Sniper Rifles Re-Work

[H3dsh0t]

Great topic!

1) no opinion on crosshair

2) Agree about the headshot multiplier, i wish that extended for all weapons.  

      (purely for example don't bother modifying)

      5x headshot with Sniper

      4x headshot with Latron/Bow

      3x headshot for semi auto

      2x headshot for fully auto 

3) Yes on innate punch through

4) Yes on piercing Nullfier bubbles.  Makes snipers unique, no need decrease the damage.

5) Dont shoot me, I too think it should be a mod.  Balance the slot by letting it scale with damage mods.

6) Stagger could hurt the follow up shot, how about a headshot blinds the enemy for 3 seconds or procs confusion.

 

Glad to see this discussion starting.

 

If the stagger was the unit not really changing height level much, but staggering back a couple of paces as the round hits his helmet/head, that could be a decent compromise between the two without making a mess of the follow up shot, it also gives snipers a role at higher levels if need be, staggering dangerous units like bombards with accurate fire. I like the idea of different headshot multipliers depending on the type of weapon, gives each class a role to play.

Edited July 11, 2015 by H3dsh0t

[Str1keFreed0m]

6) Headshots should cause stagger. [suggested: Blind, Confused]

 

I don't see the point why the hell do people confused after being shot in the head, I'll take Blind :v

 

The rest of your idea are excellent I can say :)))

Edited July 11, 2015 by Str1keFreed0m

[LuforesGildas]

How about reduced damage to bodies? In a way such as to promote the no crosshair idea and have players stay in the rear to make more precise shots instead of just killing enemies with one bullet regardless of what body part they've been hit. Cause it's the same as shooting an enemy in the leg and seeing their hp go from 100% to 0% which doesn't make sense at all. In that case, players would be prompted to make more headshots no matter how hard it is and value their ammo consumption more instead of just mindlessly shooting without even zooming. 

 

It's just a suggestion since everyone's been suggesting to change weapon statistics so far and I know ^this one would be harder since the devs would have to scale/balance every enemy type out there. 

[(PSN)Q-T-R-1-0]

Here's my ideas for sniper rifles re-work.

1) Standart on-screen crosshair on all sniper rifles should be removed to discourage no-scoping. [Controversial]

2) Damage of sniper rifles should stay the same, but headsot damage for them should be increased.

3) All sniper rifles should have innate punch through.

4) All sniper rifles should have innate ability to penetrate nullifier, and Arctic Eximus bubbles (maybe with decreased damage?)

5) Headshot kills should cause all enemies in a small area around the killed enemy to panic and search for cover. [Can be a mod]

6) Headshots should cause stagger. [suggested: Blind, Confused]

ideas/suggestions/critique?

But i like to no scope 360 fakie swap-to-swap ladder stall cross map headshot collateral. ..

I agree with everything else

Edited July 11, 2015 by (PS4)Q-T-R-1-0

[Psychosist]

 

How about reduced damage to bodies? In a way such as to promote the no crosshair idea and have players stay in the rear to make more precise shots instead of just killing enemies with one bullet regardless of what body part they've been hit. Cause it's the same as shooting an enemy in the leg and seeing their hp go from 100% to 0% which doesn't make sense at all. In that case, players would be prompted to make more headshots no matter how hard it is and value their ammo consumption more instead of just mindlessly shooting without even zooming. 

 

It's just a suggestion since everyone's been suggesting to change weapon statistics so far and I know ^this one would be harder since the devs would have to scale/balance every enemy type out there. 

 

You have to consider console players having a more difficult time landing headshots. This would be a nerf for them.

[BlazeJefferson]

Okay, i will try to explain, why its pointless.

All this topics exists only because players wanna change something in game.

To change something, you need to be heard. You can't be heard if instead team-up with other players. You will work on your own ego.

 

You are being more critical than constructive in your attitude. Your idea of teaming up is good however, in the way that you are going about talking about it, you are not being a demonstration of teaming up. You are being a demonstration of do things the way that I want. Since this current topic is gaining some momentum and has more discussion, how about bring the ideas or conclusions from your topic over to this one so that the information is shared? May as well consolidate fuel around the biggest fire. (If you want to discuss this further with me, message me so we don't derail the topic of sniper rifles)

[Tcorn]

Idea: Remove all guns from the game and we all throw rocks at the enemies!

[Fait]

I love the idea, especially the disgusting crosshairs we have since it's so hard to see what the hell you are doing with that very bolded dot.

[Boosted.Oreo]

Here's my ideas for sniper rifles re-work.

 

1) Standart on-screen crosshair on all sniper rifles should be removed to discourage no-scoping. [Controversial]

2) Damage of sniper rifles should stay the same, but headsot damage for them should be increased.

3) All sniper rifles should have innate punch through.

4) All sniper rifles should have innate ability to penetrate nullifier, and Arctic Eximus bubbles (maybe with decreased damage?)

5) Headshot kills should cause all enemies in a small area around the killed enemy to panic and search for cover. [Can be a mod]

6) Headshots should cause stagger. [suggested: Blind, Confused]

 

ideas/suggestions/critique?

1) neutral, i don't mind it being there or not, a skilled player can pretty much tell where the shot will land since technically unless they add someway where the bullet travel randomly it should travel straight

2) headshot multi should be increased, but on any high caliber weapon, sniper rifles and opticor for example

3) yes please.

4) that would be nice, or make them hp based that won't number of shots but will count torward damage, eg if i do 2k damage to a bubble with my sniper it should deplete it if another gun can do the same damage and take out the bubble, but if it will punch through the bubbles it should have decreased damage since logic wise some of the bullet damage went for the bubble, i would maybe suggest - my bullet crit for 20k damage but the bubble have 5k hp, the damage you did to the target would be decreased by 5k so it get hits by 15k

5) no opinion

6) yes please.

Edited July 11, 2015 by Shinzo.K

[Rimuru]

Maybe sniper rifles maybe they should have like the punch through like that shred mod and have some kind of bonus that comes with it?

[Sir_Cripple]

Here's my ideas for sniper rifles re-work.

 

1) Standart on-screen crosshair on all sniper rifles should be removed to discourage no-scoping. [Controversial]

 

maybe just have reduced weapon damage if not zoomed in

Edited July 11, 2015 by Sir_Cripple

[CephalonShy]

maybe just have reduced weapon damage if not zoomed in

 

Or lowered accuracy, or maybe no headshots unless zoomed it *shrug*

 

Just want to encourage accuracy.

Edited July 11, 2015 by CephalonShy

[CataReverb]

This would be nice, but what we really need are more game modes that encourage sniping.  As it stands, the only one is Rescue.  Spy would work if it wasn't so enclosed.  Also, since the dark sector armestice, why the hell would anyone run rescue beyond alerts or map clearing.

Edited July 11, 2015 by Arkinvas

[Cybernetix]

Really like the idea of enemies freaking out when you start dropping people. Give us an excessively large, overcompensating anti-material rifle that's so needlessly loud that the sound alone makes people run for cover.

[MGlBlaze]

Here's my ideas for sniper rifles re-work.

1) Standart on-screen crosshair on all sniper rifles should be removed to discourage no-scoping. [Controversial]

2) Damage of sniper rifles should stay the same, but headsot damage for them should be increased.

3) All sniper rifles should have innate punch through.

4) All sniper rifles should have innate ability to penetrate nullifier, and Arctic Eximus bubbles (maybe with decreased damage?)

5) Headshot kills should cause all enemies in a small area around the killed enemy to panic and search for cover. [Can be a mod]

6) Headshots should cause stagger. [suggested: Blind, Confused]

ideas/suggestions/critique?

Honestly I think even just points 1-4 would be good.

That said, regarding removing the standard target reticule; only if they also to a pass on the reticule for scoping in as well. Most of them (The Vectis itself being a big culprit) have the actual 'dot' in the middle for aiming being way too big. Like at mid range the entire aim dot is larger than what you're actually aiming at. I seem to recall the Lanka having a reasonably small point but I'll need to check and I remember it had a bunch of other clutter.

Aside from that, increased headshot damage, innate punch-through (Lanka has a really significant innate punch-through but none of the others do) and being able to partially ignore Nullifier nonsense? Yes please. Nullifiers in general are a global slap in the face to every non-explosive single-shot weapon. I'll settle for a partial bypass; completely ignoring it might be too far.

Point 6 would be a nice bonus but since the whole idea of sniper rifles is "One shot, one kill" I'm not sure it would come into play.

As for point 5, while it would be nice it would also involve a bunch of new code and working on the game's AI which would be a whole lot of work for not a whole lot of return so I can't imagine the devs would see much appeal in doing it.

Some new sniper-exclusive mods might be cool though. I recall someone else bringing up that Team Fortress 2 has a game-mode where the sniper is able to deal AoE damage via headshot kills, and perhaps something like that could be applied as a mod in Warframe. Not necessarily damage, but an area status proc. Maybe the same impact stagger you mentioned on point 6. Things to reward precise aiming in general, considering they're all supposed to be precision weapons.

Edited July 12, 2015 by MGlBlaze

[Jukantos]

Ability to penetrate nullifiers.... A beautifull wish, but not in this lifetime. Maybe in a parallel universe or when Warframe 2 comes out xD

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Give them at least 5m of punch-through, make them silent, and give them and infrared scope that can see enemies through walls like the scanners (but don't have the outlines fade in an out.)

[CephalonShy]

Give them at least 5m of punch-through, make them silent, and give them and infrared scope that can see enemies through walls like the scanners (but don't have the outlines fade in an out.)

 

Nah i think we should keep silent thing for the bows.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Nah i think we should keep silent thing for the bows.

Fair enough.  I think the punch through and infrared scopes are a must through.  You could still make them silent with a mod, Being able to see and shoot enemies and cameras through walls would make them ideal for spy missions.

[4MostlyHarmless2]

I had an topic about this a while back, but I can't find it anymore; besides most of what I mentioned in my topic are also mentioned here, so I'll just expound on them. 

a.) Sniper rifles need very high Innate Punchthrough --- Not to deal with enemy crowds, but in order to remove the one advantage the enemy keeps on using against us in rifle vs. rifle combat: heavy cover. 

 

b.) Sniper scopes should illuminate targets (Infrared scope) while zoomed in, and can also see through walls --- The sniper rifles have very limited magazines, so it would be nice if I could see who I should shoot first in the next room before I enter it, and just how many enemies are waiting for me on the other side. 

 

c.) Sniper rifles should be more effective in utility against units/heavy units --- Sniper rifles should be more effective but not necessarily damage-wise, since the current damage and armor scaling is really weird in Warframe. I was thinking effectiveness more along the lines of utility, like sniper shots having an innate chance to disarm enemies upon hit (if it doesn't kill the enemy). 

 

The problem really is that with the way Warframe's AI is structured, Snipers will continue to be disadvantaged. Though they can definitely roll out reworks for snipers and shotguns, if the enemy mechanics won't be changed anytime soon then the reworks won't feel like they make a difference. 

[Paroxysmal]

As interesting as all the ideas here are, i personally think that the only thing that keeps snipers from being large scale usable is their inability to wave clear. But since i quite love snipers and have been shown this topic I wanted to add my thoughts to the pool

 

For 1, i actually dont think i'd notice cause i tend to step back and bring up the scope when i shoot

For 2, I actually think this would help quite a bit for snipers when unmodded so you can really feel their power

For 3, I use shred on all my weapons so this would just be nice to have more punch through than anything for me, but for newer players this would be significant

For 4, this would be nice because nullifiers is why i stopped relying on my sniper rifles for high level corrupted or corpus content. Can't deal with their bubbles, cant deal with the stronger units, everything is awful

For 5 + 6 , I'm not a huge fan of either of these because changing the way the enemies AI is reacting to your presence can make aiming a pain for all people involved and if you're not able to 1 shot your target with a headshot [if you include previous headshot bonus] you probably shouldnt still be fighting the enemies. As previously suggested and something i mentioned in some other topic either a sniper only mod, or a sniper passive ability to hit a handful of enemies around your target would solve most of people's grievances with it. I'm thinking an example of like ' sniper shot to ricochet to 6 nearby targets within 5m' with each additional enemy hit reducing the initial damage or something

 

like i quite enjoy my snipers but i find myself only ever using a pure electric lanka now'in days because the electric proc can kill all the smaller units that end up clumped together

[alfaomega04]

Here's my ideas for sniper rifles re-work.

 

1) Standart on-screen crosshair on all sniper rifles should be removed to discourage no-scoping. [Controversial]

2) Damage of sniper rifles should stay the same, but headsot damage for them should be increased.

3) All sniper rifles should have innate punch through.

4) All sniper rifles should have innate ability to penetrate nullifier, and Arctic Eximus bubbles (maybe with decreased damage?)

5) Headshot kills should cause all enemies in a small area around the killed enemy to panic and search for cover. [Can be a mod]

6) Headshots should cause stagger. [suggested: Blind, Confused]

 

ideas/suggestions/critique?

This is basically some of the best idea that have been put forward for the rework of sniper rifles compiled into a single post. +1 

 

1 - First time i've seen this suggestion but I like it and would also appreciate if the current scopes on the rifles were a bit better (take vectis for example)

 

2 - this is one of the big ones that I would truly like to see implemented. Snipers should highly reward accurate shooting. Also, the unreliability of the critical chance on them should be completely removed and instead be changed to a reliable headshot multiplier. I don't care if i can hit 50k crit shots every blue moon and tickle them the next shot; I want my rifle to be reliable and give consistent results if one is skilled enough to consistently pull off headshots. 

 

3- another great suggestion that should have been implemented since they were introduced. This would be similar to other games that have high number of mobs but make snipers still viable. Hell, even Bastion has this feature and it's an isometric indie action/adventure game.

 

4 -  and yet another great suggestion that i've also proposed before. I do agree on the reduced damage, but if you are able to hit heatshots, even the reduced damage should be able to take them down in a single shot. And quite honestly, if one is able to hit headshots when there are 50 enemies flooding the pod and bombards from every side, a downed nullifier with a single shot is apt compensation. 

 

5 -  while i find the idea intriguing, i'm not fully sold on it. I would say make some type cover and other not effected at all. As for the effect being a mod, even so I would tone it down a bit since this is getting into the warframe abilities. 

 

6 - Also another neat idea which I hand't seen before. This one I like and if find it to be balanced. If the headshot did not kill the target, a stagger is a very logical follow up.

[H3dsh0t]

People just want to make the lanka obsolete... i will not let that happen!

 

This would far from make the Lanka obsolete, its already one of the best sniper rifles when used properly.

 

Gonna bump this thread up again, I feel that there are far too many good ideas for this thread to be completely forgotten.

[TaylorsContraction]

People complain about shotgun snipers, but do you forget nullifiers? It's faster for me to slide into bubble and 1 shot the nullifier than to swap to a hrof secondary, burst down the bubble, and then shoot the nullifier. DE forced us into melee range stop treating it like it's bad or is the players' fault.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Infrared scopes