Frost Buff?

[ZephyrPhantom]

About 3 weeks ago, DE posted that they had plans to buff Frost's Snow Globe, including an experimental change to try giving Snow Globe Frost's 190 armor rating.

 

Fast forward to several updates later, and there seems to be a lack of changes to Snow Globe in general. Now don't get me wrong, I think the improved Avalanche is pretty awesome in it's own right, but is anything being done about the globe at the moment?

Edited February 27, 2014 by ZephyrPhantom

[Ninjamander]

Frost is currently still dead my opinion. They need to change snowglobe.

[WhiteCopain]

Frost is still amazing for T3 Def. I feel very uncomfortable going into higher waves without one unless we have the absolute cheese group build of Rhino and 25 Energy Oberon/Nova ults.

[Aramet]

I recall sometime in the last several days, I think during the Prime Time stream chat, one of the DE members said they're going to keep reviewing feedback on Snow Globe before they make any jumps to change it. I could be wrong though, but I am pretty sure I read that.

[nekrojiji]

Armor on the globe would be nice, but hey they took out invulnerability so you don't all stay inside like scared mice.

 

The globe is like a buffer. so everyone can reorganize, not to fully protect the objective. I was doing T3 defense missions alone, with Frost .... that was OP.

 

Stop saying that snow globe is broken or useless .... learn to play the game. Whine less, think more. There is a way of making your snow globe, over one objective, be 100% more effective. You just have to think. 

 

 

As I stated before .... I like the new Frost.

 

Remember that if they put armor on Snow Globe they have to put armor on Rhino's Iron Skin too!(which is not that bad)

Edited February 27, 2014 by nekrojiji

[ZephyrPhantom]

Putting up more globes doesn't prevent enemies from shredding them at the same speed, especially at high levels where it would only take enemies from one 'side' to destroy each globe in 2 seconds. Also, why 'hide like mice' when you can Radial Disarm/Blessing/M Prime/Chaos/Bastille/etc...? There are plenty of ways to beat T3 Def without a Frost and without breaking a sweat. Iron Skin isn't really a fair comparison either, seeing as a Globe can't move with your or provide immunity to status effects.

 

Like I said, don't get me wrong, the new Avalanche is awesome. It's just that DE promised a Snow Globe buff and there seems to have been no action taken on that yet.

Edited February 27, 2014 by ZephyrPhantom

[Valiant]

Whatever they do that timer NEEDS to go or be very decently extended.

Edited February 27, 2014 by Naith

[tris1]

Armor on the globe would be nice, but hey they took out invulnerability so you don't all stay inside like scared mice.

 

The globe is like a buffer. so everyone can reorganize, not to fully protect the objective. I was doing T3 defense missions alone, with Frost .... that was OP.

 

Stop saying that snow globe is broken or useless .... learn to play the game. Whine less, think more. There is a way of making your snow globe, over one objective, be 100% more effective. You just have to think. 

 

 

As I stated before .... I like the new Frost.

 

Remember that if they put armor on Snow Globe they have to put armor on Rhino's Iron Skin too!(which is not that bad)

 

 

you oviously done see any problem with frost as he is now then let me explain

 

snowglobe dies within 5-8 seconds in t3 deffense and high level planets

damge still can go through the globe such as napalms scorches and greandes and other types of damage

it is a non mobile skill

the globe is big so attracts more damage

the globe has a health and timer

 

 

now lets look at iron skin

 

blocks all damage

blocks all procs

blocks all staggers

its mobile

no time duration

smaller radius than snowglobe attracts less damage

thats a big difference between snowglobe and iron skin

 

this is not including skills that rhino has and can beat frost at any of them

frost can be beaten by any  frame now such as

 

radial blind/choas/bastilla/invisibility/blessing

Edited February 27, 2014 by tris1

[nekrojiji]

you oviously done see any problem with frost as he is now then let me explain

 

snowglobe dies within 5-8 seconds in t3 deffense and high level planets

damge still can go through the globe such as napalms scorches and greandes and other types of damage

it is a non mobile skill

the globe is big so attracts more damage

the globe has a health and timer

 

 

now lets look at iron skin

 

blocks all damage

blocks all procs

blocks all staggers

its mobile

no time duration

smaller radius than snowglobe attracts less damage

thats a big difference between snowglobe and iron skin

 

this is not including skills that rhino has and can beat frost at any of them

frost can be beaten by any  frame now such as

 

radial blind/choas/bastilla/invisibility/blessing

 

First!

Don't compare Rhino's Iron skin that only protects him with globe that protects the whole team!

 

Second!

Snow globe is not supposed to block more than 8 seconds of damage. If you need it to block more than 8 seconds of damage, youre team shouldn't be doing T3 defense.

The whole point of giving HP to the Globe was to end the days when Frost was mandatory for defense missions.

 

And by the way in the situation that one globe holds 8sec of damage, what I've drawn keeps 16 sec of damage because the overall damage that one globe receives is 1/2. Even if the objective is attacked from only one side .... the first globe will hold 8 s and the second one will hold another 8 s.

 

I use my Frost with full energy efficiency, Focus(no Blind Rage) and fan-brain Helm (~5k globe). The time for one of my globes is 11 sec because I know it won't last more than that if attacked. I use only 13 energy for 1 globe ..... So I can use them as much as I want. If you want to be the protector, than be the protector and let the other ones do the damage.

 

By the way I know that my globes don't last 16 seconds.....

 

And lastly .... Try defending a cryopod with invisibility, blessing, radial blind, bastille against ranged attackers.

 

That's the idea .... Frost can do something no other frame can ..... but it's not mandatory anymore for defense missions.

Edited February 27, 2014 by nekrojiji

[LukeAura]

Second!

Snow globe is not supposed to block more than 8 seconds of damage. If you need it to block more than 8 seconds of damage, youre team shouldn't be doing T3 defense.

If it was not supposed to block more than 8 seconds of damage, why has it kept its 30 second timer? 

Why did it have 30 seconds to start with if it only was ever supposed to protect for 8 seconds? 

And why wasn't it just nerfed to last 8 seconds if it was decided 30 was too long? 

Don't get me wrong, I entirely believe 30 seconds was way too long for a snowglobe to last, and it probably should have always been an emergency defense tool. But just saying it's only supposed to block 8 seconds really isn't true. 

It was supposed to block 30 seconds, then it was decided 30 seconds was too long. But instead of adjusting the value to reflect that change they made it so that it scaled poorly and then let it have a duration cap of 30 seconds just to add insult to injury. 

I could understand if we got Frost at Venus as more early/new player oriented frame, his snowglobe would power up with us as we proceed and eventually drop off in effectiveness once we hit Pluto/Endgame(Kind of like Iron Skin), but we get him in one of the farthest areas in the game. Giving him an ability that scales worse with levels as we seek to push passed our current limit and in to endgame is pointless.  

 

[TwiceDead]

I could understand if we got Frost at Venus as more early/new player oriented frame, his snowglobe would power up with us as we proceed and eventually drop off in effectiveness once we hit Pluto/Endgame(Kind of like Iron Skin), but we get him in one of the farthest areas in the game. Giving him an ability that scales worse with levels as we seek to push passed our current limit and in to endgame is pointless.  

 

Oh I don't know so you could leave it somewhere without having to re-cast it 8 seconds later...? And as he cleanly illustrated earlier in a nice drawing, if you stack snowglobes in different ways you can increase their effectiveness, this would by much harder to do if you only had a 5 second timer. 

 

Don't get me wrong, I entirely believe 30 seconds was way too long for a snowglobe to last, and it probably should have always been an emergency defense tool. But just saying it's only supposed to block 8 seconds really isn't true. 

It was supposed to block 30 seconds, then it was decided 30 seconds was too long. But instead of adjusting the value to reflect that change they made it so that it scaled poorly and then let it have a duration cap of 30 seconds just to add insult to injury. 

You are seriously confused here. Just because something has a duration of 30 seconds, doesn't mean it's supposed to have 30 seconds of effective use. Rhino's Iron Skin has an infinite duration, does that mean it was supposed to nullify an infinite amount of punishment? What about Loki's decoy? It has a duration of 25 seconds at max, and can be pushed for as long as 1 minute, but it hardly lasts that long in any scenario. Same thing with Saryn's Molt. 

 

Duration does not equal it's effective usage. 

 

I could understand if we got Frost at Venus as more early/new player oriented frame, his snowglobe would power up with us as we proceed and eventually drop off in effectiveness once we hit Pluto/Endgame(Kind of like Iron Skin), but we get him in one of the farthest areas in the game. Giving him an ability that scales worse with levels as we seek to push passed our current limit and in to endgame is pointless.  

 

What people currently count as an endgame in Warframe is no endgame at all. It's just repetitiveness and monotonous grind for an hour against the same enemies you fought a million times before. Warframe has no proper endgame, so it's actually pointless to discuss balance surrounding something we don't have.

Edited February 27, 2014 by TwiceDead

[LukeAura]

Oh I don't know so you could leave it somewhere without having to re-cast it 8 seconds later...? And as he cleanly illustrated earlier in a nice drawing, if you stack snowglobes in different ways you can increase their effectiveness, this would by much harder to do if you only had a 5 second timer.

You are seriously confused here. Just because something has a duration of 30 seconds, doesn't mean it's supposed to have 30 seconds of effective use. Rhino's Iron Skin has an infinite duration, does that mean it was supposed to nullify an infinite amount of punishment? What about Loki's decoy? It has a duration of 25 seconds at max, and can be pushed for as long as 1 minute, but it hardly lasts that long in any scenario. Same thing with Saryn's Molt.

Duration does not equal it's effective usage.

Drawing is broken for me. And then you can't see out of it if you stack them. Nor should the spamming of one ability over top of itself really be considered a good idea.

And I thought the intention was for Snowglobe as a snap defense according to people now? You shouldn't be dropping it over and over but using it as a very brief respite only when all else fails. 8 seconds is all it needs, you set up camp, mow things down, then move on. You really shouldn't be running back and recasting it over and over again indefinitely. The whole point of the new Frost and globe is to not do that. And where health fails at doing that, causing people to progressively spam it to stack it over and having no use after a certain point, 8 second timer would succeed in pushing the point home that there is no point to do that, you have better options and Snowglobe is a niche last resort.

I'm not at all confused. He did not say effective use. He said supposed to last. Snowglobe was supposed to last 30 seconds, you shouldn't be using it for more than 8. There is a difference. And since its health and timer based right now, it probably should be considered to have 30 seconds of effective use any ways and its up to us to see it last that long.

Duration does indeed not equal effective use. But I was talking about expected duration, not

effective.

Oh, and by Endgame, I'm talking about the point where Enemies start shredding the globe in two seconds. Enemies that were classifiable as 'endgame' back in D1.0 around current levels 50-60. That is the current upper expected limit of enemy levels.

Edited February 27, 2014 by LukeAura

[Countess_Hapmuhr]

Yeah DE, we've tried the new snow globe and without overexaggerating, it's safe to say it sucks. It lasts 2-5 seconds in T2 defense at level 20, unless you have a Nova or other ult spam frame to back you up. Right now playing Frost, I'm just annoyed at having to spam SG over and over while every once in a while plopping down a energy restore, because right now, there's no way in hell I'm going to dare leaving the pod for even one second.

 

So DE, may we *please* have the old Snow Globe back?

 

Right now the changes have resulted for us in that I never leave the pod EVER and that my clan mates are restricted to only certain frames. This is not fun.

Edited February 27, 2014 by Hap-muhr

[ZephyrPhantom]

Bump. The update's great and all, but I'd like to see where our ice king is headed, DE. :)