Chroia

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About Chroia

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  1. CRAP. This was not supposed to be posted yet, I'm still typing. Please hide/ignore for now. Okay, think that was everything. Disclaimer: Was not using Zenurik's dash. That's basically the only way to run a fair test. Same loadout as before. (Ignis W, Rad status Zakti, Kesheg) Ran 1 SO with a different build, as I'd hoped that the better duration'd counter the lower range, netting me better status chance in the proccess. No dice. Reverted to my [url=https://i.imgur.com/ukTlRx2.jpg]initial max range build[/url] and ran 1 Kuva Surv. Distinguishing between Toxin DoTs and Spores DoTs is even more crucial now, but no easier. Which contributes to: Spores is extremely unreliable now. I'll think I'm laying into a Spored crowd, and discover the Decaying! indicator. So my ranged Saryn's play devolved to perma ADS -> find enemy -> tap 1 -> tap LMB -> Repeat. This is both very concentration intensive, highly restrictive of your mobility, awareness, and subsequently survivability. In my Kuva Surv run, I literally spent more time staring at the minimap trying to find an enemy to Spore than anything else. Noped out at ~12 minutes, once I hit 50% air at the 10 min mark and discovered that the surv progressed better once I stopped using Spores and just stuck with my Toxic Lash-ed Ignis Wraith. Spores stacks sat between 80 and 200, when they didn't bottom out entirely. On the bright side, rarely ran out of energy. In my normal SO run, with 2 maxed Energize, I literally ran out of energy every other wave. As well as using up 6 revives, between less damage avoided via dodging and less agro avoided/damage healed from not having energy to use Molt basically ever. I only managed to pass 600 damage stacked once (more on that later), and never managed to start a round with more than 200 stacked damage. Holy crap, that decay is high. "Amusingly", best results I found were the last round when I literally said 'fk it' and Spores -> TL -> spin to win with a max-range-rivened (4/5) polearm the entire round. Broke 1k stacked damage, sat constantly as max eff for possibly the first time, least damage absorbed. Current verdict: Spores can kill stuff. Using it in that manner is high maintenance, stressful due to the high penalty for letting the ball drop (assuming you had an option to begin with, as you're limited by spawns and pathing), and less effective than simply using Toxic Lash and spraying AoE everywhere with either an Ignis Wraith or a Kesheg. As I see it, either: * Spores doesn't kill fast enough where it is, or * you lose the built up stacks too fast, or * the payoff to effort invested ratio is highly skewed and the game doesn't do anything to make your life easier in any way. I'd get better results ignoring Spores, or just taking a different frame and calling it a day.
  2. Chroia

    Dev Workshop: Spores Revisited (Saryn)

    You're right, actually. I wasn't. So thanks for that. There's nothing said about 'per spore'. In fact, it does say which is a third of what I thought. So, new vs. current - max growth of 20 per sec is just under 7 max-spored enemies, currently. That's... actually a fairly steep step down in any game mode with serious spawns. Welp, off to edit my reaction post.
  3. Chroia

    Dev Workshop: Spores Revisited (Saryn)

    Except that you'll carry over ~70-50% of your ramp-up between rounds now. Could you clarify what you're talking about here? Granted that I haven't read much on the forums recently, recasting currently does not spread spores, just removes them for an extra tick of damage to infected enemies, so I assume you're not talking about that? 2 damage per sec per spore, before Strength modifier. 3 spores per enemy, 10 enemies max. That's 60 damage per sec at base, nowhere near 300. I'd argue that the higher damage mitigated the need for more corrosive procs where applicable. Where no armor exists, it's just a damage nerf, obviously. That said, it does give DE control over how quickly Spores can ramp. The rest, I agree with.
  4. Chroia

    Dev Workshop: Spores Revisited (Saryn)

    Again, 'first reaction' post, writing as I read. Edits will be kept minimal. Speaking of edits: Since I forgot my manners before - Thanks for the info. It's good to have. Onward. Wonderful. This both removes the 'start, stop' of constantly (and sometimes accidentally) having to kill off a ramped infection because there's a bigger group of enemies elsewhere. Might even be able to divert some mods from absolute max range, which'd be nice. We'll see. Not entirely sure what you mean by the first line, but if it's a preface for the second line - I'm fine with that. I'd honestly be fine with simply being unable to cast Spores on already-infected enemies at all and calling it a day. I've got no problem with needing to spread Spores primarily via Toxic Lash rather than recasts. My issue was the no recast impacted coverage in any context where enemies spawned in widely spread groups - meaning everything that isn't E/SO. If that first line doesn't refer to the second, could you clarify, please? Ah, so I'm not crazy. Good to know. And even better, seeing it be fixed. Ooh, ouch. I guess I'll have to wait and see, but this feels like it's really going to hurt. Tone of voice doesn't carry over text, so I'll do the HK-50 thing: Interrogatively questioning - do you see this as having actually been a problem in any context that wasn't E/SO? Whaaa~?! Spores' problem, imo, was that it ramped up too slowly for being unable to be seeded elsewhere. Between the 'no spread on tick damage kill and this, how does this not effectively kill Spores as a damaging ability, turning it primarily into an armor stripping tool? How about, instead, we compare the 'maximum growth' between new and current? Seems it'd be a more enlightening comparison. New Spores has double the tick damage, 10 enemies (*3 spores per). Maximum growth is 60 damage/sec. Under the current Spores, that'd translate into (60 dps, divided among 3 spores = ) 20 currently infected enemies. Hm, given the concurrent spawn cap, this is not as terrible as I expected as first glance, as long as you're not staying in any mission past the first rot C, solo. Rather bad for any kind of longer run or a squad situation (let alone both) though. Also, absolute murder on her ramping in SO, but I expect that was the point. Hold up. It was pointed out to me that I read that wrong: There's no mention of 'per spore' in the new ramping. That puts us at: New Spores having a max growth of 2 damage (average of 1-3, I assume) per Infected enemy, cap of 10. That's a maximum damage growth of 20 per second, as per Under the current Spores, that'd translate into (20 dps, divided among 3 pores = ) 6.667 currently infected. On the bright side, that's reasonable in any non-respawning, star-chart-level solo mission. On the dark side, wow. That's terrible in any endless past the around first rot B if you're solo; terrible from the get-go if you're in a squad. It's absolutely nothing in E/SO. tbf, while I'm not sure what kind of 'fun factor' you're looking for, it was fun, in a "I have sown; I have toiled. And now I reap. Behold the fruits of my labor!" gratification sort of way. While counterbalanced by the fact that a ramped Infection burned itself out, it felt like 'payoff' rather than 'going out with a whimper'. This was literally one of a handful of places you can get that in current-iteration Warframe. And it was satisfying. So much for that. Thanks Obama Simaris ESO. (To be fair, I shouldn't be surprised. Experience shows that this is pretty standard DE MO - balance things around the best, mixmaxed farming scenarios, ignore that-and-how said changes will impact any other context. "This is why we can't have nice things - they're too good for farming in edge cases, so they can't exist at all".) Oh. Ohhhhh. Hm. So, on the one hand you can carry 50% of your current Infection between E/SO rounds, assuming instant transition. That paints things in a somewhat different light for E/SO. On the other hand, Nullifiers go from 'they dispel your Toxic Lash' to ' really going to fk you over'. Back to having to snipe bubbles from the outside. Thanks ESO. But, you know, outside of SO, what's your time to 50% damage, 20% damage, dieoff in a 'general use' case? 3 seconds, 6 and 8 seconds? That's pretty rough. It will let you 'carry over' an infection between spread out spawn groups, which is certainly nice. But if you've got a hiccough in spawns, that's not going to be enough to save your Infection. Nor is it enough to carry you between waves of Defence or Interception. (And that's ignoring the added ~15 seconds in the two tiles with a moving defense objective.) So I'm not entirely sure what the intent here is, in any context that isn't ESO (assuming that there is one)? ----- tl;dr - On the plus side, * Spores gets faster rampup, * can be recast at different locales, and * you get a bit of carry-over if you can re-seed it fast enough when it dies out. This is amazing. On the negative side, * Spores got capped max growth (not an issue for short runs and solo, detrimental outside that), * no longer spreads passively - meaning you're limited to things you can directly kill, meaning you're constrained by spawn logic and tile LoS lines, which I expect will kill your ability to sustain an Infection outside of Ext and SO (don't even think about trying a surv in the Kuva Fortress). Between the two of them, these two nerfs look like they'd limit your ability to actually use Spores anywhere that isn't SO, and the 'die-off delay' I estimated isn't going to be enough to counter that. And, as if that weren't enough: * -as a new addition- Nullifiers can zero out your infection, disincentivizing the simplest and most direct method of handling them. I'll have to try it out, but for all that the positive changes look amazing, the nerfs look like they invalidate them completely - practically speaking - and now you need to fear Nullifiers. That honestly doesn't feel like a worthwhile tradeoff.
  5. Chroia

    Word filter is abysmal

    Absolutely. But - speaking for myself, and even ignoring people possibly abusing their power to push an agenda - the ability to trade or recruit is too valuable to risk losing because I accidentally said something I didn't know was wrong verboten and triggered the bot (or someone with ban powers). So I've basically opted out of chat over the last year or so. Which has a negative impact on my investment in - and enjoyment of - Warframe, but -as you say- I can only play within the sandbox I'm given (or leave).
  6. Chroia

    Melee: Present and Future goals!

    This is wonderful. Doesn't affect attacks with large sweeps getting canceled due to hitting corners before hitting the enemies, but certainly a step in the right direction. On that note: Does this change, by any chance, affect LoS checks for abilities?
  7. A couple of notes I forgot in my initial feedback: * If you're looking to spread infection, Spores-ed enemies are too hard to discern from enemies simply Tox procced by Toxic Lash. Maybe it's just my min-graphics, but it basically devolves into clouds of numbers, and the only way to distinguish is to try and spot the corrosive status procs. Not very conducive to trying to rekindle a dying infection. * To elaborate: Enemy spawn-point density and spread incentivise camping a dead-end, as in Sewer camp. In SO/ESO, you're disincentivised from canceling your Spores - the spawn point density makes it likely that letting the Spores kill the last carrier will take long enough for new spawns to pop in to pick up the infection from its death. Outside of SO however, the restriction on seeding spores, combined with the encompassing spawns if you're in a hub tile either forces you to constantly be ending active Infections in one spot so you can start one in another, losing you both spend build-up time, as well as energy. An easy counter to that, ofc, is to hole up in a dead end, forcing all the spawns to bottleneck and infect each other. Which is, I believe, a play style you're trying to move away from?
  8. Right, so. In order, I've played solo through: 1 ESO, 1 SO, 2 SO starting unranked, 1 ESO, 1 Kuva Surv, 1 MD Kuva Flood. On the basis of the spawns in the last 2, I feel I can accurately extrapolate the experience in an Int, Ext, Spy, Cap or PoE bounties. This is my build and I'm primarily using a Zakti built for rad status. Saryn's very good in SO/ESO due to how enemies spawn everywhere, so spores keep spreading rather than burning out. Molt's nice but not huge without the augment. Miasma's pretty pointless. Either the area's small enough that Spores'll do the work, or too big for Miasma to hit much. Now for the bad. The change to Spores makes it effectively useless in anything that isn't SO. The combination of * removing the Molt <-> Spores interaction, * the 'recast = instant sterilization' and * staggered and/or spread out spawns means that Spores is at most affecting a fraction of the extant enemies at a time, and is constantly either burning itself out, or you're constantly extinguishing the (however ramped up) current infection so you can apply Spores elsewhere for the armor stripping - rendering Spores' damage effectively moot, despite theoretically huge possible numbers. I mean, I literally ended up with more weapon kills while trying to cultivate and husband my infection than actual Spores kills in the Kuva Surv. Don't even get me started on the MD. Toxic Lash is in an interesting spot. The fact that it pops spores is quite helpful. The added straight damage, however, puts it in conflict with Spores. If you don't need the extra damage from TL to kill enemies, you don't need Spores. If you do need to extra damage, you'd be better off letting Spores build up, doing both more armor stripping (improving your weapon damage) and more Spores damage (which TL would then let you spread). Translating the previous iteration to the current one, the Toxin proc inheritance let you 'jump start' Spores' damage. Either Spores needs to be easier to spread, or require less ramp-up. This could be achieved by (for instance) removing TL's +%Toxin damage and instead making it increment the Infection damage. The issue with that being that it'd now be entirely dependent on Spores to have any effect. Whether or not you see that as a problem (considering Nidus' kit), idk. tl;dr - Spores is excellent in SO modes, made useless elsewhere by its restricted delivery mechanic and constant burnouts. Molt is functional. The speed boost's nice but unimportant. Toxic Lash's Spore-popping's great in SO. Its +Toxin damage is of much greater effect anywhere else. Miasma I honestly haven't had much use for. Will need to try running Saryn on a less well equipped account, I guess.
  9. I'm unhappy to see that, despite the reams of feedback, neither was anything changes, nor any rationale or counterarguments given to commonly raised concerns. Edit: Correction - a concern regarding Miasma / Viral spreading was addressed - Miasma got more range but lost the damage buff and Toxin proc mult. That said, I will try and give it a fair test drive. Well, that's one way to increase sentinel differentiation. But why isn't Reawaken a global precept >_< (And what about the poor unloved, vastly-outperformed-by-a-dog Shade?) Hm, interesting. Not, I think, particularly useful, as you cant change your tools to address an enemy mid-mission, but it does get you the info before capping out your Codex (or visiting the wiki), I guess? Awesome.
  10. Chroia

    Melee: Present and Future goals!

    Okay, this is a 'first reaction' post. I'm literally writing it as I read. Edits will be kept minimal. Might revisit the thread tomorrow/sunday if I've thought of anything different or else. Wow, I literally haven't seen anyone do this in over 22 months. ... Ah. Well, I appreciate your at least saying this outright, even if you're de-emphasizing it. Yeah, alri- oooh S#&amp;&#036;. Um. Remember Viver? Remember the LoS restrictions on abilities? Remember those restrictions breaking those abilities in a large portion of your tiles (due to design decisions, read: lots of cover, few long, clear sight-lines)? Or, more recently - Remember melee weapons inside a Arctic Eximus globe or Null bubble hitting the bubble meaning it doesn't harm the one projecting it? Which, incidentally, is still the case? Weapon swings in Warframe are not a precision tool at the best of times. I can only imagine the heckstorm that'll happen when object collision breaks any melee with more range than a dagger. I hope you don't mind that I argue that assertion. * 100^% block, which requires that your melee be wielded, both putting you at a range disadvantage against anyone with a gun or aura, and subjecting you to the effing interminable weapon swap animations if you need a ranged option at any point. If you don't have a melee wielded, blocking, channeling and stances effectively don't exist. But let's put that aside for a second. * 100% block, with energy cost scaling to damage. -> Energy spent blocking is energy not spent on the -much more effective- frame abilities. * 100% block, in a frontal cone, which is useless in any mission with continuous perimeter spawns. So pretty much anything that isn't Exterminate. ^ 100% block, in a horde mode game. If you're blocking, you're not attacking. Honestly, the one good thing about Blocking was that it didn't restrict your mobility. Oh, and damage reflection falls off by level 30, and that's before considering the opportunity cost of not just using that energy for your actual abilities. Well yeah, it's pretty but it's got very little to recommend it as an actual gameplay mechanic, as per above. Alright, will bide. Okay. Again: 1) Warframe's a scaling horde mode game. 2) There's no encounter design, it's all handled via weighted and capped RNG spawns. The only time 'burning your cooldowns' is worth using is against a VIP, or a closed/non-scaling mission. This means exterminates, boss missions (ignoring health gates), and assassins. Unless building a counter-stack is trivial, it's not worth consuming at any other time. Gib a heavy/eximus now, the next spawns in 20-30 sec, assuming you don't have multiple onscreen to begin with. Look, from experience and observation, for people who aren't melee fanatics, this is how the melee-progression works: - 'Braton kills bishes'. - 'Or not. Panic-spam E and hope your targets die before you do.' - 'Wow, that air slam does some good CC.' - *discovers ground finishers* - ... - eventually gets a 2nd elemental damage mod, a Serration, and mostly stops using melee except as an ocassional panic CC airslam. - Sooner or later, the damage falls off, and the player returns to melee. - Player learns about Damage 2.0 and armor, farms Fleeting Expertise, and effectively never uses melee again. - {Optional) Gets Maiming Strike/slide-crit riven. Proceeds to spin-to-win forever. Heavy attacks suffer from animation lag - any ranged target's gonna retreat faster than your anim unleashes the attack, (and any heavy has probably already killed you with their burst DPS/AOE DoT, and any assassin or boss's too dangerous to play sitting duck with) and a poor Damage <-> Time tradeoff - they're simply not effective to use even when they do connect. 'Cool factor', sure. But any actual point in playing like this? [size=14]![/size] Holy crap, this is HUGE. One of the myriad main issues plaguing melee is animation lock. Wow. This could be huge. Awesome. Any chance this includes hitbox matching weapon size? Stance combos are problematic, and have been since forever. Pulling them off is an exercise in pedantic, mind-numbing button-press counting, timing is impacted by attack speed, which suffers from the fact that more attack speed is always beneficial (and that's before taking anim-lock into account), certain combos restrict your movement, and - oh yeah, most of them do cause anim-lock. (And the reason I harp on anim lock: it makes you a literal sitting duck, open, vulnerable and rooted.) I assume it'd be too much to hope that you're going to rework combos entirely, but I can't help but feel you'd be better served going the beat'em'up route: Ditch the combo tree system. Stances are now 'styles' (e.g. Sparring can get Capoera, Muy Thai, Karate), equipping one unlocking a set of command-moves from that combat style, giving the player a themed toolbox of moves from that style. Each move is a standalone, self-contained, one-shot attack with different properties (damage vs. speed, yes/no distance closer, crit chance, procs, hitboxes, knockdown, conditional effects; and so on). Sure, some moves will be easier to use, some more useful, but (at least theoretically) now you've removed anim-lock entirely, and the player has reason to do something beyond EEEEEE and is rewarded for it. At least to start with, this oughtn't be too difficult to implement (I think), as you've got loads of individual attack animations to draw on. The harder part'll probably be managing the inputs, because controllers. But that's just my personal pipe-dream. ====================== On a semi-related note: [size=12]Any chance that you'll revisit/remove crit?[/size] Rewarding skill with damage is (supposed to be headshot/crit volume's job). Crit, as it stands, particularly on guns, where intentional headshots are possible, is purely a passive, opaque, non-interactive damage multiplier. There could be some merit to in melee as a payoff for specific buildups, but in the 'combo tree' paradigm that's already handled by forced combo damage mults and/or procs.
  11. Chroia

    Developer Workshop: Saryn Revisited 2.0

    This is both not the reason, and not needed. In other words, you couldn't cast Spores on Molt even once, let alone twice. --- Eh, that's a reasonable argument. I still don't like the change for the reason I gave, but I'll accept it.
  12. Chroia

    Developer Workshop: Saryn Revisited 2.0

    While I don't know why these changes are happening, I'm (almost) not embarrassed to say that I literally squeed when I saw this. I missed Saryn under Damage 1.0. I found OG Saryn under Damage 2.0 to be 75% useless (1-3), 25% niche (min dur Miasma). I liked the idea of the interactions in Saryn Revisited. (An incarnation of an infection, spreading a disease that grows more powerful as the infection spreads - essentially the debuff counterpart of what Nidus later came to be. Nidus' spreads his Infestation to make him stronger, Saryn tends her Infection to make it stronger.) But the implementation felt so forced and power hungry that I just couldn't. Which was sad, because while I didn't love Saryn, Saryn Prime is absolutely gorgeous. Granted, some if this is simply due to Warframe's technical state (or standards?) improving in the 3ish years inbetween. So yeah, Saryn getting a better implementation of an appealing concept, on a frame that's already visually appealing? I'm (trying to remain cautiously) quite excited. Amen. Glad to see this changed. If multiple tools don't work independently, it's a dependency not a synergy. Amen. See Molt note, but having some guaranteed uptime is an immense improvement - and might make Molt worth using in level 60+ missions that aren't a turtle mode.. While I never saw the point of this (Spores + Torid/Gas Lanka all the way), I can live with Sayrn being less braindead. *Shrug* honestly. This is an opaque change, and as far as I can tell not very significant, which just contributes to general stat bloat. Hrm. Interesting. Does it still interact with toxin procs? Edit: Stream says 'no' 😞 This is a pretty darn big deal. Also, I'm honestly surprised to see infinite duration, given that it was explicitly removed from Gara's Mass Vitrify, with an extreme reduction to its survival time and a scaling mechanic that's of dubious use. This makes sense to me, given the much higher proc rate of Spores over Miasma, as well as Spores now working as setup, letting Miasma act as a crescendo. Assuming that the damage is there. Otherwise it's just a anticlimax. The corollary, of course, is that Spores is now hugely less effective against Infested and Corpus, due to no longer halving their health while not benefiting from the Corrosive procs either. :/ And with a 15m base range, Miasma doesn't really have the range for wide area Viral application, I don't think. Maybe stop it popping Spores and have Spores extend Miasma's Viral proc range? Edit: Or just have a Spores-ed enemy suffering a Viral proc apply it to all other Spores-ed enemies, I guess? Then they still interact, though it's no longer the same 'set them up and knock them down'. Since tone doesn't carry in text: this is a bewildered question. (Given that Spores is now infinite, and scales by time,) Why would I ever rather wipe out my ramped up Infestation (let alone for a mere 2 ticks worth of damage) rather than letting me seed spores in a new place if I'm afraid of the infection burning out where it currently is? Edit: Clarified the question's phrasing Erm... why? If you have Spore stripping armor, Corrosive to allies is both unneeded; and loses the Damage 2.0 multiplier. Cheers. If nothing else, all things being equal, this gives molt 8+ seconds of uptime. (4 invul, 4 sec to drain the time the damage absorbed, plus time to drain the innate HP.) Which is up from the <1 sec past starchart. Amen. Ah! Contagion Cloud's pretty much never been worth using, as melee already had ~equal range to the cloud. But if it works with guns, and keeps its ability to proc toxin and pop spores, I am suddenly able to use so many more weapons than just Torid/Lanka/Ignis/Pox. (Some other possibilities, such as M Cernos exists, but are mostly sub-par.) This makes me happy. :) Edit: Scratch all that. I use Contagion Cloud so infrequently that I forgot that Contagion Cloud is a flat (tiny) amount, disconnected from your weapon's damage. Welp, sticking with the current arsenal. Edit 2: Scratch all that. Spores apparently no longer transmit Toxin DoTs, making all this moot from the word go. Replies inline in red Looking forward to seeing this, and fingers crossed.
  13. Chroia

    Developer Workshop: Saryn Revisited 2.0

    Be careful what you wish for.... *PTSD flashes of the devstream video of making the Nox sounds intensifies*
  14. Hey Megan, any chance these today-to-today posts could include a relative time rather than, or on top of, absolute time? In other words: X will be starting then this post is 8 hours old. As I'm about to say there: I'm looking forward to it.
  15. Chroia

    Where is update 22.20.0?!

    \o/ Making Warframe a more better game is worth waiting for new stuff to rank up. I approve, keep it up 👍