This Game Is Way Too Easy

[Ghobe]

Yea I asked this on there last Q&A stream (CanadianxPC) and they simply laughed. "More rollers?" They simply said. So now I kind feel done with this game that I invested a little to much money  in I have to admit. I can simply solo all content excluding a few defense missions to about 25.

That's....that's really depressing. I guess that's pretty much the 2nd to last nail in the coffin for me :\ I suppose I'll keep watching to hope they implement something some day, but as to what's available now...I'm done. I've never been big into alts, and other warframes are like alts to me so I distinctly want to NOT do that. Oh well...another game shelved due to lack of content :\

[MagnumKnight]

honestly, i don;t see the deal of asking for more content in an open beta. hard open beta or soft open beta or what ever, it's still a beta. it's a taste of what's to come. some people struggle through the content as it is now, others find it medium difficulty, and others find it easy. as for the amount of content it's still a beta. they are WORKING ON IT. if the game is too easy get off the forums and stop complaining about it. come back at a later time to see if it's changed then and if it's still too easy for your tastes go ahead and gripe about it, but it's not going to change over night. there is so far pretty much no end game content other than farming. they're working on it. just sit down, relax, take a break from the game, instead of saying it's too easy and refusing to make more warframes. you made it to this point. you gave your two cents. stop beating the poor horse. they're working hard to give you this game, and they'll get to the harder, better, funner content sooner or later. just takes time.

Edited April 12, 2013 by MagnumKnight

[arune]

 - Scaled difficulty. It's pretty obvious to me (and perhaps I'm wrong), but the game is very difficult solo, and with a full group, generally gets to cakewalk territory quickly. It'd be nice if the game would adapt to new players entering the game, by increasing the number or difficulty of enemies, or even alternate between the two.

It actually already does: enemy numbers are increased, more heavy enemies added, enemy damage gets a significant boost. The problem is than even if there's 3x as much cannon fodder, its still just cannon fodder.

 

 

I had a moment of remembrance for what this game is at its best earlier. I joined an alert mission on Ceres with seconds left, so I ended up all alone in it. I went with my rank 20 Saryn, using my toy guns (Boltor, rank 19 / Lex, rank 23 / Fragor, rank 20, modded for melee). I figured, what the heck, I can handle Ceres easymode with my unleveled stuff.

 

Lotus tells me its data recovery x4. Mmmkay, so Lex is pretty crap against high-level infested in Ceres, with an underranked frame. Still manageable, very carefully gather 4 kits. MFW Lotus tells me "there's more valuable information on board, gather it".

 

Another 4 data kits to gather... I can do this. The packs of ancients with mixed corruptors and toxics are pretty tough, have to drop my data kits and use Boltor, and apply Moult creatively. Then it runs out of ammo. Finally even Lex runs out of ammo. I still manage to gather the kits, and heading to extraction, struggling with ancient packs, killing them by gathering them on Moult decoy and killing with Fragor slowly, ever so slowly. Then just before extraction, get hit by corruptor, didn't see it coming so I could dodge. F***. No energy, no ammo... Facing pack of corruptors mixed with toxics. Make a dart for extraction, sprinting past two ancient packs as hard as I can. Thankfully extraction was right around the next two corners and I made it.

 

Now that experience is what warframes is supposed to feel like, not this "herp derp I'll just run into level 70 enemies and instagib them".

Edited April 12, 2013 by arune

[Ghobe]

honestly, i don;t see the deal of asking for more content in an open beta. hard open beta or soft open beta or what ever, it's still a beta. it's a taste of what's to come. some people struggle through the content as it is now, others find it medium difficulty, and others find it easy. as for the amount of content it's still a beta. they are WORKING ON IT. if the game is too easy get off the forums and stop complaining about it. come back at a later time to see if it's changed then and if it's still too easy for your tastes go ahead and gripe about it, but it's not going to change over night. there is so far pretty much no end game content other than farming. they're working on it. just sit down, relax, take a break from the game, instead of saying it's too easy and refusing to make more warframes. you made it to this point. you gave your two cents. stop beating the poor horse. they're working hard to give you this game, and they'll get to the harder, better, funner content sooner or later. just takes time.

They didn't even take it seriously in the stream. They joked about making a level of nothing but nervos and immediately went into the next question. They're not acknowledging it here, they're not acknowledging it there. Also, if nothing is ever complained/criticized/whateveryouwannacallit then nothing ever changes and no, having 1 post on it, does not mean you get heard. Especially on a forum with this level of activity where even a really active thread can fall off the front page in moments.

[Mystrunner]

Well, then we keep making threads, keep providing feedback. If there was more difficulty, I'd probably keep throwing money at it. But there's no point in playing with a puzzle you already know how to solve...

[Chira]

I've been playing this game for a week now, and the first thing I thought was "Wow, this game is really easy." Now I can say that, after two weeks of playing this game, "This game is still way too easy." In all honesty, the only thing that offers difficulty is the defense missions after wave 15. That's. It. This game isn't going to last most people for long if you can just blow through everything with one level 30 supercharged primary gun.

Another main issue why I'm being heavily deterred from this game is that every level feels like a grind. There's no uniqueness to any of the levels. A good possible fix to this would be to spawn a random boss or encounter on every mission. Another thing to help alleviate this would be to make the grunts much more dangerous, capable of instagibbing players. The best thing they can do is stun you some, and for any player with shield/hp mods (which is most), it will only be an inconvenience. The grunts can be blown through fairly easily, and each level, even pluto, can be literally run through.

In short, please make this game much more difficult so the game feels less of a grind and more like a game.

People have suggested a difficulty slider, and that is acceptable to a point; however, there's only so much difficulty you can add by just spawning more mobs and jacking up their health/damage; the mechanics themselves need to be harder as well.

Before anyone starts, don't you even DARE try to bring up defense missions as an argument to say the game is hard; anything that scales to infinity will naturally be impossible. The other missions need to be difficult to succeed in as well to keep the game interesting. If a Loki can literally remove all his weapons, abilities, and mods, except an unranked primary and his decoy and still solo all the missions on pluto (except Outer Terminus and the boss because of small damage output), then there's a problem.

 

 

too easy? play in solo mode and you get your &#! kicked ~..~ ... too easy ... -_____-

[MotherCorpus]

Did anybody watch the cast they did the other day?

[MagnumKnight]

They didn't even take it seriously in the stream. They joked about making a level of nothing but nervos and immediately went into the next question. They're not acknowledging it here, they're not acknowledging it there. Also, if nothing is ever complained/criticized/whateveryouwannacallit then nothing ever changes and no, having 1 post on it, does not mean you get heard. Especially on a forum with this level of activity where even a really active thread can fall off the front page in moments.

if they made a joke then they probably have somethign already up their sleeves, nothing to be offended about. they have a plan. yes if nothing if called out on then nothing changes, that is true. but this is for calling out for more difficulty. i believe they already discussed the possibility of having a difficulty setting so people can choose to go in balls to the wall hug that cover difficulty, or be able to take a few hits but find it generally enjoyable and challenging, and then the cake walk.  but given that people are complaining about the lack of content as well i feel the need to point out that they're taking suggestions already and riflign through the forums and so on so several issues or ideas are implimented/addressed. they're trying to get this ball rolling but if they're too busy focusing on giving us more content then nothing is going to be fixed or things will be fixed but it will be slower more agonizing as there will be more things TO be fixed. in the end what i am saying is, hold onto your horses. good things come in time. and mainly my arguements are just with the people saying they're going to shelve this game mainly because of the reasons that A) it doesnt have alot of content B) too easy.  i guess i kind of fit into trolling but i'm tired of seeing people saying they want to shelve a game simply because of those things.

Edited April 12, 2013 by MagnumKnight

[Ghobe]

if they made a joke then they probably have somethign already up their sleeves, nothing to be offended about. they have a plan. yes if nothing if called out on then nothing changes, that is true. but this is for calling out for more difficulty. i believe they already discussed the possibility of having a difficulty setting so people can choose to go in balls to the wall hug that cover difficulty, or be able to take a few hits but find it generally enjoyable and challenging, and then the cake walk.  but given that people are complaining about the lack of content as well i feel the need to point out that they're taking suggestions already and riflign through the forums and so on so several issues or ideas are implimented/addressed. they're trying to get this ball rolling but if they're too busy focusing on giving us more content then nothing is going to be fixed or things will be fixed but it will be slower more agonizing as there will be more things TO be fixed. in the end what i am saying is, hold onto your horses. good things come in time. and mainly my arguements are just with the people saying they're going to shelve this game mainly because of the reasons that A) it doesnt have alot of content B) too easy.  i guess i kind of fit into trolling but i'm tired of seeing people saying they want to shelve a game simply because of those things.

Don't think I like this new quote system...but just because I'm shelving the game doesn't mean I'll never take it off the shelf. I said I'll watch it, but I'm not going to play it for now. I mean, I don't have a REASON to play anymore. Any my reason to play games come down to 2 things: lust for progression and challenging content to prove stuff to myself.

 

I'd quote mr solo but I don't know how to do it anymore. We CAN solo all the content, we don't get our asses kicked. All it does is slow us down a little, it doesn't cause us to start dying left and right.

[highlifeSW]

Well this IS a beta. DE said that they will implement some difficulty choice. At the moment it is easy! I never had a party whiped out.

[Kindar]

Remove mods from supercharged weapons, remove mods from supercharged frame, put on solo, run pluto. BAM, instant difficulty.

[Ghobe]

Remove mods from supercharged weapons, remove mods from supercharged frame, put on solo, run pluto. BAM, instant difficulty.

Why don't I just unplug my keyboard while I'm at it? Or better yet, not even play! I'll never beat the game then! I am so god damned tired of that "argument".

[Cpl_Facehugger]

To tell the truth that was an oddly small map. It was a Spy mission with 4 data terminals that were all within 1 room of each other, and the extraction point 2 rooms away from that. Most of the time it's between 80-150 though, doesn't get higher than that unless I'm camping an infinite respawner or doing a defense mission.

EDIT:

Also I'm getting really tired of being suggested to that I should drop the shotgun(that I don't have), stop rushing through levels skipping enemies(which I don't do), and being told to unequip my shield/health for damage options(which don't exist outside of energy skills and I'm not playing a warframe with a spammable kill energy skill).

 

How about you start playing the game like you were a space ninja, rather than like you were Master Chief? That is to say, being very aggressive and using your mobility and melee options rather than running from cover to cover? Because on high level systems, my ubertank rhino is very fun when I do this, compared to crouching behind cover which is very boring. And if I get overwhelmed, I even have a panic button in iron skin.

 

And really, with pugs you kind of have to be aggressive, because otherwise you'll get left behind by the rushers.

[Kindar]

Why don't I just unplug my keyboard while I'm at it? Or better yet, not even play! I'll never beat the game then! I am so god damned tired of that "argument".

Only thing I could think of that would add any real difficulty, though I do enjoy seeing people get mad over a suggestion. :)

[Cpl_Facehugger]

 

 

Just a friendly warning: Dont take MJ12 way too serious.

He is the guy who wrote (i quote):

His arguments are fallacious at best and borderline trolling at worst, such as the idiotical idea that if you want your game more difficult then you should remove your mods. Why not try playing with your feet instead? That too should be a decent handicap to make you think that the game is actually har... oh wait its not... its just that you handicapped yourself... damn.

 

Why don't I just unplug my keyboard while I'm at it? Or better yet, not even play! I'll never beat the game then! I am so god damned tired of that "argument"

 

 

 

 

I don't understand what the problem with "game too easy? Remove your crutches in favor of other cool abilities" is. To date, I haven't seen a single good argument for why this is unacceptable. It always boils down to guys talking about how having to 'handicap' themselves is bad for some nebulous reason that's never explained. Do you think you could explain the issue for me, please?

Edited April 12, 2013 by Cpl_Facehugger

[Enomilli]

This thread.

[Ghobe]

Only thing I could think of that would add any real difficulty, though I do enjoy seeing people get mad over a suggestion. :)

You're like the 20th person to "suggest" that.

 

 

I don't understand what the problem with "game too easy? Remove your crutches in favor of other cool abilities" is. To date, I haven't seen a single good argument for why this is unacceptable. It always boils down to guys talking about how having to 'handicap' themselves is bad for some nebulous reason that's never explained. Do you think you could explain the issue for me, please?

#1: There is no alternatives. None. Not a one. Should I get more sprint? What's it do for me? Helps me skip trash more? Let's me get to melee faster? Oh oh I know I should take off my redirection and max out stamina so I can endlessly block and melt even faster as block doesn't reduce damage to 0(though it may save your &#! when your shields are low/out). Oh I know I should equip energy related skills so I can spam my only damage skill which costs 100 energy, that way when I use it, I still don't kill anything with it, but I could use it one more time during the run and reduce them from 40% health to 30% health! Yay! What other mods are there to invest in...oh I know loot radar! Because loot is so hard to notice/find outside of defense /eyeroll oo oo enemy radar! Yes! Because I can't tell from which direction I'm being shot from! Let's see...are there any other options.....no...no there's not. So...my only VIABLE options are Redirection, Crush, Vitality, and Fast Deflection...those are the only options that will help me IN A FIGHT, the rest I'll be using between fights.

#2: I put in all this effort to get these mods, upgrade these mods, etc etc...and now I'm supposed to not use them because the developers didn't design content around their own content? Wat? Doing this type of thing is only to prove a point, like playing a sword and board character in an arpg and choosing to not use the board to prove content can be downed without it.

 

 

How about you start playing the game like you were a space ninja, rather than like you were Master Chief? That is to say, being very aggressive and using your mobility and melee options rather than running from cover to cover? Because on high level systems, my ubertank rhino is very fun when I do this, compared to crouching behind cover which is very boring. And if I get overwhelmed, I even have a panic button in iron skin.

 

And really, with pugs you kind of have to be aggressive, because otherwise you'll get left behind by the rushers.

Rhino player telling mag user to be more reckless. This has got to be the most genius post on the forums. Either way, I don't run from cover to cover, I run from cover to enemy to cover(because I need my shields to recharge le gasp). Btw, a ninja wouldn't even be spotted in the first place. And when we're talking a full group...I don't even take the game seriously. It just becomes one big mind-numbing experience or a contest in who can kill more before the rusher reaches the end. "Difficulty".

[753rdVanguard]

The difficulty is just fine where it is, and one way to increase it is to play a lower leveled frame and whatnot, or drop the HP/SP mods.

 

As I'm entering the resource and BP grind for new frames, I'm completely adverse to ratcheting the difficulty up when from what I hear the drop rates are low. The last thing I need is for it to take even longer.

 

And even with my Excalubur with 400/440 SP/HP I can still find myself in a bind solo, especially against the ever-annoying Moa that swarm me. (As I tend to run with two friends, I forget to put my skills back on after running a pure tank setup, so no Radial Javelin to smite a dozen Moa that are humping me.)

 

I think that if we were to up the difficulty, it should be an option. Keep it as it is, which becomes the default difficulty. Players (and Squad hosts) can instead elect to increase the difficulty at a whim before entering a mission, rather than a hard increase. This I think would greatly increase replayability for maxed frame players while still allowing soloists to do their grind without every level becoming Solo Infested.

 

Also, the suggestion of mooks being able to instagib is, to be blunt, terrible. This isn't Curbstomper Simulator (aka Dead Space) and the last thing people need is to suddenly die late game on a solo to some Grineer Lancer. Especially if this was universal, and didn't have scaling applied to it (so an R30 frame with maxed HP/SP mods could die to the Grineer at Terminus.)

 

That, and pulling out of a battle gone sour by an insanely slim margin has entertainment value. The two Loki's I babysit every day got swamped and escaped with less than 10 HP each, and neither has more than 200 SP. I had to wade into the fray and even my 400SP was torn apart and I was dropped low to just ~90HP. So we were all crapping our pants dreading the next cluster of Moa that was, if what we just waded through is any indication, going to surely kill us.

 

On that note, I'd be cool if it were possible to re-attain stealth at any given time in a mission. If between randomly spawned assaults you could approach a new cell and find enemies not already locked on to you through the wall. It'd be of much relief to those whose random mission bonus is to get unalerted kills (which from what it seems, is nigh impossible outside of Corpus cameras and the odd Infested that is just shambling about.)

 

Not saying they should instantly be unalerted, but rather they should need to reaquire the players locations, and with a bit of effort, a player could try to sneak past a lightly populated room, and possibly score a few stealth kills along the way. (Or if enemies firing at one player became oblivious to players behind them, and would never instantly switch to the guy behind him like they've got eyes in the back of their skulls. Especially Grineer, who physically can't look behind them and generally are quite dim. I think it'd be easy to have one player draw fire, and another player to use that distraction to go about stabbing people in the spine. Maybe they'd catch on after they see the corpses, as in an open enough area two people could potentially get nothing but 'stealth' kills.)

 

Finally, and this is somewhat unrelated, but: Defence vs Infested. Nothing sucks quite as much as loosing on Wave 2 because every suicide Infested charged at the pod and blew up at the same time, killing it immediately. That's sort of like the instagibbing suggestion given by the OP. At least that was Wave 2- that would have produced epic levels of rage had it happened Wave 10+. :/

[Kindar]

You're like the 20th person to "suggest" that.

Haven't seen it suggested before, though I did just skip through the topic to post. Still, I love seeing people's panties get in a knot over simple suggestions. :D

[Starberyl]

I partially agree with this. Though honestly, they need to lower the rarity of mods like flow/fury/elementals etc so that players can reach their end game goal a lot faster. This might seem like a bad idea but It'll work when they do increase the difficulty of mobs. I do want to reach end game quickly but feel like I have to put in a heroic effort ontop of my current weaponry. 

 

Also....there needs to be player to difficulty ratio implementation, since solo'ing is quite difficult in some occasions. 

[Sealgaire]

I guess no one stuck around after the livestream. Steve said that he agrees custom difficulty settings are necessary, so I assume we'll see them at some point.

[Despara]

Don't think I like this new quote system...but just because I'm shelving the game doesn't mean I'll never take it off the shelf. I said I'll watch it, but I'm not going to play it for now. I mean, I don't have a REASON to play anymore. Any my reason to play games come down to 2 things: lust for progression and challenging content to prove stuff to myself.

 

I'd quote mr solo but I don't know how to do it anymore. We CAN solo all the content, we don't get our asses kicked. All it does is slow us down a little, it doesn't cause us to start dying left and right.

 

Maybe you should go back to CoD WoW or Guild Wars if its to easy for you. I think the game is entertaining, and I'm not interested in a game that is insanely challenging. Judging by how this game is growing even in such an early stage its obvious most players would agree with me.

[Xtorma]

 

Only thing I could think of that would add any real difficulty, though I do enjoy seeing people get mad over a suggestion. :)

I don't think they are mad, they are just pointing out how stupid that argument is.

[Aerensiniac]

I don't understand what the problem with "game too easy? Remove your crutches in favor of other cool abilities" is. To date, I haven't seen a single good argument for why this is unacceptable. It always boils down to guys talking about how having to 'handicap' themselves is bad for some nebulous reason that's never explained. Do you think you could explain the issue for me, please?

 

Please elaborate this concept of "crutches" for me.

You make it sounds as if people were using aim bots and then complain that the game is too easy.

Meanwhile in reality all they are doing is using the options given to them by the developers. How are you comparing the mod system or for the same matter "cover" to a "crutch" please?

If perfectly legit and intended parts of the game are "crutches" then there is literally no boundarity as to what can be considered a crutch, starting with your hands maybe, cause think about how much of a challenge it would be to learn to play with your feet.

 

You want a good argument against what has been implyed here by MJ12 and a few others?

Im sorry you wont get one, cause one can only make arguments against something that has logic in it.

To claim that legit and deliberately built in features of the game are "crutches" is just a bit over the line of being completely and utterly irrational.

Other than that, this also distorts the concept of "crutches" cause by that logic there is literally nothing that couldnt be called a crutch, and sorry to point out, but the suggestion to remove mods to increase difficulty is exactly what it is: Handicapping yourself cause you are deliberately limiting yourself.

To question whether or not this is in fact "handicapping yourself" just ands a 2x multiplier to your irrationality.

 

If you want people to make arguments against what you are saying, then first make a logical argument.

The notion of "calling game mechanics "crutches" and deliberately limiting the potential of your character, but refusing to call it handicapping" just wont cut it in terms of "arguments" and "rationality".

 

EDIT: Oh and one more thing.

 

 

"game too easy? Remove your crutches in favor of other cool abilities"

Suggests that there are "cool abilities" to be gained by removing your mods or by not using covers.

Please start your explanation with this, cause i somehow cant find any reference for the claim that removing mods will grant you new abilities.

Edited April 13, 2013 by Aerensiniac

[Aggh]

Lol @ the take off your mods argument.  It's basically suggesting that people give up on any kind of progression in order to play at a higher difficulty.  In game difficulty is something the game should create, not the player.  People that bring up this argument are just trying to find a way to get the devs to not make the game any harder for them.

Edited April 13, 2013 by Aggh