Why Is There Dmg Falloff In Space?

[dashashou]

it just seems to really hurt the corvas , and makes no sense  

[Somedude1000]

Tbh why would anyone use a shotgun in space >.>

 

Also, real life shotguns don't have damage falloff at all, spread alone reduces their single target dmg at long range, damage falloff from shotguns is a game balance thing...

 

edit; I was mistaken, some shotgun bullet types do have a velocity decrease at range, but as pointed out, perhaps the values in game are nt necessarrily reflective of actual shotguns, which is why the dmg figures aren't as consistent as they probablt would be 

Edited October 31, 2014 by Somedude1000

[Llyssa]

Well, it's noteworthy that space is not a vacuum, contrary to popular belief. There is an "interstellar medium", made of various gases and particles, not to mention the fact that "space" as we recognize it starts a mere 20 miles from a planet, but atmospheres can extend several hundred miles in to space. It's been noted that this means that space even has a "smell", caused by the chemicals floating out there.

 

So, it does make some sense that there's damage fall off, but not enough sense that it's high enough to make you ask about it.

[Frostosti]

why are there explosions in space?

why do i stop sprinting if i release the sprint button?

yeah , its a game, its not realistic i^^

[Llyssa]

Oh, additionally, it's noteworthy that things lose heat rapidly without any real insulation, so a pellet may deform badly while it cools.

 

 

...still, it should probably lose the most damage from the mere spread of particles as it travels, rather than any other inherent reason.

 

It's also noteworthy that the imperator ALSO has damage falloff--sniping an enemy from over 500m causes significantly less damage than shooting them at PBR.

[Implodingbanana]

why are there explosions in space?

why do i stop sprinting if i release the sprint button?

yeah , its a game, its not realistic i^^

i imagine stamina becomes a rechargeable power source within the archwing that allows us to temporarily fly faster

[Llyssa]

It's also possible that the projectiles used disintegrate as they travel, the internal pressure pushing them apart against the virtual non-pressure of space. If the projectile expands as it travels, this would increase the time of impact, thus decreasing the force of impact, thus lowering the damage.

[OverlordMcGeek]

It's also possible that the projectiles used disintegrate as they travel, the internal pressure pushing them apart against the virtual non-pressure of space. If the projectile expands as it travels, this would increase the time of impact, thus decreasing the force of impact, thus lowering the damage.

she solved it right there its all correct.

[Llyssa]

i imagine stamina becomes a rechargeable power source within the archwing that allows us to temporarily fly faster

His point is the laws of thermodynamics--if you accelerate something and there is little resistance, it will not lose velocity. Constant thrust != constant velocity, but, rather constant thrust ==constant acceleration.

 

So, logistically, we should be able to use sprinting to go faster and faster, but we should not slow down when we stop sprinting, only when we actively try to slow down, or when we hit something.

 

There could be something from the laws of rotational dynamics that possibly matters, given the way we change postures and the way we're in orbit, but that's kind of sketchy, particularly as this happens in all directions, not merely when traveling in a plane parallel to the rotation of the planet we're orbiting.

[Noxonion]

Sometimes, to make a good game, logic needs to step out of the way.

 

 

I mean, we already have space magic and crazy AIs yelling at us for not making wings goddamnit!!!

 

[Vahlak]

It's also possible that the projectiles used disintegrate as they travel, the internal pressure pushing them apart against the virtual non-pressure of space. If the projectile expands as it travels, this would increase the time of impact, thus decreasing the force of impact, thus lowering the damage.

Beyond that, when firing any kind of gun your accuracy drops the farther your target is... just cause your 'sight' is lined up on the center of the head does not mean that's where the bullet will hit.  You could miss them completely, you could hit the giant metal plates that everyone seems to use for a helmet, you could hit their ear or clip the jaw which causes tons of damage but isn't technically fatal.   Not every spot on a target will cause the same amount of damage. 

 

  I don't care for damage falloff in general but honestly it's the best way to simulate actual accuracy on a hit scan weapon.

[Archistopheles]

Science and Magic don't mix well.

[Llyssa]

The counter-point to the movement question is how we can change directions at all--we'd need something to be pushing against, and although the interstellar medium *does* exist, it's nowhere near thick enough for our highly-controlled movements. We don't appear to leave exhaust trails, and our wings are quite small, so that rules out the possibility of us using rocket-type propulsion.

 

However, it's noted that AW are made using Orokin Technology, so it's plausible that they rely on some sort of void mechanics interaction to produce propulsion without carrying fuel.

 

...which is a very long way of saying "Orokin Void Magic", but... eh.

[Noxonion]

The counter-point to the movement question is how we can change directions at all--we'd need something to be pushing against, and although the interstellar medium *does* exist, it's nowhere near thick enough for our highly-controlled movements. We don't appear to leave exhaust trails, and our wings are quite small, so that rules out the possibility of us using rocket-type propulsion.

 

However, it's noted that AW are made using Orokin Technology, so it's plausible that they rely on some sort of void mechanics interaction to produce propulsion without carrying fuel.

 

...which is a very long way of saying "Orokin Void Magic", but... eh.

Tell me, why aren't you posting videos on The Game Theorists?

[GreyEnneract]

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." -Arthur C. Clarke.

[shut]

Well, it's noteworthy that space is not a vacuum, contrary to popular belief. There is an "interstellar medium", made of various gases and particles, not to mention the fact that "space" as we recognize it starts a mere 20 miles from a planet, but atmospheres can extend several hundred miles in to space. It's been noted that this means that space even has a "smell", caused by the chemicals floating out there.

 

So, it does make some sense that there's damage fall off, but not enough sense that it's high enough to make you ask about it.

 

I keep noticing the whole InterStellar Medium thing popping up whenever the whole "vacuum in space" topic is mentioned, but even the densest of ISMs are still effectively vacuums on our scale.

 

FUN FACT!

Molecular clouds (the birthplaces of stars, and the densest of Interstellar Medium clouds) are still roughly ten trillion times thinner than air. That ain't slowing down jack.

[Implodingbanana]

His point is the laws of thermodynamics--if you accelerate something and there is little resistance, it will not lose velocity. Constant thrust != constant velocity, but, rather constant thrust ==constant acceleration.

 

So, logistically, we should be able to use sprinting to go faster and faster, but we should not slow down when we stop sprinting, only when we actively try to slow down, or when we hit something.

 

There could be something from the laws of rotational dynamics that possibly matters, given the way we change postures and the way we're in orbit, but that's kind of sketchy, particularly as this happens in all directions, not merely when traveling in a plane parallel to the rotation of the planet we're orbiting.

true but as most people said when it comes to games the question would be: what is logic? :P

[Archistopheles]

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." -Arthur C. Clarke.

I asked that guy what he thought of our forums:

"I'm sure the universe is full of intelligent life. It's just been too intelligent to come here." -Arthur C. Clarke.

[PlebbyMilliner]

Also, real life shotguns don't have damage falloff at all, spread alone reduces their single target dmg at long range, damage falloff from shotguns is a game balance thing...

 

This is false. #7-#8 Birdshot is typically down to half velocity at 50 yards. 00 Buckshot is down ~27% at 50 yards and ~50% at 150 yards.

 

But then, these are "space guns".

[SlyBoots]

now does someone want to make elaborate excuses why this should be in the game purely in terms of gameplay mechanics?

Edited October 30, 2014 by SlyBoots

[Llyssa]

now does someone want to [explain] why this should be in the game purely in terms of gameplay mechanics?

...because the way they designed shotties in this game, rather than having all pellets equal up to one regular bullet(which is what they should, effectively, do), they made each pellet do a significantly larger portion of damage, so that the overall damage is far superior to a singular bullet.

 

The consequence of this is that an accurate shotgun becomes the ultimate sniper rifle at long range, with less chance to miss, and still greater damage than their singular-bullet counterparts.

 

Rather than nerfing the per-pellet damage output on shotguns, they decided to instead have them drop damage over distance, so that they would still be superior weapons for close range fighting, but would cease to be godly sniper rifles.

 

The Corvas is just another shotgun, so the same rules are applied to it.

 

TL;DR: Balance.

[Zangon]

Tbh why would anyone use a shotgun in space >.>

 

Also, real life shotguns don't have damage falloff at all, spread alone reduces their single target dmg at long range, damage falloff from shotguns is a game balance thing...

 

u wot? You do know how gravity works right?

[Shehriazad]

Tbh why would anyone use a shotgun in space >.>

 

Also, real life shotguns don't have damage falloff at all, spread alone reduces their single target dmg at long range, damage falloff from shotguns is a game balance thing...

Any weapon with conventional bullets has damage falloff. Air resistance + Gravity.

You wouldn't expect a Magnum to still deal as much damage after 500 meters as it does after 10...right?

Same goes for shotguns.

Of course the values in games are ridiculous.....but that's just how games work (unfortunately).

In space, though....if it's a shotgun with "conventional bullets"...then it should not have any damage falloff whatsoever.

Edited October 31, 2014 by Shehriazad

[Theodorick]

Oh, additionally, it's noteworthy that things lose heat rapidly without any real insulation, so a pellet may deform badly while it cools.

 

 

...still, it should probably lose the most damage from the mere spread of particles as it travels, rather than any other inherent reason.

 

It's also noteworthy that the imperator ALSO has damage falloff--sniping an enemy from over 500m causes significantly less damage than shooting them at PBR.

 

That's another misconception about space.

 

There is no convection or conduction in space. Heat transfer is done through radiation and that process takes quite some time in a near vacuum environment. The "flash freeze" you may see in movies is not based on real facts.

 

Anyway back on topic, as others have said it's more about gameplay mechanics than making an accurate space representation.

[Somedude1000]

Of course the values in games are ridiculous.....but that's just how games work (unfortunately).

 

I probably should have lead on wiht this statement