Excalibur 2.0 - We Are Almost There!

[JokerVictor]

A pure damage increase would help to let it scale a little higher, but it´s not the best solution that´s correct, tath´s why most people want the melee counter integration since it´s a passive damage buff that requires a little more skill and thought to achieve addittionaly a forced bleed proc is what i and many others suggested since it fits well with the concept and damage type of the ability while also increasing it´s damage outputt.

 

A blast or radiation proc doesn´t make any sense though... I simply doesn´t fit with the concept of the ability! We are not doing a radiation dash after all, are we. ;)

 

Fair enough, I'll concede that one.  Actually, using SD to beef up your combo multiplier as a way to open combat would be pretty excellent.  Since we're all talking about removing Super Jump as well, why not move the stealth function to SD as well?  Say you get 2-3 seconds of stealth (or till you attack or use a power) at the end of the dash? This could be made into an ability augment, at least.

Edited December 3, 2014 by JokerVictor

[r0ckwolf]

Fair enough, I'll concede that one.  Actually, using SD to beef up your combo multiplier as a way to open combat would be pretty excellent.  Since we're all talking about removing Super Jump as well, why not move the stealth function to SD as well?  Say you get 2-3 seconds of stealth (or till you attack or use a power) at the end of the dash? This could be made into an ability augment, at least.

Having that effect as an augment would have indeed be cool!

[JokerVictor]

So, I had a thought.  Everyone seems to be all in favor of a couple things: Making slash dash add to the melee counter (and possibly making it aimable), removing super jump, and adding a melee buff of some kind.

 

Bearing that in mind, why not synergize Excal completely and have this as yet to be determined buff enhance the combo meter?  While it's active you get a bonus to movement speed (really the most important thing in melee), every melee hit adds 1.5 to the combo meter instead of just 1, and the combo meter decays 5 seconds slower.  This could also stack with slash dash.  25 energy activation, 1 energy/s while active.  This also gives you the option of going total gangbusters by adding channeling on top.  This could be a team buff as well, good for rolling with a valkyr.... might be a bit OP there though.

[Lagomorf]

So, I had a thought.  Everyone seems to be all in favor of a couple things: Making slash dash add to the melee counter (and possibly making it aimable), removing super jump, and adding a melee buff of some kind.

 

Bearing that in mind, why not synergize Excal completely and have this as yet to be determined buff enhance the combo meter?  While it's active you get a bonus to movement speed (really the most important thing in melee), every melee hit adds 1.5 to the combo meter instead of just 1, and the combo meter decays 5 seconds slower.  This could also stack with slash dash.  25 energy activation, 1 energy/s while active.  This also gives you the option of going total gangbusters by adding channeling on top.  This could be a team buff as well, good for rolling with a valkyr.... might be a bit OP there though.

I'd better suggest that each enemy hit while Slash Dashing would increase mellee combo multiplier by 1, meaning that if you hit 5 enemies, you will get x5 damage multiplier. That would really make Slash Dash usefull all the round, especially if it's own damage would raise whith that multiplier.

[Veddhartha]

The best thing possible seems to be dropping Super Jump.

[Thaumatos]

And just to nip the whole "Zephyr" thing in the bud, I do think that an 'aimed Slash Dash' is exactly what Zephyr has...and exactly what she needs to have changed.

 

Her "Tail Wind" should be a short duration Archwing-like flight ability.  They've already got proven mechanics for it.

[RahuHordika]

Just gotta bring this back, Excal is right on the path, but he still needs those buffs to his abilities.

[Kaeldian]

Ever since I discovered how to "super jump" with directional air melee, the ability seems pointless to have now.  Heck, I get more use using my Bo Staff in mid air than I ever got out of Super Jump.

[Thaumatos]

Excalibur was a "balance between offense and movement" ... and now everyone has his level of movement for free.  So what is he a balance between now?  Wasting energy and spending energy?

[RahuHordika]

Slash Dash needs more focus on the offensive aspect. As others have said melee scaling or trait inheritance seems to be the prefered way to go.

Super Jump needs to be changed, not opted out of what it is now, but it should also have an option to make quick horizontal leaps/dodges while on the ground. I've given a more detailed description several times before.

I still think Javelin should impale/ragdoll surviving enemies rather than just the little stun it has right now.

[DSpite]

sighh.... it´s not about him being broken! His Abilities work for what they are intended to do, but his flat damage is simply the lowest in the game, which results in Excalibur simply not scaling at all, even with midrange enemys. After lvl 20 Enemys you don´t do any damage at all anymore, which makes Excalibur extremely undesirable to have in an high level lineup.

 

His only redeeming quality is ofcourse a maximizied Radial Blind, which results in an extremely boring playstyle, that has nothing to do with what Excalibur is intended to do: Be an badass SWORDFRAME!!!!

 

"... after level 20 ... no damage" ???

 

Am I supposed to take ANYTHING seriously after you make the statement that his abilities are bad on enemies higher then level 20?

 

First, to point out that as far as DE is concerned, level 30-40 enemies are the ones that we should be "facing" during special Alerts. When you fight endless you are not "facing" anything, you are playing silly buggers "sit in one spot Tower Defense games"

 

I have no problem taking him into all the Tactical Alerts, and it's not DE's fault if people see endless as "farming expeditions" and not missions, and use those with specialized duration/strength builds to spam ultimate's non stop.

 

All missions should play closer to what Payday 1/2 missions play like, where you have specific objectives, not hunker down in a room with heavy machines guns pointed into the only doorway in, which is how we spec for endless.

 

His abilities, AND other Frames abilities just need to function properly for normal missions, not "Wave 40 T4" which is scaled artificially using whacky formulas.

[DeadlyBard676]

i wish people would stop trying to make excalibur a melee frame. cause he isn't he is supposed to be a basic easy to learn frame. a jack of all trades master of none. just because his ability animations use a skana doesn't mean he was built for being a melee frame.

What needs to be done is for de to make maps where he can utilize his abilities to the max(such maps would also beable to work well with other frames with high moblity and LoS abilites) and give his damage abilities scaling

[azmyth1]

Now that everyone is talking about passives, perhaps Excalibur could get super jump as a passive and a totally new ability for 3.  It could be toned down a bit because passives shouldn't be as good as actives.

[DSpite]

Now that everyone is talking about passives, perhaps Excalibur could get super jump as a passive and a totally new ability for 3.  It could be toned down a bit because passives shouldn't be as good as actives.

 

You do realize that "jumping in the air 20 meters" is NOT a "passive" anything. A passive addition would be for the jumping he has now to get a slight boost, say 1-2 meters, not gain an ENTIRE jumping skill built it.

[tris1]

"... after level 20 ... no damage" ???

 

Am I supposed to take ANYTHING seriously after you make the statement that his abilities are bad on enemies higher then level 20?

 

First, to point out that as far as DE is concerned, level 30-40 enemies are the ones that we should be "facing" during special Alerts. When you fight endless you are not "facing" anything, you are playing silly buggers "sit in one spot Tower Defense games"

 

I have no problem taking him into all the Tactical Alerts, and it's not DE's fault if people see endless as "farming expeditions" and not missions, and use those with specialized duration/strength builds to spam ultimate's non stop.

 

All missions should play closer to what Payday 1/2 missions play like, where you have specific objectives, not hunker down in a room with heavy machines guns pointed into the only doorway in, which is how we spec for endless.

 

His abilities, AND other Frames abilities just need to function properly for normal missions, not "Wave 40 T4" which is scaled artificially using whacky formulas.

Damage is terrible on the frame and what De called end game is just silly as I do the syndicate levels and the enemy is like level 45-50

[Thaumatos]

"... after level 20 ... no damage" ???

 

Am I supposed to take ANYTHING seriously after you make the statement that his abilities are bad on enemies higher then level 20?

 

First, to point out that as far as DE is concerned, level 30-40 enemies are the ones that we should be "facing" during special Alerts. When you fight endless you are not "facing" anything, you are playing silly buggers "sit in one spot Tower Defense games"

 

I have no problem taking him into all the Tactical Alerts, and it's not DE's fault if people see endless as "farming expeditions" and not missions, and use those with specialized duration/strength builds to spam ultimate's non stop.

 

All missions should play closer to what Payday 1/2 missions play like, where you have specific objectives, not hunker down in a room with heavy machines guns pointed into the only doorway in, which is how we spec for endless.

 

His abilities, AND other Frames abilities just need to function properly for normal missions, not "Wave 40 T4" which is scaled artificially using whacky formulas.

 

Wow, you dug that out of the mothballs just to say that Endless Defense is imbalanced?

 

Your guns and your melee weapons can easily overcome any frame's worthless abilities in Warframe.  That's what people are seeing with xcal right now.  They're not having trouble playing him because they're not reliant on frame abilities.  Nobody is.

 

We don't need any one ability.  Frankly, I spend most of my time playing with a full bar of energy...until I need to leech life (which is another band-aid they need to fix).  The only time I ever use RJ is when I'm a client and I feel like actually clearing a room with bugged RJ client damage.  Once they fix that, I'll be going back to dealing with not having any reason to use anything outside of RB when I want to rez someone.

 

And yes, xcal's abilities top-off at about 20-ish rank enemies.  Against Grineer they stop at 16.  There's really no reason I should have to Slash Dash through a pile of targets more than twice to kill them.  I'd just as soon shoot them all with my Akbolto and not waste the energy.

 

I gain nothing from SD now.  I can move faster for no energy.  Jump + Swing > Slash Dash

 

i wish people would stop trying to make excalibur a melee frame. cause he isn't he is supposed to be a basic easy to learn frame. a jack of all trades master of none. just because his ability animations use a skana doesn't mean he was built for being a melee frame.

What needs to be done is for de to make maps where he can utilize his abilities to the max(such maps would also beable to work well with other frames with high moblity and LoS abilites) and give his damage abilities scaling

Except 2 of his 4 abilities are things all frames can do the without spending energy (jump and dash).

 

Excalibur wasn't meant to be a 'jack of all trades'...I'm not sure how that cropped up but it's just a fan-based falsehood.  He's as easy to learn as the other two "starting" frames.  That's why they removed Loki from the list.  He's hard to play when you don't have a perma-invis build.

 

And just because something is easy to learn doesn't mean it has to be lack-luster, lame, useless, pointless, or even wasteful.  Haven't you ever heard of the phrase "Easy to learn, hard to master"?

[(PSN)Nozomi244]

I just want them to make RB the way it was.

[BerserkerPrime]

i actually think the "energy sword melee only" should be his 3rd ability and should be like ballistic battery+hysteria. you get you melee energy sword and you take all the damage you've dealt and deal it in an AOE attack similar to RJ like animation. and you have some awesome combos only for that sword. because if mesa is a guns focused frame and she is new, excal is old, which means he is sword focused frame

[skydog1122]

This all sounds really awesome but if your gonna rework excalibur's abilities, you at least have to make some changes to his appearance... 

 

Anybody up to making some artwork (cuz i'm terrible at it)

 

At least make up some casting animations, and what they'd look like.

[RahuHordika]

I just want them to make RB the way it was.

I don't, not yet at least. I'm just glad people can look at Excal's abilities as they are rather than refusing to do so because of the poor attempt of an excuse that was the 'stunlock-everything-in-the-room-and-the-next-2' that was the old RB.

Hek, just remember the outcry about how 'Excal is useless now' once the power was nerfed. One good ability does not justify the rest of the kit being underwhelming, and I wish more people understood that.

[Vaskadar]

I don't, not yet at least. I'm just glad people can look at Excal's abilities as they are rather than refusing to do so because of the poor attempt of an excuse that was the 'stunlock-everything-in-the-room-and-the-next-2' that was the old RB.

Hek, just remember the outcry about how 'Excal is useless now' once the power was nerfed. One good ability does not justify the rest of the kit being underwhelming, and I wish more people understood that.

 

I'm mostly miffed that Slash Dash wasn't touched at all. It used to be so incredibly good.

[RahuHordika]

I'm mostly miffed that Slash Dash wasn't touched at all. It used to be so incredibly good.

I never saw it as that good, but helluva lot better than it is now. It just needs a scaling damage component so it's not rendered immediatly useless after lvl 20s but can also still have a proper use besides the outmatched mobility.

The melee weapon scaling idea not only is good because it helps in this situation, but it's also a very interesting concept of the pleyr's progress when you think of it. Excalibur is a starter frame, with starter gear his abilities won't be fantastic but as the player progresses and gets better gear Excalibur's powers (particularly Slash Dash) get stronger as a result.

[r0ckwolf]

i wish people would stop trying to make excalibur a melee frame. cause he isn't he is supposed to be a basic easy to learn frame. a jack of all trades master of none. just because his ability animations use a skana doesn't mean he was built for being a melee frame.

What needs to be done is for de to make maps where he can utilize his abilities to the max(such maps would also beable to work well with other frames with high moblity and LoS abilites) and give his damage abilities scaling

He is advertised by the in game description, as a Warframe that features sword atacks.... sounds a lot like melee to me!

Also suggesting they should redesign the maps around his abilitys is a little far fetched, first of all i don´t really know why the abilitys don´t work for you in the current maps, could you explain?! Secondly designing the abilitys in a way so they work with the current maps is completely possible as shown by other frames and i do believe my suggestions would too!

I don't, not yet at least. I'm just glad people can look at Excal's abilities as they are rather than refusing to do so because of the poor attempt of an excuse that was the 'stunlock-everything-in-the-room-and-the-next-2' that was the old RB.

Hek, just remember the outcry about how 'Excal is useless now' once the power was nerfed. One good ability does not justify the rest of the kit being underwhelming, and I wish more people understood that.

This is exactly right! The previous RB was indeed overpowered and it was totally ok to nerf it a bit. What DE did wrong was using "logic" as an argument in a game that has no place for it in the fist place when it comes to the warframe abilitys. They should have just been honest about their intentions. Additionaly the so called buffs to his other abilitys have been very underwhelming and didn´t deliver to the point where you could call them an improvment, i would even say that RJ lost a bit of it´s identity. Edited December 8, 2014 by r0ckwolf

[Wrecked.]

I just want them to make RB the way it was.

 

I dont think thats going to happen.

 

What i would like is for them to fix the way LoS works atm. Im just not blinding targets that i can even see, i just can't rely on it at end game.

 

I would like to think that my Future Space ninja has a better blind then the current Armed Forces Flashbang :)

[MichaelSD]

RB was not overpowered. Why is Stomp, Miasma, Overload or a speed Nova not overpowered?