So Disappointed With This Game

[coincience]

I'm so disappointed with this game. I like idea of being space ninja and i like sci-fi games, movies, books and all.  My friend suggested me to try this game as he thought i'd like it like I like many other this kinda games but this game is worst I've experienced in long time. Maybe not worst but it kinda pissed me off every time i was playing it. It was not aboutgrinding or the many bugs I died to or could abuse to complete level for free. At start i picked Loki as my warframe because of his ability to go invisible and distract enemies with decoy while I sneak behind them and cut them half silently. Or so i thought i could do. When I after some playing get to try out all Loki's abilities I was a bit disappointed. Wasn't too bad thought and as I knew there is few other warframes with ability to be played "stealthy". First planet was nice and easy enough for everyone to complete. Last boss was little hard thought as I couldn't win him alone and had to join online game. Yeah, I know it is co-op designed game but i prefer playing solo as I wanted to play "stealthy" and other players were just running through enemies to the end. I enjoyed discovering mechanics of this game in early levels and there were many things I enjoyed but the few downsides ruined my experience with this game. 

 

First big downside was map design. There was always only one way to next room and to the end. And the amount of dead ends and locked doors was higher than I have ever before seen in one game. And the one time you could go explore the ship/station when some lucky door was open (maybe bug?) it lead you to dead end whole another side of map and f*cked up your waypoint so you had no clue where you should go. I'm not even sure if I want to know why did u wanted to make maps so limited when you could easy make maps a lot more fun. First of all just unlock all doors. Let players actually explore the maps and see what is behind locked doors. Add some codes for doors you don't want to be passed but please don't just block access to three fourths only because there is no object on that side. You didn't do it because you don't want players to get lost in such big maps and your waypoint system sucks? For crying out loud! Where is normal map?! The girl telling objects for sure sees whole map on some big screen on her office but why cant she show it instead of small useless minimap. That would save so much time for getting lost because of buggy waypoint she is updating. And why not to add game more ways to get next room? Like add tunnel or two that leads you to different position in next room or you could bypass room(s) full of harder enemies but which included better loots. That'd make game so much better in my opinion and with only small effort.

 

Now we can come to the second downside (one maybe thinks this is good side but for me it is maybe the worst).

The stealth gameplay. As huge stealth and invisibility mechanic fan in the games I was so disappointed how poorly it was designed in this game. I know it is really hard to put into effect and balance and that not all like it but stealth could be nice way to play this game solo. I'd love to sneak silently to enemies and oneshot them from behind. Now there is no way to play game stealthy as if you make one little mistake whole map goes alert and enemies come endlessly. After you get spotted once you cant get back to shadows and hide behind objects because somehow all enemies seem to be a telepath and have some kinda ability to see through 10 walls and to 10 miles away. Even if i stealth with Loki after getting spotted and run to another room to become visible and start sneaking again. NOPE! Enemies still know exact point I am. Now the only way complete levels seems to be just rush through them. And there really should be alternative way to play this game for those who prefer stealth and playing solo over rushing with 4 man party. I really hope you keep patching stealth (in better way).

 

Third flaw i kinda mentioned already but want to be more specific about. It is again bigger problem for solo players but good mechanic to make missions harder for groups. I'm talking about enemy spawning rate and locations. This is one thing that makes me hate game more and more after every mission. After getting spotted enemies spawn way too fast for one man to kill them and to what locations?! There is coming tons of enemies from the deadend room you just secured. I'd like to see some good explanation for that! And there is no realistic reason for 10 man to go run whole ship alert because of one guy? Atleast give soloplayers way to deal with endless enemies. Something else than wasting all your ammo from rifle and sidearm for one room. And after you clear that one whole ship alert and no more enemies coming you think they all dead but surprise waits in next room where is still one enemy left who alerts whole ship again. Then try to deal with another thousand of enemies with no ammo left at all. I don't mean that it'd not bee fun to kill mass of enemies with 4 man group but alone it is kinda depressing to die in mission directed to 10-16 levels with over 20 level warframe only because of endless enemies from start to end. 

 

I know my problems are kinda soloplayer problems and this game is meant to be co-op but I also know there are many players who would like to play this game as solo but cant yet play and you should really try to come towards solo players and listen our needs too. I know it is yet just beta and you will patch it a lot before it is "finished" and hopefully I can come play it then and enjoy more than my last experience with the game. Hopefully you guys who work with the game read this and hopefully players have time to read this long wall of text and  this thread brings discussion to the forums (more intelligent than "go back to wow rogue") Thanks for reading.

[Scandroid]

go back to wow rogue

[Ageless_Emperion]

I'm so disappointed with this game. I like idea of being space ninja and i like sci-fi games, movies, books and all.  My friend suggested me to try this game as he thought i'd like it like I like many other this kinda games but this game is worst I've experienced in long time. Maybe not worst but it kinda &!$$ed me off every time i was playing it. It was not aboutgrinding or the many bugs I died to or could abuse to complete level for free. At start i picked Loki as my warframe because of his ability to go invisible and distract enemies with decoy while I sneak behind them and cut them half silently. Or so i thought i could do. When I after some playing get to try out all Loki's abilities I was a bit disappointed. Wasn't too bad thought and as I knew there is few other warframes with ability to be played "stealthy". First planet was nice and easy enough for everyone to complete. Last boss was little hard thought as I couldn't win him alone and had to join online game. Yeah, I know it is co-op designed game but i prefer playing solo as I wanted to play "stealthy" and other players were just running through enemies to the end. I enjoyed discovering mechanics of this game in early levels and there were many things I enjoyed but the few downsides ruined my experience with this game. 

 

First big downside was map design. There was always only one way to next room and to the end. And the amount of dead ends and locked doors was higher than I have ever before seen in one game. And the one time you could go explore the ship/station when some lucky door was open (maybe bug?) it lead you to dead end whole another side of map and f*cked up your waypoint so you had no clue where you should go. I'm not even sure if I want to know why did u wanted to make maps so limited when you could easy make maps a lot more fun. First of all just unlock all doors. Let players actually explore the maps and see what is behind locked doors. Add some codes for doors you don't want to be passed but please don't just block access to three fourths only because there is no object on that side. You didn't do it because you don't want players to get lost in such big maps and your waypoint system sucks? For crying out loud! Where is normal map?! The girl telling objects for sure sees whole map on some big screen on her office but why cant she show it instead of small useless minimap. That would save so much time for getting lost because of buggy waypoint she is updating. And why not to add game more ways to get next room? Like add tunnel or two that leads you to different position in next room or you could bypass room(s) full of harder enemies but which included better loots. That'd make game so much better in my opinion and with only small effort.

 

Now we can come to the second downside (one maybe thinks this is good side but for me it is maybe the worst).

The stealth gameplay. As huge stealth and invisibility mechanic fan in the games I was so disappointed how poorly it was designed in this game. I know it is really hard to put into effect and balance and that not all like it but stealth could be nice way to play this game solo. I'd love to sneak silently to enemies and oneshot them from behind. Now there is no way to play game stealthy as if you make one little mistake whole map goes alert and enemies come endlessly. After you get spotted once you cant get back to shadows and hide behind objects because somehow all enemies seem to be a telepath and have some kinda ability to see through 10 walls and to 10 miles away. Even if i stealth with Loki after getting spotted and run to another room to become visible and start sneaking again. NOPE! Enemies still know exact point I am. Now the only way complete levels seems to be just rush through them. And there really should be alternative way to play this game for those who prefer stealth and playing solo over rushing with 4 man party. I really hope you keep patching stealth (in better way).

 

Third flaw i kinda mentioned already but want to be more specific about. It is again bigger problem for solo players but good mechanic to make missions harder for groups. I'm talking about enemy spawning rate and locations. This is one thing that makes me hate game more and more after every mission. After getting spotted enemies spawn way too fast for one man to kill them and to what locations?! There is coming tons of enemies from the deadend room you just secured. I'd like to see some good explanation for that! And there is no realistic reason for 10 man to go run whole ship alert because of one guy? Atleast give soloplayers way to deal with endless enemies. Something else than wasting all your ammo from rifle and sidearm for one room. And after you clear that one whole ship alert and no more enemies coming you think they all dead but surprise waits in next room where is still one enemy left who alerts whole ship again. Then try to deal with another thousand of enemies with no ammo left at all. I don't mean that it'd not bee fun to kill mass of enemies with 4 man group but alone it is kinda depressing to die in mission directed to 10-16 levels with over 20 level warframe only because of endless enemies from start to end. 

 

I know my problems are kinda soloplayer problems and this game is meant to be co-op but I also know there are many players who would like to play this game as solo but cant yet play and you should really try to come towards solo players and listen our needs too. I know it is yet just beta and you will patch it a lot before it is "finished" and hopefully I can come play it then and enjoy more than my last experience with the game. Hopefully you guys who work with the game read this and hopefully players have time to read this long wall of text and  this thread brings discussion to the forums (more intelligent than "go back to wow rogue") Thanks for reading.

 

I am sorry but if you die in a lvl 10-16 mission with a warframe that is over level 20 you need to back to point and click games.

[Crysentos]

go back to wow rogue

Now, now, thats no way treating a long thought out opinion. While I agree there are some flaws in the system they are working on it.

[SoulEchelon]

I'm sorry, but I can't really give you any credence if your account is literally 3 hours old. How can you be disappointed in a game when you haven't even truly played it?

[Luxangel7]

OP, very few of the points you made actually make any sense, like the part about how we should be able to view the entire map, that I actually agree with. The rest of what you wrote came across as aggressive, rude and often times completely nonsense (levelling up for free, what??)

 

If you cannot form your thoughts in both a logical and polite manner, don't expect to be confronted with anything but contempt and disdain from people who enjoy the game very much and are accustomed to making polite requests of a dev team that often doesn't come here to say "hey that's a great idea" but instead applies updates and fixes really fast because they keep up with what their fans want. 

 

Remember, that even when you're right if you are needlessly rude and aggressive you become wrong. (although let me stress that in your tirade you were "right" about very little)

[Mak_Gohae]

At this point the game isnt really designed for stealth.

Stealth is more of a bonus that can help you out for a bit, but they have implemented a few things that can help like enemies not noticing you until you are close to their detect zone which can help stealth kills to happen.

[TheVavil]

 

Third flaw i kinda mentioned already but want to be more specific about. It is again bigger problem for solo players but good mechanic to make missions harder for groups. I'm talking about enemy spawning rate and locations. This is one thing that makes me hate game more and more after every mission. After getting spotted enemies spawn way too fast for one man to kill them and to what locations?! There is coming tons of enemies from the deadend room you just secured. I'd like to see some good explanation for that! And there is no realistic reason for 10 man to go run whole ship alert because of one guy? Atleast give soloplayers way to deal with endless enemies. Something else than wasting all your ammo from rifle and sidearm for one room. And after you clear that one whole ship alert and no more enemies coming you think they all dead but surprise waits in next room where is still one enemy left who alerts whole ship again. Then try to deal with another thousand of enemies with no ammo left at all. I don't mean that it'd not bee fun to kill mass of enemies with 4 man group but alone it is kinda depressing to die in mission directed to 10-16 levels with over 20 level warframe only because of endless enemies from start to end. 

 

 

 

This is not a flaw.

 

This is why the Solo Play is so much damn fun.

 

The enemies are not endless, sadly there does seem to come a time when they stop spawning and you have to leave the Planet/Ship/Roid

 

On a side note I would like to see more enemies spawn in Extermination missions please.

[coincience]

-SoulEchelon

  I've played game now for sometime and my account is only "3 hours" old because this was first time i really logged in forums.

 

-LuxAngel7

  I have no mean to offend anyone nor be agressive or rude. Even it can be a bit single sided opinions this was best i came with less than 2 hours writing. I just wrote up things i don't like in the game and make me want to quit it so devs can work on them and i can hopefully come back and be happy with the fixes they have done.

[Thaumatos]

Well the OP complains about the doors being locked and an obvious way to go, but then complains about being able to explore and getting lost.  I'm not sure there's anything anyone can do for you at that point.

 

S/he's obviously frustrated with a 'track-like' level randomization engine.  That's what this game is.  Unfortunately, you CAN discern whether or not you enjoy this game in 3 hours.  I would say even less.  What you do at rank 0 is hardly any different at all from what you do at 30.  The only thing that changes is the difficulty of doing it and what you do it with.  That is, you're running from point A to point B and killing or passing any monsters in between.  Sure there are sometimes objectives to complete along the way such as "pick this up" or "destroy/kill this" but it all boils down to just run and gun play.

 

I happen to enjoy mindless action when it plays well.  Barring some (fixable) flaws in design, many of which are being discussed in great detail, this game has a fundamentally solid, fast-paced, and fun combat system paired with simple yet effective progression that keeps players coming back to the grind.  Grinding/farming doesn't have to be boring and having dynamic combat in your game keeps it from becoming so.

 

They're working on end-game right now and it's curretly their toughest puzzle yet (according to DE_Steve, its what keeps him up at night).  There is no end-game yet.  There will be though...patience.

[Patrick-Swayze]

Loki is the worst frame for soloing by a long shot.

I didn't really enjoy my time with him when I played solo, but his abilities become essential when playing with friends on the harder difficulties.

The game is a little grindy but it also happens to be very good.

I personally enjoy the combat so much I forget about the grinding and just enjoy the ninja flow a lot of the time.

[_Aks_]

LuxAngel, about the map I agree with you, but right now we don't really need maps without really explorable map. I mean if we could open every door and the ship had many connecting doors/corridors/rooms map will be essential. Right now we only have limited space and missions like "go there and do something" and we can only go and do it. We can't just choose another route except vents in planet missions. But if we had open maps, also without those "fall-teleport back" things, so you need to go back manually, variety in ways of doing missions like "go and blow up main door and destroy reactor" or "stealth to the control room, hack and overload reactor" or even "overload it manually from... i don't know, somewhere" and those kind of missions, we would really need to plan our way through, avoiding really dangerous things like Elite HQ's and reactors that are really reactors that can be really dangerous and not those ball-like things, and doing all sort of interesting things. Also, it will be very good if we won't be able to get the map from the start and need to manually locate some room where map of the ship can be downloaded. Or you can just clear all rooms while exterminating everything you see. Sorry for long post, just really wanted to speak about maps.

[Ageless_Emperion]

-SoulEchelon

  I've played game now for sometime and my account is only "3 hours" old because this was first time i really logged in forums.

 

-LuxAngel7

  I have no mean to offend anyone nor be agressive or rude. Even it can be a bit single sided opinions this was best i came with less than 2 hours writing. I just wrote up things i don't like in the game and make me want to quit it so devs can work on them and i can hopefully come back and be happy with the fixes they have done.

 

At the moment stealth is not very viable, it is useful. Especially when you have a shade sentinel which will cloak you when your near an enemy until you leave their field of vision, allowing you to move past areas with a high density of enemies with ease or to surprise them with a melee charge attack. They have REPEATEDLY stated they are working on stealth gameplay so patience is in order.

 

You have to have a right weapon to solo in the game, suggestions being the boltor and strun at lower ranks and the hek and gorgon when you become more comfortable with the gameplay.

 

You NEED to dodge and use cover when you play by yourself, if you use the mentality of WoW and stand in front of them trying to click until one of you falls over it will most likely be you in most cases that will be the first to go down.

[Mietz]

>OP is disappointed in an unfinished product.

 

 

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[MrSnipyCat]

Because beta doesent mean anything *facepalm*

[aszabo]

After the second paragraph all I could think of was some guy running up to every door he saw in game and freaking out when it did not open. Then I imagined this same situation in real life and checked the locks on my front and back doors. So I guess to fix the first issue they could just remove doors from the game?

 

All joking aside while I find the random map generator to be a bit stale that is the tricky part with a random map. You have to make it work right. I agree about wanting more complex map design but they can keep locked doors in my opinion. The new map units they added was a step in the right direction and I think they will get there in time.

 

When one of the enemies goes to a console and alerts the ship/base that there is an intruder then what do you expect to happen? I don't play stealth but I have read and heard of plenty of people who do entire missions with out detection.

 

Spawn locations is a bit goofy sometimes but imagine they came through one of those dreaded locked doors. Spawn rate seems to be random but it does seem higher in full groups. For instance the time I did grineer mobile defense and the scoreboard showed a combined 800 kills(37k xp for my rank 30 warframe :/). Once/if you play long enough spawn rates will not bother you. Most people are looking for more of a challange from the game.

Edited April 25, 2013 by aszabo

[coincience]

Even english isn't my strong side I hope it isn't that hard to understand. I see many of you haven't  read the text at all or didn't understand it :/

[Withinfinite]

1) RNG Maps means that huge complexity can be a huge issue. And if the majority of locked doors were unlocked it would be redundant.

2) Stealth has always been brokened and is being fixed

3) "it is kinda depressing to die in mission directed to 10-16 levels with over 20 level warframe..." Sums it up. If you cant deal with all of those enemies then youll have to practice on lower levels and understand that stealth is a part of this game. Not the whole thing.

[Strac_CRO]

what games do you like to play ?

[SilentCynic]

I managed to solo my way to Pluto with a Loki, with no potatoes involved. It is really not that hard when you have invulnerability (in the form of your invisibility) on demand.

 

That aside, to address your issues:

1) The locked doors aren't sealing off content. There's nothing beyond them. This is how the randomized map generators work.

2) Stealth was only added in patch 7, I believe (might be mistaken). It's still a work-in-progress, and this is the first iteration thereof. Be patient.

3) I suppose the spawns can get overwhelming, but I've found that the pressure keeps the game's tempo up. Makes it feel more challenging and dynamic.

[GrumpyPigeon]

I'm sorry, but I can't really give you any credence if your account is literally 3 hours old. How can you be disappointed in a game when you haven't even truly played it?

 

I don't think that the forum account indicator is exactly accurate and based on when they made their account to play ingame, I may be wrong though.

 

If you cannot form your thoughts in both a logical and polite manner, don't expect to be confronted with anything but contempt and disdain from people who enjoy the game very much and are accustomed to making polite requests of a dev team that often doesn't come here to say "hey that's a great idea" but instead applies updates and fixes really fast because they keep up with what their fans want.

 

You may want to step back for a minute and realise that the OP very probably doesn't even speak English as a first language. He's frustrated and he has good right to be as a new player, I love the game now, but the game doesn't tell you anything outside of "left click to shoot" in the tutorial, doesn't even explain most of the mobility mechanics such as walljumping-doesn't even attempt to explain the mod system ingame and to top it off has a rather clunky UI at  times.

 

If you think the developers only wanted to hear people speak about how wonderful the game is, you're wrong. It's useful for them to know what a new player feels like and all his frustrations I've heard from steam friends who have briefly tried the game in the past, and I agree, the game doesn't explain anything outside of how to shoot or choose a mission at all and doesn't really even attempt to. I was upset when 11 hours in I realised that a potato for my Warframe would double the mod capacity and it was easily the most invaluable thing to purchase with starting platinum. We all have different problems and frustrations, if the devs know about said frustrations they can then fix them (and they probably will fix most issues eventually).

 

go back to wow rogue

 

Thanks for being a constructive member of the community.

 

>OP is disappointed in an unfinished product.

 

Greentexting? On a forum? Seriously?

 

When one of the enemies goes to a console and alerts the ship/base that there is an intruder then what do you expect to happen? I don't play stealth but I have read and heard of plenty of people who do entire missions with out detection.

 

The problem is the stealth really feels like it revolves around frantically killing anything that attempts to make a run for it (which is often say a few metres in game?) and these consoles are littered EVERYWHERE (also the weird almost necessity for having a ghost sentinel to even really attempt stealth). Also I'm not even sure that there's even any benefit for stealth running missions, surely there should be a bonus for not being seen or something of the sort? There's an entire gamemode called Spy that really just involves mowing down tons of enemies then "subtly implanting" something into their systems then buggering off into space again leaving a trail of bodies behind the exit, obviously there's more to certain spy missions with other objectives, but why wouldnt someone get rewarded for completing a mission in stealth when it's clearly meant to be an objective of subterfuge?  We'll see what time brings!

[Foofmonger]

Easy complaints to answer.

 

1. Welcome to RNG. Ever play other videogames before?

 

2. Stealth mechanics are stated to be a work in progress.

 

3. Try to not be so bad? Work on your loadouts and your playstyle. If you are failing to deal with the spawns (which certainly aren't endless) it is your own problem. In fact, I usually run out of things to kill long before I'd like.

 

 Now sure the game isn't perfect, but these wouldn't be the complaints I have about it by any mean. Complaints 1 and 3 are just completely ridiculous to be honest. And we can complain about the stealth all day but everyone including the devs knows that the current stealth system sucks.

Edited April 25, 2013 by Foofmonger

[NalkorRN]

Loki is the worst frame for soloing by a long shot. I didn't really enjoy my time with him when I played solo, but his abilities become essential when playing with friends on the harder difficulties. The game is a little grindy but it also happens to be very good. I personally enjoy the combat so much I forget about the grinding and just enjoy the ninja flow a lot of the time.

Loki for grouping as utility, Ash for Solo/Group as mostly combat/survivability with some utlity (Teleporting to a downed team mate/cryo pod in defense). That's how I see the two stealth frames anyway.

[PlebbyMilliner]

I'd like mutli-pathing as well, but from development standpoint, it'd probably be very difficult to implement.

 

However, I will agree with you a little about the enemies behind you spawning in. One of the interesting ways to overcome this and keep being surprised about enemy direction is to have "enemy only" doors/"monster closets". So in a level where there's only 1 green door and a bunch of reds, have a portion of the enemies come in through some of the red doors. This could easily be accomplished in the procedurally generated levels.

 

Lastly, to help with enemy flow control, if I can hack OPEN doors, can't I hack doors CLOSED? So when I see a huge room of red doors that enemies might come out of, I can lock them down as a delaying tactic. Like "closing the blast doors in Star Wars". Add in some angry sounds from these and I think it would add to the teamplay and atmosphere.

[Thaumatos]

Because beta doesent mean anything *facepalm*

 

Haven't played many betas have you?  Status of the game in beta varies greatly from game to game.

 

Look up the Alpha footage of Hellgate London...then go look at the game.  Notice a difference?  Didn't think so...

 

Alpha comes before beta, just incase you were wondering.