7.11.0: Rhino Iron Skin Change... How It Is Now

[Namacyst]

Immortality is completely gone.

 

Ancient Disrupters can now disrupt you through Iron Skin.

 

Toxic Ancients hurt now.

 

Damage is reduced by 80% and seems to work on Damage to shields (Steel Fiber (Armor) only works on Health).

 

Still can't be staggered or knockdowned. <-- Confirmed.   (an attack that would stagger or knockdown you just pushes you back a bit)

  

/discuss

Edited May 17, 2013 by Namacyst

[Timmuk]

Seems a bit more fair even though my Rank 30 Rhino and my fave frame will miss it

 

Either way 80% I can live with, though I wish 80% also was on HP, or at least reduce Toxic Ancients by 80% as well

[Snowball]

Actually can be knocked down.

[KvotheTheArcane1]

really? I've been knockedbacked, haven't tested knockdown yet or disruptors yet.

[Adagio]

drainable by disruptor is sad.

[Namacyst]

Edited the Topic... sad sad day for Rhino.

[Schokoladenonkel]

It seems bugged anyway at the moment, I'm pretty sure it does nothing right now. I think they messed up in the patch,

Edited May 17, 2013 by Schokoladenonkel

[Kynian]

It was a necessary nerf, but he was singled out and left others "offenders" go free.


Give Trinity the same treatment and I'll be cool. She was never meant to be a tank, but she's now THE tank, way better than Rhino. But since she has a lot less armor than Rhino, making her Link protect her for only 80% of the damage and return it would even things out. She wouldn't be able to tank, and would get a decent not OP protection spell.


Also, Frost's Snowglobe also needs adjustments if this is to be done, Only logical to make Snowglobe "break" after absorbing a set amount of bullet damage, as opposed to it being some kind of holy ground.


I'm sure haters will hate, after all this is the internet, but what I'm saying makes sense, doesn't it?


Please implement this DE!

[KvotheTheArcane1]

Well, no more leling at enemies as you save your ally's life and rez them, or stand up to the disruptors in melee, etc.

 

RIP rhino :/

 

(The knockdown is a bug currently, DErebecca stated on page like 4-5 of the update thread that you shouldn't be knocked down as rhino with iron skin)

[Timmuk]

Well, no more leling at enemies as you save your ally's life and rez them, or stand up to the disruptors in melee, etc.

 

RIP rhino :/

 

(The knockdown is a bug currently, DErebecca stated on page like 4-5 of the update thread that you shouldn't be knocked down as rhino with iron skin)

I sure hope its a bug, if they allow KD effects as well as the 80% then it was nerfed way to hard

[Riga92]

I would be cool if Rhino still had his stun immunity.

 

But removing that along with the invincibility nerf?

 

You just made the Tank class no longer a tank.

[Namacyst]

Tested it one more time vs. Pluto- Hydra infested... no knockdown or stagger. Edited Topic.

[TemplarEx]

Its the same rage-over-nerf syndrome again, like saryn molt's nerf, etc

"omg they nerfed this godmode skill!, omg, my warframe its useless now! damn you DE!!"

[Tulzscha]

He had it coming, a needed change IMO.

 

A post from another related thread sums it up quite well: "There is a difference between being a tank and being ninja Jesus."

 

80% damage reduction, 150 armor (even more with Steel Fiber) and as much health/shields as you can afford with Vitality/Redirection still sounds pretty damn tanky to me.

[JerryMouse13]

If nothing else Rhino needs his immunity to ancient disruptors restored, I'd like to see his immunity to toxins restored as well but that's just a want as opposed to what seems to be a rather pressing need.

 

If rhino is supposed to wade in and take hits then we need a way to protect our energy so that he can continue to function after his initial iron skin wears of. Otherwise why even bother? I'm better off just sitting back and shooting from range than wadding into the fray like i'm supposed to.

Edited May 17, 2013 by JerryMouse13

[Kynian]

Well, to me it's more of a rage over singling out his one godmode skill while there are still two others active.

Most critical one is Trinity's Link, that coupled with her infinite energy and any good dmg weapon makes her the do-all-end-all frame, instead of a support. If she had the same exact treatment, say, absorb 80% of damage with link, take the 20, it'd be fine - because onlike Rhino, she has no armor, so she can't tank, and Rhino would be on his element again.

[RogueDarkJedi]

I hate how he can be staggered (pushed back is the same thing as this). Seriously, I would be fine with his changes if he was immune to stunlock.

[KvotheTheArcane1]

Its the same rage-over-nerf syndrome again, like saryn molt's nerf, etc

"omg they nerfed this godmode skill!, omg, my warframe its useless now! damn you DE!!"

but saryn can kill things with her abilities, while rhino has to do it with guns, and that's ALOT harder than just hitting 4 and watching everything die.(which is fine, no sarcasm)

[Ragan42]

Just throwing my 5 cents in after playing a Pluto defense with the Iron Skin change.

I have it maxed out, also using maxed streamline and continuity for extra goodiness, and I was using it a lot to save some reckless people in high level missions.

But as of now, that ability just doesn't worth using at all, the 80% reduction is practically nothing if you face just one lvl 70+ toxic ancient while trying to revive a downed teammate at higher waves of endless defense. Your health ticking down anyway, the friendly neighbouring Disruptor eats your energy, and you are left with 100 health and no energy to face the next wave which will be a zerg of lvl 80 ancients. And you are rocking in a corner hoping to get an energy drop somewhere away from those ancients. Some tank ey...

 

The nerf may not affect random groups as much, since they practically quit at wave 5-10 no matter what, but for those who were looking for some challenges in endless defense, this makes Rhino just not worth playing, since his damage is inferior to offensive frames. I could just play  an Ember and max out Overheat, that skill at least protects from energy drain, while giving 70% reduction (and also scales with focus, so in reality, 91%).

 

I think it would make sense to give back the energy drain protection, and have focus affect Iron Skin, because by the time you find and max out a Focus mod, you are pretty much in endgame, and sticking to one frame for that long deserves a sense of achievement I believe.

Edited May 17, 2013 by Ragan42

[TennoSkoom]

Sad day indeed. Rhino is now useless. He was a tanky bastard with iron skin that was useful for that reason (for rezzing teammates, taking the heat off them from bosses etc.) and completely justified his slow movement speed and blatant lack of useful/effective offensive abilities.

 

After all the mastery rank 1 and 2 players that were crying for a nerf on iron skin- hope you're happy... funny how shy you are on the forums now that it's happened. Please experience a game more before suggesting class ruining changes like this in the future.

 

What could've been done to better balance out iron skin? revert changes made to iron skin so that you can actually use the rhino to rez teammates caught in a clusterfuck- and then nerf the damage output of all weapons while iron skin is active. Simple right? Easy? Effective? Sure... That's why it didn't happen.

 

as things are now, rhino's 1 useful ability has been rendered useless and none of his other abilities have been buffed to make the rhino's damage output acceptable.

 

So as a recap of what happened during my testing of iron skin on an infested defense on pluto after the update:

1 disruptors now disrupt you regardless of iron skin being active or not

2 toxic ancients now directly destroy your health regardless of whether or not iron skin is active

3 you can be knocked down while iron skin is active but this is considered a bug and will be fixed

4 damage mitigation only affects damage to shields, which- really... doesn't matter much once you have a decent redirection. Iron skin is now redundant and offers no practical benefits over increasing your shields by 3 mod-slots worth. Great.

 

R.I.P rhino, go sit in the corner with the other ineffective warframes like ember, whom is still useless short of her third ability.

Edited May 17, 2013 by AnalogAnomaly

[Veryk]

Unnacceptable! Toxics should be ignored.

[Abenoki]

Just throwing my 5 cents in after playing a Pluto defense with the Iron Skin change.

I have it maxed out, also using maxed streamline and continuity for extra goodiness, and I was using it a lot to save some reckless people in high level missions.

But as of now, that ability just doesn't worth using at all, the 80% reduction is practically nothing if you face just one lvl 70+ toxic ancient while trying to revive a downed teammate at higher waves of endless defense. Your health ticking down anyway, the friendly neighbouring Disruptor eats your energy, and you are left with 100 health and no energy to face the next wave which will be a zerg of lvl 80 ancients. And you are rocking in a corner hoping to get an energy drop somewhere away from those ancients. Some tank ey...

 

The nerf may not affect random groups as much, since they practically quit at wave 5-10 no matter what, but for those who were looking for some challenges in endless defense, this makes Rhino just not worth playing, since his damage is inferior to offensive frames. I could just play  an Ember and max out Overheat, that skill at least protects from energy drain, while giving 70% reduction (and also scales with focus, so in reality, 91%).

 

I think it would make sense to give back the energy drain protection, and have focus affect Iron Skin, because by the time you find and max out a Focus mod, you are pretty much in endgame, and sticking to one frame for that long deserves a sense of achievement I believe.

can confirm that now rhino now had no use in higher level content, he has poor dmg and now compared to ember and trinity he can no long perform the role in the same manner. High level mobs even with iron skin will kill you in moments soresing a team mate is out of the question, you are no longer immune to toxics and disruptors, you can be knocked back you just dont fall.

Rhino from the way i played him and how i understood his purpose was to be a reliable and impenetrable wall that in a pinch could save his team from inevitable doom....he can no longer do that...

[OxexRaclir]

Unnacceptable! Toxics should be ignored.

 

I'm sure they just want to sell us another super rare Anti-Venom mod or some other trash."Get one free with Handspring when you spend 149.99 USD in our cash shop!"

[JerryMouse13]

The nerf may not affect random groups as much, since they practically quit at wave 5-10 no matter what, but for those who were looking for some challenges in endless defense, this makes Rhino just not worth playing, since his damage is inferior to offensive frames. I could just play  an Ember and max out Overheat, that skill at least protects from energy drain, while giving 70% reduction (and also scales with focus, so in reality, 91%).

 

 

So what you're telling me is that not only Trinity, but also Ember now have better damage mitigation skills than Rhino?

[McCrabby]

well, now i regret picking up rhino.  it was fun, but now he's not really better than ember.  at least ember gets to burn infested, while rhino gets to be slow.