your example of Snowglobe being the turning factor from it's benefit of giving absolute defense towards ranged attacks and giving the perceived infinite stunlock. The absolute defense is a clear benefit, however can be similarly replicated by clever use of a Volt and Electric Shield. No, it isn't as great, however can be an adequate substitute for snowglobe without getting in the way of players who move a much more around the map and not near the pod.

Your second point on infinite stunlock can very easily be replicated by multiple frames, if not improved upon. Nova can replicate the same result as the slow field of snowglobe  with the added benefits of adding a damage multiplier on the enemy, larger range and presistent for a set amount of time, among other things (Molecular Prime, of course). Rhino has his stomp, Nyx with chaos, Loki on Radial Disarm, and Banshee, too, with SoundQuake (though would more likely on the team due to Sonar for the damage multiplier). Heck, by this degree Saryn can be arguably a better choice with a combination of Molt, Miasma and Venom (Molt away from pod, pull to pod for Miasma stun, then Venom+pop zits. Pop zits all day, and job is done. Melee distance would be covered by Contaigon, the most unappreciated power in the game [which, to my great dismay, is with proper warrant]).

 

No, I do not have any videos to prove what I said, however countless others have competed on higher ranked defense missions without Frost and with great success, I may add.

This is not to say that your gripes (if I may call them that) are unfounded, either, as this thread most definitely supports you in many ways (also makes for an amusing read):

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/130795-level-2190%E2%80%99s-no-problem/?hl=%20frost%20%20defense

To support our response:

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/131975-a-million-trampolines-on-a-crypopod-its-so-beautiful/

 

Note that neither of the above are mine, just thought I should leave ample proof it is possible, though.

For more solid proof, just look up "Warframe Defense 100." Should at least give validity to our claims, if not convice.

[SquirmyBurrito]

Actually when you're proving a statement the burden is on you >_>;

 

I wasn't trying to prove a statement. But I did provide proof that countered the idea OP was trying to put across.

Edited November 19, 2013 by SquirmyBurrito

[Anarties]

I wasn't trying to prove a statement. But I did provide proof that countered the idea OP was trying to put across.

You were trying to prove something the moment you went up against the other Tenno saying that you solo'd a T3 and was not Frost.

 

Like I've said before, never make big claims without proof.

 

You only make yourself look like a fool.

[SquirmyBurrito]

You were trying to prove something the moment you went up against the other Tenno saying that you solo'd a T3 and was not Frost.

 

Like I've said before, never make big claims without proof.

 

You only make yourself look like a fool.

 

Nope, just putting something out there. Kinda like when someone hops on the forums and says "X is impossible to get" and people reply with "got mine from Y". They don't back up their statement with videos or pictures because they don't really care enough to and if OP decides not to believe them that's on him/her. Same thing applies here.

 

It wasn't a big claim and I gave proof of concept. You trying to argue with me is making you look like a fool, not me.

[Specimen2561]

You trying to argue with me is making you look like a fool, not me.

 

You're all making yourselves look like fools at this point.

 

As for the OP, I would certainly recommend taking a Frost on a defense mission that wasn't infested, however, as has already been pointed out, there are other ways to do it without him. My friends and I recently completed T3 defense with Nova, Nyx, Ash and Rhino. Between Nyx using Chaos and Nova using mp (which means of course that they blow themselves up, which is always amusing to watch), Rhino Roar and Ash's Smokescreen when it came to downed players, we managed to get through without too much difficulty. Yes, we died occasionally in the higher levels, but don't forget, the lasers near the pod on the T3s...they do a pretty amazing job of clearing an area.

 

We have also done the missions with Frost, much to the same effect (killing things, being awesome, dying, winning :P), and the pod received less damage, but there are ways to get through a T3 without having a Frost.

[HackShield]

why is frost so needy <.< nyx + nova Narcissus till wave 30 and the pod dont got touched frost is the to be sure tactic if you dont know about a nub teammate is in but basicly not a permission to deal in high def  basiclly for me he is a gamw brake in t3 def :o nyx noa or good combi is vauban loki and rhino and may trini here  out there so much good combos if you have a good team they need risk and some skill dont denied that BUT brings more fun 

 

dont be scary come out of your bubble