A Solution To The Increasing Trade Scams

[CruelCrow]

Note: Hybrid between feedback and suggestion. Move as needed, however I believe it belongs in Feedback as it is not an idea for something new, but rather a suggestion for a modification to improve upon something already existing.

If you've browsed the subforums or even region chats lately, there's a good chance you've seen someone leave a question about multipart trading scams - i.e. agreeing on one price for a quantity greater than 4 items, and then getting blocked and cut off after only part of the transaction.

While I haven't seen the results of the entire support tickets, I would imagine it's not enforced since it falls under trades by promises, and they aren't bound by their word.

However, this does NOT mean that this toxicity and deceit should be tolerated. It's really an exploitation of the trade system, ergo it is exploitable, ergo it should be fixed.

I propose something simple that I see as having a positive cost-reward benefit for ever party (aside from scammers). Instead of gaining one trade of 4 slots per rank per dat, a player shall gain 4 trade slots, granting an infinite amount of trades within the daily slots granted. Therefore, a non-founder at mastery rank 4 could make a single trade worth 16 items, 2 trades of 8 items, 16 trades of individual items, and so on.

Analysis:
Cons:
●Players could make more daily trades in theory, since many trades are for single items or other quantities less than four
●Supports players buying items using Platinum. I.e. a player paying platinum to another for several items would only use 1 trade slot, whereas the seller would use several
●possible harmful effect on market prices, unable to determine without statistics relating to scammed
● Requires minor work on graphical user interface (it could remain the same as current until you add a 4th item to the trade- and then a scrollbar appears, and 4 more slots are made available, until the 8th is used, etc.)
Pros:
●Reduced scamming(and reduced ability to do so) results in:
○Less load on support team (which is much needed in its current state and has several more independent benefits)
○Slightly happier, less toxic, more loyal community
○Possibility of more trading due to more security (which could mean increased Plat sales)
●Overall, it's morally correct. This almost completely elminates scamming, which should not be encouraged - even omission can be considered encouragement in the scenario.

Alternate & Hybrid Solution: Keep the daily trade limit, but allow players to use multiple daily trades (multiple sets of 4) at one time. E.g. if I want to give somebody 5 items in exchange for 50 platinum, they put their platinum up for offer, I put 4 items up, and another set of 4 trade boxes opens up. I place the 5th item in, and when the trade is completed, I receive the platinum, and they receive 5 items in a single trade. With the hybrid system, I will expend 2 of my daily trades, whereas they have expended 1.
Please refer to the previous analysis except exclude the first 2 points.

 

Edit: Response to points such as : "It's easy to avoid", "Trade chat says promises not enforced", others related to the current system and how it's responded to previous attempts:

Unfortunately, many players - especially new ones - are not aware of the trading policies, and even as written in the trading chat that trades are not enforced for promises, the message is quickly hidden by the large volume of traders. 

 

Many players, especially new ones, may be used to similar MMO style games with different trading mechanics where deals can be made in a single transaction, allowing integrity to be upheld, or others where one's word is honor bound. Even at Mastery Rank 2, much of the game and her mechanics are new and unexplored, and the trading system is no exception. Getting scammed in this manner is seemingly becoming more common every day - by agreeing to one price for a set amount items, and then only getting a portion of them even if the full price is not payed (i.e. skewed values) or vise versa. I see no reason to drive new players away, either by being scammed or by the fear of trading due to the shared experiences of others. Although flagging potential abusers is a solution, it is an active solution, i.e. an ongoing one, whereas the one I propose is passive, a single change that solves the problem without further action.

 

Although I concur that it would be additional work for seemingly little reward, I would like to also point out that it would be further beneficial for all players to maximize their trading, and since there is no incentive to purchase Platinum for trading (i.e. to get more daily trades), it would not have a hindrance in that aspect. 

 

I typically do not request changes for one specific purpose, but rather try to find ways in which one change could solve a myriad of difficulties. This is one of those.

 

Remember that although it may seem obvious to you, there is quite the learning curve in the game, which can be disorienting. What may be common sense to you may seem like an over-reactive, unnecessary measure that would never cross the minds of those who were not exposed to it or a previous encounter where it would apply.

I feel that scamming, especially the exploitative category of which that abuses loopholes and deceives honest players who have faith in the integrity of others is the worst type, and should not be tolerated. I will correct as needed, and with that, thank you for reading.

Edited July 22, 2015 by CruelCrow

[CTanGod]

How can you even get scammed with this trading system ? HOW ?! If trading for more than 4 items is such a hassle then you need to negociate with the person better or limit yourself to those 4 items.

[Kthal]

Might be only slightly relevant, but I think one of the recent devstreams had an image of an upcoming trade interface with 5 slots, although it may have only been a concept piece.

 

 

 

I am all for trades being limited based on slots used per day, not trades per day, especially since you end up wasting around half of them.

[ToxicTroublermaker]

The only actual way to scam someone with the current trade system is to only offer, dont accept, wait for the other party to accept, then quickly change the plat count and accept within seconds.

 

Besides that there is literally no other way to scam in this game's trade system. If you encounter a situation that is not the above method than that trade is your fault and the loss of items/plat is your fault.

 

The method you are suggesting is pointless and wasteful of resources when the current system is 99% flawless

Edited July 22, 2015 by ToxicTroublermaker

[Stratego89]

Solution to not get scammed: using common sense. You cannot scam in this system- it is impossible. DE explicitly states "do not trade for promises" in trade chat. This includes multipart trades. Split up the platinum among the trades as well as the items evenly. If you cannot or will not do that- it is on you if you are "scammed".

[Uzpian]

Might be only slightly relevant, but I think one of the recent devstreams had an image of an upcoming trade interface with 5 slots

They should have done this a long time ago.

[Institute-Marksman]

I think I can fix this problem, here you go:

THIS THING GIVES YOU THE ABILITY TO THINK.
USE IT, FOR FROHD'S SAKE!!

Edited July 22, 2015 by Institute-Marksman

[CruelCrow]

Unfortunately, many players - especially new ones - are not aware of the trading policies, and even as written in the trading chat that trades are not enforced for promises, the message is quickly hidden by the large volume of traders. 

 

Many players, especially new ones, may be used to similar MMO style games with different trading mechanics where deals can be made in a single transaction, allowing integrity to be upheld. Even at Mastery Rank 2, much of the game and her mechanics are new and unexplored, and the trading system is no exception. Getting scammed in this manner is seemingly becoming more common every day - by agreeing to one price for a set amount items, and then only getting a portion of them even if the full price is not payed (i.e. skewed values) or vise versa. I see no reason to drive new players away, either by being scammed or by the fear of trading due to the shared experiences of others. Although flagging potential abusers is a solution, it is an active solution, i.e. an ongoing one, whereas the one I propose is passive, a single change that solves the problem without further action.

 

Although I concur that it would be additional work for seemingly little reward, I would like to also point out that it would be further beneficial for all players to maximize their trading, and since there is no incentive to purchase Platinum for trading (i.e. to get more daily trades), it would not have a hindrance in that aspect.

 

I typically do not request changes for one specific purpose, but rather try to find ways in which one change could solve a myriad of difficulties. This is one of those.

 

Remember that although it may seem obvious to you, there is quite the learning curve in the game, which can be disorienting. What may be common sense to you may seem like an over-reactive, unnecessary measure that would never cross the minds of those who were not exposed to it or a previous encounter where it would apply.

[Kostadin]

it would be a good idea for DE to write some rules or something and when a new player enters trading console to pop up and read it or something

[Institute-Marksman]

it would be a good idea for DE to write some rules or something and when a new player enters trading console to pop up and read it or something

You can show someone the law but that cannot stop him from breaking it.

[CruelCrow]

You can show someone the law but that cannot stop him from breaking it.

Well, I think they were going for from the other facet.

 

We now have the loading screen which shows quick facts about the game that aren't as commonly known, which can be helpful to newer player s(and even some veterans.)

 

The Message of the Day gets lost in trading chat in a matter of seconds. It would be more helpful than what we have now if it showed messages in the trading box reminding people of what items were tradeable and the basic trading rules.

Edited July 22, 2015 by CruelCrow

[weezedog]

How about you just don't give them all the platinum till you get all the parts. If it's a multipart trade, then they get the platinum in multiparts as well.

[(XBOX)ShapelessHorr0r]

Evidence of trade scam increase?

An infinitely easier system would be to simply allow us to trade as many items as we want.

[SemperSupra]

How can you get scammed on a system that requires both parties to consent prior to the trade?

[Phatose]

Given how many trades are made for single items, this would effectively quadruple the number of trades per day.

 

Won't back that.

 

 

Easier just to allow more then 4 items per trade, with the caveat that you need to have - and it costs - the minimum number of trades of 4 item it would take to complete.  Trades for 1-4 items cost 1 trade, 4-8 cost 2 trades, 9-12 costs 3, and so on.  It's based on the greater of the 2 players number of items in the trade for both players.  So if you trade 100p for somebody elses 11 items, both of you need to have 3 trades available, and both of you use 3.