Tl;dr - My Problem With Exilus Slots Is The Build-Inflexibility That's Often The Price Of Using Them

[Chroia]

I'll start by saying: An extra mod slot is a potentially powerful thing.

The limits on what mod it'll take make it significantly less so, but still not bad to have.

I like being able to slot whatever aura I want.

I've 'paid' for the privilege with 2 extra formas on most frames, (read: 6 polarized slots per frame on most frames) before Exilus was a thing.

If I want to use an Exilus slot, I'm now faced with 2 options:

Polarize another slot (7/8) - which significantly reduces my build options - or only use 'right' polarity auras.

Admittedly, in the current state of mods there's rarely any real choice in aura polarities (with few exceptions, dash-polarity is best polarity), but there's no guarantee that this is how it will remain. And even if it is, that doesn't make it okay.

Am I whining? I don't think so, but you tell me.

Following are screenies of all my min/maxed builds. Note that there's some flexibility in the builds shown, e.g. swapping Overextended for Narrow Minded on the Volt group-Speed build.

I hate releveling. If it's not Prime I only formaed it (again: before Exilus was a thing) enough to more-or-less enough fit everything.

Note that if I want to use a 'wrong polarity' aura, I need to have 9 points free (for anything that isn't Steel Charge).

I'm assuming that the largest drain I'll be putting in an Exilus slot is 9 points. If you want to be perfectly safe, add +1 slot to my estimates.

Ash

Bladestorm spam.

Polarities? 6/8.

Enough room? Yes.

Need more? No.

Smoke Shadow

Polarities? 6/8.

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more, for 7/8.

Rising Storm/Sustained Bladestorm

Polarities? 6/8.

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more, for 7/8.

Verdict: Problem.

1 conflicting polarity.

Banshee

General use. Swap out QT for defense of your choice (all equal or cheaper).

Polarities? 5/8.

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 for Mobilize (6/8), 2 for anything else (7/8)

Resonance

Polarities? 5/8.

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 for Mobilize (6/8), 2 for anything else (7/8)

Sonic Fracture. I'm irked that I can't get Overextended in there. :/

Polarities? 5/8.

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 for Mobilize (6/8), 2 for anything else (7/8)

Verdict: 7/8 polarities.

No current polarity conflicts. 1 - 1 V fits all.

Chroma Not minmaxed, don't play him.

Ember

Max range Exterm bully

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Yes.

Need more? No.

Fireball Frenzy, Aviator because no defensive mods.

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Mostly.

Need more? Could use 1 more.

Balanced build

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Mostly.

Need more? Could use 1 more.

Verdict: 7/8 polarities.

No current polarity conflicts. 1 - fits all.

Equinox

Syndicate/Medallion hunt

Polarities? 4/8

Enough room? Not for wrong polairty aura + Exilus + maxed mods.

Need more? 2 for wrong aura (6/8), 3 for maxed mods (7/8).

General use - Essentially identical.

Polarities? 4/8

Enough room? Not for wrong polairty aura + Exilus.

Need more? 2 for wrong aura (6/8).

Max Maim slash, test build

Polarities? 4/8

Enough room? Not for wrong polairty aura + Exilus + maxed mods.

Need more? 2 for wrong aura (6/8), 3 for Exilus (7/8).

Verdict: Problem.

1 conflicting polarity, 1 - 1 D fit all.

Excalibur Not minmaxed.

Frost

Grineer/Void pod defense

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Mostly.

Need more? Could use 1 more.

Augment build

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 for Mobilize (7/8), 2 for anything else (8/8)

Coverage/Medallion hunt

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Yes.

Need more? No.

Verdict: Not much of an issue.

Hydroid

Pilfering Swarm (No longer relevant)

Polarities? 3/8

Need more? Need 2 more for wrong aura, and 2 more for Exilus

for a total of 7/8.

Don't know about conflicting polarities, haven't bothered with building for duration.

Limbo

Solo/general use.

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Not for wrong aura, nor for any Exilus except Mobilize.

Need more? 1 more for wrong aura, 1 more for Exilus

for a total of 7/8.

Nuker. Swap P.ContIntensify and add Narrow Minded for coverage over strength.

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for wrong aura, 1 or 2 more (depending on badslotting other mods) for Exilus.

Team play/medallion hunt

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 2 for Exilus for a total of 7/8

Verdict: 2 - fit all, for a total of 7/8 polarities.

Loki

Irradiating Disarm. Edit: Woops. Just realised that the NM should be QT. Whatever, same cost.

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for wrong aura.

Duration invis/Syndicate Medallion

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Assuming no costlier Exilus, yes.

Need more? 1 more to be safe for a total of 7/8.

Verdict: Not much of an issue.

Mag

Glass Polarize cannon

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for wrong aura.

General use/Bully (Aviator due to no defense mods)

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more to account for wrong aura, for a total of 6/8

General use

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 2 more to account for both for a total of 7/8.

Verdict: 7/8 polarities.

No conflict with existing mods, 1 - 1 v fits all.

Mesa

General use/Buffs/Peacemaker.

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 2 more to account for an Exilus slot.

General use/Efficiency/Peacemaker.

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more to account for an Exilus slot.

General use/Buffs/gunplay.

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 2 more to account for an Exilus slot.

Verdict: Problem.

7/8 polarities needed.

1 conflicting polarity, 1 - fits all

Mirage

General use/Total Eclipse

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Neither for wrong aura nor Exilus.

Need more? 1 for wrong aura or Exilus, a further 2 more for the other for a total of 8/8

General use/range

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Neither for wrong aura nor Exilus.

Need more? 1 for wrong aura or Exilus, a further 2 more for the other for a total of 8/8

Blind/range

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? either a wrong aura or an Exilus.

Need more? 2 more for both.

Verdict: Problem.

2 conflicting polarities, 1 D fits all.

Nekros (another frame with not-perfect builds.)

General use: Despoil, Soul Survivor/Flex

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for an Exilus slot.

Desecrate, range~balanced.

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Either a wrong aura or Exilus.

Need more? 2 more for an Exilus slot.

General use, Efficiency+Str~balanced/Medallion hunt

Polarities? 5/8

Enough room? Either a wrong aura or Exilus.

Need more? 2 more for an Exilus slot.

Verdict: Problem.

1 conflicting polarity, 1 - fits all.

Nova

Max range slow M Prime

Polarities? 7/8

Enough room? Either a wrong aura or Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for wrong aura.

Speed M Prime

Polarities? 7/8

Enough room? Either a wrong aura or Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for wrong aura.

General use/medallion hunt

Polarities? 7/8

Enough room? Yes.

Need more? No.

Verdict: 1 - fits all (ignoring the bad slot in config B) for 8/8 polarities.

P.S. This is why I was irritated at Nova P coming with 3 V polarities. The most any of my configs uses is 2.

Nyx

General use - max duration Chaos Sphere; aura, Exilus, and Natural Talent can be changed.

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Yes.

Need more? No.

Mind Freak experimentation build.

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for wrong aura + Exilus

General use - Max range Chaos Sphere; aura, Exilus, and Natural Talent can be changed.

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Yes.

Need more? No.

Verdict: Problem for build diversity.

Mind Freak (which needs Strength) conflicts with the general use builds.

Oberon Since his rework he's a very solid all-arounder. I just don't see that as being adequate reason to use him.

Rhino

No-brainer/NM mode

Polarities? 7/8

Enough room? Yes.

Need more? No.

General use/balanced

Polarities? 7/8

Enough room? Yes.

Need more? No.

General use/range/medallion hunt

Polarities? 7/8

Enough room? Mostly.

Need more? 1 more for full Exilus coverage.

Verdict: 7/8, slight problem if attempting to maximize as 8th slot conflicts.

Saryn (Unsynergistic, self-conflicting kit -> Walking nuke. Yawn.)

Reworked Saryn - Too much effort for too little return, some role conflict (caster/melee).

Trinity

EV/Min duration

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for Exilus.

Blessing/High duration

Polarities? 6/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 2 more for Exilus

Verdict: Problem.

2 conflicting polarities.

Valkyr Didn't have the mods for her at the time, haven't revisited. Awaiting ability pass.

Vauban

Vortex

Polarities?

Enough room?

Need more?

Bastille

Polarities?

Enough room?

Need more?

Volt

Solo Speed

Polarities? 7/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for Exilus

General use/Squad

Polarities? 7/8

Enough room? Yes.

Need more? No.

Nuker.

Polarities? 7/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for Exilus.

Verdict: Problem.

1 conflicting polarity for 8/8.

[size=5]Zephyr

Selfish Jet Stream/Tonkor

Polarities? 4/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 3 for wrong aura + Exilus.

Squad Jet Stream

Polarities? 4/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 3 for wrong aura + Exilus.

Verdict: 7/8.

No conflicting polarities, 1 v 1 - 1 = fit all.

tl;dr -

So in summary: of the 17 frames I flagged, 8 have no problem, 9 do.

That's just over of half the frames having to choose between flexibility or an Exilus slot.

And none of which touches on the crafting costs (since I'm okay with that) nor on the odious task of releveling every single frame 4-6 times (since that's a completely different issue).

Notes to self:

Update Loki, Mag, Nekros, Frost, Hydroid.

Add and disclaimer Excal. Add Vauban.

Need to unembed deprecated builds - hitting post image limit.

Deprecated:

Nyx. Reason - Chaos is now recastable, so duration is worthwhile.

Build

General use, anything can fit into the empty slot. Example:

Build

Same thing, medallion hunt.

Polarities? 4/8

Enough room? Not for wrong-polarity aura + Exilus.

Need more? 1 more for wrong aura, a further 2 for Exilus.

Verdict: 7/8.

No known conflicts since her augments aren't worth using (imo), nor is building for positive duration desireable.

Edited February 5, 2016 by Chroia

[Don_T_Shoot]

I'm sure it will come up at some point and I'll be annoyed that I have to make a choice between flexibility and an utility but on Nova P, Loki P and Oberon, as you've noted, I haven't had any issue at all besides maybe an added forma or two.    I can still have Speed Nova, Slova, and Neutral Nova without issue.  Oberon has one build that I rarely tweak but certainly don't switch to completely different builds.  His powers don't warrant it.   Loki has a Disarm build and an Invis/general Loki build.  That's it.

 

Maybe if I "mained" some other frames more I'd see it but most of my other frames only have one build that I use for each anyhow.   If I'm tweaking them it usually involves the same sorts of stats that I'm improving.  I mean, how many of those frames benefit from wildly different builds?

 

I guess what I'm asking is, is this an issue in practice?  Or just theoretically a problem?

[Chroia]

Fair question, which is why I added pictures and commentary on all of my used builds.

Can't tell for sure about Hydroid or the crossed out frames, but

(off the top of my head) I've actively run into this with Ash, Mesa, Mirage, Nekros, Trinity and Volt.

 

As to 'wildly different stats', pretty much every frame will be using efficiency. But:

Any frame that has an AoE buff (Duration (selfish)/range (group)).

Any frame that has a combination of nuke+anything else (Str (nuke)/duration (anything else).

Again, off the top of my head.

 

Loki, like Nyx (and to a lesser extent Nova, unless you're modding for M Prime's explosions) have the distinction of being able to mostly ignore Strength (and Nova can mostly ignore range).

This makes modding them much easier.

Edited August 25, 2015 by Chroia

[Don_T_Shoot]

I think the issue for you is the insistence on using every aura as you see fit.   That is, you are not willing to compromise that to gain power elsewhere.

 

That would not be a balanced system if you could have both.   I don't think I'd run into these issues much, if at all, because I pick an aura polarity and stick with it.   Auras most important feature, in my view, is to give you more mod points to work with, the actual bonus of the aura is just that, a bonus.

 

With the definite exception of 3-4 Corrosive Projections on a team.

 

Same issue with the exilus slot itself.  So far, I've been able to leave it neutral to experiment but if I had to choose between build versatility and a utility slot, I'd polarize the exilus slot with a dash and be done with it.  Problem solved.

 

These discussions about the Exilus slots often seem to boil down to wanting to use everything all of the time without sacrifice.  If adding utility compromises your flexibility then pick one.    Being able to pick both with no consequences is just another form of power creep.

[Chroia]

I think the issue for you is the insistence on using every aura as you see fit.   That is, you are not willing to compromise that to gain power elsewhere.

 

That would not be a balanced system if you could have both.   I don't think I'd run into these issues much, if at all, because I pick an aura polarity and stick with it.   Auras most important feature, in my view, is to give you more mod points to work with, the actual bonus of the aura is just that, a bonus.

 

With the definite exception of 3-4 Corrosive Projections on a team.

 

Same issue with the exilus slot itself.  So far, I've been able to leave it neutral to experiment but if I had to choose between build versatility and a utility slot, I'd polarize the exilus slot with a dash and be done with it.  Problem solved.

 

These discussions about the Exilus slots often seem to boil down to wanting to use everything all of the time without sacrifice.  If adding utility compromises your flexibility then pick one.    Being able to pick both with no consequences is just another form of power creep.

This is correct, to a point.

 

* The fact that most auras' main benefit being more mod points is something I see as a con, not a pro.

And 4*CP blows anything else out of the water anyway.

 

* I wouldn't mind polarizing the Exilus slot instead of a warframe slot. I'd prefer it, even.

But Exilus slots are newer. I'm not certain that I know which mods it will support when things 'settle down'.

 

* and I take issue with 'wanting to use everything all of the time without sacrifice'.

I assume you mean it as a general statement, but I don't think it's applicable.

I'm spending the time, effort, resources (or plat) to get the Exilus adapter.

I'm spending the time, effort, keys (or plat) to get the many forma required.

I'm spending the time, attention and resources to build the damn things, one at a time.

I'm spending the time, effort and attention required to level and relevel and relevel frames from zero. A task that I loath.

Is that not 'sacrifice'?

Or, alternatively, what am I supposed to be sacrificing?

[Don_T_Shoot]

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that the difficulty of getting and implementing an Exilus slot is not a sacrifice.  It is a huge pain to do it without spending Plat, that is for certain!  And the adding 1 - 2 more forma after we thought we were done leveling a certain frame is a hassle and more time spent. There is definitely sacrifice there. 

 

But, I was focusing on the end results once you get to that point.  There are still choices to be made that make this all interesting.  If there was one best way to do it, it gets a bit stale I think.  Building weapons and frames needs to be a zero sum game for the health of the rest of the game. 

 

I agree with you about waiting and seeing what happens with exilus polarities.    I'm hoping I can keep them neutral for a while in case something really interesting comes along that is not a dash.

Edited August 25, 2015 by Don_T_Shoot

[Chroia]

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that the difficulty of getting and implementing an Exilus slot is not a sacrifice.

No worries, just making sure we're both on the same page.

 

 

But, 1) I was focusing on the end results once you get to that point.  2) There are still choices to be made that make this all interesting.  3) If there was one best way to do it, it gets a bit stale I think.  4) Building weapons and frames needs to be a zero sum game for the health of the rest of the game.

1) Okay, I get that. But a choice between losing my build flexibility or not using an Exilus slot isn't really a choice, though.

And given that I can already fit anything I want onto any frame...  *shrug*?

 

2) This is exactly it, though. There aren't really choices to make. Or at least, not to continuously make.

You review your available mods. You prioritize modifiers and then stack multiples by importance. You forma to fit them.

And then you're pretty much done. At least until the next batch of power-affecting corrupted/mods is released.

 

3) I agree, though I'm not sure that there isn't a single (subjective) 'best', already.

 

4) Again, I very much agree.

It's one of the reasons I think that base and Corrupted mods shouldn't stack.

 

 

But, unless I misunderstood their representation on whichever Devstream it was, Exilus slots are supposed to allow space for (purely) utility mods, exactly not power creep (which is why Natural Talent isn't a candidate).

And an implementation of such an 'endgame' (by which I mean costly) mechanic that directly gimps the player using it seems to be, idk, kinda counterproductive?

 

 

At any rate, whatever comes next - thank you for the discussion.

Have a +1 and an excellent rest-of-week.

[Spookmineer]

not willing to compromise that to gain power elsewhere.

 

It will be interesting to see where this is going once there are more primed mods available.

Trying to fit them all won't work in some cases.

[Don_T_Shoot]

It will be interesting to see where this is going once there are more primed mods available.

Trying to fit them all won't work in some cases.

 

I welcome that time if/when it comes.   More tough decisions to make. 

 

You'll end up with some saying "no, I can't live without my Primed Flow and Primed Continuity" while the next Tenno will gladly forego one of those to fit in...Primed...I don't know, Redirection???  whatever it might be.  It will lead to more of that sort of thing and I think that is good.

 

If it leads to easily fitting in all Primed mods at once, then you have everyone with the same 'best' build.  Borrring.

[Chroia]

Bumped for adding in Equinox. (Spoiler: It conflicts.)

As far as frame-changes go, still haven't updated Frost builds, Mesa's unchanged, Ember's unchanged, and need to update Nyx.

Welp, eventually.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Chroia

[ashrah]

for exilus slot u have 2choice rush or handsprings all other  u can skip really