Constructive Feedback On The New Bps For Former Credit Weapons

[Bleak_Advent]

It sounds to me like you don't like the crafting time? If that's the case then... well... you have greater issues than the change added in, because a ton of things are foundry only. If you're referring to the materials farming... then you didn't read my post at all, because that's exactly what I said the problem with the implementation of the new system is.

I did read your post. I was just emphasizing the point. I only have an issue with the farming time these BP changes impose on newer players and how it discourages the experimentation necessary for those newcomers to really get into Warframe.

[plznohurtme]

I did read your post. I was just emphasizing the point. I only have an issue with the farming time these BP changes impose on newer players and how it discourages the experimentation necessary for those newcomers to really get into Warframe.

yeah, definitely... they need to just lower the mats requirements and ease people into it... kinda best of both worlds, this current system just throws people into the deep end, rarely ends well sadly.

[Bleak_Advent]

yeah, definitely... they need to just lower the mats requirements and ease people into it... kinda best of both worlds, this current system just throws people into the deep end, rarely ends well sadly.

This is just one of those concerns for which a solution/compromise would be easy to achieve, but the community just has to make that concern known.

[ValhaHazred]

They need to implement a free firing range and/or a trial weapon renting system. Something like 500 creds an hour maybe? 

[Bleak_Advent]

They need to implement a free firing range and/or a trial weapon renting system. Something like 500 creds an hour maybe?

Rentals would definitely enhance the accessibility from just being able to get hands on with weapons and I can see it being a good potential addition to the game. I still think the inflated material cost for the entry tier of weapons needs to be decreased to a reasonable level, but I like the idea of a "shooting range" to give all weapons a go, but at some sort of cost to the player.

[Spellcasterz]

No,for the love of everything dont even give them the idea of rentals.

Thats one of the single worst mechanics f2p games introduced and more often than not opens the gatesway to hell.

 

Though I have to admit I like the idea of getting newcomers into the foundry system through the help of low-tier weapons the production coasts would have to be heavily modified for that.

As pretty much everyone agrees alloy simply shouldnt even come into play on that low level range.

[ValhaHazred]

I still think the inflated material cost for the entry tier of weapons needs to be decreased to a reasonable level

Absolutely. I think that goes without saying at this point :P

[holdenagincourt]

What if they were to add in a new resource? Something similar to alloy plate but weaker and cheaper, so  it would be used for low-end crafting rather than high end (e.g HEK). If you guys agree on the idea of a new resource I am sure I can come up with a well written essay and ideas about this resource.

 

That resource is supposed to be Ferrite...its description is "Alloy pellets used in Grineer manufacturing."

 

Similarly, Salvage is detailed as "High value metals collected from war salvage." Of course, we know Salvage is anything but high value, considering that about 35,000 of it has piled up in my inventory while I can never keep more than a few hundred of the comparatively nondescript Alloy Plate.

 

The point is, we don't really need new resources so much as better distribution of the resources we already have. I just bought the Snipetron blueprint (didn't bother with it before now since I have Paris and Latron) and it requires 450 Alloy Plate. The Snipetron is the entry level sniper rifle...I mean can't it use Ferrite instead of Alloy Plate? Why is this one tedious resource required in large amounts for so many things?

[Bleak_Advent]

That resource is supposed to be Ferrite...its description is "Alloy pellets used in Grineer manufacturing."

 

Similarly, Salvage is detailed as "High value metals collected from war salvage." Of course, we know Salvage is anything but high value, considering that about 35,000 of it has piled up in my inventory while I can never keep more than a few hundred of the comparatively nondescript Alloy Plate.

 

The point is, we don't really need new resources so much as better distribution of the resources we already have. I just bought the Snipetron blueprint (didn't bother with it before now since I have Paris and Latron) and it requires 450 Alloy Plate. The Snipetron is the entry level sniper rifle...I mean can't it use Ferrite instead of Alloy Plate? Why is this one tedious resource required in large amounts for so many things?

Ferrite or salvage would be much more reasonable, while maintaining realistic materials for what the blueprint produces.

[Bleak_Advent]

No,for the love of everything dont even give them the idea of rentals.

Thats one of the single worst mechanics f2p games introduced and more often than not opens the gatesway to hell.

 

Though I have to admit I like the idea of getting newcomers into the foundry system through the help of low-tier weapons the production coasts would have to be heavily modified for that.

As pretty much everyone agrees alloy simply shouldnt even come into play on that low level range.

I'm sure DE knows other games offer rentals, but please understand that rentals only remedy the ability to explore your options, not the cost to utilize your chosen options. The idea of rentals is still a valid opinion. If you disagree with a proposal, just present your own ideal solutions, instead of attempting to invalidate a potential solution.

[NalkorRN]

The movement towards the BP was a good/bad thing. Its great, because it feels like progress towards a new weapon. Its terrible, because everything costs an abnormal amount of Alloy Plates, which have one of the worst drop rates in the game, along with a relatively low drop count. Oh, and the time to actually use said weapons, since it takes 12 god damned hours to forge even a Burston.

 

A fix? Increase the amount on pickup, or increase drop rate. Either would work. And for lower tier weapons, they could reduce the production time to.. 2~4 hours? Would be acceptable.

I have the perfect idea for a fix: Revert the changes. Everything was perfectly fine before that. The credit-purchase weapons were good and a nice way to find a playstyle, the alloy plate requirements were well, standard. They never got above 300 for any weapon, yet here I'm seeing people speak of the Snipetron costing 450 Alloy Plates.

One reason I'm going to fall in love with Paris/Twin Vipers/Glaive (or Dual Ethers) is that those weapons have very easy crafting materials. Yeah some of them require a bit of Alloy Plates (Dual Ethers only) but the rest is just common stuff.

[Bleak_Advent]

I have the perfect idea for a fix: Revert the changes. Everything was perfectly fine before that. The credit-purchase weapons were good and a nice way to find a playstyle, the alloy plate requirements were well, standard. They never got above 300 for any weapon, yet here I'm seeing people speak of the Snipetron costing 450 Alloy Plates.One reason I'm going to fall in love with Paris/Twin Vipers/Glaive (or Dual Ethers) is that those weapons have very easy crafting materials. Yeah some of them require a bit of Alloy Plates (Dual Ethers only) but the rest is just common stuff.

Honestly, this would be the ideal solution. However, I'd still like to say that if DE is intent on keeping those weapons as BP/Plat only, they could make it less restrictive. Always good to keep a middle ground in play.

[Fleetwing]

I have the perfect idea for a fix: Revert the changes. Everything was perfectly fine before that. The credit-purchase weapons were good and a nice way to find a playstyle, the alloy plate requirements were well, standard. They never got above 300 for any weapon, yet here I'm seeing people speak of the Snipetron costing 450 Alloy Plates.

One reason I'm going to fall in love with Paris/Twin Vipers/Glaive (or Dual Ethers) is that those weapons have very easy crafting materials. Yeah some of them require a bit of Alloy Plates (Dual Ethers only) but the rest is just common stuff.

 

As a relatively new player, I'm going to have to agree.  The weapon prices were already daunting starting out--it seemed like it took forever just to get a new secondary wep. Despite this I still went for a founder pack and just recently bought a whole load of weapons and slots.  I'll also put forth the suggestion of charging less for guns and more for slots.  Let us make the difficult choice of spending a few bucks or letting one of our weapons go. Take us back to the old system and ramp up the plat price for weapon slots. 

Also, why do you need a blueprint to build a bo? It's a stick. 

[NalkorRN]

As a relatively new player, I'm going to have to agree.  The weapon prices were already daunting starting out--it seemed like it took forever just to get a new secondary wep. Despite this I still went for a founder pack and just recently bought a whole load of weapons and slots.  I'll also put forth the suggestion of charging less for guns and more for slots.  Let us make the difficult choice of spending a few bucks or letting one of our weapons go. Take us back to the old system and ramp up the plat price for weapon slots. 

Also, why do you need a blueprint to build a bo? It's a stick. 

Since you're a relatively new player, I'd recommend you go with the weapons I mentioned, as they use far more common crafting materials in much more reasonable amounts (Glaive requires 10 morphics though). Plus, I find they compliment each other nicely.

[Bleak_Advent]

As a relatively new player, I'm going to have to agree.  The weapon prices were already daunting starting out--it seemed like it took forever just to get a new secondary wep. Despite this I still went for a founder pack and just recently bought a whole load of weapons and slots.  I'll also put forth the suggestion of charging less for guns and more for slots.  Let us make the difficult choice of spending a few bucks or letting one of our weapons go. Take us back to the old system and ramp up the plat price for weapon slots. 

Also, why do you need a blueprint to build a bo? It's a stick. 

Well, it is a stick made of metal.

[Pieguy]

Im glad I got most of the weapons I wanted that were for credits before this patch.  Using up my alloy plate hoard would have been devastating.

[0shi]

I just wanted to add my agreement here.

The change massively punishes new players and blocks any choice of their playstyle. The first thing I spent credits on was Burston because of my preference for burstfire rifles, if I was starting playing now, I'd be stuck with a Braton for god knows how long, with the only end in sight being a slightly different Braton. It's also worth mentioning that the materials required are not displayed in the market, so new players won't even be able to guesstimate how hard these things are to make before they purchase the patterns.

 

Speaking of the patterns, there is enough grinding in the end game, why push new players into it as well? And why make them grind THOSE materials, with alloy plate being ridiculous to obtain for low level players and there being multiple other under-used resource types. The games doesn't need a new resource, it just needs to balance out the use of all resources over various patterns.

 

Setting it up this way sends a very clear message to new players that they need to pay money to skip massive grinds, or pick another game. I also imagine they've annoyed a bunch of the players making use of the reset function who now find they're much less able to move on from their starting items.

Edited May 19, 2013 by 0shi

[sylothix]

Plastids I think is a pretty unused resource and could be used in more recipes. 

[sewens]

I dont have any gripes with the BP's but its strange that you cant just get alloy from all grineer missions since the desription says its a grineer armor material in the first place.

[ValhaHazred]

More Alloy drops! I'm not even sure why guns should need it. It seems like something that should only be used in Frame crafting.

[Emotitron]

Slower acquisition is just fine (and sort of needed if they intend to keep the quantity of items in the store low). The only issue I have is that Alloy Plate restricts the farming to a limited number of grinds. In a game already very light on content - that is not a good plan.

Building stuff should set players off on scavenger hunts rather than commit them to grinding the same maps over and over.

It also may backfire a little, as the main thing smart players save their platinum for is potatoes and inventory slots. By slowing acquisition of new items they may see a decline in cash purchases as a result.

[Bleak_Advent]

Slower acquisition is just fine (and sort of needed if they intend to keep the quantity of items in the store low). The only issue I have is that Alloy Plate restricts the farming to a limited number of grinds. In a game already very light on content - that is not a good plan.

Building stuff should set players off on scavenger hunts rather than commit them to grinding the same maps over and over.

It also may backfire a little, as the main thing smart players save their platinum for is potatoes and inventory slots. By slowing acquisition of new items they may see a decline in cash purchases as a result.

Slower acquisition on a broader scale, yes. Slower acquisition for weapons key to play style exploration for newer players, we have a bit of an issue. Appropriately tiering which weapons are more accessible and which are not so easily acquired would achieve a much needed middle ground.

[Emotitron]

Slower acquisition on a broader scale, yes. Slower acquisition for weapons key to play style exploration for newer players, we have a bit of an issue. Appropriately tiering which weapons are more accessible and which are not so easily acquired would achieve a much needed middle ground.

 

Yup, that is actually my real recommendation for how weapon crafting should work. There should be two tiers (possibly more even over time) for every weapon. The second tier would use the first tier version as part of its recipe. Much like how the lato can be used to make a bolto, and then two boltos are required to make AKBoltos.

The first tier version would be relatively easy to get.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Emotitron

[BlueEden]

I wouldn't mind seeing a weapon training area in a clan's dojo where clan mates could lend weapons to other players to test out. Much like going to the shooting range and lending your buddy your M1911A1 and explaining how to use it before they decide to go buy one.

I think DE should decide on the weapon tiers and put everything in those categories so it makes sense to players. Tier 0 are weapons that you buy with cash and are play style weapons to experiment with to decide what you want to upgrade to. Tier 1 would be weapons requiring morphics and common materials, but are more powerful than basic gear (Cronos over Skana), then you can progressively upgrade your weapons to XP locked gear that requires annoying amounts of alloy plate.

Having more weapons that you upgrade like Lato to Bolto would be really cool. Like why didn't the Braton get converted into a Boltor?

[0shi]

I wouldn't mind seeing a weapon training area in a clan's dojo where clan mates could lend weapons to other players to test out. Much like going to the shooting range and lending your buddy your M1911A1 and explaining how to use it before they decide to go buy one.

I think DE should decide on the weapon tiers and put everything in those categories so it makes sense to players. Tier 0 are weapons that you buy with cash and are play style weapons to experiment with to decide what you want to upgrade to. Tier 1 would be weapons requiring morphics and common materials, but are more powerful than basic gear (Cronos over Skana), then you can progressively upgrade your weapons to XP locked gear that requires annoying amounts of alloy plate.

Having more weapons that you upgrade like Lato to Bolto would be really cool. Like why didn't the Braton get converted into a Boltor?

 

I reallly don't like tiering of power in free to play games, it just makes new players feel like they need to spend money or large amounts of time playing to get anything "worth having." Ideally the tiers would represent more specific playstyles or trickier to use weapons, e.g. the Strun is available to give players a taste of shotguns, then people would have a good idea whether they wanted a Bronco for a pistol slot shotgun, a Hek for a more long ranged / focused shotgun or a Boar for an automatic shotgun.

I also don't like using weapons as materials to make unrelated weapons, as it's impossible to go back if it turns out you actually preferred your Lato to your Bolto. When they're being straight upgraded, that's not an issue (other than my points above about tiered power in F2P), but if the playstyle and strengths of the weapons are being transformed massively, it can be a problem.