Limbo Makes Me Uneasy; It Feels Uncomfortably Close To Jumping The Shark.

[Mak_Gohae]

 

 

Don't see many threads making a big deal about their aesthetics these days, do you?

Must not have been enough meddling kids. They got away with it.

 

Use the search function.

After a bit one hopes DE did read the comments but it seems they have not.

So people will continue to post their feedback until there no more discussion.

[Darkmoone1]

If the first promo image of him hadn't been the hat tip one, I bet there wouldn't be nearly as much of a problem. Everyone's issue seems to be the hat, the rest of his design is weird but otherwise appropriate. 

I'd be more dissapointed than anything if all we're really harping on is an idle animation. Otherwise you would never know if the hat came off or not.

[ElHefe]

@ Mak_Gohae ...discussion ends when it decends into personalization

 

I believe it is worth reiterating that what makes a forum heathly is one that allows critical expression without it being an argument over who's right and who's wrong

 

What everyone needs to recognize is that we all are PLAYERS first and JUDGES second

We all support the game and DE - so much so that we all  take the time to participate in these forums

 

It is the variety of point of view that we should seek, not the elimination of it

 

I will go back to SilentMobius' post where he outlined just how the Orokin could have gotten a stage magician construed to be a very powerful figure

It isn't hard to imagine that records from our time were so garbled that the Orokin may have thought such a character was on par with Vishnu

Consequently, what is so out of place is truely a matter of our perspective - NOT the Orokin's - and the discussion of Limbo can turn over to a discussion what the Orokin thought, not the player's opinion

[vaugahn]

I will go back to SilentMobius' post where he outlined just how the Orokin could have gotten a stage magician construed to be a very powerful figure

It isn't hard to imagine that records from our time were so garbled that the Orokin may have thought such a character was on par with Vishnu

Consequently, what is so out of place is truely a matter of our perspective - NOT the Orokin's - and the discussion of Limbo can turn over to a discussion what the Orokin thought, not the player's opinion

 

As I've pointed out before, stage magicians are not the only ones to have dressed like that.

 

If the Orokin could remember the pirate archetype, or the knight, then they could very well have remembered a gentleman duelist or thief. 

 

Earlier in the thread you compared Limbo to a well-dressed gambler in a saloon full of cowboys, and if I recall correctly, that character was often one of the more dangerous ones in the room. For example in Stagecoach, Hatfield was one of the better shots of the bunch. The cultured badass is a fairly common trope, so it makes sense that the Orokin could have picked up on it, and DE as well.

[MrMitchel]

I think he's the best looking frame in the game, a real nice addition.

 

 

Opinions.

[Kestral9999]

Use the search function.

After a bit one hopes DE did read the comments but it seems they have not.

So people will continue to post their feedback until there no more discussion.

That really only strengthens my argument.

There used to be threads about that subject, but now there aren't. (at least not new ones)

They got away with it.

 

In a few months, I doubt many people will still be giving Limbo flak like this. I'm sure there will still be that vocal minority.

And considering I've never seen a frame whose overall design was influenced by community reaction AFTER they were released, I doubt it'll ever matter.

Edited October 31, 2014 by Kestral9999

[ElHefe]

@ vaughan ... all your points are well taken

 

In a way, Warframe has taken on the feel of The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen or even The Invisibles (both Vertigo Comics) which have an ECCLETIC and BIZARRE cast of characters AND plots

 

I would be most interested in hearing what others thought about that specific view point (and not just a rehash of "well DE can make it what ever they want"

Example:  Is there anything concrete in the Lore so far to support a homage to TLOEG or The Invisibles

Answer:  Ragged Robin may be the inspiration for Mirage

[Ahzagothis]

Among other issues, one of the ones that really twists my suspension of disbelief is the entire "Gentlemen, sir" archetype that a tophat is associated with. It is very silly to imagine a warframe with an posh accent and a cane using that particular dapper means of speaking. I roll my eyes when I imagine it. I can truthfully say with full honesty, that nothing before has really been anything like this in terms of jarring -- I myself didn't bat an eye at Mirage (I do play warhammer 40k, and Harlequinns are no joke so i'm familiar with nasty jesters. same with Shaco from league of legends back when I played long ago). Pirates are portrayed as blood thirsty warriors and really had no issue imagining Hydroid fitting in either. Ember... I never really noticed the chicken thing too much, but I played her fairly early in my warframe experience so I was probably still getting used to it -- frankly I think ember prime's helm is really nice. Nekros on the other hand is a bit dark and edgy, which I am going to have to argue is a pretty strong theme of warframe overall given many of the villian's motives and actions.

 

Warframe thus far has come across as a fairly crapsack world where few people really seem to be living carefree. What? With a villian that is a floating head, another slicing warframes apart to sell and make into four legged monstrosities and what not? Not at all suggesting it is *only* dark and edgy, it's always had a mild light side. There are villain quotes about fashion scenes and another comment about being out of nails, perhaps they'll use tenno instead... but overall, the humor is almost completely lost in the otherwise grim future setting this game has portrayed, and that very aspect is part of what attracts me to it (I mentioned I play warhammer 40k, if you are unfamiliar with how crappy that universe is I recommend looking it up)

 

But the entire Dapper Gentlemen frame seems really, really stupid to me. It's too much of a joke across the internet for me to take it serious. While most other content is either dark (Nekros) or comes from a violent archetype (Pirates), the tophat gentlemen thing is neither of those. Someone mentioned Baron Samedi. He wore a tophat, yes, but honestly it was more about the voo doo and lou thing than the top hat that made him. The tophat was just iconic. Now that they added mustaches I actually groaned aloud but I am far less annoyed at that because it's temporary. Limbo though is unfortunatly here to stay. Some people like it, that's cool. I have said before and repeat now; I am a voice equal to any other. I am not the only one whom dislikes it but that doesn't make anyone whom dislikes it wrong either. There are people whom like it, and while I vehemently disagree, I am but one voice -- and so are they. It's fine. I am fine waiting for an alternate hat on alert, to those whom like Limbo. Cool, I hope you guys enjoy but I myself am a creature of principles and while it's no sweat off of anyone else's backside I can wait till I unlock an alternate helm that is less reminiscent of those really bad internet jokes and memes.

 

Also just as a final aside? Though I would think the gandalf-esque hat would have been out of place as well I would have prefered that to the one we got. It has less annoying connotations connected to it, i'd much rather take the "You shall not pass" references to the "Jolly Good" "Dapper" and "Kind sirs" thank you very much... and yes, I do use alternate Nekros helms before anyone wants to discuss default Nekros's hood, although that one wasn't annoying enough to bar me from playing it till I had a helm built.

[vaugahn]

@ vaughan ... all your points are well taken

 

In a way, Warframe has taken on the feel of The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen or even The Invisibles (both Vertigo Comics) which have an ECCLETIC and BIZARRE cast of characters AND plots

 

I would be most interested in hearing what others thought about that specific view point (and not just a rehash of "well DE can make it what ever they want"

Example:  Is there anything concrete in the Lore so far to support a homage to TLOEG or The Invisibles

Answer:  Ragged Robin may be the inspiration for Mirage

 

I can see something like that, though maybe not a direct correlation. The eclectic cast though, is something we've had for a long time. Even in the original set of warframes there is a wide variety of characters. It's definitely a good thing.

 

As long as things don't get too silly, I'm fine with a varied cast of characters. 

 

-snip-

 

Simply wearing a top hat does not make you a British gentleman. There are a wide variety of more threatening top hat-wearing stereotypes.

[Mak_Gohae]

That really only strengthens my argument.

There used to be threads about that subject, but now there aren't. (at least not new ones)

They got away with it.

 

 

LOL! Wth were you looking for? That we went over to DE offices and held them hostage until they made changes?

We give feedback on a subject. There comes a point where there is no discussion so what else is there to do?

If you continued posting you are troll and if you dont that's also bad.

 

Sorry, dude but people here dont work on your rules.

 

 

 

Simply wearing a top hat does not make you a British gentleman. There are a wide variety of more threatening top hat-wearing stereotypes.

 

You cant randomly throw stuff in just because.

Cause that's like saying Zephyr is a platypus because they both have beaks.

Edited October 31, 2014 by Mak_Gohae

[vaugahn]

You cant randomly throw stuff in just because.

Cause that's like saying Zephyr is a platypus because they both have beaks.

 

Except Zephyr does not have any of the trappings of a platypus, while all of those stereotypes could fit Limbo.

 

Don't even bother. It's clear you're angry, and that's okay. But your justifications are getting weaker and weaker.

[Borockobama]

DE really pushed the line with his design. Im ok with it and I honestly kinda of like it and his abilities. But if they push the line any further, I will be upset.

says the person with a bird for a warframe?

[Mak_Gohae]

Except Zephyr does not have any of the trappings of a platypus, while all of those stereotypes could fit Limbo.

 

Don't even bother. It's clear you're angry, and that's okay. But your justifications are getting weaker and weaker.

 

Would you mind listing all the trapping that Mr. Peanut has that matches a serial killer of women?

[Kestral9999]

If you continued posting you are troll

You're pretty much already there. Continue if you must.

[optyk]

I think he's the best looking frame in the game, a real nice addition.

 

 

Opinions.

 

Hes the best looking because hes the most mainstream approachable and relatable Frame to date. (Loki Prime IMO still holds the trophy for best looks) Limbo is 'cookie cutter safe' in design appeal. Kinda like Master Chief from Halo.

 

If they add a new mesh skin (like they did for Excal) that resembles robes to match Limbos alt helm, people would be pleased; me included. But right now hes a joke, nothin' but a 4chan meme frame with a powerset ganked from Middle Earth.

[EetNotErn]

Hes the best looking because hes the most mainstream approachable and relatable Frame to date. (Loki Prime IMO still holds the trophy for best looks) Limbo is 'cookie cutter safe' in design appeal. Kinda like Master Chief from Halo.

 

If they add a new mesh skin (like they did for Excal) that resembles robes to match Limbos alt helm, people would be pleased; me included. But right now hes a joke, nothin' but a 4chan meme frame with a powerset ganked from Middle Earth.

 

Calls Limbo cookie cutter, mainstream and a meme but wants robes so he can look like every depiction of a wizard ever. Yeah....

[vaugahn]

Would you mind listing all the trapping that Mr. Peanut has that matches a serial killer of women?

 

Not necessarily Jack the Ripper specifically, but the Cultured Badass trope, or the Gentleman Thief. I'm not sure why you've latched onto that example.

 

Now, I know what you're going to say "oh, he's not a thief! His powers don't steal things!" or something along those lines.

 

However you yourself have shown that a character doesn't have to default to something. You said that Ember was a phoenix, not a chicken. The same applies here. 

[optyk]

Calls Limbo cookie cutter, mainstream and a meme but wants robes so he can look like every depiction of a wizard ever. Yeah....

 

Because thats the trend, and if you're going that route, go all the way. If you're going to put Gandalf in the game, put him in the game.

 

Hydroids Alt helm makes him look more Godzilla-ish. Zeppys even more bird-like.

 

Just going with the flow instead of moaning about it, since everyone is stout on nothing will change and that theme is here to stay yadda yadda we cant have fun blah blah. Fine, lets roll with Team Fortress style accessories.

[EetNotErn]

Because thats the trend, and if you're going that route, go all the way. If you're going to put Gandalf in the game, put him in the game.

 

Hydroids Alt helm makes him look more Godzilla-ish. Zeppys even more bird-like.

 

Just going with the flow instead of moaning about it, since everyone is stout on nothing will change and that theme is here to stay yadda yadda we cant have fun blah blah. Fine, lets roll with Team Fortress style accessories.

 

You mean you weren't moaning about it? 

[Ahzagothis]

Hey, man. I'm sorry you feel that way. If you don't like what I post, find it stupid, etc. That's fine. As my post said everyone's got an opinion, and that's fine. But insulting someone for their opinion is not conductive. You can disagree with someone's opinion without attacking them for having an different opinion.

[ElHefe]

@ EetNotErn ... yes and thank you for calling it out

Look folks, if things don't cool off this thread will be locked and all the the time spent reading and writing would be for NOTHING

Please stay on topic

[Mak_Gohae]

You're pretty much already there. Continue if you must.

 

Correct, like i said, no matter what anyone that has a different view than you it's wrong.

 

 

Not necessarily Jack the Ripper specifically, but the Cultured Badass trope, or the Gentleman Thief. I'm not sure why you've latched onto that example.

 

Now, I know what you're going to say "oh, he's not a thief! His powers don't steal things!" or something along those lines.

 

However you yourself have shown that a character doesn't have to default to something. You said that Ember was a phoenix, not a chicken. The same applies here. 

 

I didnt say anything about the default i stated what theme the frame is, Ember is a Phoenix.

So what's the theme of Mr.Peanut? Gentlemen Thief? Sorry, doesnt match.

Cultured Badass? That only explains how a character acts which has nothing to do with the frame since the frame is just equipment.

[vaugahn]

I didnt say anything about the default i stated what theme the frame is, Ember is a Phoenix.

So what's the theme of Mr.Peanut? Gentlemen Thief? Sorry, doesnt match.

Cultured Badass? That only explains how a character acts which has nothing to do with the frame since the frame is just equipment.

 

You're so wrapped up in your own justifications at this point that it isn't even funny.

 

Everything you've said about Ember could have words switched out to be the exact same thing I'm saying about Limbo. You'd be better off just making up explanations for things at this point.

 

Ember is a phoenix? Cool, Limbo is a gentleman. There are dozens of gentleman warrior archetypes. None of them are any more fantastic than the archetypes we've had in the game since closed beta. All of them could fit Limbo. 

 

And just as an aside, the frames are characters. 

[optyk]

I have indeed, but it was for naught. And not just here either.

 

Moaned when they added Light Sabre Bat'leths to Star Trek Online too. As did others. Moaned when they added pink color sabre crystals to Star Wars. As did others. Moaned when they took Titans out of Titanfall. Think I dont need to explain why on those. But golly, I'm sure seeing all the same 'dont ruin my fun bro, you have no rights!' retorts here as I did there.

 

Warframe is a diff beast, squeaky wheel gets the oil, money talks, so be it right? So if were gonna play meme frames and vaguely inspired theme frames that are open to interpretation, cool I'm down, why fight it. Players are saying that a stereotypical magician looking frame is a-ok? Cool, well add in the stereotypical wizzy robes then right? (I mean, no one is allowed to tell me whats fun and whats not...)

 

Comprende?

[Mak_Gohae]

You're so wrapped up in your own justifications at this point that it isn't even funny.

 

Everything you've said about Ember could have words switched out to be the exact same thing I'm saying about Limbo. You'd be better off just making up explanations for things at this point.

 

Ember is a phoenix? Cool, Limbo is a gentleman. There are dozens of gentleman warrior archetypes. None of them are any more fantastic than the archetypes we've had in the game since closed beta. All of them could fit Limbo. 

 

And just as an aside, the frames are characters. 

 

I've been asking for you to list how Mr. Peanut matches whatever example you are using at the moment and all you reply with is, "It matches just because."

 

The fact that you cant list anything shows how solid your argument is. 

 

Mr. Peanut is a silly magician, he is Mandrake the Magician inserted into the game.