Now That We Know That Warframe And Dark Sector Is Linked, How Are The Tenno And Hayden Linked?

[Morec0]

1) Implying that he didn't survive long enough.  After all, he could be immortal owing to Technocyte.

 

2) Hayden Tenno is a Tenno.  He was the first Tenno, and we are named after him.  He would sleep because like us, he was not needed, or he knew something was coming. 

 

If the Tenno WERE immortal like that, I'd think that we wouldn't have needed to go to sleep. We'd just lie back in our Dojos and wait for something.

 

As I said elsewhere:

 

 

Again: he's the first Tenno in the SAME sense that Teron Gorefiend

 

http://wowpedia.org/Teron_Gorefiend

 

Is the first Death Knight.

 

EVEN THOUGH Arthas Menethil

 

http://wowpedia.org/Arthas_Menethil

 

Would LATER come along to be the FIRST of the Lich King's Death Knights.

 

So, Hayden WAS the first, in the greater sense of Technocyte, but he is NOT related to us as the first of OUR Tenno.

 

Because of that, he plays by different rules. And I don't think that immortality and most CERTAINLY Cryosleep  technology were among them.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Morec0

[Tesseract_The_Pariah]

 

If the Tenno WERE immortal like that, I'd think that we wouldn't have needed to go to sleep. We'd just lie back in our Dojos and wait for something.

 

As I said elsewhere:

 

 

 

Because of that, he plays by different rules. And I don't think that immortality and most CERTAINLY Cryosleep  technology were among them.

 

TBH, its possible we slept to prevent unrest, boredom, and violent deaths.  Time kills even the immortal. 

 

We could have also slept in the hopes that people will forget we killed the Orokin.

 

And yes, that's a possibility, but I think there is a more.. direct link.  We have too many similarities. 

Edited March 29, 2014 by Gaminus

[.Talia.]

Facts:

 

DE Geoff, Steve, Sheldon and Scott all agreed on the Livestream that Hayden Tenno is the first.  

 

DE Megan posted on hot topics confirming that "Dark Sector was the beginning" and "Warframe and Dark Sector are inextricably linked".

 

That's enough for me. Anyone who disagree is on denial.

 

On a more serious note, this discussion is one more example of how thirsty the community is for Lore, we're all fighting over the few bites we have available. I wish the DE release some substantial Lore explaining the origins of Warframe's Universe to end once and for all this speculation...

[Morec0]

 

Facts:

 

DE Geoff, Steve, Sheldon and Scott all agreed on the Livestream that Hayden Tenno is the first.  

 

DE Megan posted on hot topics confirming that "Dark Sector was the beginning" and "Warframe and Dark Sector are inextricably linked".

 

That's enough for me. Anyone who disagree is on denial.

 

On a more serious note, this discussion is one more example of how thirsty the community is for Lore, we're all fighting over the few bites we have available. I wish the DE release some substantial Lore explaining the origins of Warframe's Universe to end once and for all this speculation...

 

 

 

Not disagreeing with you, just pointing out that saying someone is "the first Tenno" doesn't MEAN they're all connected by anything more than a name and, perhaps, a legacy and tradition.

 

After all: our Tenno were sent into the Void, were altered by it. Hayden never was, Hayden was only altered by the Technocyte. There's a bigger difference there than you want to give it credit for. 

 

Besides, you always seem to ignore that Steve later says in that SAME VIDEO: "Warframe takes place WAY beyond that timeframe, ridiculously" - so by his own words the two don't HAVE to be connected in the kind of sense I feel like you're trying to say they are.

 

Also, is denial a drug now?

 

[.Talia.]

Ok Morec0 lets not start the same discussion in two threads XD 

I just thought i should post here that livestream link and the facts we have from official DE statements.

[Morec0]

Ok Morec0 lets not start the same discussion in two threads XD 

I just thought i should post here that livestream link and the facts we have from official DE statements.

 

And I thought I'd post the counterpoint so people have a second opinion to bounce their own ideas off of.

 

That IS the problem with how things are turning out with all these threads, though: hard to keep a strong debate going. Let alone in one place.

[.Talia.]

And I thought I'd post the counterpoint so people have a second opinion to bounce their own ideas off of.

 

That IS the problem with how things are turning out with all these threads, though: hard to keep a strong debate going. Let alone in one place.

 

And once the threat hits like 4 or 5 pages, most people don't go in there to discuss anymore =(

Like this topic demanding Lore https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/201738-de-we-need-official-lore-i-mean-real-lore/

[victor_victory]

If we gonna connect dark sector and warframe, this video of the original dark sector is a good starting point.

Basically we still don't know whether is the dark sector we have now or the original dark sector that is in the same universe of warframe.

Hayden maybe still exist, or not. But if it is the original Dark sector that DE is talking about, my theory would be he didn't go in cryosleep after the war and he is fighting with the remaining humans.

[OniDax]

Long quote

 

The point is that they take place within the same universe. They are connected. It's like saying ancient Rome is connected to the United States. Well, not really, but they exist within the same history. It's the same way here. In Warframe's past, Dark Sector happened. Yes, anyone who doesn't agree with that last sentence is in denial.

 

Also, Gaminus, there's nothing that suggests Hayden Tenno had some foresight or foreknowledge into the events of the future. IF DE decides that he did, and that he sleeps, then yes, it can certainly happen. It's not impossible. But for now, there is no reason for him to do so, nor is there any indication that he did. For now, I say he didn't, and there's no need for him to do so.

 

I still go off of the leaked datamine that showed the Lotus telling the Tenno to sleep. Why? Not only did it exist in the game, but it also confirmed my assumptions about the Lotus. She's the one who woke them up. She gives them orders. No where do you see Tenno giving orders. Therefore they'd sleep because she told them to. She existed during the Orokin era because she's an Orokin AI. Her design clearly gives that away. As well, they killed the Orokin for the same reasons the Tenno fight now: balance. The Orokin, with the defeat of the Sentients, became the hegemon in the system. There was no balance, and therefore the Lotus told the Tenno to kill them. Question is whether the Lotus was programmed to seek balance, or if the AI went rogue. But because they, in their condition, had no purpose other than to kill, she told them to sleep.

 

@victor_victory: I'm pretty sure with this proto-armor, that the original Dark Sector isn't in play. There's also a major aspect missing from that Dark Sector -  the Technocyte-infested state of Hayden. I'd say that the Hayden of the released Dark Sector is much closer to the Tenno than the original Hayden of the original Dark Sector.

Edited March 29, 2014 by AntoineFlemming

[MegaSnail]

LOOK AT THAT! I can finally disprove everyone with my Dark sector crap stuff... and theories.. and everything else. 

 

 

 

Where is the quote located?

Edited March 29, 2014 by MegaSnail

[Morec0]

The point is that they take place within the same universe. They are connected. It's like saying ancient Rome is connected to the United States. Well, not really, but they exist within the same history. It's the same way here. In Warframe's past, Dark Sector happened. Yes, anyone who doesn't agree with that last sentence is in denial.

 

Yeah, got no problem with that. Or were you agreeing with me?

[OniDax]

Yeah, got no problem with that. Or were you agreeing with me?

 

Agreeing.

 

 

LOOK AT THAT! I can finally disprove everyone with my Dark sector crap stuff... and theories.. and everything else. 

 

 

 

Where is the quote located?

 

What quote?

Edited March 29, 2014 by AntoineFlemming

[SilentMobius]

The point is that they take place within the same universe. They are connected. It's like saying ancient Rome is connected to the United States. Well, not really, but they exist within the same history. It's the same way here. In Warframe's past, Dark Sector happened. Yes, anyone who doesn't agree with that last sentence is in denial.

 

 

"The are connected" and "One is completely canon to the other" are _very_ different things. I would actually love DS to be canon it would be really useful to us and really interesting. But that is not what DE said and in fact the were _very_ careful not to say that, you know why? Its limiting, and being limited is _not_ something DE want right now.

 

"Connected" sure, they both came from the same well of ideas (as was said). There was a Hayden Tenno in Warframe, for sure, he _was_ the first Tenno that much was said. It's suggested that the Technocyte virus ravaged the earth in the pre-codex. The hint in livestream 10 even suggests that the Orokin are humans using a refined version of the "living metal" that the technocyte virus creates.

 

All of that is fine. But anything else is _not_ guaranteed right now. Maybe Enferon never existed, maybe the shielding powers from Dark Sector didn't exist at that time in Warframe, _we don't know_  and DE will do whatever makes sense for Warframe _not_ what fits with Dark Sector.

 

"Anyone who doesn't agree with that sentence in in denial" is utter nonsense and should be beneath you

 

There are _many_ series, movies, stories that are inspired by others, reference the same characters or entities and yet do not consider _all_ of the previous content "canon" currently Warframe is one of them.

[OniDax]

How does Dark Sector being canon (is not being connected really canon with or without some retcons?) limiting to Warframe?

 

I've said previously that Dark Sector is canon but possibly with some retcons. That's still connected.

Edited March 29, 2014 by AntoineFlemming

[Morec0]

How does Dark Sector being canon (is not being connected really canon with or without some retcons?) limiting to Warframe?

 

I've said previously that Dark Sector is canon but possibly with some retcons. That's still connected.

 

Not to mention, again, that Dark Sector is SO far in the future they can do almost anything they want... Hell, I can't think of ONE WAY that the current established connection of canon is limiting/can't be maneuvered out of from a writing perspective.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Morec0

[Muminidas]

If we consider Dark Sector as cannon then.....

 

We are called Tenno and not Sulek 'coz she died(Hayden killed her) and Hayden Tenno lived, left Lasria and created his "image". You must bet that he was doing stuff after DS story right?

 

Why we are called Tenno? We may have some technocyte symbiosis stuff, any affections with technocyte but above all we are "children of the Void". Tenno are less about technocyte and mroe about the Void energy, Void influence....

 

So, we can actually be called Tenno 'coz we are wielding the same armour/exo-suit(warframes) as Hayden Tenno. Seems legit to me.  

At least, we know Warframe technology was older than the Orokin, which brings even more mystery about those exo-suits. 

[Morec0]

If we consider Dark Sector as cannon then.....

 

We are called Tenno and not Sulek 'coz she died(Hayden killed her) and Hayden Tenno lived, left Lasria and created his "image". You must bet that he was doing stuff after DS story right?

 

Why we are called Tenno? We may have some technocyte symbiosis stuff, any affections with technocyte but above all we are "children of the Void". Tenno are less about technocyte and mroe about the Void energy, Void influence....

 

So, we can actually be called Tenno 'coz we are wielding the same armour/exo-suit(warframes) as Hayden Tenno. Seems legit to me.  

At least, we know Warframe technology was older than the Orokin, which brings even more mystery about those exo-suits. 

 

The Tenno are descendants a mystical and ancient order, the Orokin (or whoever it was in Ember's Lore... no, sorry, it IS the Orokin there) took some children from them (maybe) and threw them into the Void as an experiment of some kind to make us what we are. The original organization itself could be something that either Hayden founded or was founded to honor Hayden. Hell, maybe Hayden became like Jesus because he did something?

[Tesseract_The_Pariah]

If we consider Dark Sector as cannon then.....

 

We are called Tenno and not Sulek 'coz she died(Hayden killed her) and Hayden Tenno lived, left Lasria and created his "image". You must bet that he was doing stuff after DS story right?

 

Why we are called Tenno? We may have some technocyte symbiosis stuff, any affections with technocyte but above all we are "children of the Void". Tenno are less about technocyte and mroe about the Void energy, Void influence....

 

So, we can actually be called Tenno 'coz we are wielding the same armour/exo-suit(warframes) as Hayden Tenno. Seems legit to me.  

At least, we know Warframe technology was older than the Orokin, which brings even more mystery about those exo-suits. 

Perhaps we are simply a new version of Tenno.  It does not mean that we arent at least influenced by Technocyte.  After all, the infested say things like "You are our flesh" or something along those lines. 

 

The Tenno are descendants a mystical and ancient order, the Orokin (or whoever it was in Ember's Lore... no, sorry, it IS the Orokin there) took some children from them (maybe) and threw them into the Void as an experiment of some kind to make us what we are. The original organization itself could be something that either Hayden founded or was founded to honor Hayden. Hell, maybe Hayden became like Jesus because he did something?

This is where my theory ties in.  Tenno are influenced by the Void to activate and evolve their technocyte, supercharging our capabilities.  And what if the void and technocyte are linked, somehow?  After all, most Orokin tech is based on Technocyte, and they have  a lot to do with the void.

[Beheader87]

Who's to say that Hayden COULDN'T be alive in the Warframe Universe? Look at the Infested and specifically, Lephantis. The infested had been around since Hayden's time and Lephantis is supposed to have been created "by the Orokin as a weapon against the Sentients". If Lephantis's life could be that long because of the Technocyte virus, what's stopping it from extending Hayden's life and making him immortal?

[Muminidas]

Who's to say that Hayden COULDN'T be alive in the Warframe Universe? Look at the Infested and specifically, Lephantis. The infested had been around since Hayden's time and Lephantis is supposed to have been created "by the Orokin as a weapon against the Sentients". If Lephantis's life could be that long because of the Technocyte virus, what's stopping it from extending Hayden's life and making him immortal?

 

So, are you trying to say Hayden is several millenias old? Moreover, he did not aged through the time ppl invented spaceships and stuff....

 

Hmmmm, Lephanits is pure form of Infestation, we don't now the nature of Technocyte virus, but still it's just virus. Virus is neither living or dead organism, it's just DNA/RNA surrounded by protein shell ( least 2 layers). It will live as long as it can multiple. 

 

If there's an organic host, virus can multiple.... so Hayden should look like abomination right now.

 

Moreover, what if Technocyte can actually transform host cells into autothropic cells, it was millenia since Technocyte was released, it could evolve. By doing so this virus is immortal and eternal....

 

Edit: Sorry for any biological mistakes(they can be 'coz of bad grammar), but it's hard to write this stuff in english and not my national language. :) 

Edited March 30, 2014 by darkhades2012

[Tesseract_The_Pariah]

So, are you trying to say Hayden is several millenias old? Moreover, he did not aged through the time ppl invented spaceships and stuff....

 

Hmmmm, Lephanits is pure form of Infestation, we don't now the nature of Technocyte virus, but still it's just virus. Virus is neither living or dead organism, it's just DNA/RNA surrounded by protein shell ( least 2 layers). It will live as long as it can multiple. 

 

If there's an organic host, virus can multiple.... so Hayden should look like abomination right now.

 

Moreover, what if Technocyte can actually transform host cells into autothropic cells, it was millenia since Technocyte was released, it could evolve. By doing so this virus is immortal and eternal....

 

Edit: Sorry for any biological mistakes(they can be 'coz of bad grammar), but it's hard to write this stuff in english and not my national language. :) 

Not unless Hayden can channel and control it.

Which he can.

But Technocyte is no normal virus, either. 

[Muminidas]

Not unless Hayden can channel and control it.

Which he can.

But Technocyte is no normal virus, either. 

 

I agree, Technocyte isn't normal. That's why it's so hard to make any connections to present viruses (i.e. HIV, HBV). 

 

Again, IF we consider Dark Sector as cannon .... Technocyte during that storyline is much different. Infected cells, tissues - all are covered in some kind of metalic crust and bodies of it's hosts are less deformed than bodies of Warframe's Infested. 

 

Personally, I love to make theories and connections of Warframe and Dark Sector. One of my theories is that Orokin - which were leading scientists of genetical modifications discovered Technocyte virions (virus particles) and modified it's genetic material (be it DNA/RNA). In a result they acquired unstopable biological weapon against Sentients (probably as a mindless armies of Infested to battle Sentients, 'coz there are high chances Sentients were synthetical). 

 

Something went wrong and Infested were isolated for millenia ( Lephantis was formed during that time as a result of absorbing matter). 

 

My point is that Haydens infection, which he was able to control or channel is much different than current Technocyte(modified by the Orokin). He not necessarily was immortal, moreover could survive millenia thanks to Technocyte. 

 

 

Lol, I started writing stuff about Infestation and I forgot the main topic. As I said before, Hayden is more like spiritual ancestor of current Tenno. I may be wrong, 'coz Dark Sector that devs are talking about could also be Dark Sector that wasn't released (old 2004 version). 

Also, Hayden was associated with Lotus organization during DS, same as Tenno are now.

[Evangilion]

Where to Start? :) Hayden Is the First Generation Tenno and The First Generation of Infested. This was not intended By design. But, It is True regardless. I am sure there are alot of interesting reasons why we could/want Hayden Around today (Present Point in lore). Virus normal or not, live and Change. Having the Puriest form of Tenno and infested must be beneficial (research Purposes). A leader figure such as Mr. Tenno himself seem almost Symbolic ("Captain America") if your into that. Sleeping Him would be a good Move to the Story.

Edited March 30, 2014 by Evangilion

[VoidGhost]

Gaminus time travel is part of science as well...

[Evangilion]

I am waiting for some tenno to embrace the infested counter part (Possibly like the Stalker...Ugly!!!). This would have a Pervasive and Perverse affect on the Warframe/DS universe which seem to over all interest people on a whole. ( I might be speaking for myself). Look at the Stalk he has issues and do not  embrace this Lotus of ours. Truthfully I would Sacrifice my Sentinel to be infested incline for lets say two extra Arms to duel wield four Skana for Devastating Melee Prowess (Attack and Defecting). Granted my Mind is with me and tis a choice i just Couldn't refuse :F