Continued Exclusive Gifts To Founders Makes Us Feel A Bit Left Out

[grillv20]

I honestly don't see the big deal. Its not like its breaking the game because you don't have this sigil or anything. Now if they just started handing out over powered stuff to founders then it would probably be a big deal. BUT it seems like all they're doing is handing out something cosmetic and honestly that shouldn't even be up for discussion. Sure, you've played a long time and been around but so have they. Sure you gave them money and sure they gave them money also. If you really want to complain about something redirect it at something useful. This is quite literally a jealousy thread and its dumb that it has this many posts. 

 

I honestly think they should have kept the founders thing open since the game isn't even out of beta yet... -_-

Edited November 17, 2014 by grillv20

[Onida_a]

Off-topic:

 

This thread is convoluted with information on- and off-topic! I am surprised it has not been locked.

 

On-topic:

 

 

Not including information on Founder cosmetics in patch notes or update messages would not be, let me say this, a morally right action. I am even against the idea of hiding it behind a spoiler tag, because it is hiding something from plain view. Does DE need to hide cosmetic content from its playerbase? I do not think so.

[-FV-Wsocks]

Off-topic:

 

This thread is convoluted with information on- and off-topic! I am surprised it has not been locked.

 

On-topic:

 

 

Not including information on Founder cosmetics in patch notes or update messages would not be, let me say this, a morally right action. I am even against the idea of hiding it behind a spoiler tag, because it is hiding something from plain view. Does DE need to hide cosmetic content from its playerbase? I do not think so.

Many people have expressed their concern with completely leaving out items from the patch notes and it has been suggested that a Spoiler section might be a more appropriate approach. 

[-FV-Wsocks]

I honestly don't see the big deal. Its not like its breaking the game because you don't have this sigil or anything. Now if they just started handing out over powered stuff to founders then it would probably be a big deal. BUT it seems like all they're doing is handing out something cosmetic and honestly that shouldn't even be up for discussion. Sure, you've played a long time and been around but so have they. Sure you gave them money and sure they gave them money also. If you really want to complain about something redirect it at something useful. This is quite literally a jealousy thread and its dumb that it has this many posts. 

 

I honestly think they should have kept the founders thing open since the game isn't even out of beta yet... -_-

You seem to be basing your argument on things that you don't actually know for certain. You claim that my motive is jealousy but you can't possibly know what my motives are without asking. I've said many times that the re release of the founders pack is not something that I'm concerned with nor am I concerned with the Founders continuing to receive exclusive content. In addition, I've only been playing this game for a few months so the argument that I want something simply because I've been playing for a lengthy period. Referring to my concerns simply as complaints really does little more than group you in with the large number of people who seem to be misunderstanding the point of this post and who choose to act in a rude and often ill-tempered manner. I believe that the concerns that I've brought forward are worth considering and if you believe otherwise then that's really all that matters. 

[LordOfScrugging]

Except plenty of other Founders claim they did just that. Or are you one of the few who wouldn't mind seeing Excalibur, Lato, and Skana Prime released for the masses?

i love my excal prime but i don't think frames or weapons should be exclusive. the only exclusives should be cosmetics. like say we turn back time and excal prime was released in a PA and along side it the founder's package game exclusive skins for excal, lato, and skana prime respectively. like have a super epic exclusive proto armor caliber skin for founders.

 

edit: like others have stated, its just a sigil. why complain? its not like DE said that founders will get some form of exclusive in every kind of update. don't see a liset prime or kubrow primes for founders. know for a fact we wont get archwing prime as founder exclusive. whats the point in crying over a sticker that we throw on our jumpsuits ? 

Edited November 17, 2014 by Llelouche

[-FV-Wsocks]

i love my excal prime but i don't think frames or weapons should be exclusive. the only exclusives should be cosmetics. like say we turn back time and excal prime was released in a PA and along side it the founder's package game exclusive skins for excal, lato, and skana prime respectively. like have a super epic exclusive proto armor caliber skin for founders.

 

edit: like others have stated, its just a sigil. why complain? its not like DE said that founders will get some form of exclusive in every kind of update. don't see a liset prime or kubrow primes for founders. know for a fact we wont get archwing prime as founder exclusive. whats the point in crying over a sticker that we throw on our jumpsuits ? 

I'd like to say, just for the record, that I am not calling for the re release of any Founder exclusive gear or any otherwise exclusive gear. Just to be safe. 

 

Edit because I didn't get a chance to read your edit:

Why do all of these posts start off as reasonable opinions to soon be edited to be accusatory and rude? I'm sorry that the issue seems trivial to you but I believe that there are others who share this concern. 

Edited November 17, 2014 by wearing_socks

[LordOfScrugging]

I'd like to say, just for the record, that I am not calling for the re release of any Founder exclusive gear or any otherwise exclusive gear. Just to be safe. 

 

Edit because I didn't get a chance to read your edit:

Why do all of these posts start off as reasonable opinions to soon be edited to be accusatory and rude? I'm sorry that the issue seems trivial to you but I believe that there are others who share this concern. 

never accused you of that calling for re-release. just that i wouldn't care about them being released because of my mindset on this subject. and for the edit, i don't mean to be rude but there are some really idiotic people in this community. 

[grillv20]

You seem to be basing your argument on things that you don't actually know for certain. You claim that my motive is jealousy but you can't possibly know what my motives are without asking. I've said many times that the re release of the founders pack is not something that I'm concerned with nor am I concerned with the Founders continuing to receive exclusive content. In addition, I've only been playing this game for a few months so the argument that I want something simply because I've been playing for a lengthy period. Referring to my concerns simply as complaints really does little more than group you in with the large number of people who seem to be misunderstanding the point of this post and who choose to act in a rude and often ill-tempered manner. I believe that the concerns that I've brought forward are worth considering and if you believe otherwise then that's really all that matters. 

 

I cant understand where you're coming from. If they want to give founders some stupid cosmetic crap to give thanks for the people that actually spent a couple hundred dollars to help jump start their game then whats the big deal? I know it would be nice for them to say thanks to the general populace of the people that play regularly but thats a whole other issue all together. Maybe they should put in some sort of daily log in bonus? We DID just get the free mastery insignia for free that they're putting in the plat shop soon.

Edited November 17, 2014 by grillv20

[Phatose]

Many people have expressed their concern with completely leaving out items from the patch notes and it has been suggested that a Spoiler section might be a more appropriate approach. 

 

How long exactly would that protect you from feeling left out?  Assume we did exactly what you suggested for this latest sigil - no patch notes, instead founders get an in-game email where it's added.  Nothing in the notes at all, to make you feel left out.

 

But we're talking about an online-only multiplayer game with a considerable contingent of founders who still actively play.  You've spared yourself feeling left out in the patch notes - but it's only a matter of time before you run into a founder with the sigil plastered across their back in-game.  At best, this is a delaying tactic, and at worse it's hopeless.

 

What other effect is that going to have though?  How long after those changes til we get threads in here complaining about hidden changes and how DE must be embarrassed about giving them out, because they obviously are hiding it?  How many extra threads about other 'hidden changes' are we now going to see, since DE establishes that it's OK to do that, and especially given the heavy RNG in this game?

Edited November 17, 2014 by Phatose

[grillv20]

Also, I would like to add that the title of the thread absolutely screams jealousy and if you say you aren't jealous then you're a liar. Like a huge big fat liar.

[fatpig84]

If you want to feel appreciated, buy a prime accessory or prime access.

There you got an avatar that I don't have.

You got a nice scarf and armor that I again don't have.

 

Tada DE appreciates you.

 

 

DE might even release a Prime Sigil soon.

Just that they have not gotten to it yet.

[-FV-Wsocks]

Also, I would like to add that the title of the thread absolutely screams jealousy and if you say you aren't jealous then you're a liar. Like a huge big fat liar.

I really can't control how you feel, but I can control how I feel, and what I feel is not jealousy. lol. I'm sorry but the argument that I'm just a big fat crybaby is a bit silly so you'll excuse me if I get a laugh out of it. 

[-FV-Wsocks]

If you want to feel appreciated, buy a prime accessory or prime access.

There you got an avatar that I don't have.

You got a nice scarf and armor that I again don't have.

 

Tada DE appreciates you.

 

 

DE might even release a Prime Sigil soon.

Just that they have not gotten to it yet.

I've done that and I'll continue to do that to show support but the post isn't about having more exclusive items than someone else. Instead of trying to please me, how about you simply comment on whether you think the concerns I've suggested have merit. If you come to the conclusion that they do not, perhaps try to understand that others may have a different view. 

[Onisa]

i love my excal prime but i don't think frames or weapons should be exclusive. the only exclusives should be cosmetics. like say we turn back time and excal prime was released in a PA and along side it the founder's package game exclusive skins for excal, lato, and skana prime respectively. like have a super epic exclusive proto armor caliber skin for founders.

 

edit: like others have stated, its just a sigil. why complain? its not like DE said that founders will get some form of exclusive in every kind of update. don't see a liset prime or kubrow primes for founders. know for a fact we wont get archwing prime as founder exclusive. whats the point in crying over a sticker that we throw on our jumpsuits ? 

Did you even read what I posted above that response? Or did my terminology trigger a bit of knee jerking?

[Rapxtor]

I have to say that im suprised how you alway keeped your response civil OP, even when "attacked" by users that simple think diferently, your effort is comendable but misdirected, with intention or not, you are simply disregarding the meaning of the word Founder.

 

In every project, Founder is symbolic way to apreaciated the support gived by number of individual, in warframe that mean little itens are gived, but in many other things like associations, people are apreciated every year with recognitions bc if it wasnt them, that thing may not reached so far, be one of them isnt what really matter, what matter is be part of it and keep that alive to be able to reach even further.

 

What you are proposing is like, lets just everyone forget about them bc they already got their things and any apreciation should be personal, when you should be was thankfull for my support i was i am for yours to make Warframe better that it was.

[SIDESTRE4M]

I don't get it... there are exusives everywhere in this game.

 

Certain Vandal/Wraith Versions, Proto Skin, Syndianas, sword thingies, avatars, extractors...

 

Back then I missed Strun Wraith. Measingly 4min more in survival was all I needed, but I was a rookie back then and didn't know what's going on. Everytime I look up my profile and see the time for the survival event, it hurts.

 

It won't come back for me or others. That's life.

 

So we founders got a sigil as a reminder that we aren't forgotten. It's a nice idea honestly.

[Gr33hn]

Many games have exclusives for early players/backers but nowhere have I seen so much jealousy about it as I have in this playerbase. 

 

What is it with Warframe players!? 

 

Whenever I see someone with a "Veteran" title and Alpha Squad Camo in Planetside 2, I smile. When I encounter an original backer in Star Citizen who has a whole discounted fleet with Lifetime Insurance I feel like patting him on the back, I have neither but I can still be happy for them and I appreciate that they were there in the beginning and helped get the show on the road.

 

 

But warframe players, no, they point fingers, cry and play victim. 

[matrixEXO]

I was following your argument and appreciating your honest opinion until you, like so many others, decided to trivialize the matter by both not fully understanding what I'm asking for and by claiming that jealousy is the only possible motive I could have. Really? Complaining? I'm making a suggestion about something that I think might actually be a valid concern for some people. It has been said more than once, more than twice, more than five times in this thread already that because there are so many people suspicious of DE's character, a Founder dedicated spoiler section so that nothing would be left out of the patch notes. I nowhere said that I was upset that Founders were receiving frequent or constant  thanks through items. I've only ever used the word continued. As the support shown is actually continuing long after the initial purchase of the pack was made, this is an apt description. I also said that I thought it was appropriate that the Bright Purity mod be added to the Skana Prime and even went so far as to suggest that improving Founders weapons to the point that they're actually on par with non-exclusive items might not be a bad idea. I'd really appreciate if everyone who had an opposing viewpoint to my suggestion didn't sling around the word 'jealousy' like that is the only reasonable explanation for why I would take the time out of my day to write all of this. If people would stop questioning my motives and my moral character and instead go through the thread as it is so far to see my responses that have covered all of the thus far debated topics, maybe there wouldn't be so many accusations of my feelings in inadequacy or needing to be a completionist being thrown around. I'm only mastery rank 11 so being a completionist at MR18 isn't really something I'm very concerned about at the moment. There are many people who make the argument that there should be ways of reaching MR18 without the Founders items but this post is not making that argument. I suggest that if you'd like to use that as a defense, you go find one of the people actually making an argument that would warrant such.  

That valid concern really isn't valid when you think about what we've been getting since the end of Founder purchase. A single bonus gift and an additional mod equip to our Founder-only weapon (which obviously you cannot get elsewhere so you can either have that or go the bonkers route and have unique Founder-only mods which would raise even more problems) is nothing much. Again, it's just a sigil that holds no special power and a slight bonus of mod equip for Skana Prime, which normal Skana has the option to as well.

 

Personally, DE's character is nothing much. Just a company trying to make things go boom. In many ways. Thus things like Syndicate and Vivergate. That being said, it's not that you must go and do a one-time thing and forget about it. As for the Founder section, I digress. Since Founders are humans and Wikia needs data on everything, words will get out and some people will still feel butthurt. Feeling butthurt about something that's publicly informed is just a part of the human emotion that relates to either their jealousy that they could not attain something others could or their completionist aspect where they cannot complete their set. Otherwise, why would anyone feel butthurt about this? Read and move on, right? Regardless of how someone claims that they are not jealous or that their completionist aspect in them is hurt, it stands to say that if a person's feelings didn't get affected by the notes, they wouldn't really care. I personally wouldn't unless it's something like "Only Founders can fight Void Vor" or somewhere along those lines because it's downright unfair for normal players. Also, I'm sorry for calling you jealous and/or being a completionist.

 

Well, that was my interpretation on things. My bad then.

 

Personally, no. Founder equipment has always been unique and it's more of a symbol of support than a weapon meant using, especially during later games. If the base is buffed up, then only will I agree that Founder gear be buffed alongside it. Otherwise, they are more ornament than not.

 

I'm Mastery Rank 11 too. Completionist doesn't mean anything with MR though. But I get where you are going.

[Azawarau]

The only way this would be possible is to give everyone founders items

 

Give founders nothing new thats exclusive

 

Make no new items exclusive (including founders sigil)

 

Or destroy all exclusives

 

None of these will ever happen

[matrixEXO]

The only way this would be possible is to give everyone founders items

 

Give founders nothing new thats exclusive

 

Make no new items exclusive (including founders sigil)

 

Or destroy all exclusives

 

None of these will ever happen

LOL, then a part of the Founders community will start a rage as well. Once you start going down the path of no return, there definitely is no returning. Such is the issue with exclusives and 'limited time access' things.

Edited November 17, 2014 by matrixEXO

[SIDESTRE4M]

Azawarau hits the nail on the top.

 

There is no equality. This shouldn't sound arrogant, but I'm tired of justifying my founder status and the the stuff I got to a small group of people who just missed their chance.

 

OP says it's all cool and stuff, but what is the reason of existence for this topic then?

Edited November 17, 2014 by SIDESTRE4M

[PanicPrime]

This is a recurring fear I have about this late-game player retention.

There are many items that are/were timed exclusives and become unobtainable the longer you wait to play.

 

Founder bonuses and gear will never be seen again.

Prime pack rotation is going to be a long time before the earlier frames come back round, like Ember. That means Prime extractors, syandanas, and profile icons are off limits to people who would be more than willing to pay for them.

Old helmets with stats on them are now exclusive to the people who originally bought them.

Vandal/wraith weapons are exclusive to the events in which they are rewarded.

Some mod cards are exclusive to the events they happened.

 

 

It's easy to say "some of these rotations will come back round", but the question is when?

 

If a new player starts today there are entire builds that they can't have. No means of acquiring some cosmetic items, no means of acquiring vandal/wraith weapons, no means of acquiring arcane helmets, etc.

 

How will it make them feel when they realize they are late to the party and will therefore miss a pile of content they will never have the chance to acquire?

 

Some items can still be purchased from trade chat, but eventually the supply for those will dwindle to the point that the cost isn't justified.

 

Just my thoughts about going forward into the future.

[SIDESTRE4M]

The toxic dual mods already got added to Vor's droptable in T4.

 

Even Brakk and Detron are obtainable now, which is a huge community success.

 

I think there will be solutions... soon.

[matrixEXO]

The toxic dual mods already got added to Vor's droptable in T4.

 

Even Brakk and Detron are obtainable now, which is a huge community success.

 

I think there will be solutions... soon.

No. Solutions won't ever come about that easy. Regarding limited time exclusives and special event-only gear and the such, the thing is that these marks people who have been continuously playing the game while leaving the people who came late to the party feeling neglected. It's not to say it's never been practiced and done out well but those are done in such a manner that it still ends up in the player's skill to use it (WoT is an example).

 

For this game, the issue is from multiple aspects of the game. Weapon stats being upgrades rather than side-grades. Mods giving exponential increases in performance, etc. It's undeniable that this game has tons of issues that it seems to hold itself on one foot with a very shaky foundation. So, again I will say that the solution won't ever come about that easy.

 

Also, I know this is off-topic and deserve it's own thread.

[Onida_a]

 

Off-topic:

 

To start off I would like to say that I do not wish to offend anyone with what I am going to type. There seems to be an issue with entitlement in a part of the playerbase, the inability to accept that there are items that one will not aquire due to the player not being present at the time the item was up for sale or obtainable through an event.

 

On-topic:

 

- snip -

 Note: Arcane Helmets are tradable.

 

Again, the OP has this issue:

 

This post is in no way asking for Founder exclusive items to be re released or asking that Founders stop receiving exclusive items.

Please keep this in mind as you read.

 

- snip -

 

TL;DR

Please allow the Founders access to new items in such a way as to not make the rest of us feel that our contributions are not appreciated. The request is to omit the addition of said items from public patch notes. 

 

- snip -

 

A wearer of socks

 

 

As in my previous post #227  I can't stress the issue of hiding information in patch notes to not be straightforward on the developers part, therefore it should not happen. If any Tenno can come up with a straightforward way of ommiting information from plain sight, I would be quite surprised.

 

I agree with Brimir and optyk on this:

Again, the Sigils were not a new gift but rather an expansion on the Emblems...

--

Many people have expressed their concern with completely leaving out items from the patch notes and it has been suggested that a Spoiler section might be a more appropriate approach. 

It would seem that you have either not read through my post or chosen to not respont to what I wrote.