The Most Unrelated Reason Why People Don't Use Snipers.

[Ironlixivium]

First, Moderators: this is in the correct section, even though the title makes it seems otherwise. 

Sorry for the bold, just want to make sure this won't be moved due to a misunderstanding, this is in fact feedback about the maps.

 

Second: This is just my opinion, I'm not intending to speak for all that don't use snipers, this is just how I see it.

 

     I recently got my nova prime and daikyu, I'm loving them together, as AMD does insane amounts of damage from just a single shot, but recently, I'm been attempting to snipe with it. As I was running a cambria mission, I noticed that many of the areas that appear to be good sniping perches are blocked off by height limits and "teleport back to path" volumes. 

     This is very aggravating as currently every mission requires combat, and hiding solves nothing, so why can't we use these areas? Our movement should be restricted to the extent of being unable to fly to space, but why are there invisible walls keeping me from climbing on top of tall roots?

       One of the biggest offenders of overuse of restricting volumes is the Orokin Derelict Defense map. There are so many restricting volumes that the game feels broken. I understand that before, it was impossible to die on this map, since you could just camp on a ledge with your torid, but since then, infested have received an obnoxious ranged unit, auras of all kinds (iirc, those were added after the map was made, doesn't matter though, cause they still hurt you when you aren't on the path) and a fix to ancient's grappling hooks, so that they can grapple tenno no matter where they are (I can't tell you how many times I've been dragged through infested moa goo).

     Then there's zephyr....The frame you seem to have forgotten about. You recently "fixed" the ceiling of void defense and interception maps. But, instead of removing the height limit and making the ceiling be how it appears (it's just a flat ceiling, despite appearing arched) you added a "teleport to path" volume there. Now I can't use tail wind from the upper area of the map, cause I'll just teleport back down. Zephyr can also fly above the phobos maps, so it's VERY inconsistent. 

     Honestly, zephyr's turbulence augment helps a lot with bows as snipers, but since all the sniper perches are blocked off, It's not really fun. D:

     Please change this DE, I know there are other problems with snipers, but this is a big one, too (not just for snipers, but for other stuff as well). You've done a great job with making these maps beautiful, I just want them to function that way as well.

 

TL;DR: Maps have unnecessary restrictions that make many areas that appear as good sniper perches unreachable, making the role of support sniper difficult in some cases.

 

A few sidenotes:

 

The only place I think "teleport back to path" volumes should be used are places that you can't return from, like when you fall off the path in the grineer asteroid tileset. 

 

I don't think you should be able to explore as far as the eye can see, and would like restrictions on open sky maps, but the restrictions shouldn't stop me from going onto strategic ledges and areas.

 

the forcefield around the portal on void sabotage missions makes melee impossible.

 

"teleport back to path" volumes remove active abilities, meaning when they're used for quick patches to fix things like the void defense ceiling, you're also stealing 75 energy from curious zephyrs (or if you're like me, 18 energy if you accidently use tail wind on the upper portion, as I have a ton of duration).

Edited May 19, 2015 by Ironlixivium

[Yorinar]

Agreed.  I can kinda see why there are height limits on phobos in the canyons, for the purpose of keeping you in the map, but many of them feel more like they were added as a quick band-aid for holes to keep people from falling out of the map.  Hitting the invisible ceiling and teleporting as Zephyr is so insanely frustrating.  It's the Ikarus Effect. :P  Fly too close to the sun and poof.  Another example is the Pluto corpus dam map.  Being able to soar high on there would be so amazing because the map just begs for it.

[dummifighter]

I totally agree with you, while snipers should deal huge amounts of damage from a longer distance, there are really no maps that actually have that long range (maybe some orokin survival or the orokin defense maps). The same is with shotguns actually, the maps may not be long range, but they're not close range either, in the higher lvl's (with that I don't mean Pluto or Ceres, I mean looong runs of survival/defense/interception), the only weapons taking advantage of the map builds, are the rifles with medium range and the bows, since these can be fired on close-medium(-far?) range. But back on topic: They should absolutely add better sniping spots... 

+1

[Grander.Alderman]

The Zephyr problem with the teleporting ceilings has bees bugging me for a very long time... There are parts on the ice planet maps where the "ceiling" you can't even do a directional melee upwards without getting teleported...

[TrickBox]

Yeah ! Moar snippy maps !

[Lady_Khaos]

I absolutely agree with this. I love sniper rifles but most of the maps are not appropriate for them.

In regards to the title, I'd actual say that maps are a major reason people don't snipe. That and the excessive speed many players think is necessary.

Edited May 19, 2015 by Khaos_Zand3r

[Ironlixivium]

Agreed.  I can kinda see why there are height limits on phobos in the canyons, for the purpose of keeping you in the map, but many of them feel more like they were added as a quick band-aid for holes to keep people from falling out of the map.  Hitting the invisible ceiling and teleporting as Zephyr is so insanely frustrating.  It's the Ikarus Effect. :P  Fly too close to the sun and poof.  Another example is the Pluto corpus dam map.  Being able to soar high on there would be so amazing because the map just begs for it.

 

Actually, last time I checked (a while ago, but still) you can fly above the map on phobos, and even though I exited the light-importance area, I still have fun sniping with my lanka while I could do it mordecai-style (from borderlands 2)

 

I totally agree with you, while snipers should deal huge amounts of damage from a longer distance, there are really no maps that actually have that long range (maybe some orokin survival or the orokin defense maps). The same is with shotguns actually, the maps may not be long range, but they're not close range either, in the higher lvl's (with that I don't mean Pluto or Ceres, I mean looong runs of survival/defense/interception), the only weapons taking advantage of the map builds, are the rifles with medium range and the bows, since these can be fired on close-medium(-far?) range. But back on topic: They should absolutely add better sniping spots... 

+1

 

Yeah, I also would like if they could make all shotguns as accurate as the tigris. I've shot a still target from point blank with my mara detron and watched at least 5 pellets fly past, despite my crosshair being dead center on my target.

 

I absolutely agree with this. I love sniper rifles but most of the maps are not appropriate for them.

In regards to the title, I'd actual say that maps are a major reason people don't snipe. That and the excessive speed many players think is necessary.

 

     Of course, there are quite a few reasons why snipers aren't as viable as many other weapons, I just want to make sure this specific one isn't overlooked. Imo snipers should be like the dread and paris prime, while bows should be more like the daikyu, but that kind of change would enrage pretty much everyone with a potatoed bow, so I won't even ask for that, lol, just my opinion.

[H3RRD0KT0R]

I'd like to see not only tilesets sniper friendly, but also new mission types that could favour the sniper role, with a more slow/strategic pace of action, in the actual endless missions for example, there's almost no room for a sniper, you cant protect any objective from waves of enemies with a sniper rifle, neither you can get enough oxigen by killing single enemies.

 

If the stealth system is ever reworked, that's maybe something that could help the snipers, cause having alarmed enemies coming right at you, no matter where you hide (or how they got alarmed in first place) is certainly something that doesnt help.

[Ironlixivium]

I'd like to see not only tilesets sniper friendly, but also new mission types that could favour the sniper role, with a more slow/strategic pace of action, in the actual endless missions for example, there's almost no room for a sniper, you cant protect any objective from waves of enemies with a sniper rifle, neither you can get enough oxigen by killing single enemies.

 

If the stealth system is ever reworked, that's maybe something that could help the snipers, cause having alarmed enemies coming right at you, no matter where you hide (or how they got alarmed in first place) is certainly something that doesnt help.

 

     That would be great, but what kind of missions? o.0 The only missions I can think of that would be best with a sniper are kill everything and kill vip missions, but we already have those :/ so really the best thing would just be to make these missions have better sniping areas. I guess, what about a mission where you have to intercept a vip's transport...? so close to capture and we already have an interception mission....google's synonyms fail me again...

[DSpite]

I don't use snipers because there is no point in using one. I can stick two recoil reduction mods on a Soma and it basically paints a single dot at long distances because of zero recoil, or just use a Volt shield and a Synod Gammacor or a Flux Rifle.

 

Having a gun that has rare ammunition and when all the ammo drops from my kills end up 500 meters away seem rather pointless.

 

In Global Agenda, the sniper was energy based and energy came back on it's own, also, most enemies could mess with you regardless of where you perched because they just fired back quite well.

[Ironlixivium]

I don't use snipers because there is no point in using one. I can stick two recoil reduction mods on a Soma and it basically paints a single dot at long distances because of zero recoil, or just use a Volt shield and a Synod Gammacor or a Flux Rifle.

 

Having a gun that has rare ammunition and when all the ammo drops from my kills end up 500 meters away seem rather pointless.

 

In Global Agenda, the sniper was energy based and energy came back on it's own, also, most enemies could mess with you regardless of where you perched because they just fired back quite well.

 

Exactly. There's no place where sniper scopes and such long range rifles are actually useful. 

[Grom-84]

Dont forget about ammo clip and reloading. The game throws at you tonns of enemies waves so there is no time for "sniping", you need to shoot fast fast fast as much as possible.

Edited June 2, 2015 by Grom-84

[Ajreil]

I'm not a huge sniper user, and I don't play Zephyr outside of rushing void capture keys, but I do wholeheartedly agree with you. Those "teleport to path" barriers are extremely immersion breaking for me. We are space ninjas with extraordinary amounts of maneuverability, with even more coming in parkour 2.0. There are just so so many areas where an area that doesn't have any logic reason to be blocked off is hit by an out-of-bounds barrier. Walking underneath bridges is some corridor rooms in the corpus outpost tileset, for example.

 

When the underwater tileset was released with the Tubemen of Regor event, the best thing about it was the almost complete lack of out-of-bounds barriers. I was free to go almost anywhere I wanted, and it really felt liberating. The fact that this seemed to be a consideration for the new tileset is a good sign, because it suggests that the level design team is concerned about the problem. DE has mentioned more than once in recent Devstreams that old tilesets are going to be reworked, most notably to be consistent with the planet they are on (Phobos looks like Mars, and we are soon going to get actual images of Ceres, for example), and to work with the changes to parkour 2.0. Let's hope they make this a serious consideration when they create new tilesets and revamp the old ones.