Trinity Needs To Be Nerfed Into The Ground

[Sekcbaba]

only the corpus have bullets you can actualy dodge with wallruns and stuff grineer have instant hit scan bullets the only way to "dodge" them is to be invincable "ninja" tactics go out the window I am not saying I am happy about i, but I love being the healer and the way the current game is low level content is way to hard and high level content is way to easy because of weapon mods anything past these planed content levels and time limets is actualy reeealy hard and trinity is only useful there so removing invincability would kill her more so then she already is dead people dont play her to have fun with her like I try to they play her because they have no choice if they want to play harder stuff

 

and the op is mad at trinity being able to kill stuff almost as well as press 4 to kill warframes after 6 forma >.<

I really love playing support characters too, and planned on getting trinity ASAP until i started reading about stuff like this.  I really hope they  just make the support more interesting than permanent invulnerability - that doesnt sound very interactive or enjoyable to me.  It seems like the issue is that the massive survival / defense times people are playing to is realistically content that is not intended to be beaten / played to that duration, but is enabled by invulnerability.

Edited April 7, 2014 by Sekcbaba

[MoyuTheTrinity]

I really love playing support characters too, and planned on getting trinity ASAP until i started reading about stuff like this.  I really hope they  just make the support more interesting than permanent invulnerability - that doesnt sound very interactive or enjoyable to me.  It seems like the issue is that the massive survival / defense times people are playing to is realistically content that is not intended to be beaten / played to that duration, but is enabled by invulnerability.

the "perma" invincability is only obtained after HEAVY modding you need all 3 durration mods 2 power efficiency mods one of thos mods is nightmare mode and 2 of them are currupted mods from vualts it takes ALOT of work to fit them all onto a trinity you will need probably 2 or 3 forma this is entierly end game content

now trinity with just a continuity streamline flow is actualy quite refreshing and helpful to a small group of friends  your blessing lasts long enough for ppeople to regroup and its 75 cost with large energy pool lets you cast it 4-5 times if S#&$ hits the fan but you will find energy vamp and well of life usless in most situations and link will be what you will cast most of the time to prevent knockdowns

op ran into probably me while i was leveling my castanas in a low level mission I got bored and tried the link thing for a while

Edited April 7, 2014 by MoyuTheMedic

[NovusNiveus]

Tell me now OP do you really think i rely on something called "fun", when i wanna farm cores or test my weapon on a long Survival run?

If you're not having fun, why are you playing?

No, seriously, when I come home from work at 8am, the furthest thing from my mind at that moment is doing more work.

What is wrong with you people? Do you understand what video games are for?

[AscendantWyvern]

Nerf? Maybe. Nerf into the ground? Noooooooooooo.

This. 

 

Adjustments are necessary to preserve the enjoyment of the game, however, "nerfed into the ground" does not an enjoyable game make.

[Eoptap]

Only 20 min wow that's it try making it to 40 first before complaining lease. Sounds like the person build the trinity for higher level running but only went 20 minutes. Instead of asking for something why don't you learn the abilities of your war frames the strengths and weaknesses. Find a good group of friends, and work on teamwork. This  is a game of teamwork yeas it can be one of solo, but it is about team survival, and not about how many you kill. PVP is not the name of the gam it is PVE after all. You need o understand in a team that is randomly thrown together you will not always be the spotlight. some people build the Warframe they have for higher level gameplay, and farm low level gameplay. The solution is to not to ask to have the rest of the trinity punished because you ad a bad experience. the solution is to get better, of find a few stable groups you game with that are at you level of gameplay so you do not get randomly thrown in with someone who can handle the higher level gameplay, or solo.  Think team not I, and use one of the strategies I suggested. They work trust me, as I have run into similar problems. The worst problem I ran into was actually the opposite though. Someone who did not know how to play the Warframe they had. Loki invisible is not a viable shield, and cannot stand up to laser fire. I would much rather an experienced player that can handle high end gaming than a noob who tries to use the invisible Loki as a shield. I may be a noob as well but instead of crying op I learn the system, I learn the gameplay, I learn my play level, and I find people who I can play with and have a good time with. I build for team play, and have a growing group of friends. I think I just suck, but apparently I am good enough to get invited to game with some very good players at times. I have even learned how to build to solo t1 and t2 survival to 40 minutes, due to no one on my friends list being on. That is a challenge, and that is grinding if that is a difficult you are looking for try it. Sorry you had a bad experience, but your solution is to punish others for your inconvenience instead of trying to use other solutions. It is getting very hard to get very far in survival as it is with the group who think things are op cry and get things weakened. Realize Survival, and defense have no cap, and so while you stop at 20 some of us have a goal of one day going 40 min+ on T3 and getting Rhino prime, and other drops that only drop high end. Also you may not have been hunted yet, but I also have a goal of defeating these three ugly things that keep coming after Teno. If Teno keep getting weaker because people who think this is PVP keep getting powers weakened PVE will become imposable. Then again that might be your goal, I love PVE I am old school gaming PVE rules. Team gaming rules. I am not the best, I may not always explain things the greatest, but I do understand what this is suppose to be, and what DE wanted. The concept is great, the Gameplay is great. The cry for weakening powers by people who have never made it high end gaming needs to stop. I one day would like to reach high end gaming. Some changes at times may need to be made to help the teno work better as a team, but not because one player dose not know how to dial it down and work with a team.

[Zkorp]

i can't say it better than Eoptap (but I'll surely have made some space in my text...lol), it's exactly that...

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Only 20 min wow that's it try making it to 40 first before complaining lease. Sounds like the person build the trinity for higher level running but only went 20 minutes. Instead of asking for something why don't you learn the abilities of your warframes, the strengths and weaknesses.

 

Find a good group of friends, and work on teamwork. This  is a game of teamwork.  Yes it can be one of solo, but it is about team survival, and not about how many you kill. PVP is not the name of the game it is PVE after all. You need to understand in a team that is randomly thrown together you will not always be the spotlight. some people build the Warframe they have for higher level gameplay, and farm low level gameplay. The solution is to not to ask to have the rest of the trinity punished because you had a bad experience. the solution is to get better, of find a few stable groups you game with that are at you level of gameplay so you do not get randomly thrown in with someone who can handle the higher level gameplay, or solo.  

 

Think team not I, and use one of the strategies I suggested. They work trust me, as I have run into similar problems. The worst problem I ran into was actually the opposite though. Someone who did not know how to play the Warframe they had. Loki invisible is not a viable shield, and cannot stand up to laser fire. I would much rather an experienced player that can handle high end gaming than a noob who tries to use the invisible Loki as a shield.

 

I may be a noob as well but instead of crying op I learn the system, I learn the gameplay, I learn my play level, and I find people who I can play with and have a good time with. I build for team play, and have a growing group of friends. I think I just suck, but apparently I am good enough to get invited to game with some very good players at times. I have even learned how to build to solo t1 and t2 survival to 40 minutes, due to no one on my friends list being on. That is a challenge, and that is grinding if that is a difficult you are looking for try it.

 

Sorry you had a bad experience, but your solution is to punish others for your inconvenience instead of trying to use other solutions. It is getting very hard to get very far in survival as it is with the group who think things are op cry and get things weakened. Realize Survival, and defense have no cap, and so while you stop at 20 some of us have a goal of one day going 40 min+ on T3 and getting Rhino prime, and other drops that only drop high end. Also you may not have been hunted yet, but I also have a goal of defeating these three ugly things that keep coming after Tenno. If Tenno keep getting weaker because people who think this is PVP keep getting powers weakened PVE will become impossible. Then again that might be your goal, I love PVE I am old school gaming PVE rules.

 

Team gaming rules. I am not the best, I may not always explain things the greatest, but I do understand what this is suppose to be, and what DE wanted. The concept is great, the Gameplay is great. The cry for weakening powers by people who have never made it high end gaming needs to stop. I one day would like to reach high end gaming. Some changes at times may need to be made to help the teno work better as a team, but not because one player dose not know how to dial it down and work with a team.

Please... paragraphs... grammar... spelling... O.o  I'll fix it for you...  I'm going to assume you wrote that on a phone?

 

Anyways, you appear to fail to see the value of balance in PVE.  I assure you, there is a great deal of value to balance in PVE.  Full explanation available here.

 

Unfortunately, your solution suggests that people have those options available to them.  Many (such as myself) do not.  That's just how it is.

[Guest Shibboleet]

and the op is mad at trinity being able to kill stuff almost as well as press 4 to kill warframes after 6 forma >.<

I posted a build in my giant post that takes 0 forma. The only real mod that this is lacking is streamline, but could sub out Energy Siphon for a D polarity and slot it in.

 

As for 'almost as well'...link+bless is infinitely better than prime explosions.

[MoyuTheTrinity]

I posted a build in my giant post that takes 0 forma. The only real mod that this is lacking is streamline, but could sub out Energy Siphon for a D polarity and slot it in.

 

As for 'almost as well'...link+bless is infinitely better than prime explosions.

 

yeah killing 5-6 people with 175 energy is so much better then killing everything with only 100?

[Guest Shibboleet]

Only 20 min wow that's it try making it to 40 first before complaining lease. Sounds like the person build the trinity for higher level running but only went 20 minutes. Instead of asking for something why don't you learn the abilities of your war frames the strengths and weaknesses. Find a good group of friends, and work on teamwork. This  is a game of teamwork yeas it can be one of solo, but it is about team survival, and not about how many you kill. PVP is not the name of the gam it is PVE after all. You need o understand in a team that is randomly thrown together you will not always be the spotlight. some people build the Warframe they have for higher level gameplay, and farm low level gameplay. The solution is to not to ask to have the rest of the trinity punished because you ad a bad experience. the solution is to get better, of find a few stable groups you game with that are at you level of gameplay so you do not get randomly thrown in with someone who can handle the higher level gameplay, or solo.  Think team not I, and use one of the strategies I suggested. They work trust me, as I have run into similar problems. The worst problem I ran into was actually the opposite though. Someone who did not know how to play the Warframe they had. Loki invisible is not a viable shield, and cannot stand up to laser fire. I would much rather an experienced player that can handle high end gaming than a noob who tries to use the invisible Loki as a shield. I may be a noob as well but instead of crying op I learn the system, I learn the gameplay, I learn my play level, and I find people who I can play with and have a good time with. I build for team play, and have a growing group of friends. I think I just suck, but apparently I am good enough to get invited to game with some very good players at times. I have even learned how to build to solo t1 and t2 survival to 40 minutes, due to no one on my friends list being on. That is a challenge, and that is grinding if that is a difficult you are looking for try it. Sorry you had a bad experience, but your solution is to punish others for your inconvenience instead of trying to use other solutions. It is getting very hard to get very far in survival as it is with the group who think things are op cry and get things weakened. Realize Survival, and defense have no cap, and so while you stop at 20 some of us have a goal of one day going 40 min+ on T3 and getting Rhino prime, and other drops that only drop high end. Also you may not have been hunted yet, but I also have a goal of defeating these three ugly things that keep coming after Teno. If Teno keep getting weaker because people who think this is PVP keep getting powers weakened PVE will become imposable. Then again that might be your goal, I love PVE I am old school gaming PVE rules. Team gaming rules. I am not the best, I may not always explain things the greatest, but I do understand what this is suppose to be, and what DE wanted. The concept is great, the Gameplay is great. The cry for weakening powers by people who have never made it high end gaming needs to stop. I one day would like to reach high end gaming. Some changes at times may need to be made to help the teno work better as a team, but not because one player dose not know how to dial it down and work with a team.

I'm all for teamwork, but I'll bring up the example in my first post (as ridiculous as that power might sound to some people, but that's the point)

 

"

Balancing is good for a pvp game and is also good in a pve game.

Hypothetical Question: What if there was an ulti that one shot the entire map, gave invulnerability to the team, and gave everyone 5k credits on use?

Not saying it would logically happen, but where is the line drawn? It's all perspective.

"

[Guest Shibboleet]

yeah killing 5-6 people with 175 energy is so much better then killing everything with only 100?

Only 5-6 with one cast? I can cast link + blessing for a duration time of 28 seconds. You think I'll only stug myself twice in that amount of time?

 

Think about it this way. M.Prime can only explode once per target (on death), and each target hit by a group can only be hit by the strongest explosion. Also considering M.Prime scales out at earlier levels...when the exact opposite is true with link, and link starts out strong.

Edited April 7, 2014 by Shibboleet

[MoyuTheTrinity]

I'm all for teamwork, but I'll bring up the example in my first post (as ridiculous as that power might sound to some people, but that's the point)

 

"

Balancing is good for a pvp game and is also good in a pve game.

Hypothetical Question: What if there was an ulti that one shot the entire map, gave invulnerability to the team, and gave everyone 5k credits on use?

Not saying it would logically happen, but where is the line drawn? It's all perspective.

"

Refrence: Developed content is up to 20 minute survivals up to wave 20 defences and anything level 35 and lower

 

you dont seem to understand how unessisary trinity is within the developed content within the nessisary content invincability is neerly worthless everything dies instantly there is just no need for trinity within it everything you listed is for EXTREAM content that is porpusly not balanced and unplaned for literaly unplayable without trinity in most cases it isnt trivializing anything when other things trivialize the real content of the game

rhino prime / soma / brakk / boltor prime / synaps orthos prime / galatine (nova also  makes all developed content easier since you just walk thru empty room after room)

Only 5-6 with one cast? I can cast link + blessing for a duration time of 28 seconds. You think I'll only stug myself twice in that amount of time?

 

Think about it this way. M.Prime can only explode once per target (on death), and each target hit by a group can only be hit by the strongest explosion. Also considering M.Prime scales out at earlier levels...when the exact opposite is true with link, and link starts out strong.

 

you cant get an ogris at low levels.... if you are high enough level to get an ogris then your playing content to low level for your refrence

Edited April 7, 2014 by MoyuTheMedic

[Guest Shibboleet]

Refrence: Developed content is up to 20 minute survivals up to wave 20 defences and anything level 35 and lower

 

you dont seem to understand how unessisary trinity is within the developed content within the nessisary content invincability is neerly worthless everything dies instantly there is just no need for trinity within it everything you listed is for EXTREAM content that is porpusly not balanced and unplaned for literaly unplayable without trinity in most cases it isnt trivializing anything when other things trivialize the real content of the game

rhino prime / soma / brakk / boltor prime / synaps orthos prime / galatine (nova also  makes all developed content easier since you just walk thru empty room after room)

 

you cant get an ogris at low levels.... if you are high enough level to get an ogris then your playing content to low level for your refrence

I don't think you got my point (Not sure if you quoted the wrong post). Where is the line in power balance? Is a map wide ultimate that insta killing everything that also gives immunity for 4 minutes and gives everyone bonus affinity ok? Would you disagree to a new frame having that ability? If so, why?

 

Stug takes rank 2, ogris is too slow.

Edited April 7, 2014 by Shibboleet

[MoyuTheTrinity]

I don't think you got my point (Not sure if you quoted the wrong post). Where is the line in power balance? Is a map wide ultimate that insta killing everything that also gives immunity for 4 minutes and gives everyone bonus affinity ok? Would you disagree to a new frame having that ability? If so, why?

 

Stug takes rank 2, ogris is too slow.

trinity's only usable skill by itself is blessing noone actualay wanted an attack skill on trinity you are compairing 2 skills a 3 and a 4 against 1 hypathedical 4 that does more then the 3 and the 4

 

or you could just shoot everything with the stug or even in the same time it takes you to link blessing and spam the stug you could have just hit 4 on any other warframe over and over with max power eff and killed everything and run past the trinity

[Grayle]

I quite like it when there's a Nova or a Trinity or other frame geared for high level stuff roflstomping some random Helene runs for Cells. I make it my mission to kill everything before they can, and usually they respond in kind resulting in one hell of a play session with everyone using every trick in the book to get to the new enemy spawn before anyone else to pop em first. 

 

Unloading and killing all enemies in the time it takes a Nova to cast her M-Prime, or said Nova wormholing to the next cluster to ensure the kills while I hoof and zorencopter as best I can but end up just short. It's great fun, you should try it instead of just giving up and coming to the forums to whine. And I'm pretty sure Link can only target 3 or so enemies at a time, if you can't beat that then, man, maybe you should just give up. 3 kills per boomboom, if you can't do better than that just by aiming then there's not a lot of hope left. Especially on Defense or Survival. And the first 20 waves? Christ, any random offensive 4 one-shots most if not all things there.

Edited April 7, 2014 by Grayle

[-SLX-J3tAc3]

I think is funny how a "Healer Frame" needs to be nerfed.  If you know HOW to play a frame, that frame is infinitely more powerful than the same frame played by someone that only knows how to "Run and Gun".  Seriously, GROW A PAIR and learn how to play your frame.  OH, and please stop *@##$ing about people that have spent the time to learn how to play the game and play their frame.  You Wuss.

While I believe Trinity, Valk and the other frame could use a little reworking (making their invincibility powers' time last shorter and use more power to discourage spamming them), I respect your opinion and thoroughly agree with you. I remember someone on the forums was saying how this or that frame was "useless", but the frames they named simply required you to think more tactically and more advanced besides simply point and shoot.

[Edgedemon]

after watching a Trinity keep up Blessing for an entire round, blowing herself up with Castanas, while Linking damage across the whole map I'm seriously doubting coming back for anymore. This was about the least "ninja" playing experience I've ever had, there was no danger, no one to kill, and really no real game play. I just followed the Trinity running back and forth to soak up the tidal wave of xp for the weapons that had on me once any other strategy just seemed futile. 

 

the system can be exploited? yes.

 

But there exactly is the point "it can" but you don't have to do it, if the game required you to use a permanent blessing built to win even a single mission i would agree that it is broken (and would probably stop playing myself) but if someone is too lazy to play and want to do it that way, it's his problem, i have more than enough not playing with him, he may think that's fun but hes not gonna ruin my fun. 

 

you could just leave that session or even ignore the player.

 

the problem is not the system is the people using it.

[GetAtMeMods]

Ya they should nerf trinity.

I put a ton of time in my loki. I forma'd loki and equipped maxed corrupted mods, but you don't see me clearing maps.

She's more op than nova honestly.

[MoyuTheTrinity]

Ya they should nerf trinity.

I put a ton of time in my loki. I forma'd loki and equipped maxed corrupted mods, but you don't see me clearing maps.

She's more op than nova honestly.

you arnt supposed to clear maps your supposed to run thru them :U

when scott was it?

reqorked trinity I do belive he showed off nuking himself with the ogris and blowing up everythign around him as an intentional thing for trinity so she wont just be a use blessing and energy vampire frame but now she is use link and use blessing frame and if you want use explosives and kill stuff so what O_o she will get a rework again eventualy hopefuly a more supportive update but its eventualy there are far more stronger frames being invincable is unessisary in content the devs make and being able to nuke weak enemys is not that impressive

[Monolake]

 

the system can be exploited? yes.

 

But there exactly is the point "it can" but you don't have to do it, if the game required you to use a permanent blessing built to win even a single mission i would agree that it is broken (and would probably stop playing myself) but if someone is too lazy to play and want to do it that way, it's his problem, i have more than enough not playing with him, he may think that's fun but hes not gonna ruin my fun. 

 

you could just leave that session or even ignore the player.

 

the problem is not the system is the people using it.

 

People will always gravitate towards the best and most efficient ways, if something can be exploited to make game easier - it will be exploited. Its developers job to fix the exploits. It is nonsense to put something into the game and then say "Dont use it, its too good!"

And like it or not Blessing is an exploit, a cheat, that completely removes any danger from the game globally with no drawbacks. It makes redundant everything else that should be used to survive and avoid the damage: teamwork, tactics, movement, skills and abilities. Exactly half of the combat  - "not taking damage" - is made irrelevant.  

Edited April 8, 2014 by Monolake

[MoyuTheTrinity]

People will always gravitate towards the best and most efficient ways, if something can be exploited to make game easier - it will be exploited. Its developers job to fix the exploits. It is nonsense to put something into the game and then say "Dont use it, its too good!"

And like it or not M-Prime is an exploit, a cheat, that completely removes any danger from the game for 3 rooms with no drawbacks. It makes redundant everything else that should be used to kill and cause damage: teamwork, tactics, movement, skills and abilities. Exactly half of the combat  - "causing  damage" - is made irrelevant.  

 

you can replace blessing with many other things and they work better and more fun in dev'ed content thats why you never see blessing outside of a bored end gamer or a dedicated team player trinity in pubs guns and destructive 4s are much more fun/faster/reliable way of winning in public matches

Edited April 8, 2014 by MoyuTheMedic

[Temporary]

Unfortunately, all people I know that have tried the game quit and my clan isn't exactly close-knit.

 

You can't expect everyone to be able to regulate who they play with unfortunately.

 

As far as rarity goes, I'm Mastery 14.  I think about half the Trinities I come across are capable of infinite invincibility at that level.

Um... sorry that your friends didn't last and that your clan isn't "close-knit"?

Actually yes I can, people are usually online at the same time every day (or every other day) given their time zone so there are plenty of people you can play with, you just have to find them which isn't hard; unless you're picky as all hell. Is it really that hard to find like minded people that play at the same time as you, sure I get that people don't last but there are always more where they came from.

I come across a Trinity maybe once every two weeks and whilst you mentioned you were rank 14 I'm rank 15 so there isn't that much of a difference in our play time, I'll just put the difference down to luck and leave it at that.

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Um... sorry that your friends didn't last and that your clan isn't "close-knit"?

Actually yes I can, people are usually online at the same time every day 

Except I'm in college so saying that I have any sort of regular schedule for gaming would be a hilarious joke.

 

And is it that much of a stretch for someone to request that pubs be at least semi-decent?

 

Also, I never mentioned the frequency I saw Trinities, only the frequency with which they seemed able to give perma-invincibility.  I don't see Trinities that often either.

Edited April 8, 2014 by Volt_Cruelerz

[gamefreak9149]

Just 20 minutes.....20 minutes is nothing in a t3 survival so of course she/he was one hitting everything with the link+blessing combo. Heck once i get to wave 40+ I have to find a heavy gunner then stand in front of him and detonate all my Castanas on him or in front of him so I can start to do damage to them again even that takes a few reloads. after 60 minutes all bets are off and link+blessing is mostly so I dont deal with knock downs so I can cast blessing again and you all can start to shine. The 100% proc chance on stun is just a nice bonus on those weapons.

 

Now 20 minutes I could run around with a invisible loki/ash just spamming my melee and most things will die in one swipe at that point and with a number of weapons at rank 30 with decent mod setup. Rhino running around using a stomp spam setup for damage could still work and cover chunks of rooms. An Ember with World on Fire for the first 20 minutes also works against multiple factions. Volt makes corpus a joke for the first 20 minutes, heck even longer then 20 minutes. Nova with Mprime and her second power will devastate things for way longer then 20 minutes against every faction.Those are to name a few off the top of my head.

 

edit: the rhino stomp idea might start to slow down at wave 10+. So might have to rethink that and get to shooting them while they are suspending in air for 8 seconds each like normal.

Edited April 8, 2014 by gamefreak9149

[fatpig84]

Then you better don't get angry at my Penta Nyx then.