Nerfing Nova For The Sake Of Challenging Missions.

[LisRestall]

-snip-

Because you built Nova in the wrong way. Nova needs all the duration mods available making Mprime reach more than 80m or even 100m w/o Fleeting. There is a problem with this setup yes, which is finding the enemy but that is easily solved by you, the Nova, by using Enemy Radar + Enemy Sense. I have been doing this alot on T4S but yes it does need a Nekros for us to last long.

 

What are the results? Well, it was a 1hr T4S w/ barely any deaths. Once a mob is slowed, there is no way for nullifiers to remove the slow debuff. What happens is the only mob that approaches us quickly are the nullifiers themselves but they are so easy to engage since they are alone most of the time.

 

I also mentioned previously, you want fast R5 cores? Find T4 Intercept, use a Nova with all duration mods, ask someone to be Trinity. Tada, enjoy facerolling through T4I where the only problem is just nullifiers alone.

 

What does this spell? EZgaming.

[.Re-light.]

Because you built Nova in the wrong way. Nova needs all the duration mods available making Mprime reach more than 80m or even 100m w/o Fleeting. There is a problem with this setup yes, which is finding the enemy but that is easily solved by you, the Nova, by using Enemy Radar + Enemy Sense. I have been doing this alot on T4S but yes it does need a Nekros for us to last long.

 

What are the results? Well, it was a 1hr T4S w/ barely any deaths. Once a mob is slowed, there is no way for nullifiers to remove the slow debuff. What happens is the only mob that approaches us quickly are the nullifiers themselves but they are so easy to engage since they are alone most of the time.

 

I also mentioned previously, you want fast R5 cores? Find T4 Intercept, use a Nova with all duration mods, ask someone to be Trinity. Tada, enjoy facerolling through T4I where the only problem is just nullifiers alone.

 

What does this spell? EZgaming.

EZ gaming, with premade team, another CC frame and either Trinity or energy restores. Congrats..

 

Do you think this is your usual "few hundred hours into the game/hopefully making it to at least 1000h(you know, longevity through fun of the game for the individual)/just found a game through recruiting - player"?

 

I don't think so.

 

No, you most definetly do not need Nekros to get to 1h in survival. Is it me or you playing Nova wrong?

 

I doubt 90% of people find longer then that either fun, or easily doable without camping, CP, and just turning the game into a grind. (Grind as in, "we here to farm r5s and do 2h minimum, fun be damned")..

 

  To each their own. We need balance, but nerfing frames based on opinions, 1 at the time won't get us closer to balance..

 

DE did a good job by fixing/nerfing obvious broken things, (blessing, imortal snowglobe, broken max range RB, broken self reviving Oberon, self reviving Syndicate weapons), still leaving us with plenty of viable tools to either be efficient or have fun. The choice is yours, don't advocate taking it from others.

Edited January 30, 2015 by ReLight13

[LisRestall]

-snip-

You don't get it. The problem is Nova being able to create something as EZgaming, is it really that hard to comprehend?

 

I know that Nekros isn't necessary to reach 1h T4S but I specifically mentioned that a full duration built Nova NEEDS a Nekros because mobs do not swarm like normal since they are slowed by Mprime on who knows where. I'm definitely not playing Nova wrong because I was doing the exact role I am supposed to do, unlike what you mentioned,

Second game, we also had a Nyx. I had 19 revives that game, 2 people still died and had to use one of their revives. Borderline spamming Mprime from about 30 to 40minutes didn't help them much.

Which is why I said you built Nova the wrong way. You said spamming Mprime didn't help your squadmates where opposed to how I play, spamming Mprime DOES increase the survivability of the team significantly.

 

Just because you're inexperienced in using Nova doesn't mean it's the same case for others who have been using Nova ever since her release until what she is now.

Edited January 30, 2015 by LisRestall

[.Re-light.]

 

Also, am I the only one who wants solar map content to be relevant and challenging?  Make the journey the destination instead of breeding a community of players who think you have to stay in and endless mission for 40 minutes to reach "endgame."  

 

In the end, I want the power levels of both enemies and players to be scaled down so that growth (and the resulting disparity between funded and unfunded players) isn't so extreme as to make 70% of content practically "irrelevant."  I want every mission to be a healthy challenge for me and my squad, whether it's on Venus or in a Void tower.  I also want the capability to succeed and excel in a mission to be as much the result of my skills as it is the result of my equipment.

No, you are not alone.

 

How ever, our current progress is measured through about 70% gear (as in mods) and 30% skill. In such environment, you cannot find anything fun on Venus, unless crippling yourself. It is designed for new people. Rebalancing from the ground up, making both us and enemies a bit less power creeping sounds like a sound idea, and how that could be achieved should be the name of this topic, not nerfing nova.

 

  It is ridiculous that we measure everything through t4, and also the fact that I cannot find random people to play hard survivals on Ceres or Pluto at all, or the fact that I've spent last 6 months of casual 1, 2h a day play, almost solely in Void.

[.Re-light.]

You don't get it. The problem is Nova being able to create something as EZgaming, is it really that hard to comprehend?

 

I know that Nekros isn't necessary to reach 1h T4S but I specifically mentioned that a full duration built Nova NEEDS a Nekros because mobs do not swarm like normal since they are slowed by Mprime on who knows where. I'm definitely not playing Nova wrong because I was doing the exact role I am supposed to do, unlike what you mentioned,

Which is why I said you built Nova the wrong way. You said spamming Mprime didn't help your squadmates where opposed to how I play, spamming Mprime DOES increase the survivability of the team significantly.

 

Just because you're inexperienced in using Nova doesn't mean it's the same case for others who have been using Nova ever since her release until what she is now.

Excuse my "who is playing Nova wrong" comment, that was uncalled for.

 

I am a new Nova player, and I build all my frames to be self sufficient, but still healthy addition to team, off course there are other ways. But you still admit you need Nekros, and slowing mine and other 3 rooms is not how I like to play. Still, we both have options.

[Adaptor-Face]

rhino can slow more, and potentionally give more bonus damage.

 

i have said it before, nova in her own is not that strong, she just multiplies the strenght you ALREADY have. Try using nothing but powers on nova to see my point.

[Sunfaiz]

 

 

 

And play solo mode for the rest of the game, or Invite Only with a strict ban on seeing Nova played, or leaving any Public matches in which a Nova appears.

 

I don't agree with the OP's reasoning, nor with the conclusion to nerf Nova, but this particular train of logic can only go so far when you're trying to avoid the effects of a particular frame or ability in your matches.

 

[LisRestall]

Excuse my "who is playing Nova wrong" comment, that was uncalled for.

 

I am a new Nova player, and I build all my frames to be self sufficient, but still healthy addition to team, off course there are other ways. But you still admit you need Nekros, and slowing mine and other 3 rooms is not how I like to play. Still, we both have options.

Sigh* I don't know what to say. You saying "we both have options" is like others saying "don't play nova". I will just leave it like this, the problem is "what Nova is capable of" and that's what the thread is about.

 

I'm out.

Edited January 30, 2015 by LisRestall

[.Re-light.]

Sigh* I don't know what to say. You saying "we both have options" is like others saying "don't play nova". I will just leave it like this, the problem is "what Nova is capable of" and that's what the thread is about.

 

I'm out.

   No, since you went into specifics so it's not the same. Me saying we both got options = you can mod the way you want, I can mod the way I want and we still get good results. Your way being generally safer needing another frame or 2, (Nekros, Trin?) to achieve the same goal but with less diversity in your team composition.

 

 Options, diversity, personal preference.. you know, spices to make any good game.

[LisRestall]

   No, since you went into specifics so it's not the same. Me saying we both got options = you can mod the way you want, I can mod the way I want and we still get good results. Your way being generally safer needing another frame or 2, (Nekros, Trin?) to achieve the same goal but with less diversity in your team composition.

 

 Options, diversity, personal preference.. you know, spices to make any good game.

I get it I get it. Problem remains, Nova's capabilities, fact is still she can almost break the game if it weren't for those nullifiers.

[Soul.Fire]

Any frame even a Mesa under Shatter Shield dies pretty quickly if hit by bombard's missile 2 times, go try it. While Zephyr doesn't have any problem at all with Nullifier, she has major problems with bombards. Using Nullifier to say Nova is squishy isn't a good argument, because any frame without any ability to defend themselves would have the same said squishiness.

 

Your vision is too narrow, let me enlighten you. Like someone said here, you can reach 80+ meters on Mprime with all the duration mods available. It makes every other mob easy to kill except only for Nullifier because it isn't affected. For the mobs that cannot be seen because they are slowed on their awkward places, the solution is simple, 2 person using Enemy Radar. Back to the Nullifiers, even though this will obviously 1 shot you at 45mins+ of T4S even with P. Flow + QT, other mobs are still so slowed where your teammates could pick you up w/o any problems after killing the said Nullifier. This is how broken Mprime is with the right usage.

 

Let me throw another bomb, you want fast R5s? Go T4 Intercept, use a Nova with maximum duration w/o Fleeting and camp in the middle of the map, get a Trinity as a teammate and start facerolling T4I giving way faster rewards than T4D and T4S.

 

With what I said above, it just proves how overpowered Nova is to be able to do such things.

No, it actually doesn't, all that proves is that the duration mods give you a huge amount of range. I tested you people's theory, on her being overpowered last night and tonight, I was not impressed. I don't know if any of you main a Nova, and I'm pretty sure just from what you're saying that none of you do, because the blatant ignorance and rejection of the idea of her being squishy astounds me. M.Prime is, quite literally, the only skill she has going for her, Null Star helps the enemies more than it helps you, AMD is a bug fest and a self-funeral waiting to happen, and Wormhole takes too long to cast and use to be even remotely effective in combat. I used up all of my revives last night on Mercury, tonight on Venus, now granted I was soloing both times, but come on, it's the two lowest level planets in the game other than Earth, a level 30 frame that's had 3 formas should be able to handle that. Not Nova. With all the lasers, lankas and provas she suffers terribly. It's no better with Grineer on Mercury, the cleavers, slash-proc shotguns and the rockets will bring you down in milliseconds. I'm fully convinced at this point that the whole reason everyone is screaming "Nerf Nova" so loudly as it were is because her skills are flashy as F***. There are several other frames that are much more effective against everything than Nova, but no one is screaming to nerf them. The difference is they aren't flashy.

Edited January 30, 2015 by Soul.Fire

[Stratego89]

The issue is when it conflicts with end game

 

If you want to play casually you can without impeding on end game and being rewarded for it

 

Its alot of the reason WF hasnt been able to hit a real end game that players feel satisfied with

Just wanted to make sure you are aware of this... the devs do not balance around "end game" (which mind you end game doesn't even exist atm so I'm assuming you're referring to late T4S/D), they balance around the star map. Bringing up end game is not going to help your case at all.

Edited January 30, 2015 by Stratego89

[LisRestall]

-snip-

I'm not gonna bother with someone who just read a few post on the last page then suddenly throws a sh*t post. Also, you're being too obvious as a newbie or VERY inexperienced Nova. Bye.

 

Edit: Btw, yea I agree she's too squishy and can't even rank on Mercury so I just decided to rank her up on Void T2S for 40 minutes alone,

Edited January 30, 2015 by LisRestall

[akira_him]

I'm not gonna bother with someone who just read a few post on the last page then suddenly throws a sh*t post. Also, you're being too obvious as a newbie or VERY inexperienced Nova. Bye.

 

Edit: Btw, yea I agree she's too squishy and can't even rank on Mercury so I just decided to rank her up on Void T2S for 40 minutes alone,

-snip-

synoid gammcor, I see what you did there

[LisRestall]

synoid gammcor, I see what you did there

Going by your logic, Synoid Gammacor = More Survivability?

I'm using a non-maxed Nova but Synoid Gammacor would make me feel like some fully modded Nova?

[akira_him]

Going by your logic, Synoid Gammacor = More Survivability?

I'm using a non-maxed Nova but Synoid Gammacor would make me feel like some fully modded Nova?

T2S, means enemies with less armor, less HP far less damage(T4 are triple damage than T123, nightmare mode in starchart is also triple damage than normal enemies of same level)

And you took the highest dps weapon there, with AoE for every 2000exp

You basically kill all stuffs before they can actually hit you

Dead enemies don't do damage

Edited January 30, 2015 by akira_him

[Soul.Fire]

I'm not gonna bother with someone who just read a few post on the last page then suddenly throws a sh*t post. Also, you're being too obvious as a newbie or VERY inexperienced Nova. Bye.

 

Edit: Btw, yea I agree she's too squishy and can't even rank on Mercury so I just decided to rank her up on Void T2S for 40 minutes alone,

I read the whole thread up until the last two or three posts, so don't start with me. You're being insensitive, even if all your mods won't fit right now I'm willing to bet that you still have at least a few corrupted mods among others that I don't have because RNG is fully convinced that I don't need them. You also have the Synoid Gammacor, which whether anyone wants to admit it or not, actually counts for a lot towards survivability. Not everybody has the time, energy and platinum to commit to getting all these wonderful things that make so many people want to nerf Nova, and quite frankly most of them don't care to either. WE PLAY THE GAME. We don't sit here trying to become as OP as possible and then tell everyone else that their main frame needs a nerf just because we can. Besides, I play with a founder who is very fond of my Nova, he likes the way she's currently built and he likes the way I personally play her. He will also tell anyone who brings it up that there's been too much nerfing already and there's no need for anymore nerfing. Sorry if it bothers you, but I'm going to have to agree with him.

[LisRestall]

T2S, means enemies with less armor, less HP far less damage(T4 are triple damage than T123, nightmare mode in starchart is also triple damage than normal enemies of same level)

And you took the highest dps weapon there, with AoE for every 2000exp

You basically kill all stuffs before they can actually hit you

Dead enemies don't do damage

*facepalm* Tower 4 does x3 damage of T3 but all Towers have same base hp/armor/shield/etc and growth. Go ahead and try it for yourself before throwing out wild assumptions.

[LisRestall]

-snip-

Don't go rage on me just because I've proven that Nova isn't squishy at all kid.

[Soul.Fire]

Why? And each mechanic in this game has its drawbacks when modding, and the very nature of the said power gives it limitations. The point of a power is to complete a purpose, if it does that, why hate the power?

 

No no, I'm saying that you can use either, you have the ability and the choice to use either or both, to complete the tasks at hand. I'm saying that instead of nerfing something unjustly, we help the rest of the powers along that people feel are lackluster. Each example allows for players to specialize or synchronize their gear/power kit, and use them either in tandem or individually to overcome the obstacle. We don't want to force confluence, if players choose to stay the course of guns or powers, they are still able to overcome the obstacles placed before them. If they choose to use all the tools available to them, by their choice alone, then so be it.

 

Why? We modded for big damage and big numbers, that's why we made them like that. The point of the Void is to be the End Game, if it were similar to the star chart then there would be no purpose for it because it's just the same level enemies and we deal less damage. That's no style of progression. DE is continuing to balance fine as is, nerfing the entirety of the player base's damage output isn't going to help that, it's just going to tick everybody off.

 

The Solar Map content is relevant. You aren't feeling it because, guess what, you've built your gear for end-game, for the real threats in the Void. New players and players unlocking planets don't have maxed out mods like we do. For them, the map is already challenging, enemies pose a far greater threat to them that us because we have the gear and loadouts to handle that kind of mess on the Star Chart. If you want challenge, then use gear that isn't out of the range of the planet you're fighting on, and voila, you've got your challenge. Not change the entirety of the game simply because you don't want to change your loadouts.

 

You made your WarFrames and Weapons for end-game, OF COURSE it's going to sweep aside anything that isn't end-game. That's the case with ANY GAME that gives you replay ability. If the Void felt exactly like Venus, then there would be no point in progressing through the game.  If you want challenge, instead of changing the entire game to suit your own needs, hows about you change out the loadouts to actually match the planet you're fighting on. DE is also introducing a Difficulty Setting, so just keep your nickers untwisted and wait for that, and you'll get your challenge well enough.

 

We were built to decimate armies, to clear whole ships and move on to the next threat. This isn't Gears of War, where threats are just as dangerous as you are, we're supposed to be super powerful and strong enough to face an entire army and win, just the four of us, or even less. Nerfing the game to "even the playing field" isn't how this game is supposed to be. If you want something like that, Gears of War, Dark Souls, or whatever other title are there for you to play.

They should go play Path of Exile.

[Soul.Fire]

Don't go rage on me just because I've proven that Nova isn't squishy at all kid.

I didn't rage, You're just ignoring your gear and your mods. Get over yourself.

[LisRestall]

I didn't rage, You're just ignoring your gear and your mods. Get over yourself.

So now you're saying, because I have the right mods, Nova isn't squishy anymore? Being hypocrite are we?

 

What did I say? I kept mentioning, P.Flow + QT along with her 65 armor makes her actually tanky. I have 700 energy on Nova Prime with 1 from top P. Flow and that is equivalent to 1680 HP not even counting her base HP, armor is also applied to QT. Those mods were the only ones I needed to be able to take alot of hits from enemies on T2S with my non-maxed Nova Prime. Energy Siphon's .6 energy regeneration is like 1.44 HP regeneration with QT, each 25 energy orb I pickup is like 60 HP heal with QT.

 

Squishy? Obviously, you're just trying to prevent Nova from getting nerfed.

[akira_him]

*facepalm* Tower 4 does x3 damage of T3 but all Towers have same base hp/armor/shield/etc and growth. Go ahead and try it for yourself before throwing out wild assumptions.

I haven't play T2S for that long for at least 3 months

The starting level of enemies are different, if they share the same growth curve in terms of level, the enemies in T2 at 40 mins is still weaker than T3's

as they have lower level

If they have same level at a given time no matter what tier it is, than they don't share the same growth curve

[LisRestall]

I haven't play T2S for that long for at least 3 months

The starting level of enemies are different, if they share the same growth curve in terms of level, the enemies in T2 at 40 mins is still weaker than T3's

as they have lower level

If they have same level at a given time no matter what tier it is, than they don't share the same growth curve

You're just simply throwing out assumptions for the sake of having a counter-argument. Go ahead and solo it with a frame that you're ranking till 40mins with your Synoid Gammacor and tell me how easy it is and how Synoid kills everything before they damage you even at nearly 40mins.

[Airwolfen]

So now you're saying, because I have the right mods, Nova isn't squishy anymore? Being hypocrite are we?

 

What did I say? I kept mentioning, P.Flow + QT along with her 65 armor makes her actually tanky. I have 700 energy on Nova Prime with 1 from top P. Flow and that is equivalent to 1680 HP not even counting her base HP, armor is also applied to QT. Those mods were the only ones I needed to be able to take alot of hits from enemies on T2S with my non-maxed Nova Prime. Energy Siphon's .6 energy regeneration is like 1.44 HP regeneration with QT, each 25 energy orb I pickup is like 60 HP heal with QT.

 

Squishy? Obviously, you're just trying to prevent Nova from getting nerfed.

 

Yes. Nova is squishy. The Mod tanks damage. Not nova. Nova herself can pretty much be at 2 health the entire time while Qt does the work.

 

Now try the same without Qt. Is she tanky? Not at all. And that just shows how much of a essential mod that already is. Why? Because she is damn squishy.

Her health and shield are average. Her armor is on the line of negligible in terms of damage reduction and she has no inherent Tanking skill. She has no personal damage reduction, just CC and evasion. And fully relies on Qt.

QT is what you'd call a unhealthy element to the game. And his is one of the sole reasons that Nova is truly unbalanced. I know a lot of games where they nerf the things like QT or even fully remove them for the sake of balance.

 

So lets just remove Qt from the game. tadaa. Nova nerf. Now you NEED to spam her skill or you will die. Is that what you want?