Sentinel Vs. Kubrow

[Uio937]

   Hello there! Today I will be mentioning facts about Kubrows and Sentinels, as well as my opinion on the matter. Might I ask that if anyone notices any false information I may use please mention it in a reply? If you notice any mistakes I will update it immediately. Also as the game progresses and more hotfixes begin fixing the Kubrow's unbalancing issue, I will update my thread, to mark those out as fixed. Also if you think of any other Pros/Cons for any section at all, please mention it, thank you. Let's begin. 

 

AI

 

Sentinels:

 

Pros:

 

- Follows you around, does not go ahead

- Uses guns, kills from a distance

 

 

Cons:

 

- No bleed-out time, instant death.

 

Kubrows:

 

Pros:

 

- Has a bleed-out time, able to be revived.

 

Cons:

 

- Ignores crowds of enemies, runs into them with no fear at all. [[This is due to the melee aspect of them. However if the Kubrow took any safety precautions that'd be nice.]]

- Ignores dangerous enemies, such as Arson Eximus leaders. [[When an Arson Eximus leader uses its ability, the flame wall thing, the Kubrow dies easily]]

- Ignores instant kill objects, such as lasers in the Void 

 

 

Cosmetics

 

Sentinels:

 

Pros:

 

- Able to be manually customized.

- Cosmetic items guaranteed when purchased with platinum [[Example: Wings, tail, mask, colors (with color palettes)]]

 

Cons:

 

- Not fuzzy and cute.

 

Kubrows:

 

Pros:

 

- Fuzzy and cute

- Different genders

 

Cons:

 

- Purely RNG [[Fur color, patterns, tail, ears, eyes are all RNG]]

- As the scrambler has been removed, there is no way to change the way it looks anymore [[The scrambler was dumb anyway, as you paid platinum to RANDOMIZE it]]

 

General

 

Sentinels:

 

Pros:

 

- Weapon able to be changed.

- Takes no work to get, and you know exactly what you'll get

- Revive mod available, essentially giving the Sentinel 2 lives per 1 player life.

 

Cons:

 

- Max redirection not capable of being as effective as Max shield link

 

Kubrows:

 

Pros:

 

- Unique abilities

- Max shield link can be more effective than max redirection.

 

Cons:

 

- Constant grinding, and yet you receive a random Kubrow type.

- Requires stasis chambers, limits the amount of Kubrow companions you can have without spending platinum.

- No revive mod available, unlike Sentinels.

 

Upkeep 

 

Sentinels:

 

Pros: 

 

- Requires no maintenance at all, and is more loyal than an actual Kubrow.

 

Cons:

 

(None currently known)

 

Kubrows:

 

Pros: 

 

(None currently known)

 

Cons:

 

- Requires you to purchase DNA Stabilizers (100k each)

- Loyalty is only able to be restored 3 times a day. [[This may cause issues as the AI for the Kubrow are absolutely awful, and not cautious at all]]

 

This is all I have for now. I will add as I find out more, or come up with more things. If any info changes please let me know. If you can contribute to the list, please let me know. Please list the category of your contribution (AI, Cosmetics, and Modding). 

Thanks,

~Uio937

Edited July 24, 2014 by Uio937

[WingedCrusade]

Kubrow customization needs to be fixed.

[MA347612890GT4078579132R]

Cons for both: Both seem to currently randomly and instantly die for no apparent reason. But your kubrow has a penalty for death, sentinels do not.

[(PSN)deathfrombelow5]

Apparently kubrows are more durable than sentinels ( max link shield mod vs. max sentinel redirection).

[Metalarcher]

Yep.  Pretty much.  I imagine this group of statistics had an agenda in that it shows that Sentinels are far more practical than Kubrows (and were easier and more fun to change cosmetically by the player).

 

Solutions?  Well, the AI should probably be increased to the point that Kubrows avoid instant and certain death, and if they still get themselves into trouble a button to call your Kubrow back and keep them by your side for a while would help protect them quite a bit more.

 

Customization of Kubrows needs a complete rework, but since I doubt DE wants to restrict Kubrow types to players who have bought plat, they should probably be able to be customized with gene-splicing tools that you can create with rare components you find by completing certain challenges.  I saw a cool thread ( https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/271938-suggestion-regress-unwanted-kubrow-back-to-egg/page-2#entry3142643 ) that talked about regressing Kubrows back to egg stage so you can keep your current Kubrow, not abandon it, not have to find another egg, and change its appearance.

 

As for mods, I imagine they'll simply be added over time, the same way Sentinel mods were.  Probably not something that needs to be brought to DE's attention.

 

To OP, you may want to add that sentinels have unique abilities as well; Kubrows cannot vaporize.  You may also want to add an "upkeep" section detailing that it is difficult to keep Kubrows healthy (and loyal, considering their self-destructive tendencies), but Sentinels require none of this to be at full strength all the time.

[Uio937]

Cons for both: Both seem to currently randomly and instantly die for no apparent reason. But your kubrow has a penalty for death, sentinels do not.

I used your reply to help edit a con in General, for Kubrow. I don't think they die instantly for no reason, but if so that is an awful bug. But this isn't really a bug thread, it's more of a Sentinel - Kubrow balancing thread, you know? But thank you for your help.

 

Apparently kubrows are more durable than sentinels ( max link shield mod vs. max sentinel redirection).

I added this to my list, thank you for your contribution.

[r110platinum]

I was JUST about to make a topic about this.

 

AS it stands right now, I personally don't find the kubrow even remotely as dependable and useful as a nicely armed sentinel. Sure the kubrow's melee attacks do a lot of damage, but it's slow and can only take out one target every 3 seconds or so at most (I have a Sahasa, I don't know if the other types are quicker with attacks), and charging into crowds (especially of higher level enemies always guarantees it dying.  A Dethcube with a Deth Machine Rifle (which is also completely moddable, just like your own weapons) is basically a shoulder mounted turret that destroys anything that gets remotely close to you. Add on the Vaporize ability and there's really no way a comparable Kubrow can keep up in terms of kills.

 

Plus, the Kubrow has those awful DNA integrity things and loyalty things you have to keep track of. It's just one more thing you have to keep in the back of your head, like in Dark Souls or other games where you have to repair weapons. It's annoying, and I personally don't think it adds anything to the game play. 

 

It's also a MAJOR pain to create a kubrow compared to a sentinel. 

 

I feel kind of bad, but once my Kubrow get's to 30 I think I'm just gonna lock her up in stasis and go back to sentinels. There really isn't a practical reason to use a Kubrow over a Sentinel right now.

[r110platinum]

Apparently kubrows are more durable than sentinels ( max link shield mod vs. max sentinel redirection).

Yeah I just thought of this. A Volt with a max redirection and vigor along with the link shields mod on your kubrow will give it MASSIVE shields. But still, it's combat efficiency and lack of awareness in attacking crowds still means it probably won't last as long as a sentinel on higher levels.

[Uio937]

Yep.  Pretty much.  I imagine this group of statistics had an agenda in that it shows that Sentinels are far more practical than Kubrows (and were easier and more fun to change cosmetically by the player).

 

Solutions?  Well, the AI should probably be increased to the point that Kubrows avoid instant and certain death, and if they still get themselves into trouble a button to call your Kubrow back and keep them by your side for a while would help protect them quite a bit more.

 

Customization of Kubrows needs a complete rework, but since I doubt DE wants to restrict Kubrow types to players who have bought plat, they should probably be able to be customized with gene-splicing tools that you can create with rare components you find by completing certain challenges.  I saw a cool thread ( https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/271938-suggestion-regress-unwanted-kubrow-back-to-egg/page-2#entry3142643 ) that talked about regressing Kubrows back to egg stage so you can keep your current Kubrow, not abandon it, not have to find another egg, and change its appearance.

 

As for mods, I imagine they'll simply be added over time, the same way Sentinel mods were.  Probably not something that needs to be brought to DE's attention.

 

To OP, you may want to add that sentinels have unique abilities as well; Kubrows cannot vaporize.  You may also want to add an "upkeep" section detailing that it is difficult to keep Kubrows healthy (and loyal, considering their self-destructive tendencies), but Sentinels require none of this to be at full strength all the time.

 

I'll use your ideas to edit my thread, thank you for your contribution. And I think that thread is pretty neat too, thanks for the link!

[r110platinum]

Cons for both: Both seem to currently randomly and instantly die for no apparent reason. But your kubrow has a penalty for death, sentinels do not.

Sentinels also have a revive mod too, which essentially gives it two lives per player life.

[Uio937]

Sentinels also have a revive mod too, which essentially gives it two lives per player life.

Good point -- Will add this to my thread.

[Max7238]

Kubrows need to run extermination or capture missions in the beginning to avoid death. Once Link mods and Pack Leader can be equipped, though, their usefulness skyrockets.

[r110platinum]

Kubrows need to run extermination or capture missions in the beginning to avoid death. Once Link mods and Pack Leader can be equipped, though, their usefulness skyrockets.

But is it more useful/reliable than a comparable sentinel? I doubt a Kubrow would be able to live through a T4 Defense or Survival, mostly due to their tendency to run into crowds to attack. Like I said earlier mine is only lvl 19 right now, so I can't say for sure, I got all the link mods too and pack leader, it still has trouble surviving on some tougher missions.

Edited July 24, 2014 by r110platinum

[Max7238]

With the way it's going, I'd say yes. Definitely. A forma'd and potato'd Sunika would be able to one-shot just about any enemy it grappled, and would have TONS of HP, shields, and armor on a Frame like Frost. Take that with Loyal Companion and Pack Leader and you've got an unkillable shredding machine. That just happens to be cute and fluffy

[Uio937]

With the way it's going, I'd say yes. Definitely. A forma'd and potato'd Sunika would be able to one-shot just about any enemy it grappled, and would have TONS of HP, shields, and armor on a Frame like Frost. Take that with Loyal Companion and Pack Leader and you've got an unkillable shredding machine. That just happens to be cute and fluffy

Although it can get the stats of a Warframe, the AI still runs into crowds of enemies without regard to anything. By all means it gets stuck with some Fusion MOAs or Heavy Gunners late game T4S, it's practically screwed. The AI for a Sentinel is more likely to stay back, and value it's life. Making it more useful, or more appropriately, more ALIVE late game. If I have a carrier, I want it alive, to continue to pick things up for me. What's its use if it's dead? The AI needs to have more cautious tendencies. After all, dogs are sentient beings. It's only normal for them to express fear in a dangerous situation