--Sensei-- Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 Game doesn't guilt-trip you, but a lot of people on these forums do. It's the number one defense when asking for a more reasonable business model: "HOW DARE YOU, DEVS GOTTA EAT, GAME WILL GO OUT OF BUSINESS BECAUSE OF YOUR FREELOADING". It's a S#&$ty defense because the game shouldn't guilt-trip you, and if the game doesn't neither should you. Current limits are slots, orokins and wait times. They're pretty damn important for the overall gameplay so quit downplaying them. The simple fact that there is some sort of obtuse way to get them doesn't a reasonable business model make. It just makes it non-pay-to-win which I'm grateful for but that doesn't mean I won't criticize it when there's still work to be done. ESPECIALLY since this is closed beta and the time where many important changes are made. The one that you're missing. Take the hint next time. No, I don't. I disagree with the entire orokin system. Remove them and make the frames/weapons harder to level. It would make XP boosters worthwhile as well as provide a reasonable time-for-money exchange system. Limit the XP boost to one thing at a time if you want. Bottom line: some free-to-play games' success has depended heavily on how user-friendly and reasonable their business model has been. The happier your customers are, the more they'll be inclined to spend money. This isn't me trying to freeload my way into the devs' precious assets without paying. I'm suggesting a system that will work better in the long run and will lengthen this game's income AND lifespan. I do not NEED to play this game. I'm here because I like it, and if I stop liking it I'll just stop playing. And trust me, a non-paying player is way better than no player at all. Consider this semi-hypothetical situation: I may not have money, but my friends do. Play this game enough, have enough fun with it, and they'll want to check it out. Most of my friends have jobs or an income and won't mind paying the equivalent of a pack of smokes every once in a while to expediate their gameplay. But if you alienate them and make them feel like they're forced to spend, they will not spend. They will find another game that isn't as aggressive with implied payment towards them and will play that instead. And I will join them. Simple as that. You lose a part of your community, potential customers and potential income in one fell swoop. And if you'd like to disagree, first tell me one good free to play game that has run out of business for not being greedy enough. Fantasy Earth Zero, a great game like Warframe, old game too, everyone had everything for free, all the gear were same stats so no one had an advantage over others, other than personal skill. Game went bankrupt because it was so fair, that and the high learning curve for newbie players made them quit, skill2hard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mak_Gohae Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 Sure, I would like to. Some examples: Crimecraft - You payed only for premium for boosted EXP and bling-bling like unique decorative clothings and coloring. Ran out of business because of lack of final objective in game, just playing all day long killing players and bots gets boring eventually, nothing really epic or remarkable once you get to maximum level, just the same routine as always. Game still exists, but there are no more than 50 players inside. Most players are in "Apb reloaded" now. This game has PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DolgVlaPet Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 Yep, crimecraft had both PVP and PVE and it was really good FTP game at the beginning, I really loved it. It's sad it had to go like that... New crimecraft version on steam is a zombie of his older self. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bptamblyn Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 (edited) Thankfully WARFRAME doesn't sell power xD. Cuz that kind of F2P is disgusting. OP, your point has no validity. You say you feel forced to pay? This sounds like a personal issue and not something that is WARFRAME's doing. I'm not saying your super depressed or trying to mock you or anything like that. I'm just saying that the game obviously offers all of its content for free. Slots are not content. If you want to play all the frames, then you just have to delete one of the frames and play a new one. This is content. However, for you convenience, you can pay for more slots and retain the Frames that you already have and add a new one at the same time. The request your making is unreasonable. The reason you want them to give you everything w/o spending money is because you dont intend to spend money (whatever the reason is, thats your right and I am not judging). But it is leterally their job to make money. I'm sure you can see how these two concepts conflict, right? Bottom line, yes they give you the full content of the game free and yes they do have options for people to who pay a little (they will recieve some perks, but not game breaking perks), but they do not force anything upon you. Edited March 12, 2013 by bptamblyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skepsis Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 (edited) Feeling forced to pay is an opinion, as well as those who feel the current status is a good way. Personally, I feel that the current setup is fine, you get your 50 plat, and that's enough to boost your first warframe, and a weapon, if you choose to farm another frame and save your reactor for that? So be it, you'll still have a supercharged frame, and the ability to play it. fortunately, the easiest and least expensive way would be to find the blueprints for the frame you wish to make, and make it. it's still cheaper to Rush the frame, and throw a reactor in it, than to buy it off the market. which is what DE was getting at, in my opinion. it's 5 dollars for 75 plat. that gets you a TON of stuff, I personally have a strict budget, and found I could cut out eating out for two days, and drop 10 bucks here. It's not that hard. nor is it forcing you to purchase plat just to have fun, I play with plenty of people who have put no money in this game and still stand on their own even on Pluto. It's about playstyle, mods, and level of playing ability, inb4 "l2p". I'm not typing this to be the bad guy, I just hope this opens your eyes to see that everything is obtainable by a free user, It just requires effort instead of paying for the convinience. Edited March 12, 2013 by Skepsis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KyleOne Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 It only costs $2 to upgrade/buy slots. $2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorddash2 Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 Inb4 lots of things. Inventory slots are known as a problem aleady by the DE team and has been discussed. At the moment, you do have another option, sell some weapons to open up slots. Everyone that has been apart of the forums knows it's hard to do, but you are not forced to buy platinum to buy slots. I think slots is one of the main ways DE is making money, besides cosmetic items, and the catalysts/reactors. In the end it will be DE's choice in the matter, but they are working on a solution to the problem. you kinda are. unless you get blueprints for reactors. and the slots should not be locked. if you dont spent all your plats for anything else than slots, you need to buy more plats or sell a warframe, whit would be gameplaywise pretty bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venarge Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 you kinda are. unless you get blueprints for reactors. and the slots should not be locked. if you dont spent all your plats for anything else than slots, you need to buy more plats or sell a warframe, whit would be gameplaywise pretty bad. since you can do an optional restart after a certain point of beta, this is not really a problem.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skepsis Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 you kinda are. unless you get blueprints for reactors. and the slots should not be locked. if you dont spent all your plats for anything else than slots, you need to buy more plats or sell a warframe, whit would be gameplaywise pretty bad. I disagree, if you get the feel for the game and like it, should at least throw 5 bucks at it, I think that's the most frustrating thing, you can cut out Mc donalds, or eating at a fast food place one time, and have enough money to throw 5 bucks at this game. that's plenty for slots/reactors/cats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DolgVlaPet Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 5 bucks as minimal payment, plenty of payment methods, developers did marvelous job on game and they threat really well all the players, so why not pay from time to time? 5 bucks is a standart price for pack of cigarrettes and anyone can afford that expence... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelydrone Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 Credits are so easy to obtain and the company has to make money so.... I dont see the real problem. You want better weapons? craft them and sell your old ones, done. That. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austinrelis Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 Hey guys, What I want to talk about here is, that feeling that you get, when you are playing a free to play game and it makes you feel like you are forced to spend real money on it, because if you don't, there's no other alternative. This is all coming from my experience as a free player in Warframe so far. I have 24+ hours into the game, and it's a lot of fun, there are still some things that could use some obvious changes, but I'm sure they will be covered somewhere. At this moment in the game for me, I'm stuck with no way out. What's limiting me from enjoying more of the game, is inventory space. There's no other way to get it, other than spending real money. Sure, players get free 50 platinum when they first start out, but most of them probably learn that they need catalyst early on and spend it on that. After playing the game and enjoying it, they come to a stand still, like I did. Not enough inventory space, be it for guns, or frames it's a necessity. With no other way of getting more of it, It feels like I'm pinned into a corner, stuck, with no way out, other than buying platinum. That's' not what a good free to play game should make it's free players go through. I really want this game to succeed because it's a lot of fun, and can see it going places with the right advertisement and improvements. A simple solution would just to make inventory space attainable via lots of credits. But I want to hear what you guys think about this topic? Thanks a lot for reading. -Naso I don't feel forced into buying anything, and I have gotten about 5 reactors since I started playing. Around the same with catalysts. I joined during OB weekend. I only have what I use in my inventory so I have free slots (asides from frames, I have 2 currently). But I do agree that you should be able to obtain inventory slots via money, or even possibly gain them through alerts or a very rare drop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rathlol Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 Hate people who come onto the forums and complain about platnum, if you arent prepared to support the game then expect to have some disadvantages. Correct the game is free to play and play for free you may but don't cry like a little girl when their are some things unobtainable without platnum. As a player allready stated the Devs need to make money it is a independant studio and a buisness after all. I despise this attitude, if the game is advertised as free to play, it should allow you to have comparable features to someone who does pay, but in the case of inventory slots it does not, there should be at least some way for a free player to have access to the weapons they want while still maintaining a realistic variety, having such a limited amount does not encourage someone to keep playing but rather pressures them into feeling like they have to pay in order to have a comparable experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venarge Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I despise this attitude, if the game is advertised as free to play, it should allow you to have comparable features to someone who does pay, but in the case of inventory slots it does not, there should be at least some way for a free player to have access to the weapons they want while still maintaining a realistic variety, having such a limited amount does not encourage someone to keep playing but rather pressures them into feeling like they have to pay in order to have a comparable experience. since you got 50 start plat to obtain slots, i dont see the problem here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lagniprimatte Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I put all of my faith in that MMOBomb giveaway only to lose to completely irrelevant and dumb comments from those that just started the game. Now I'm just waiting for update 7 to transpire. I currently have 3 warframes in the foundry that are waiting for slots, and 7+ weapons in the foundry waiting for slots as well. F2P seems to be a broad term these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lagniprimatte Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 since you got 50 start plat to obtain slots, i dont see the problem here. I don't know if someone with grand master status can be speaking on this matter without sounding biased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MothraElita93 Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I don't know if someone with grand master status can be speaking on this matter without sounding biased. They can't, but they'll still shove their opinion any which way since Master and Grand Master get into Design Council, meaning that any rich brat can buy his way into shaping the game to what he thinks is right. See: the Sarin dispute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renan.Ruivo Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 (edited) I don't know if someone with grand master status can be speaking on this matter without sounding biased. Not all of us started the game with the founders pack you know. I only bought mine a few days after experiencing the game, and seeing for myself that it was worth it. And still.. other than spending some plat on slots, some on potatoes and some on boosters, i still have most of my plat left and i'm taking the free player route. Which obvioulsy is the buy BP with creds and farm components and mats. In my opinion it is far, far more enjoyable than buying frames and weapons with plat. The only thing plat is good for is to ruin your long-time enjoyment of the game. You can ask that from the fuckload of "Masters" and "Grandmasters" who bought and ranked everything, then ranted their hearts out and quit the game, full of bile. PS: Before anyone accuses me of being a spoiled little brat, i used comfort food money (i miss my weekly pizza fest) to get my pack. Which means i spent the rest of february eating macaroni with cheese and diet salt crackers. And will keep on that diet until i get paid in the 15th. And the title of Tenno Operative means that i actually do pro-bono work for Digital Extremes to benefit other players. Which is more than a lot of people can say, founders or otherwise. Edited March 13, 2013 by ruivoml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renan.Ruivo Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 They can't, but they'll still shove their opinion any which way since Master and Grand Master get into Design Council, meaning that any rich brat can buy his way into shaping the game to what he thinks is right. See: the Sarin dispute. You sound like a lovable person to have a level-headed, rational discussion with :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skepsis Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Games are not developed as Free to Play to get a game handed to the public, it's F2P for people to be hooked, enjoy the game, and toss some investment their way tonot only show your support for the game, but to unlock new content as well, It's sad to see people actually think that game developers should lay down and hand crap out to people who "Play for free" and don't think they should work for what they want. you pay for the convinience. You pay to support an awesome game and the development of the game itself. You should feel privliged enough just being in the beta. And for those with founders packages have just as much right to speak on this issue as anyone else. They forked over a ton of money for the BETA. not the game itself. I know if I actually had the money to do it, I would as well. to show my SUPPORT in DEVELOPMENT of this game, and it's team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renan.Ruivo Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 (edited) Games are not developed as Free to Play to get a game handed to the public, it's F2P for people to be hooked, enjoy the game, and toss some investment their way tonot only show your support for the game, but to unlock new content as well, It's sad to see people actually think that game developers should lay down and hand crap out to people who "Play for free" and don't think they should work for what they want. you pay for the convinience. You pay to support an awesome game and the development of the game itself. You should feel privliged enough just being in the beta. And for those with founders packages have just as much right to speak on this issue as anyone else. They forked over a ton of money for the BETA. not the game itself. I know if I actually had the money to do it, I would as well. to show my SUPPORT in DEVELOPMENT of this game, and it's team. Basically a lot of people mistake the categories. One thing is a "Free to Play" game, another thing entirely is a "Freeware" game. Edited March 13, 2013 by ruivoml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venarge Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I don't know if someone with grand master status can be speaking on this matter without sounding biased. Well i started without a founder package and had no problems.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venarge Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 (edited) They can't, but they'll still shove their opinion any which way since Master and Grand Master get into Design Council, meaning that any rich brat can buy his way into shaping the game to what he thinks is right. See: the Sarin dispute. You mad because no one asked for you opinion? It seems someone needs a tissue over here...... What dispute? In other threads you are crying because people couldnt stand the name. What does that have to do with people with the founder packs? So why dont you tell me whats your point? Edited March 13, 2013 by Venarge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renan.Ruivo Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 (edited) You mad because no one asked for you opinion? It seems someone needs a tissue over here......What dispute? In other threads you are crying because people couldnt stand the name. What does that have to do with people with the founder packs? So why dont you tell me whats your point? Dude. a *nickname for Richards* is like an animal. If you don't feed it, it dies. ;) (i agree wholeheartedly with you though. Don't tell him that.) PS: stop editing your post so i can stop editing your quote, silly. Edited March 13, 2013 by ruivoml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venarge Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Dude. a *nickname for Richards* is like an animal. If you don't feed it, it dies. ;) (i agree wholeheartedly with you though. Don't tell him that.) PS: stop editing your post so i can stop editing your quote, silly. Yeah silly me :3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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