[Suggestion] Dual Lex Pistols!

[HadronVictorioso]

Aklex, anyone? :3

I love the Lex, but right now the Lato Vandal with mods has completely surpassed it for me, as the Vandal has a higher base RoF, almost the same accuracy, and more ammo in the clip.

So, I'd like to suggest a dual version of the Lex, the AkLex:

Base Damage: 80.0

Base Firing Rate: 1.6

Accuracy: I know the current Lex's is 16, but it had perfect accuracy - so just make it slightly less

Base Clip Size: 12

Base Ammo Capacity: 210

Base Reload Speed: 2.5s

Base Crit Chance: 15%

It's essentially just dual-wielding Lex pistols. The accuracy would suffer a little bit, but the rate of fire and clip size would go up - however, reload speed would have to be decreased.

I'm thinking you could buy the blueprint from the marketplace for 40,000 creds, and use 2 Lexs to craft it.

I love magnums, and since the hotfix prior to U7 put down the Lex's recoil quite a bit (down from S&W 500 to a Desert Eagle), it would still be realistically manageable to fire with one in each hand.

Edited March 28, 2013 by HadronVictorioso

[guymanbrodude]

I'm against this simply for the fact that a dual Lex should NOT be called Aklex, but just Alex

[Tsukinoki]

I agree with this and it would give me another pistol option to use besides the akboltos.

[HadronVictorioso]

I'm against this simply for the fact that a dual Lex should NOT be called Aklex, but just Alex

XD

OK, the name could use some work, but I don't want to call it "Alex". Find me a legendary character who used dual magnums and I'll edit the first post.

[HadronVictorioso]

I agree with this and it would give me another pistol option to use besides the akboltos.

Why thank you :)

[newnar]

Then we'll be having all kinds of dual stuff sooner or later like aksicarius, akraken, etc and their single-wield counterparts will definitely be outshined so bad that nobody even touches them. Does anyone still use the single-wield lato,furis or bolto? Just for that little bit more accuracy???

I think one thing that the lato Vandal is doing well is to offer an alternative to the aklato that doesn't suck so bad like the single normal lato. Dual-wield sidearms versus their single-wield counterparts shouldn't be a direct upgrade, but a give-and-take concept of exchange. Exchanging firerate and clip size for reload speed and accuracy. Currently the exchange rate is WAYYYY to much in favor of the duals. This is one of the things that require some concern.

Edited March 28, 2013 by newnar

[Bennyworld]

I think this is an OK idea - but I really think that dmg should be nerfed, or recoil increased to crazy amounts - those guns are powerful!

[HadronVictorioso]

I think one thing that the lato Vandal is doing well is to offer an alternative to the aklato that doesn't suck so bad like the single normal lato. Dual-wield sidearms versus their single-wield counterparts shouldn't be a direct upgrade, but a give-and-take concept of exchange. Exchanging firerate and clip size for reload speed and accuracy. Currently the exchange rate is WAYYYY to much in favor of the duals. This is one of the things that require some concern.

You raise some valid points. However, how would you see them being "balanced", as you say? Or would you rather the single-wields be buffed?

[HadronVictorioso]

I really think that dmg should be nerfed, or recoil increased to crazy amounts

Why would this happen? Damage nerf, that is. You're just using a Lex pistol in each hand. That's not going to effect the size or velocity of the bullet.

On the other hand, the recoil would be the same - when you're not aiming down the sights on Lex, it has some pretty high recoil. That's basically what it should stay at, since when you're not aiming down the sights, your character is one-handing it. If that's the normal recoil for one-handing it, then why should it increase if you're alternating fire between 2 magnums in each hand?

[newnar]

First of all, all the sidearms are overpowered compared to main weapons. There should be an "across-the-board" 20-30% dmg reduction for all sidearms. Seriously, a Lex shooting harder than a Latron hardly makes any sense. The reason why not a similar boost for all main weaps is because this will require the hp of all enemies to be buffed as well so we'll rather keep the mains at where they are and reduce the power of the sidearms.

Then to solve the problems of the dual vs single sidearms, we need to either make the single arms stronger in terms of reload speed and accuracy or reduce these things for the duals even further. Either way will work, it's just a matter of relativity. The important thing is to maintain relative sidearm-esque comparison with the main weapons while having good diversity in single/dual-wield choices. Right now Lex and a couple of other sidearms are wayyyyyy overpowered even when single, which is why it would be absurd to dual-wield them. The current dual-wields are also wayyyyyyyy overpowered compared to the single-wield versions.

[HadronVictorioso]

First of all, all the sidearms are overpowered compared to main weapons. There should be an "across-the-board" 20-30% dmg reduction for all sidearms. Seriously, a Lex shooting harder than a Latron hardly makes any sense. The reason why not a similar boost for all main weaps is because this will require the hp of all enemies to be buffed as well so we'll rather keep the mains at where they are and reduce the power of the sidearms.

Latron sounds and looks like it's shooting a .30 caliber slug, whereas the Lex seems like it's firing at least a .44. Bullet size directly effects the damage it deals, as does velocity.

Reducing the power of the sidearms? That would get rid of the only semblance of realism in the game - just because a guy IRL has a magnum and you have a hunting rifle doesn't mean you're going to come out on top - it depends on how you use it.

Then to solve the problems of the dual vs single sidearms, we need to either make the single arms stronger in terms of reload speed and accuracy or reduce these things for the duals even further. Either way will work, it's just a matter of relativity. The important thing is to maintain relative sidearm-esque comparison with the main weapons while having good diversity in single/dual-wield choices. Right now Lex and a couple of other sidearms are wayyyyyy overpowered even when single, which is why it would be absurd to dual-wield them. The current dual-wields are also wayyyyyyyy overpowered compared to the single-wield versions.

You're right that the dual-wields should be nerfed somewhat in the accuracy department and reload speed (why is my Aklato reloading faster than my Lato?), but that's the only place where they should be nerfed.

[newnar]

I'm not talking abt how you use the weapons, just the raw stats here. Lex does way too much damage for what it is. If I'm not wrong the Bronco is also guilty of this. Although the Bronco's 2 ammo clip "kinda" balances it, Having the same damage output with a full-fledged shotgun is just obscenely ridiculous. And I don't even want to get started on akbolto.

If I'm using an M110 SASS and your .44magnum is better than it in everyway especially damage and accuracy, something is friggin wrong here.

Edited March 28, 2013 by newnar

[HadronVictorioso]

I'm not talking about how you use the weapons, just the raw stats here. Lex does way too much damage for what it is. If I'm not wrong the Bronco is also guilty of this. Although the Bronco's 2 ammo clip "kinda" balances it, Having the same damage output with a full-fledged shotgun is just obscenely ridiculous. And I don't even want to get started on akbolto.

If I'm using an M110 SASS and your .44 magnum is better than it in everyway especially damage and accuracy, something is friggin wrong here.

Ahaha, you're right about the Snipetron - but I remember reading somewhere that one of the devs said that they only including the Latron and Snipetron in order to put some sort of long-range weapon out there. I don't think they've been updated since they were added.

Snipetron could certainly use a buff, but that doesn't mean that the Lex needs a nerf.

Also, I shouldn't have compared the Lex to a S&W 500, that's a revolver. Think of it as a Desert Eagle.

[newnar]

Like I said, if we choose to buff the Main Weapons, the devs will also be FORCED to make all the enemies tankier if not everything drops too fast and screws with the difficulty. That's why I said it is alot easier to just nerf the sidearms. Because technically, the main weaps are pretty well balanced to the environment(enemies), it's just that sidearms are so much more powerful that they make things too easy if you just spam your +70% reload speed +60% max ammo Bronco and your 50,000 credit Snipetron is left rotting on your back.

My M110 SASS is supposed to be the Latron anyway, it's semi-auto like the latter. Snipetron needs to be like the AWM or XM500.

[Venarge]

Its simple: We need a dual Lex.

+1 for this awesome idea =)

[HadronVictorioso]

Like I said, if we choose to buff the Main Weapons, the devs will also be FORCED to make all the enemies tankier if not everything drops too fast and screws with the difficulty. That's why I said it is alot easier to just nerf the sidearms. Because technically, the main weaps are pretty well balanced to the environment(enemies), it's just that sidearms are so much more powerful that they make things too easy if you just spam your +70% reload speed +60% max ammo Bronco and your 50,000 credit Snipetron is left rotting on your back.

My M110 SASS is supposed to be the Latron anyway, it's semi-auto like the latter. Snipetron needs to be like the AWM or XM500.

The enemies are already tanky as - or at least the Grineer and Infested are.

I've not used the Bronco much, didn't like it.

I say that, as an indirect nerf to the sidearms, don't allow their mods to be increased as much. I mean, it goes by percent, so naturally the weapons with the higher base stat that is affected will benefit the most - i.e., Lex will benefit much more from a maxed-out Hornet Strike than the Bolto will.

What I'm trying to say is, put down the amount of percent per mod level is increased by - I might not be making much sense.

Example: the Barrel Diffusion mod goes from +30% multishot to +60% multishot in 2 upgrades - make it so that instead of it increasing 15%, make it increase by perhaps 5% per level of the mod from the mod's base.

So, if the Convulsion mod has +15% elec damage as the base, make it go from 15% to 17.5% in a level, then to 20%, and so on (although that may be taking it down a little too far).

[HadronVictorioso]

Its simple: We need a dual Lex.

+1 for this awesome idea =)

Hehe. Thank you :D

[Savan]

If there are too many Duals most of them are going to be obsolete imo. Many people want dual melee or dual pistols. I say three dual pistols is enough for me. Dont get me wrong its a good idea. Just that I dont want every weapon to be dual "everything" Otherwise some of the pistols that arnt dual loses their shine.

[Venarge]

Otherwise some of the pistols that arnt dual loses their shine.

Agreed! But like Hadron said, there could be slightly higher reload times and lower fire rates and less accurate^^

Adding some Cons on this weapon would give the one handers their "shine" and people would still have the choice ;)

[newnar]

The thing is, we don't want to touch on the difficulty level of the game when applying balance between weapons. It will get complicated very fast. And on the side of mods it's the same story. I just want to consider things once we cast aside mods. Because even then the difference in the damage numbers for main weapons, dual-sides and single-sides are ridiculous.

Edited March 28, 2013 by newnar

[Venarge]

The damage might be high. But the fire rate is already very dissuasive in my opinion. xD

[newnar]

It's bad but not bad enough. It still is able to properly rival a Latron or Snipertron which are main weapons and should be vastly superior to a sidearm in terms of direct combat. Similarly, aklatos can rival bratons and akboltos can rival boltors. This to me definitely isn't intended and is very counter-intuitive.

Edited March 28, 2013 by newnar

[PopTartZombie]

Dual Broncos plzplzplzplzplzplz

[Venarge]

It's bad but not bad enough. It still is able to properly rival a Latron or Snipertron which are main weapons and should be vastly superior to a sidearm in terms of direct combat. Similarly, aklatos can rival bratons and akboltos can rival boltors. This to me definitely isn't intended and is very counter-intuitive.

Not with less accuracy =)

[Venarge]

Dual Broncos plzplzplzplzplzplz

There is already art of the dual bronco blueprints in the information lines during loading sometimes ;)