Overzealous Nerfing

[(PSN)Krobar1976]

I don't know about the rest of you but I'm getting really tired of wasting time, platinum and forma upgrading frames and weapons only to find them nerfed in subsequent updates! The latest example being the 3 days and 4 forma I spent upgrading the Angstrum only to find out today that in update 14.2 it along with the ogris and the penta will get MAJOR max ammo capacity nerfs.Warframe has been one of the best games I have ever played, and thats saying something because I've been gaming since the early 80's, but now with this latest assult on my time and effort I'm just glad that Destiny will be out soon. Thanks for ruining Warframe for those who enjoyed the most you overzealous devs!!!! 

[DLVargas]

Hey look, another one.

[Paul_Pianoff]

Are you seriously saying that you didn't expect a 350-damage carpet bomber with huge ammo efficiency to get a nerf?

[Arunafeltz]

How dare they make us think before using explosives to dispatch a single Lancer!

[Waterheart]

the nerv was needed, but indeed I think instead of 20/30 it could be 60/80 which is decent but at least you could stay up for 5 waves in ODD

[Zero.No.Hikari]

-snip-

 

Well it's be making sense to be angry IF this wasn't a BETA and those constantly change.  I mean sure it was nice having unlimited ammo on a Carpet Bomber but really that made the experience boring for a few other players.  the change was warranted.   I mean with it came some buffs to other weapons and a few fixes to some.   If anything just changing say reload time for ammo mutation won't change anything about your build.  unless all you did was stat damage then yeah I guess it will cause some change.

[Imaru]

You only have one post here, so I am going to cut you some slack and assume that you don't frequent the forums. For at least half a week prior to the ammo capacity nerf, the forums were abuzz with threads regarding it; that it was too severe, too lenient, just right, etc. Now based on my assumption, you would not have seen that, but you should have seen from gameplay that the weapons in question had WAY too much ammo. They had functionally infinite ammo because of their slow firerate and insane killing ability. 

 

Additionally, the warframe EULA item 5 states that DE has the right to change the game as they see fit when they want to, with or with out warning. 

5.    Patches and Updates

Digital Extremes may deploy or provide patches, updates and modifications to the Game that must be installed for you to continue to play the Game. Digital Extremes may update the Game remotely including without limitation the Game Client Software residing on the your machine, without your knowledge, and you hereby grant to Digital Extremes your consent to deploy and apply such patches, updates and modifications.

[MaxiTB]

Well it's be making sense to be angry IF this wasn't a BETA and those constantly change.  I mean sure it was nice having unlimited ammo on a Carpet Bomber but really that made the experience boring for a few other players.  the change was warranted.   I mean with it came some buffs to other weapons and a few fixes to some.   If anything just changing say reload time for ammo mutation won't change anything about your build.  unless all you did was stat damage then yeah I guess it will cause some change.

 

When money get's charged it's no longer a real BETA. That's just a PR term now :-)

 

You only have one post here, so I am going to cut you some slack and assume that you don't frequent the forums. For at least half a week prior to the ammo capacity nerf, the forums were abuzz with threads regarding it; that it was too severe, too lenient, just right, etc. Now based on my assumption, you would not have seen that, but you should have seen from gameplay that the weapons in question had WAY too much ammo. They had functionally infinite ammo because of their slow firerate and insane killing ability. 

 

Additionally, the warframe EULA item 5 states that DE has the right to change the game as they see fit when they want to, with or with out warning. 

5.    Patches and Updates

Digital Extremes may deploy or provide patches, updates and modifications to the Game that must be installed for you to continue to play the Game. Digital Extremes may update the Game remotely including without limitation the Game Client Software residing on the your machine, without your knowledge, and you hereby grant to Digital Extremes your consent to deploy and apply such patches, updates and modifications.

 

That EULA reference is exactly what you get for your money. Nothing. Enjoy it as long it lasts, NEVER invest in a product with such terms attached :-).

Edited August 19, 2014 by MaxiTB

[Ittia]

Well it's be making sense to be angry IF this wasn't a BETA and those constantly change.  I mean sure it was nice having unlimited ammo on a Carpet Bomber but really that made the experience boring for a few other players.  the change was warranted.   I mean with it came some buffs to other weapons and a few fixes to some.   If anything just changing say reload time for ammo mutation won't change anything about your build.  unless all you did was stat damage then yeah I guess it will cause some change.

Beta or not, doesn't change that you have to buy forma and catalysts with platinum, a.k.a. real money. I was at least expecting a forma and catalyst refund for the launchers, but alas. S'why I quit Warframe. At least for now. 

[(PSN)KneelBeforeSaad]

I don't know about the rest of you but I'm getting really tired of wasting time, platinum and forma upgrading frames and weapons only to find them nerfed in subsequent updates! The latest example being the 3 days and 4 forma I spent upgrading the Angstrum only to find out today that in update 14.2 it along with the ogris and the penta will get MAJOR max ammo capacity nerfs.Warframe has been one of the best games I have ever played, and thats saying something because I've been gaming since the early 80's, but now with this latest assult on my time and effort I'm just glad that Destiny will be out soon. Thanks for ruining Warframe for those who enjoyed the most you overzealous devs!!!! 

 

Yeah, a rocket launcher should *totally* be able to hold 210 rounds.

 

 

When money get's charged it's no longer a real BETA. That's just a PR term now :-)

 

 

That EULA reference is exactly what you get for your money. Nothing. Enjoy it as long it lasts, NEVER invest in a product with such terms attached :-).

 

So... Those early access betas you pay to get into aren't betas?

 

And WF has been out of beta since plat was introduced? Think about that for a moment please.

Edited August 19, 2014 by (PS4)KneelBeforeSaad

[PeanutMonster]

The capacity nerf barely affected the guns You can fill all of your ammo from 2 ammo pickups -.-

Edited August 19, 2014 by PeanutMonster

[(PSN)SofeSNBR]

When money get's charged it's no longer a real BETA. That's just a PR term now :-)

You are not  forced to pay real money. OP hey think it this way, it takes 2months before ps4 gets update 14.2 so you have plenty of time use it as you want it.

[(PSN)SofeSNBR]

Beta or not, doesn't change that you have to buy forma and catalysts with platinum, a.k.a. real money. I was at least expecting a forma and catalyst refund for the launchers, but alas. S'why I quit Warframe. At least for now. 

But you dont have to buy forma or catalyst, thus making your argument invalid.

[vaugahn]

When money get's charged it's no longer a real BETA. That's just a PR term now

People need to please please stop saying this. Whether a game makes money has nothing to do with it being a beta. Beta means it's unfinished and requires testing still. Until they say they're finished, this game is still a beta. Regardless of how much money it makes.

[Orbister]

It's not even a damn nerf! each shot is still as powerful as before the balance, you just got less ammo, and that is FINE, because 500+ grenades or rockets was stupid.

[BrotherJudas008]

The capacity nerf barely affected the guns You can fill all of your ammo from 2 ammo pickups -.-

 

What PeanutMonster said, you can easily kill a group with these weapons and they will likely drop ammo. 

 

There is also the Ammo Mutation Mods, and another Mod to increase maximum ammo by 90%.  

So you can have a mass killing weapon that does overkill amounts of damage to most enemies and have to think about your ammo use (a tiny bit)...

Or...

Use Ammo mutation and carry on like nothing has changed.

[Gravalite]

You really just have to learn how to adapt.

[(PSN)HikarisSavior]

You guys don't get it, do you? If we are to keep playing and pretend like nothing happened because the nerf isn't a big deal, then what was the purpose of actually nerfing it anyway? It seems like the Devs are sick and tired of people complaining about all the weapons. Shut your mouth and play the game. The ammo nerf was so people stopped complaining about the launchers. The only time people use their launchers are when they are doing ODD or any other infested defense. I have tried using the ogris against grineer, and they blow up the rocket plenty of times. Penta and the others are worthless against infested when they charge up on you and you blow yourself up. They have to be used from an altitude. Most of the time, they are used to level up other weapons, so why the big fuss? If you're in an ODD, you're usually there to level up anyway. The people complaining about them needing a nerf have nothing better to do than to complain. You guys don't care because you probably don't use them, but I bet if the developers nerfed the weapons you use, you'd be angry too, especially since you spent formas and time making them good. Hypocrites. Eventually, we won't have any weapons to take into T4 50+ waves and minutes.

[(PSN)SofeSNBR]

You guys don't get it, do you? If we are to keep playing and pretend like nothing happened because the nerf isn't a big deal, then what was the purpose of actually nerfing it anyway? It seems like the Devs are sick and tired of people complaining about all the weapons. Shut your mouth and play the game. The ammo nerf was so people stopped complaining about the launchers. The only time people use their launchers are when they are doing ODD or any other infested defense. I have tried using the ogris against grineer, and they blow up the rocket plenty of times. Penta and the others are worthless against infested when they charge up on you and you blow yourself up. They have to be used from an altitude. Most of the time, they are used to level up other weapons, so why the big fuss? If you're in an ODD, you're usually there to level up anyway. The people complaining about them needing a nerf have nothing better to do than to complain. You guys don't care because you probably don't use them, but I bet if the developers nerfed the weapons you use, you'd be angry too, especially since you spent formas and time making them good. Hypocrites. Eventually, we won't have any weapons to take into T4 50+ waves and minutes.

Well ive spend 3 forma on ogris and i will be okay with this, really at least now i have to go collect ammo after 3 wave, instead never. It was mistake to have 545 ammo on launchers. off-topic ogris works really well against everything, you just need to remember to aim above or side against shooting enemies.

[Zyion]

People need to please please stop saying this. Whether a game makes money has nothing to do with it being a beta. Beta means it's unfinished and requires testing still. Until they say they're finished, this game is still a beta. Regardless of how much money it makes.

 

The problem with that thinking is that there is no telling if the game will ever come out of beta. In the mean time, people can use "It's in beta" as an excuse for any bad gameplay mechanics or questionable business models. World of Warcraft is constantly changing, and they don't have to use the "It's in beta" excuse to justify their choices. Same goes for Starcraft II and Diablo III, or any other game that is constantly adding new content or has PvP. And not only does Warframe have PvP now, but I seriously doubt that Warframe will ever reach a point where DE feels there is no longer a need to add new content.

[RexRgisIocus]

@zyion expansion packs/dlc are not the same as the updates warframe is doing. If you really think warframe is a finished product remember how perfectly done u14 was when it launched.

[Zyion]

@zyion expansion packs/dlc are not the same as the updates warframe is doing. If you really think warframe is a finished product remember how perfectly done u14 was when it launched.

 

I am in no way saying that Warframe is a finished product. What I am saying that the beta excuse cannot be used when you start charging money for in-game items. When you start charging money for stuff, the players go from being testers to being customers. If the game was truly in beta, then they wouldn't be charging for anything. Warframe is in a soft launch, not beta.

[RexRgisIocus]

@zyion Most early access games charge you for playing them (you have to buy them as if they were a finished product) and some of them even go as high as 25 and maybe even 30 dollars. That doesn't mean it isn't early access to an unfinished game anyways. True people shouldn't spam the "It's a beta deal with it" excuse put DE did make a post that the game was prone to changes and that while you would have access to the market you would still be doing so at you own risk.

[vaugahn]

The problem with that thinking is that there is no telling if the game will ever come out of beta. In the mean time, people can use "It's in beta" as an excuse for any bad gameplay mechanics or questionable business models. World of Warcraft is constantly changing, and they don't have to use the "It's in beta" excuse to justify their choices. Same goes for Starcraft II and Diablo III, or any other game that is constantly adding new content or has PvP. And not only does Warframe have PvP now, but I seriously doubt that Warframe will ever reach a point where DE feels there is no longer a need to add new content.

 

Those games are finished, and expansions add to the base game. Warframe doesn't even have a finished base game yet. When people come to the forums complaining about how X boss needs a better look or why don't all these menus look the same, telling them it's in beta is a perfectly valid response. The same for any other complaint of that nature. I'm sure open beta will end eventually because that would be too big an advertising tag for them to ever miss it, but it's not going to be any time soon. Most AAA games spend about 3 years in development.

 

Edit: and saying the game is in beta is a perfectly valid response to wacky balance passes

Edited August 19, 2014 by vaugahn

[Viverim]

This particular topic is the reason I will never put another forma on anything ever again.

 

Did the Penta need an ammo adjustment?  Yes.  But I expected them to change the ammo type to Sniper rounds.  A more rare pick-up, and a smaller capacity, but still a good supply of ammo.  By reducing the ammo count to 20, the weapon has been hugely nerfed.  People who have Ammo mutation will be unaffected.  Those of us who do not have the Ammo Mod (myself included) have had the weapon reduced almost to the level of uselessness.

 

I agree with the above statement that I am glad Destiny is comming out next month.  it will give me something fun to do with my free time.