A Thread On Everything Warframe Is Doing Wrong.

[Innocent_Flower]

So I wanted to sum up what I felt was the majority of warframe criticsm. If DE could properly amend every issue in this thread; warframe would be a far more popular product. 

 

Part 1

Large Issues that DE have ignored for foolish things like kubrows, new primes and more cosmetics. 

Parkour and knockdown gets ignored both on the side of the player and on the enemy who don't use it. Meanwhile puppies are being worked on. Has anyone heard of the alpha game Overgrowth? That game has both superior and fun parkour and better knockdown mechanics. Not only is that game alpha; It's indie and there's one coder who's doing everything. 

 

The mod system is collectively flawed because there are some mods you just have no reason to use. Why would you pick cold resist unless you knew for certain that you'd be playing in a fridge (you never are) Why would you pick any aura that isn't Rifle amp, energy siphon or health regen other than not having those aura? There's a massive divide between functional (health, powers) and utility/bloat mods (master thief, hacker,  acrobat, resistances) 

 

You can't yet cutomise powers in any way more meaningful than duration/intensity/range/so on mods and that is especially inadequate with frames like excalibur who use varied powers. Maybe a power tree? Alternate power sets? 

 

Melee still sucks. 

- Arial/rising attacks are non existent. 

-melee attacks slow the player down too much. 

- Most combos mean nothing to most players. 

- You can't quickfire your secondary whilst you're holding your weapon. 

Melee enemies still suck. Excluding the guys that can block. They're all fodder. In the other part I pointed out that I could easily add tougher melee enemies but we'd still have this problem: There are no interesting behaviours; No slide attacks, no jumping attacks or leap slams or whatever. No enemy dodging and hardly any abilities that close the gap. 

 

The two most played gametypes- defense and survival, aren't getting enough work done to them. Interception has a lot of potential too but nobody likes it at the moment because that potential isn't being realized.  it's good that rescue and sabotage are getting work but defence and survival realy need some work too

 

Edit: Stealth. I don't think the community has a big consensus on stealth. Some would argue that stealth gameplay is very important to them. Others would argue that stealth wouldn't be done right and would probably make the game too easy. However, i think the majority of the playerbase would have issue with the following

- The enemy can't handle invisible players in a believable or interesting way

- If one player is seen, every enemy knows where every single player is. Meaning stealthkills are gone and a lot of interesting player tactics too. 

 

Part 2

Notable yet absurdly easy to touch on issues that I, A small-time modder, could fix within a week. If I could make all those fixes within such a small timeframe; Why can't professional staff do the same?  

- New dual stat fire damage/status chance mods are being released when 2.5% status chance mods such as sure shot, melee prowess and rifle aptitude remain pathetically underpowered. 

 

- The void still has a grand total of seven enemies when all you realy need to do is recolour current units white , switch their factions and stick a gold thing into their heads. Corrupting every unit is about as difficult as adding a single new one (New units incoming) 

 

- make defence/ interception rewards better. Take out the common mods like vitality, maybe throw in the blueprints for retired weapons like ether daggers .

 

 Power mods in drop tables. 

A- Remove power mods. Powers work without mods. 

B- Have only one level for power mods. That way there's no mistaken "i ranked up my mod too high and can't fit it on my frame's build" and thus nobody would need more than their initial mod that they got from building the frame. 

C- The ability to clone power mods. Like to be able to make a power mod turn fusion cores into unranked duplicates.

 

- Balance weapons; Sure, I wouldn't personally be able to change some of their more advanced mechanics (like angstrum rocket barrages ) but tweaking stats is pretty easy. Clan tech weapons (flux, supra etc)  are currently far weaker than they're meant to be. Boltor prime is too strong even by prime standards. 

 

- Phased/wraith/rubedo items colourable or at least with the option to use their default skin, 

 

- The addition and balance of numerous new enemies with current assets. New osprey, heavy and non-fodder melee, elite variants, Some (but not all) better eximus changes. 

 

- Earth needs vey hek back. 

 

Part 3

The biggest issue. 

Scaling and leveling doesn't work. The enemy becomes super strong so you become super strong.It's the faultiest part of warframe. Chances are with pubs that one player will be OP and one player will be UP and it isn't going to be fun if you're either one of them. The OP player will take most of the kills, make everyone else feel useless and make themselves feel bored as they aren't challenged enough. The UP player will be looked upon as dead weight and will see themselves as terrible. It isn't the effect you want on players. 

 

All of warframe is focused on "the grind" at the moment. It shouldn't be. Warframe is less of an MMORPG and far more of a third person shooter. The need for "the grind" is misplaced. A third person shooter should stand alone on it's gameplay and progression mechanics can be put on top of that, not the other way round as warframe currently is. What makes it worse is that there isn't progression. With games that have a "good" grind the player is constantly getting more powerful. Warframe works in hills and troughs when it comes to power. You're underpowered, you're overpowered. You're underpowered again. You're overpowered again. It isn't productive and it isn't fun and it's part of the reason why warframe gets a 66 metacritic rating for being monotonous.

 

If it weren't for the ridiculous amount of level scaling; Offensive powers would be useful late game, anyone with any equipment would be able to have fun on any level and yet the will to obtain better/different weapons would live on. 

 

I'm not saying get rid of level scaling and weapon progression entirely. I'm saying that it should be reduced. Instead of the stupid, lazy, overblown and completely unnecessary "moar health+damage" system we have going we need something like "More elite units, better ai, New behaviors, more dastardly game director"  

 

 

 

 

If I've missed anything, Please tell me so I can include it. 

Edited June 24, 2014 by Innocent_Flower

[Marshall]

The community and developers are aware of most problems, we wait for Update 14 now because it is supposed to bring major changes to the game. Let's hope for the best.

 

Anyway, I agree with most of what you said, I also made threads about it but only a few read those text walls

[Pandoran_Stallion]

The community and developers are aware of most problems, we wait for Update 14 now because it is supposed to bring major changes to the game. Let's hope for the best.

 

Anyway, I agree with most of what you said, I also made threads about it but only a few read those text walls

Same, but people don't read walls of text, unless it's a large rant that they can flame...

[Brahmastra]

If I've missed anything, Please tell me so I can include it. 

 

stealth/ninja part of the game.

Would like to hear your opinion on that.

[Marshall]

Here is some more stuff to read for you fellas:

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/246914-quo-vadis-de

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/249657-necessary-changes-possibly-warframe-20

Edited June 22, 2014 by TRSS

[Innocent_Flower]

stealth/ninja part of the game.

Would like to hear your opinion on that.

Updated for you. I don't realy have a strong opinion on it. 

[EDeN153]

If I've missed anything, the quest system should reduce grinding. But like I said, might've missed stuff on that.

[BrotherIcarus]

Part 1 is mostly subjective. 

 

I agree with most of part 2 and like half of part 3 (Although part 3 also kind of gets subjective as well) 

[(PSN)TheRedZephyr]

So.... this

A similar thread with more content and numerous suggestions. DE won't catch the important stuff unless we unify all this important feedback.

[Innocent_Flower]

So.... this

A similar thread with more content and numerous suggestions. DE won't catch the important stuff unless we unify all this important feedback.

Thread is unfocused, supermasive and highlights quite a lot of very minor things. 

 

It also asks for  a few very gimmicky/novel ideas (like interrogating capture targets in your ship) In my opinion the ideas proposed aren't drastic enough. 

 

 

It's not that I think the guy is entirely wrong. It's more that I don't think his ideas are radical enough and although his points are valid; they should realy be secondary to more serious changes

Edited June 22, 2014 by Innocent_Flower

[CBAROG]

Where do I sign? It needs to be printed and sent to Canada. 

 

All of warframe is focused on "the grind" at the moment. It shouldn't be. Warframe is less of an MMORPG and far more of a third person shooter. 

It's neither. Warframe is a coop farming simulator. With amazing art.

[S.T.M.P.D]

They are listening, you know. They just have other plans, and those plans are actually very interesting.

 

I do want Overgrowth-class parkour, but the guy who did that worked on Shadow Of The Colossus, so he knew his poop. DE would either have to figure it out on their own or rip large sections of code.

 

And even then, it's like Rescue 2.0. There's very little motivation to use stealth or parkour in-game, which would have to be fixed by adding more parkour-intensive tiles.

 

I don't know about overgrowth melee, but we just got 2.0 so give them time.

[CBAROG]

Thread is unfocused, supermasive and highlights quite a lot of very minor things. 

 

It also asks for very gimmicky/novel ideas (like interrogating capture targets in your ship) In my opinion the ideas proposed aren't drastic enough. 

I don't agree here. This thread would make the gameplay "More Engaging/rewarding". And it's focused.

[Doughalo2]

the truth... Warframe is an amazing story waiting to be told but it isnt. Its an amazing game to play for a while.

My friends get bored, why?

The grind

the mechanics and the flow

and melee because of leveled scaling has no place for combos be ause either melee is to OP and one shots enemys or to UP that why bother useing a combo when you can shoot them??

Also enemys lach creativity they all look very much the same.

What makes me want to leave?

They wont fix the older things/current things in the game.

why do i stay?

because i know its easily fixed if they think for s second.

warframe has such great potential but idk sometimes.

BIGGEST problem is enemy level scaling. Ik Ik call me a fanboy or wat ever but look at halo as an example, different type of game ik but this needs to be in warframe. NO LEVEL SCALEING just these: more spawns, different types of abilitys (not the budget eximus crap) and variety.

without ridiculous health scaling weapons will be easier to balence.

the knockdown in warframe is the most stupid mechanic ever since it stun locks you with no ability to skillfully counter or get up quicker.

warfrAme needs mapped wall running/climbing pathway animations like assasins creed for uneven weird parts of levels.

We need stealth like clinging high above on a roof unseen or in shadows.

we need the AI to work in squads eg fodder protects weaker snipers point defences etc

LESS LAZY QUICK 'solutions' take more time with updates dont just pump them out.

alot of things are limited by LONG ANIMATIONS make them sharp and efficent (melee and movement)

dont make melee to be combos let us decide our moves and counters eg. Upper cuts stabs slams etc CAN be combined to make more natural combos anyway.!?!?

I could go on forever but i wont

[Renegade343]

It also asks for very gimmicky/novel ideas (like interrogating capture targets in your ship) In my opinion the ideas proposed aren't drastic enough. 

 

It's not that I think the guy is entirely wrong. It's more that I don't think his ideas are radical enough and although his points are valid; they should realy be secondary to more serious changes

Tell me what is gimmicky about each of my suggestions. I would like to hear it. 

 

And for the record, radical changes does not always equal better. Sometimes, minor changes can make the difference (case in point through editing in filming. A small visual/movement mistake in editing can lead to the viewers distracted by it and thus lose track of the story). 

[EDeN153]

Tell me what is gimmicky about each of my suggestions. I would like to hear it.

Thread is unfocused, supermasive and highlights quite a lot of very minor things. 

 

It also asks for very gimmicky/novel ideas (like interrogating capture targets in your ship) In my opinion the ideas proposed aren't drastic enough. 

Textbook high school drama situation.

[Renegade343]

Textbook high school drama situation.

I would really want to hear his opinion on it. After all, I am not all-knowing, so receiving as much feedback towards my suggestion as I can would help to improve it (since my suggestions contain my own bias). That is all. None of the 'high school drama' scenarios/situations you are describing. 

[EDeN153]

I would really want to hear his opinion on it. After all, I am not all-knowing, so receiving as much feedback towards my suggestion as I can would help to improve it (since my suggestions contain my own bias). That is all. None of the 'high school drama' scenarios/situations you are describing. 

Merely a joke, my friend.

[Renegade343]

Merely a joke, my friend.

Damn. Lack of verbal communication does make a difference in identifying jokes and sarcasm. 

[Innocent_Flower]

Tell me what is gimmicky about each of my suggestions. I would like to hear it. 

 

Sorry, Meant to put in "some" not all of the suggestions are "gimicky" I would pick on...

 

Your aproach to beacons. You've listed a very detailed explanation on how the beacon system could improve. I'd just throw Hek back to earth and forget the beacons. 

 

Sniper changes don't affect much. Furthermore you've written a lot about snipers. This kinda annoys me because when you talk about stuff like this in detail as if it were very important it realy belitles all the other issues there are. 

I would just retcon the snipetron into a railgun. Simple. 

 

Player mail system is interesting, but doesn't affect gameplay and at the moment warframe's big issue is the gameplay. 

 

I don't understand what you mean by orokin scrap. 

 

Well, you've listed some good suggestions, But they're all... They don't realy affect that much. That post edit 16 "here are some other threads i like" part was the best bit. But even then some of them are just silly; Like interrogating capture targets or having all seekers use vipers instead of the unique kraken pistol that was made for them. 

Edited June 22, 2014 by Innocent_Flower

[Renegade343]

Your aproach to beacons. You've listed a very detailed explanation on how the beacon system could improve. I'd just throw Hek back to earth and forget the beacons. 

I like that the real Vay Hek went into hiding (after all, he is a corrupt councillor, so it stands to reason that he would hide, but being the typical villain he is, he left a backdoor for us to find it in the form of frequency beacons), so I would keep that and improve the beacon situation instead. Make the pre-U13 Vay Hek act as a decoy and a surprise to all new players (something that Warframe lacks), along with some personality building/lore on Vay Hek and establishing a testing ground for Spy Mission reward rework. 

 

Sniper changes don't affect much. Furthermore you've written a lot about snipers. This kinda annoys me because when you talk about stuff like this in detail as if it were very important it realy belitles all the other issues there are. 

Which was rebutted very soundly by TheBlueJelly, thus the reason I wrote that it will undergo a huge change (most likely after I play around with the snipers). 

 

And after all, if the snipers are in the game, then why not improve it to become more viable in order to diversify player builds (players will not feel inferior when using snipers compared to all the other weaponry). 

 

I would just retcon the snipetron into a railgun. Simple. 

Or write a very small flavour text for it so the flavour text justifies why the Snipetron uses bullets. It gives more lore to the Corpus (which is somewhat lacking in Warframe), and does not require DE to add a new projectile (although the damage may need to be tweaked). After all, it is an alright sniper in terms of mechanics, so might as well not fix what is not broken and instead find another path to re-introduce the Snipetron. 

 

Player mail system is interesting, but doesn't affect gameplay and at the moment warframe's big issue is the gameplay. 

Just one of those quality of life changes that would improve the 'social gameplay', which takes only a little bit of time to do so (most games have the code for it, so DE could just take the framework, add a few bits to make it their own, and done). 

 

I don't understand what you mean by orokin scrap. 

Orokin Salvage (or Orokin Scrap, if you insist) is meant to be collected to build Orokin Equipment Modules, a token for buying the desired Prime part/blueprint. Please note that all of these suggestions change over time, and as of right now, I have an idea formulating in my head, which is to use Orokin Salvage as a material for researching and manufacturing Prime/(Grineer/Corups/Infested/Tenno) clan-tech research weapons for the Orokin Lab (bit like the Seer). 

[Innocent_Flower]

Argument is; You've written a lot about minor things, when realy you should go for the throat. 

[(PSN)TheRedZephyr]

Argument is; You've written a lot about minor things, when realy you should go for the throat. 

 

I would by no means call them minor. And the subjects you bring up are by no means "the throat", but are indeed large issues. I linked Renegade's thread in hopes of unifying some of the "These things break the base game" threads so ONE gets more attention rather than fifty small ones getting stomped by "OMG MUTALISTS OP". Instead, you're being rather rude to someone who I'm fairly sure shares your concerns about the game.

[Tar_Spit_Fire]

if i didn't upvote this thread.. im not a human anymore!! Totally agreed with you...

[DeadlyNerd]

I just don't understand why they haven't made combos ignore movement keys, and why do some weapons have to override character movement animation.

 

This game is all bout movement and fluidity of it, and melee system is doing the exact opposite.