Has Anyone Even Seen The Glaive Prime?

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

I meant to write this post earlier. But here it is

 

To start off, Im not the overconfident loser that most people think I am. I do call out on people, but I respect those who are of higher skill than me. I know my place and my skill level in the game.

 

To be fair there are three things that can beat me in this game, and alot of people can relate.

 

1) Someone of equal or higher skill (which is normal)

 

2) Power Spamers

 

The third one, which I have been seeing alot recently is the glaive combo. If you dont know exactly what the Glaive combo is like, think of the Plasma Pistol combo in halo. A easily charged, easy to hit plasma bolt hits the player removing his sheilds. In this case the glaive prime seemed to have hit all of my Sheilds and a chunk of health in 1 hit, and the thing hit my sides.

 

I would always lose to this, and by an overwhelming amount, so to investigate, I decided to playtest it with a friend. I used a frost. Only to find out that the glaive shot took out over 150 sheilds and roughly 15 health. Followed up by a latron shot, it would pretty much drop me dead.

 

Considering the buffs and nerfs that DE is implementing, it seems that they are striving for high ttk kills. The Glaive + weapon combo currently has the lowest time to kill in the game, from observation, with the charge time and shot following, almost as fast to perform as the Daikyu, but without much pre meditation and skill.

 

I think that this needs to be looked at, it decimates others players, and it seems that players who used this got better overnight? I think not..

 

I feel that the glaive should have more consequence, for it to do such damage. Example, the glaive bears not consequence upon missing  as you can litterally shoot the second you fire your glaive. Perhaps having a delay of fire between throws, or even to decrease the hitbox would be great. I tried it for a couple of games and especially in CQC situations I found myself hitting my targets very often.

Edited June 5, 2015 by Eureka.seveN

[Rukkhadevata.]

honestly when the new glaive comes or astral comes back we might see people use glaive p

[FelisImpurrator]

Glaive/Prime/Kestrel aren't even that fast. Seriously. They're pretty easy to dodge - a lot more than bullets - and have windup time.

 

"Easy and fast" and "Daikyu" don't sound like things that should ever be in the same sentence, either.

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

Glaive/Prime/Kestrel aren't even that fast. Seriously. They're pretty easy to dodge - a lot more than bullets - and have windup time.

 

"Easy and fast" and "Daikyu" don't sound like things that should ever be in the same sentence, either.

I did not mention those weapons, I said the glaive prime, which has the fastest Throwing weapon traveltime in the game. The windup time is fast, and it is very hard to avoid in CQC. And my mistake about the "easy" comment editing...

Edited June 5, 2015 by Eureka.seveN

[FelisImpurrator]

I took the Glaive Prime out once. Felt... not THAT much faster than the Kestrel I was running for knockdown.

(As for CQC, I am not sure I've ever seen anyone using glaives at actual melee range.)

Daikyu is still supposed to be incredibly slow though, isn't it? Full charge only, longer draw time than, say, Paris Prime...

[Thalahssalyst]

I meant to write this post earlier. But here it is

 

To start off, Im not the overconfident loser that most people think I am. I do call out on people, but I respect those who are of higher skill than me. I know my place and my skill level in the game.

 

To be fair there are three things that can beat me in this game, and alot of people can relate.

 

1) Someone of equal or higher skill (which is normal)

 

2) Power Spamers

 

The third one, which I have been seeing alot recently is the glaive combo. If you dont know exactly what the Glaive combo is like, think of the Plasma Pistol combo in halo. A easily charged, easy to hit plasma bolt hits the player removing his sheilds. In this case the glaive prime seemed to have hit all of my Sheilds and a chunk of health in 1 hit, and the thing hit my sides.

 

I would always lose to this, and by an overwhelming amount, so to investigate, I decided to playtest it with a friend. I used a frost. Only to find out that the glaive shot took out over 150 sheilds and roughly 15 health. Followed up by a latron shot, it would pretty much drop me dead.

 

Considering the buffs and nerfs that DE is implementing, it seems that they are striving for high ttk kills. The Glaive + weapon combo currently has the lowest time to kill in the game, from observation, with the charge time and shot following, almost as fast to perform as the Daikyu, but without much pre meditation and skill.

 

I think that this needs to be looked at, it decimates others players, and it seems that players who used this got better overnight? I think not..

 

I feel that the glaive should have more consequence, for it to do such damage. Example, the glaive bears not consequence upon missing  as you can litterally shoot the second you fire your glaive. Perhaps having a delay of fire between throws, or even to decrease the hitbox would be great. I tried it for a couple of games and especially in CQC situations I found myself hitting my targets very often.

Actually the Glaive / P is one of the "skillfull" melee to use, you have to aim the player, and try to hit at high speed movement, so when is it.

Seriously just Dodge more, If u miss with the glaive in mid of animation you are taking damage, and if you miss, you are already dead.

That combo you mean, is not easy to, its one melee what need accuracy, what need a "skill" way to use, no just copter. I see the damage pretty Fair.

[R3DBelmont456]

glaive prime is incapable of one shotting and it's a projectile weapon with no auto aim... it doesn't need a nerf, if anything more people should use it because all you see people do is pressing E with dual swords in conclave, and I just laugh at their ridiculousness... landing that glaive prime kill on a target running away would make me incredibly hard... Thing is, you are always gonna see OP combos in PvP, it's what seperates the good players from the monsters... just about nothing one shots in PvP anymore minus a few ultimates and 1 skills, they nerfed the strun wraith to the floor, they made all conclave mods heavy side grades instead of upgrades and you can pretty much no longer use any PvE mod minus silencers... you should be happy now that you can be a pro with pro weps...

Edited June 5, 2015 by R3DBelmont456

[Nighttide77]

-snip-

 

Have you tried using the Glaive Prime in PvP, yet?  Throwing it roots you in place for a moment, making you a sitting duck.  It does have travel time and you have to aim it at least a little.  It's 50-50 as to whether it will aim-assist, and during the time it's in the air, you cannot block, copter or aerial melee.  There's only a chance it'll bounce and hit other targets, too.

 

If a person hits with it and follows up with a Latron, they must actually be pretty good because they'd have either had to shoot a couple body shots, or one good headshot...on a target that's probably still moving.  If they use Lex...not sure if it's one or two body shots.

 

So a player not only has to risk being immobile for a moment, but they have to hit a moving target with Glaive Prime, and then follow up with shooting.  If that's not risk-reward and skill, I'm not sure what is.

 

---edit---

 

Reread your last paragraph...soz...looks like you've been using it.

 

If you manage to survive for a moment throwing the Glaive P and in CQC, it sounds like your opponents weren't on top of shooting you...

 

I've fought against a person using a Glaive P throw + Lex, and...I took them out quite a bit.  It is a powerful combo, but it did make them vulnerable, which I was able to take advantage of.

Edited June 5, 2015 by Nighttide77

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

If u miss with the glaive in mid of animation you are taking damage, and if you miss, you are already dead.

That combo you mean, is not easy to, its one melee what need accuracy, what need a "skill" way to use, no just copter. I see the damage pretty Fair.

False, the animation to throw the glaive is less than a second and the player can shoot almost instantly after the E press.

The combo is easy, it was much easier to get kills than the my standard Mk1-Paris/Braton only games. After getting the hit with the glaive getting the follow up shot was very easy, as i can shoot my target as my glaive is midair.

 

glaive prime is incapable of one shotting and it's a projectile weapon with no auto aim... it doesn't need a nerf, if anything more people should use it because all you see people do is pressing E with dual swords in conclave, and I just laugh at their ridiculousness... landing that glaive prime kill on a target running away would make me incredibly hard... Thing is, you are always gonna see OP combos in PvP, it's what seperates the good players from the monsters... just about nothing one shots in PvP anymore minus a few ultimates and 1 skills, they nerfed the strun wraith to the floor, they made all conclave mods heavy side grades instead of upgrades and you can pretty much no longer use any PvE mod minus silencers... you should be happy now that you can be a pro with pro weps...

I would understand if the combo had consequence. If it did i would completely agree with you. The fact of the matter is that, this combo does not have much consequence, as i mentioned earlier, even if you miss your glaive you can still shoot, recovery time is really quick and you can still get kills easily even if you miss the glaive. It is much more forgiving than the daikyu ever was.

 

You are correct op combos separate good players from bad ones. But that is only applicable in the case that each player has the same load out, with the same and equal opportunities ad their adversaries. Being able to generate combos based on the gear that is universal to all players can separate good from bad players. But in a loadout based game like this, that is not the case.

 

Have you tried using the Glaive Prime in PvP, yet?  Throwing it roots you in place for a moment, making you a sitting duck.  It does have travel time and you have to aim it at least a little.  It's 50-50 as to whether it will aim-assist, and during the time it's in the air, you cannot block, copter or aerial melee.  There's only a chance it'll bounce and hit other targets, too.

 

If a person hits with it and follows up with a Latron, they must actually be pretty good because they'd have either had to shoot a couple body shots, or one good headshot...on a target that's probably still moving.  If they use Lex...not sure if it's one or two body shots.

 

So a player not only has to risk being immobile for a moment, but they have to hit a moving target with Glaive Prime, and then follow up with shooting.  If that's not risk-reward and skill, I'm not sure what is.

Yes I have, if I was not I would not have made this post.

 

First of all, you can still move as you are throwing the glaive prime. The glaive prime as a very fast travel time, which makes it much easier to hit targets. It may not be a sniper, but in most cases a.k.a CQC battles, its more than enough.

 

The glaive has a very linear hitbox meaing that the margin of error is much less, think of it as shooting a line gun/vertical plasma cutter versus a seeker rifle in dead space 2. In an instance where you have to hit a target with very little time to pre meditate, you would probably have a much better chance of hitting your target with a line gun as opposed to the seeker rifle.

 

Blocking is not a efficent means of anything, air melee does not matter since you can wall run and bounce off of walls and roll (which are more vital than what you mentioned)

 

With the latron comment, as i said before, you can shoot almost instantly after you shoot your glaive out.  Making those headshots much easier to perform and much less forgiving if the glaive misses.

 

Risk and reward is not the glaive combo. Personally its much more forgiving than most people think, once you familiarize with the travel time, which is very simple it is very easy to use and not risky at all. On the contrary its the safest melee to use as you can throw is from a distance, something you cannot do with any other melee type.

[Thalahssalyst]

 

 is very simple it is very easy to use and not risky at all

 

I dont know what to say about it anymore.

Is one of the most "skill" melee weapon actually in pvp... I think you are looking for what you have say on match, melees need to be just for copter.

We are in the wrong way.

Glaive/p is high risk and not guaranted reward.

 

[Nighttide77]

-snip-

 

So...  >_> ...  The throw animation causes a player to stand in place for a moment.  You can move while winding up, but once you throw, you're standing still for a moment.

 

Landing a glaive throw is pretty hard even in close quarters.  I'd say that it aim-assists maybe once every 5 throws.

 

The speed is very dodge-able.  You can ask R3d.  I was just in a match with them throwing the glaive every chance I got.

 

Not being able to aerial melee and copter while the glaive is in flight really gimps a player's movement, too.  It can mean the difference of life and death.  Players wall-run about the same speed as they walk, not sprint.  Rolling only makes a player a slightly smaller target, but doesn't make them move any faster.

 

Blocking is a very efficient means of surviving, especially when cornered by two different foes whose combined DPS means you can't win.

 

If you've got a video showing how powerful you are with the Glaive Prime throwing tactic, I'd be happy to view it.  Maybe it would show me where I'm going wrong.

[R3DBelmont456]

atm the daikyu combo is still the superior combo in Conclave, I've just been utterly wrecked several matches in a row by several daikyu to copter or daikyu to lex prime players (and kudos to those guys for actually giving me a challenge for once, lol...),and as the poster above said, you're trading a possible finisher ranged melee  which has more disadvantages than advantages for mobility... and in Conclave, you know how important mobility is.  

[Kontrollo]

I don't really want to go into this discussion, as damage numbers can always be tweaked if they're too high. And I haven't perceived any of the throwable melees as a problem so far. I've used the Glaive Prime extensively, but mainly for its mobility.

 

I just want to say something about the drawbacks. All throwable melee have 3 of them, and they're significant:

• The throw animation takes time in which you could've shot your opponent.
  
• The travel time is significant, which makes the projectile evadable. Especially on Glaive and Kestrel.
  
• You lose your melee and with that your mobility while it's in-flight or bouncing around.

Personally, I don't throw my Glaive Prime most of the time unless I'm sure my enemy is trying to chase me around a corner.

[Skaleek]

Nah glaive P is ridiculous right now, youre not crazy at all. Anyone arguing otherwise havent used it much in pvp. It decimates, it does 100 shields and 45 hp in a hit on excal.

[R3DBelmont456]

most of the time it only hits if the person is standing still right in front of you, it's the same argument with slash dash and rhino charge... they're strong enough to instakill or take out insane chunk of HP, but they're very easy to miss unless the person is in hugging range or standing still OR if you predict where they're going, that does not make it OP especially with all the downsides...

[Zeally]

I've seen the OP's friend use the Glaive P, and its not weak at all. In fact, I loathe being the in match with the fellow when I see that we're in the same lobby, because I know its going to be one hell of a ride.

 

In all honesty, I think some of the overhead in the throw should be reduced and given back to the normal melee strikes, to balance it out.

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

•  
• The throw animation takes time in which you could've shot your opponent.

   

   

•  
• The travel time is significant, which makes the projectile evadable. Especially on Glaive and Kestrel.

   

   

•  
• You lose your melee and with that your mobility while it's in-flight or bouncing around.
•  

 

 

The Throw animation is less than a second including the action of holding the E key. Its like throwing a throwing knife in blackops.

 

Yes, for throwing weapons the projectile speed is potent. But we are talking about the glaive prime in this discussion, as it has a very fast travel time.

 

Once again as i addressed this before, you can still wall run and fly off of walls, which is almost just as viable as coptering.

 

So...  >_> ...  The throw animation causes a player to stand in place for a moment.  You can move while winding up, but once you throw, you're standing still for a moment.

 

Landing a glaive throw is pretty hard even in close quarters.  I'd say that it aim-assists maybe once every 5 throws.

 

The speed is very dodge-able.  You can ask R3d.  I was just in a match with them throwing the glaive every chance I got.

 

Not being able to aerial melee and copter while the glaive is in flight really gimps a player's movement, too.  It can mean the difference of life and death.  Players wall-run about the same speed as they walk, not sprint.  Rolling only makes a player a slightly smaller target, but doesn't make them move any faster.

 

Blocking is a very efficient means of surviving, especially when cornered by two different foes whose combined DPS means you can't win.

 

If you've got a video showing how powerful you are with the Glaive Prime throwing tactic, I'd be happy to view it.  Maybe it would show me where I'm going wrong.

Dodge-able, i disagree, especially with the movement nerf of conclave 2.0. Jumping, rolling do not avoid glaive throws that efficiently. You can run away which helps 60% of the time but that means that the only viable method of avoiding a glaive shot is to run away. And that does not make sense especially for only a melee weapon.

 

And I actually did make a video.

 

Here were the prerequisites

I used an mk1-braton as it has a decent TTK, this is to represent how much the glaive prime can take out leaving little for my primary to finish off. If you watch the video and see how much damage the glaive prime takes of, you can follow with any latron shot and you can easily kill the enemy. Delivering that insanely low TTK i was talking about before.

 

I never used the glaive prime outside of play testing. So the footage you are seeing is from my very first time using the weapon. recorded at around 1AM. I have 0 experience with this weapon and was able to produce good game results.

 

I was hitting both running targets and stand stil targets. But lets be honest here, most 2.0 conclavers act like sentry turrets.

 

 

The Result:

 

I played just as good if not better than as if i was using my mk1-paris (my most proficient weapon)

: 

Edited June 5, 2015 by Eureka.seveN

[Kontrollo]

The Throw animation is less than a second including the action of holding the E key. Its like throwing a throwing knife in blackops.

 

With 25 energy and a Boltor, I kill people in less than a second as well. And there's no need to make a target of myself and use a projectile that is slower than the bolts. And no, 25 energy and a Glaive Prime is not the better combination.

 

And if I don't have the 25 energy, I still feel safer coptering around and shooting. But that's probably just me, I usually don't like being immobile.

 

By the way, I stopped watching the video at "Everyone thought I was on drugs". Way to go overboard there, lol.

[Nighttide77]

-snip-

 

 

Lul, I still think you're on drugs.  But only for reasons of drugs, heh.

 

I'll have to watch your video a little more and mimic your style to see if I can produce the same effects.  You've definitely got good aim, but the TTK doesn't seem that bad.  Most of the opponents in the video kept mindlessly running at you even after they lost all their shields in one shot...which is kinda weird on their part.

[Thalahssalyst]

The Throw animation is less than a second including the action of holding the E key. Its like throwing a throwing knife in blackops.

 

Yes, for throwing weapons the projectile speed is potent. But we are talking about the glaive prime in this discussion, as it has a very fast travel time.

 

Once again as i addressed this before, you can still wall run and fly off of walls, which is almost just as viable as coptering.

 

Dodge-able, i disagree, especially with the movement nerf of conclave 2.0. Jumping, rolling do not avoid glaive throws that efficiently. You can run away which helps 60% of the time but that means that the only viable method of avoiding a glaive shot is to run away. And that does not make sense especially for only a melee weapon.

 

And I actually did make a video.

 

Here were the prerequisites

I used an mk1-braton as it has a decent TTK, this is to represent how much the glaive prime can take out leaving little for my primary to finish off. If you watch the video and see how much damage the glaive prime takes of, you can follow with any latron shot and you can easily kill the enemy. Delivering that insanely low TTK i was talking about before.

 

I never used the glaive prime outside of play testing. So the footage you are seeing is from my very first time using the weapon. recorded at around 1AM. I have 0 experience with this weapon and was able to produce good game results.

 

I was hitting both running targets and stand stil targets. But lets be honest here, most 2.0 conclavers act like sentry turrets.

 

 

The Result:

 

I played just as good if not better than as if i was using my mk1-paris (my most proficient weapon)

: 

That is the skill required to use the Glaive, you have nice aim to use the glaive, your problem dont come from the damage that glaive does, yor problem come from skilled people who know how to use the Glaive i think.

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

 

By the way, I stopped watching the video at "Everyone thought I was on drugs". Way to go overboard there, lol.

Sometimes it feels that way here lmao

[R3DBelmont456]

The Throw animation is less than a second including the action of holding the E key. Its like throwing a throwing knife in blackops.

 

Yes, for throwing weapons the projectile speed is potent. But we are talking about the glaive prime in this discussion, as it has a very fast travel time.

 

Once again as i addressed this before, you can still wall run and fly off of walls, which is almost just as viable as coptering.

 

Dodge-able, i disagree, especially with the movement nerf of conclave 2.0. Jumping, rolling do not avoid glaive throws that efficiently. You can run away which helps 60% of the time but that means that the only viable method of avoiding a glaive shot is to run away. And that does not make sense especially for only a melee weapon.

 

And I actually did make a video.

 

Here were the prerequisites

I used an mk1-braton as it has a decent TTK, this is to represent how much the glaive prime can take out leaving little for my primary to finish off. If you watch the video and see how much damage the glaive prime takes of, you can follow with any latron shot and you can easily kill the enemy. Delivering that insanely low TTK i was talking about before.

 

I never used the glaive prime outside of play testing. So the footage you are seeing is from my very first time using the weapon. recorded at around 1AM. I have 0 experience with this weapon and was able to produce good game results.

 

I was hitting both running targets and stand stil targets. But lets be honest here, most 2.0 conclavers act like sentry turrets.

 

 

The Result:

 

I played just as good if not better than as if i was using my mk1-paris (my most proficient weapon)

: 

 

every single one of the people you hit with that were doing the EXACT same thing I just posted for the glaive prime to hit, they were really close, practically standing still and it would only one shot them if they were weak in HP... it's not OP, it requires skill to use, try that same exact strategy against a pro player and they will wipe the floor with you... I hardly saw any of these players coptering away or even trying to properly maneuver, they were just playing the game like a TPS, so please try testing on skilled players before you make a final conclusion.

 

Your video only proves that the glaive prime is a noobstomper, well so is the kogake, so is the daikyu, so is the MK-1 braton, so is the lex prime, so is the strun wraith (even with the overnerf) so is most skill shots in conclave, hell even mashing E with a blade weapon will rape noobs... Should those weapons be nerfed too? (even more than they already have, lol)...

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

every single one of the people you hit with that were doing the EXACT same thing I just posted for the glaive prime to hit, they were really close, practically standing still and it would only one shot them if they were weak in HP... it's not OP, it requires skill to use, try that same exact strategy against a pro player and they will wipe the floor with you... I hardly saw any of these players coptering away or even trying to properly maneuver, they were just playing the game like a TPS, so please try testing on skilled players before you make a final conclusion.

 

Your video only proves that the glaive prime is a noobstomper, well so is the kogake, so is the daikyu, so is the MK-1 braton, so is the lex prime, so is the strun wraith (even with the overnerf) so is most skill shots in conclave, hell even mashing E with a blade weapon will rape noobs... Should those weapons be nerfed too? (even more than they already have, lol)...

Most of the players in these games had good K/Ds. A lot of the players i played with in this lobby win games and get high amounts of kills. If you want, search up the players that I killed, you will see that most of them are above average players.

 

Also the smallest demographic of players can actually perform those maneuvers, and with the movement nerf these movements aren't even that glorious. You also have to consider the integration of the new movement system, which from what I have seen on devstreams there will be less flinging around the map and a hit to coptering. We will all probably end up being very grounded in the future. Giving the glaive an edge.

Edited June 5, 2015 by Eureka.seveN

[R3DBelmont456]

At this point that's just pure speculation, for all you know the new parkour system may just make the glaive worse and any other melee weapon a better option, for now it's best to wait and see before jumping the gun...

[Kontrollo]

By the way, I just fought a guy who was using only the Glaive Prime in two rounds of Annihilation. It was an interesting match, because he could block a lot of shots before going in for the kill.

 

So yeah, it wasn't like he was doing a combo with a gun, but I thought I'd share it here, anyway.

 

However, it showcased pretty much what I said above: Both of us were using Volt Prime, he with his Glaive and I used mostly my Boltor Prime. He did surprisingly well both rounds, but I could ultimately beat him twice. I think he'd have been better off with a Bow with how good his aim was, but that's  simply speculation.

 

Does the Glaive Prime need its numbers tweaked? Still not sure about that, it didn't feel overpowering.