New Corrupt Mod - Transient Fortitude

[ThePresident777]

Corrupted mods are not cheap to equip at all.  The bonus you get from them always comes at a heavy cost, in my observation.  You have to pay extra drain to get the bonus, and you get a malus which then costs a slot and a lot of drain to remove.  You often pay twice the drain for the bonus you get.  It's a case of heavy diminishing returns.  Plus, acquiring them takes a lot of time or plat and leveling them up is expensive too.  And, for what?

 

EDIT:  Smoke Screen is already short, especially the CC.  Why would you want to shorten it even more?  I play primarily against massive hordes.  So, I don't see the use for this.  Is this useful in pvp, for instance?

Edited October 27, 2014 by ThePresident777

[GildedTuna]

Meaning there's no other +(stat) corrupted mod.

It makes sense to not allow stacking of corrupted mods that benefit the same stat, while at the same time allowing the stacking of negative stats.

Does it suck for the people who want max strength? Yes. However it is what DE has decided on. You can petition to get this changed, but people in here should not be calling it a bug, because it is not.

How can you be so sure its not a bug, it does not say implicitly anywhere why they cannot be put on together. All that happens is they both flash red. It could be a bug, it could be intentional but until an ACTUAL DE REPRESENTATIVE says otherwise i'm going to hope it gets changed/fixed.

Edited October 27, 2014 by LuxLo

[Koed]

Now your example:

 

Those are not "builds"; a build has more than one mod on and this is why your example doesn't reflect reality even remotely in most situations. The picture changes entirely if you have Intensify, Constitution, Continuity, Fleeting Expertise and Streamline on: 

 

Roar with Max Intensify, Continuity and Constitution with:

10/10 Blind Rage, 5/5 Streamline:                                                      214% base damage, 94 energy, 23.7 seconds

10/10 Blind Rage, 5/5 Fleeting Expertise, 5/5 Streamline:                 214% base damage, 49 energy, 15 seconds

10/10 Blind Rage, 3/5 Fleeting Expertise, 5/5 Streamline:                 214% base damage, 64 energy, 18 seconds

10/10 Transient Fortitude, 3/5 Fleeting Expertise, 5/5 Streamline:    195% base damage, 22.5 energy, 14 seconds

This time, the BR build does 10% more damage and lasts 4 seconds (28%) longer, but it costs THREE TIMES as much energy.

 

Blind Rage in fact has a HUGE indirect duration penalty in that it uses up all your energy. You can certainly make up for this with a Trinity, or you can be self sufficient and use your extra slot for another useful warframe. I should say that everything changes a bit more if you decide to put Narrowminded or Overextended on. 

 

Ofc my example isn't builds, but there is no point in putting more variables in there than BR and TF as u can just use the same mods on both of the builds, cmon.

And as for your math youre wrong lol. Following ur example of "base damage" (instead of damage increase - again complicating the matter more than neccesary) u state that Intesify+TF is 195% "base damage", and BR+intensify is 214% base dmg. Both are wrong.

BR: 50*2,29 = 114.5% damage increase (Again, I dont know why u wanna talk about "base damage" when it only further confuses, as u just so perfectly demonstrated urself.)

TF: 50*1.85 = 92.5% damage increase 

 

So for the sake of being simple - compare the 92,5% dmg increase from TF build and 114,5% dmg increase from BR build.

22% damage increase diffrence. Factor in ur party of 4 members, and ure looking at a 88% damage increase over TF build, AND, it lasts 27% longer!

And to repeat myself - energy is never a problem, as u can pop some energy from ur equipment.

So again - do the math. 99% of the time BR will be better.

Edited October 27, 2014 by Koed

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

The point is that both can be useful depending on the build and, more importantly, the goal of the build.  The only issue is that you cannot use both at the same time.  DE needs to let us know why this is the case.

 

As for optimization, it really depends which abilities you plan to use since Iron Skin and Rhino Stomp are better with Transient Fortitude, but once Roar is added then the goal of the build will determine which is better.  As Blind Rage will always affect Iron Skin sometimes just using Roar when necessary is better than trying to keep it active at all times.  Still, both have their merits and being able to use both of them at the same time would be ideal.

[Desvero]

Lol at the players that are like if you don't us BR you are doing it wrong.

 

We get it you think very highly of your mouse clicking skills and are very 1337.

 

BR is not everyone's first mod in their build and like many other players have already stated in this topic that there are indeed many uses for TF.

 

Personally I can't wait to use TF on my ash ^^

[Jinryusai]

Volt needs to go faster, this mod must be combined with rage to accomplish this...

[GildedTuna]

Would really love DEs feed back on this.

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

@LuxLo

 

Agreed.  While I understand they are busy squashing bugs and making the game more playable, this issue still needs to be addressed at some point.  As noted, it is only providing a 24% power strength increase for 16 mod points, so it's not like it is excessive by any means.  Worse yet, this sets a precedent for other corrupted mods with the same bonus stat.  Besides, I thought the point of only having 8 mod slots was to force difficult decisions on the players, not to make the decision for them.

Edited October 27, 2014 by (PS4)Hiero_Glyph

[DrJia]

Ofc my example isn't builds, but there is no point in putting more variables in there than BR and TF as u can just use the same mods on both of the builds, cmon.

There is a point in using more variables. That was literally the point of my post. Fleeting Expertise and Streamline make TF an extremely energy efficient way to increase power beyond just using Intensify. Without them and the ability to recast short duration mods, TF absolutely sucks for anything that uses duration. These mods don't exist in isolation, each can greatly alter the effectiveness of another. Also, ya did call them "build(s)" in your post, so don't "cmon" me :P

 

 

And as for your math youre wrong lol. Following ur example of "base damage" (instead of damage increase - again complicating the matter more than neccesary) u state that Intesify+TF is 195% "base damage", and BR+intensify is 214% base dmg. Both are wrong.

BR: 50*2,29 = 114.5% damage increase (Again, I dont know why u wanna talk about "base damage" when it only further confuses, as u just so perfectly demonstrated urself.)

TF: 50*1.85 = 92.5% damage increase 

My apologies for not making things clearer for you. 

 

Base damage = damage from gun without mods = 100%

Base damage (100%) + Roar with Intensify and TF (93%) = 193% base damage or 1.93x base damage

Base damage (100%) + Roar with Intensify and BR (114%) = 214% base damage or 2.14x base damage

 

Keeping it simple is why the numbers can be misleading. 

The simple view is indeed 114% vs 93% with a 22% damage increase difference.

 

If ya run some numbers, for a hypothetical gun doing 100 damage per shot:

Roar with intensify and TF gets you to 193 per shot.

Roar with Intensify and BR gets you to 214 per shot.

Like I said initially, it's ultimately 10% change in damage for three times the energy cost. 

 

In the end you can certainly say that energy doesn't matter because you can pop dozens of team energy restores in a long survival run, but I somehow doubt the many people who use fleeting expertise and streamline would agree with you. Besides, this gives you the added benefit of being able to pop a cheap Rhino Stomp much more easily and instantaneously since you don't have to worry about deploying an energy drop or its pulses to happen. 

 

Anyway, enjoy popping restores. I just wanted to throw the numbers out there for anyone else considering the mod. 

Edited October 27, 2014 by DrJia

[Tsunero]

Lol GL bro - luckily I didnt spend a single core on it myself. Let me know what response u get :D

 

It got reverted :).

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

Good to hear; now hopefully DE can respond to this issue.

[GildedTuna]

It got reverted :).

Now I wait for mine to be reverted aswell.

[Vorsches]

A mod doesn't have to be better than it's predecessors. This is DE's reply to everyone and their grandma yelling about power creep. Yeah it's great to have extremes with mods, and there are lots of crap and amazing mods to pick from. I'm glad DE is giving more clout to the "middle" tier mods, it allows variation in builds. Take it or leave it, but don't complain about power creep and then continue complaining about a mod that doesn't add to power creep.

[GildedTuna]

A mod doesn't have to be better than it's predecessors. This is DE's reply to everyone and their grandma yelling about power creep. Yeah it's great to have extremes with mods, and there are lots of crap and amazing mods to pick from. I'm glad DE is giving more clout to the "middle" tier mods, it allows variation in builds. Take it or leave it, but don't complain about power creep and then continue complaining about a mod that doesn't add to power creep.

A warning would be nice.

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

To be fair, having Transient Fortitude being weaker then Blind Rage isn't really the problem.  The problem is that Transient Fortitude cannot be used at the same time as Blind Rage.  Most of us are waiting for a response from DE regarding this issue.

[GildedTuna]

To be fair, having Transient Fortitude being weaker then Blind Rage isn't really the problem.  The problem is that Transient Fortitude cannot be used at the same time as Blind Rage.  Most of us are waiting for a response from DE regarding this issue.

Exactly, the only problem with it is that it can't be used with blind rage.

[DUSTCLOUD]

i like my 75% eff and have points to spare now so i dont mind putting them to this mod.
Loving its synergy with Saryn.
But i think it should be a 5 rank not 10 if its only gonna give us 55%

Edited October 28, 2014 by DUSTCLOUD

[Koed]

It got reverted :).

Lol wut, did not expect that! Any statement from them?

[Ishki88]

Any official word from DE?  Normally they won't say anything unless we pinpoint it out multiple times...so what's the word?

[DarkLordX2]

I still think that Transient Fortitude needs a buff, it's a Rare Rank 10 mod after all. You should send a ticket to support if you want to report this bug.

[Netheroc]

If they buff it to be a considerable sidegrade to Blind rage bonus-wise, it shouldnt stack. But as of now, i think it should stack. My Saryn would love that mod.

[Entari0]

I would think that they are intentionally non-compatible. Being able to have fleeting, transient, and blind rage would give you immense power, at a moderate cost, for essentially no time at all. Super spammy trinity would suddenly become a thing that everyone uses.

[Ishki88]

I would think that they are intentionally non-compatible. Being able to have fleeting, transient, and blind rage would give you immense power, at a moderate cost, for essentially no time at all. Super spammy trinity would suddenly become a thing that everyone uses.

Right now this is only an assumption since nobody has provided calculated proof.

 

So I'm still shouting BUG, until some provides calculations of all frames regarding this mod + BR + INST  Edit: Which would prove what Warframes we could possibly considered overpowered.

 

:^)

 

Edit:  Currently Saryn does about 5k-8k damage with a energy cost of 25 estimated....I'd imagine with BR she would do....close  to..doing math my head........probably 13-15k damage at maybe...45-50 energy cost....and her energy pool is 300....I wouldn't consider that OP since it does corrosive damage and not all enemies have + attributes to corrosive 

Edited October 29, 2014 by Ishki88

[GildedTuna]

We've been discussing this in other posts for a while now. DE has yet to say ANYTHING about it.

 

Edit: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/329467-new-corrupt-mod-transient-fortitude/

        -and

        https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/332538-blind-rage-or-transient-fortitude-why-de-why/

 

and to those of you saying it's not a bug

GreyEnneract, on 27 Oct 2014 - 07:03 AM, said:

Meaning there's no other +(stat) corrupted mod.

It makes sense to not allow stacking of corrupted mods that benefit the same stat, while at the same time allowing the stacking of negative stats.

Does it suck for the people who want max strength? Yes. However it is what DE has decided on. You can petition to get this changed, but people in here should not be calling it a bug, because it is not.

How can you be so sure its not a bug, it does not say implicitly anywhere why they cannot be put on together. All that happens is they both flash red. It could be a bug, it could be intentional but until an ACTUAL DE REPRESENTATIVE says otherwise i'm going to hope it gets changed/fixed.

Edited October 29, 2014 by LuxLo

[[DE]Rebecca]

Merged similar discussions, awaiting confirmation of intent from design.