Why Always Defense?

[Xylia]

You know, DE, you have different mission types in the game:

 

Raid

Defense

Extermination

Assassination

Sabotage

Mobile Defense

Deception

Rescue

Capture

Spy

 

Why is it that ONLY Defense and sometimes Assassination ever yield much in the way of rewards?

 

Want a Warframe? Go to a specific Assassination or Defense mission that drops it.

Want Void Keys? Pick a Defense mission and pray for good RNG (most likely not).

Want Rare Mods? Defense.

 

Defense Defense Defense.

 

Why can't we get some of this stuff by doing something OTHER than Defense? Why can't a NORMAL mission give random rewards at the end of the mission like Rare Mods, Keys, etc now-and-then?

 

This is starting to look like World of Defensecraft, where Defense is the only thing to actually DO in Warframe because of the ridiculous amounts of Forma one needs to build anything in a Dojo, or if you want anything from the Void without having to plunk down lots of Plat in consumable keys.

 

Let's put some of those things in the other missions so we can do something different now-and-then....

Edited May 26, 2013 by Xylia

[ACE6]

+1

[Mazimer]

no

god no

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

anything besides defence and assasinations is beyond ridicilously easy.

it is like lazer tag, except you're a tiny star wars bot with sith force powers of evasion and jedi mind tricks playing vs 5 years

Edited May 26, 2013 by Mazimer

[3XT3RM1NATUS]

Because why not?

[Xylia]

no

god no

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

anything besides defence and assasinations is beyond ridicilously easy.

 

Easy or no, Constant Defense gets OLD.

 

That's all my friend ever suggests anymore. "We need to do Defense for Void Keys" ... meh.

 

I've already done a bunch of defense maps...... no keys.

 

This looks like the #1 thing that might burn me out on the game, doing nothing but Defense all the time, esp when the stupid keys don't pop up anyways.

[MoonicusMaximus]

no

god no

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

anything besides defence and assasinations is beyond ridicilously easy.

 

And five waves of Io, from which you are able to get void keys, is difficult?

[Xylia]

Because why not?

 

 

Because doing the same thing all the time gets old when there are alternatives to mix it up some?

[Mazimer]

Because doing the same thing all the time gets old when there are alternatives to mix it up some?

let me post it again:

 

anything besides defence and assasinations is beyond ridicilously easy.

it is like lazer tag, except you're a tiny star wars flying ball with sith force powers of evasion and jedi mind tricks playing vs 5 year olds

 

that's why

[Xylia]

And five waves of Io, from which you are able to get void keys, is difficult?

 

To be honest, they could add a modifier based on what planet you're in...

 

Say, Mercury has maybe a 1% chance to drop a Void Key.

Maybe Pluto would have whatever the max % chance would be.

 

And of course, your % gets higher, the higher planet you go to. That way you're not tempted to farm the easiest possible, because of the low % chance. But yet, you've more variety and choices on where to go instead of being pigeonholed into Defense maps.

[Xylia]

let me post it again:

 

anything besides defence and assasinations is beyond ridicilously easy.

it is like lazer tag, except you're a tiny star wars flying ball with sith force powers of evasion and jedi mind tricks playing vs 5 year olds

 

that's why

 

Again, not much difference between doing 5-10 waves of Defense on some lower level area and doing something like a Rescue mission on Sedna, Eris, or Pluto.

 

Actually considering the Hostages' bad AI... I hate Rescue more than I do Defense, but at least it'd be something *different*.

Edited May 26, 2013 by Xylia

[LordOfTzeentch]

let me post it again:

 

anything besides defence and assasinations is beyond ridicilously easy.

it is like lazer tag, except you're a tiny star wars flying ball with sith force powers of evasion and jedi mind tricks playing vs 5 year olds

 

that's why

And defense is any different when the enemies run to you rather then making you run to them, and in a finite amount of numbers?

[Xylia]

Not to mention, Defense maps are boring because you don't get as many resource drops (a lot fewer lockers/containers to open), and as soon as a x5 wave ends you get the "Claim or Exit" prompt and they don't give you any TIME to run around and actually collect what drops.

 

Mod dropped off of the last mob on Wave 5 or Wave 10 and you want to quit? Too bad, its gone.

 

I hate that so very much....

[Mazimer]

And five waves of Io, from which you are able to get void keys, is difficult?

and you people moan about why always defence?

defence has infinitebru of waves.

i bet you never made it past wave 50. how about past 60 without a nyx? give yourself a challenge, dont be a lazy bum

[Amnoex]

Mobile Defense is an alternative if you're feeling that tired of regular defense. It also grants you lots of resources and mods.

[Xylia]

and you people moan about why always defence?

defence has infinitebru of waves.

i bet you never made it past wave 50. how about past 60 without a nyx? give yourself a challenge, dont be a lazy bum

 

The point being made here is that you don't have to go to wave 50 if you want a key. 10-15 waves is sufficient.

 

If you don't see a key by wave 10 or 15 you might as well wait until a rare mod pops and just take it and start over rather than risk losing everything you found in the map.

 

It is simply not economical to try for high wave numbers. You risk way too much. All resources that you managed to find, all mods that dropped, everything.

 

There's really no reason to reach for higher wave numbers. There just... isn't. The risk is not worth the rewards. You're better off spamming Wave 10-15 until you see a key. At least then every 10-15 waves you get to save your drops that you collect rather than lose _Everything_ in a botched run.

[Xylia]

Mobile Defense is an alternative if you're feeling that tired of regular defense. It also grants you lots of resources and mods.

 

.......but not Keys which is the whole point behind my OP.

 

You want Keys? You have to do Defense.

[Amnoex]

.......but not Keys which is the whole point behind my OP.

 

You want Keys? You have to do Defense.

Try joining a clan or joining a squad headed to Void.

[Mazimer]

The point being made here is that you don't have to go to wave 50 if you want a key. 10-15 waves is sufficient.

 

If you don't see a key by wave 10 or 15 you might as well wait until a rare mod pops and just take it and start over rather than risk losing everything you found in the map.

 

It is simply not economical to try for high wave numbers. You risk way too much. All resources that you managed to find, all mods that dropped, everything.

 

There's really no reason to reach for higher wave numbers. There just... isn't. The risk is not worth the rewards. You're better off spamming Wave 10-15 until you see a key. At least then every 10-15 waves you get to save your drops that you collect rather than lose _Everything_ in a botched run.

again, you moan without knowing the facts,

 

loot on defences saves after every 5 waves

 

YOUR

ARGUMENTS

ARE

VERTICALLY

DENIED

[Xylia]

again, you moan without knowing the facts,

 

loot on defences saves after every 5 waves

 

YOUR

ARGUMENTS

ARE

VERTICALLY

DENIED

 

You still haven't replied to the fact you don't NEED to do 50 runs.

 

You go "Oh Oh, 50 Wave Defense is WAY more challenge!"

 

.......but why do 50 Waves if you don't have to?

 

The point here is just Defense Itself gets old and boring after doing it dozens upon dozens of times. We want to do something Other than Defense. Defense just gets old after awhile.

 

But, again, Only Defense drops keys which is stupid. You're basically pigeonholing everybody into Defense whether they want to or not.

 

And RE: the other guy:

 

You cannot join a Void session. They must invite you. Therefore, you have to...

 

1). Be on someone's friend list who has a key.

2). Be in someone's clan that has a key.

3). They must have an open slot in their group.

4). They need to invite you.

 

I did a few void runs because one of the peeps in our clan bought a key pack just to try it out. It was awesome, but uh, I doubt he's going to want to keep dropping RL money constantly on it. We'd like to farm some up, but...

 

Again....

 

Defense is getting old.

[Amnoex]

 

 

And RE: the other guy:

 

You cannot join a Void session. They must invite you. Therefore, you have to...

 

1). Be on someone's friend list who has a key.

2). Be in someone's clan that has a key.

3). They must have an open slot in their group.

4). They need to invite you.

 

I did a few void runs because one of the peeps in our clan bought a key pack just to try it out. It was awesome, but uh, I doubt he's going to want to keep dropping RL money constantly on it. We'd like to farm some up, but...

 

Again....

 

Defense is getting old.

I realize that, and that's what I meant. There are many people that ask in region for anyone who wants to go to the Void with them. With a decent sized clan doing separate defense runs you should get a few keys. I doubt they'll add some interesting concept to Defense to make it more appealing. You don't absolutely have to get void keys anyway. I did like 20 runs and was disappointed in all of the rewards I'd gotten.

Edited May 26, 2013 by Amnoex

[Xylia]

I realize that, and that's what I meant. With a decent sized clan doing separate defense runs you should get a few keys. I doubt they'll add some interesting concept to Defense to make it more appealing. You don't absolutely have to get void keys anyway. I did like 20 runs and was disappointed in all of the rewards I'd gotten.

 

I would just like to have a small chance at keys by doing something other than Defense.

 

The whole point the "Challenge" guy is trying to make is that Non-Defense missions are "Too Easy", but yet his argument doesn't hold water because 5-15 waves of Defense on some of the lower planets is about the same amount of Challenge. If it is OK to get a Key from Wave 5-15, why is it not OK to get a Key from some other kind of map that has about the same Challenge?

 

And the main reason I want to do Void is for Forma.

 

I don't relish the idea of taking a year+ and HOPING the Daily Rolls will give us enough Forma to build a couple rooms. So if you want Forma, it looks like you basically are forced into doing Void.

 

But to do Void, you need Keys.

 

Meh.

 

The whole thing makes me wonder just how long I'm willing to go on grinding just so I can do more grinding.

 

I mean, it looks like this:

 

MAIN GOAL: Build a Dojo.

 

Requirements: Lots of Resources, Forma

 

Sub-Goal: Get lots of Resources. OK, I can do that.

Sub-Goal: Get Forma. Need Void Runs/Keys.

 

Sub-Sub-Goal: Get Keys. Must do Defense Maps for that.

 

So.....I gotta Grind Defense Maps so I can get Keys so I can grind Void to get Forma so my buddies and I might finally build a few Dojo rooms.

 

I don't want Defense being the 1 and only mission type Warframe has to offer. If I do anything other than Defense, I'm missing out on possible Keys (and Forma!).

Edited May 26, 2013 by Xylia

[taiiat]

anything besides defence and assasinations is beyond ridicilously easy.

k, i have a different idea then. change ALL the missions into 50% defenses and 50% assasinations. then change the name of the game from Warframe to Assasinate Defense Frame - and players will no longer be able to move but instead move along a scripted railshooter line, and must eliminate all targets before leaving a room otherwise they lose. 

 

much better!

 

 

but, it does infact feel odd that defense and assasinations is what people do almost constantly. 

there's other missions, but not really any reason to do them. 

Edited May 26, 2013 by taiiat

[Xylia]

but, it does infact feel odd that defense and assasinations is what people do almost constantly.

 

That's because they're pretty much forced to.

 

Unless, of course, you're just farming resources. Then you hit up your local Exterminate so you actually have TIME to open lockers and containers without a bunch of junk constantly respawning ontop of you.

 

But other than farming resources, everything you want/need comes out of Defense and Assassination missions.

 

Some Warframe BPs? Yup, Defense.

Void Keys? Defense.

Other Warframe BPs? Assassination.

Rare Resources? If a boss doesn't drop a BP he will usually drop one of those instead.

 

Why run anything else? Probably because you're trying to unlock worlds so you can see Alerts and no other reason.

 

We need a reason to do these other missions. The game is starting to get stagnant and boring when it is always Defense or Assassination...

[Kahruvel]

There's a lot of rude people in here turning simple disagreement into personal attacks. You folks realize that you don't need to hate someone for having a different opinion, right? Ugh. This is such bull. I want to go back to a month ago, where players were actually nice to each other.

[Xylia]

There's a lot of rude people in here turning simple disagreement into personal attacks. You folks realize that you don't need to hate someone for having a different opinion, right? Ugh. This is such bull. I want to go back to a month ago, where players were actually nice to each other.

 

IMO, the ones being Rude are usually the "Elitist" crowd that are going "OMG THE GAME IS ALREADY TOO EASY! YOU'RE JUST A SCRUB!" etc.

 

You see this same crap in World of Warcraft too; everybody thinks they're hot stuff and everybody thinks the game should always be Mega-Hard with everything.

 

The problem with this mentality is quite simple -- many people play games for enjoyment and relaxation. Some challenge is OK, but yet we don't want the "Rip your hair out in frustration" type of NintendoHard either. That's just not fun.

 

Nor do we enjoy doing the exact same thing many many many times in a row, we'd like a little changeup.

 

That and I think some people so vehemently speak out against change of any form just because they... I don't know, they don't like changes? They don't like suggestions?

 

The guy speaking out against my idea apparently loves Defense Maps... therefore anything that allows players to enjoy something OTHER than Defense, he's 100% against because he thinks the game should be nothing BUT Defense because everything else is "Too Easy".

 

God Forbid a player get a Key without doing Wave 50+, amirite? *rolls eyes*