The Warframe Market Is A Joke And Actively Discourages Impulse Purchases (Updated, Includes Solution To Installed Catalysts/weapon Slot On Weapons)

[SymphNo9]

In my opinion, shifting the platinum costs toward boosters instead of as direct purchases might help more.As an example, besides the Credit & Affinity Boosters one can buy, adding an Item Find Booster, Foundry Booster, Clan Construction Booster, and a Mod Finder Booster would encourage people to spend platinum to have an easier time. It would encourage people to play more, as the platinum purchases would be biased toward giving people an easier time, not toward instant gratification.

I despise consumables, including temporary boosters, but that is just me. Having the feeling of, well, temporary stuff is disheartening, like when shooter games offer you to rent a gun for X time or fork out real money to get it permanently.

[rhoenix]

I despise consumables, including temporary boosters, but that is just me. Having the feeling of, well, temporary stuff is disheartening, like when shooter games offer you to rent a gun for X time or fork out real money to get it permanently.

While I understand, having those consumables last for 3-7 days like the present Boosters would go quite far to alleviate your problems with them, I think. The basic idea is to shift the player's conception of spending platinum to making things easier, not instant - this would help replayability, and encourage more people to spend money regularly over time. Make sure the Boosters cover every major area where a player is likely to have to wait for something (getting something to drop, getting something to finish crafting, getting a rare material to drop, etc.) would cover all the bases.

In this way, they could even remove the platinum-only weapons & warframes from the Market and leave just the Boosters listed above along with the starter weapons and weapon schematics, and the Market would still make quite a bit of money on platinum purchases.

[SymphNo9]

While I understand, having those consumables last for 3-7 days like the present Boosters would go quite far to alleviate your problems with them, I think. The basic idea is to shift the player's conception of spending platinum to making things easier, not instant - this would help replayability, and encourage more people to spend money regularly over time. Make sure the Boosters cover every major area where a player is likely to have to wait for something (getting something to drop, getting something to finish crafting, getting a rare material to drop, etc.) would cover all the bases.In this way, they could even remove the platinum-only weapons & warframes from the Market and leave just the Boosters listed above along with the starter weapons and weapon schematics, and the Market would still make quite a bit of money on platinum purchases.

I think the main reason why I hate the concept so much is because in many games when you activate a booster, the timer will keep ticking whether you are online or not. Creating this unnecessary feeling of wasting your money because you aren't online playing the game and making use of the booster. The fair solution would be that the timer only ticks when the player is online. Kind of like in S4 League, where you rent a gun but the timer only decreases as you use it.

[rhoenix]

I think the main reason why I hate the concept so much is because in many games when you activate a booster, the timer will keep ticking whether you are online or not. Creating this unnecessary feeling of wasting your money because you aren't online playing the game and making use of the booster. The fair solution would be that the timer only ticks when the player is online. Kind of like in S4 League, where you rent a gun but the timer only decreases as you use it.

That would be a good stipulation in return - have all the Boosters only tick time down while you're actually logged in and playing.

[MJ12]

I want to reply to some of Mak_Gohae's greatest hits. I do not understand why he monomanically defends any decision DE has made, and the worse it is the more he defends it. If DE made it so that you had to Aztec ritual sacrifice a baby to get anywhere in this game (Murder to Win? M2W) he would be around defending it, saying that your capitalistic decadent western lifestyle kills plenty of starving orphans, why are you whining about killing a few more?

 

Is DE a big company? No.

There are a lot of small companies around the world selling 500 dollar jeans which do real well.

 

Mak Gohae doesn't know what a Veblen Good is. Those 500 dollar jeans are worth it because of their price. You buy them specifically because they're expensive.

 

It's like very expensive alcohol or watches. The more expensive they are, ironically, the more people want to buy them because they are symbols of how much money you can throw around. Unfortunately, a Hek isn't a Veblen good. If I buy a Hek or a Strun attractive women don't go 'wow this is an awesome weapon you have tons of money and are incredibly sexy please let me make sweet love to you'. When they do, DE can make their weapons cost as much as they want.

 

 

Isnt everything that is cosmetic just five bucks?

And, yeah, if every warframe and weapon was cheap then the number of people farming for stuff would be lowered since there is no need for it. And that would create a tremendous split in the players.

 

 

 

So people would be... buying Warframes and weapons instead of farming for them? Ding ding ding you've figured out the entire point! People should be doing exactly that. In DE's dream world nobody ever farms for weapons or Warframes, they just buy them because it makes them way the hell more money.

 

 

Mak Gohae tries to see every possible angle to things because those angles are there, stuff doesnt always have just one single path, one single possibility.

 

Mak Gohae using his super ability to see many different angles is the person that discovered how to use Radial Blast and get the maximum damage while everyone else was crying over how it did no damage.

 

Mak Gohae will now be known as Mak "Many Angles" Gohae.

 

So because you spent like 300 hours in this game (while fanatically defending decisions everyone thought was bad because 'I got mine, f**k you') you now know a ton about economics too? Let me tell you what you're doing right now.

 

It's called the Dunning-Kruger effect.

 

I do, in fact, have an economics degree and he's almost certainly right, considering literally nobody ever prices F2P games like that. Lemme find another one of your posts to segue into that...

 

 

Dude.... let's pick a game that has a PvE section and lets study their market and compare it to Warframe.

Let's just stop using PvP games completely, let's see how two PvE games work their markets and let's see how different they are.

 

I keep mentioning PvE games because it seems from what a lot of you folks posts have NOT played F2P PvE games so all your experience comes from PvP game. And for some strange reason you folks think that what works for PvP must work for PvE with absolutely no basis to that argument.

 

 

In DCUO, which is 90+% PvE and made by Sony, which does tons of F2P games, spending 9.99 gets me:

 

1. Several hours of new gameplay, often with entirely new mechanics

 

2. The ability to get some achievements, increasing my personal character power by a few percentage points (yes, 'pay to win', but it's like a 1% difference)

 

3. Tons of new models for stuff and new armor/weapons styles (cosmetics)

 

4. A new weapon and/or powerset. Given that it takes a fair bit to level from 1-30 and there's a ton of post level cap content (in fact at lv30 you are probably only 10% to where you want to be) this is actually more valuable than a single new Warframe.

 

Alternatively you can get all of this with a monthly subscription which also gives you their equivalent to platinum (station cash) free every month for cosmetics and XP/cash boosters/other things. So if we're looking at PvE equivalents, DE should sell a Warframe, a weapon, an entire new tileset, and some mods for 150 plat. Note that DCUO is not The Most Popular F2P MMORPG Ever Made or even close to it. Yet it's quite profitable while selling gameplay for so cheap.

 

[Tvol]

The only time I used plat to buy weapons was indirectly by buying credit packs and then the weapons after some very quick math in my head noting that that was a better deal, and not so damn expensive. Since those were removed, I haven't bothered dumping any play on anything else. DE already has my money, and a fair bit of it, but at this rate, I'll be damned if they see any more of it any time soon. I'll stretch my remaining platinum for all it's worth (since the Founder's packs actually had the only reasonable conversion rate to real currency I've seen in the history of WF).

And I got an okay rate on the in-game currency because of a massive bulk-buy with the founder's program. If I were coming at this as a new player I'd be in the same boat I myself am in with War Thunder: No F-ing way, no how, not while I still haven't had a hemispherctomy.

My clan has also sworn off paying for Forma to build our dojo. Five per room? Hell five for a hallway? Screw it. We actively discourage members from dumping such ludicrous amounts of money out the window (and we did the math too, based on our floor plan, which came out to into the hundreds of dollars; so no, bugger it we're sure aren't tempted, and we aren't small either; about 25-30 people and counting now, depending on how many of our hundred or so from Planetside 2 join in...sigh; way to miss opportunity DE).

[TinyLesbianRobot]

All my +1, baby.

[HellishWind]

This guy knows his MARKETING unlike DE

[Donyxz]

I strongly agree with this toppic. I've already blown the cash, so it isn't that i want it cheaper for my convenience. logically, i should want the stuff i payed for to cost more but this isnt a matter of pride, but of principle. I hope this thread gets noticed.

[Vyaldyn]

Well, I don't know about you but I don't have any insight on how their database infrastructure is. So it is all just assumption saying it won't cost them anything. Then why would Steve post-pone the optional reset for so long, if it was that easy? Because they were freakin' spending man hours on making the god forsaken thing.

The problem probably isn't the database structure but the code required to roll through the logs checking all your platinum purchases and exclusive items in order to refund those after the reset is done. It needs extensive testing with loads of different accounts with different purchase history and exclusive items.

[YourFriendlyNoggin]

I'm worried that DE will take all this feedback, make a knee jerk reaction and ruin their profits by accident. They need to make their own judgement on this case, it's pretty much the only situation where player feedback is unsafe. We don't know all the behind doors information, sales figures and profit margins. Everything in the market might be complete but that doesn't mean they have covered costs, who knows how much development costs and without a publisher supporting them a big step like this could break them if it goes wrong.

Also impulse buying is actively encouraged but it's not in the market technically, the foundry is where the magic happens, for just a few plat you can skip all those waiting times, if DE decides to lower costs that's where I would start, but like I said above that's not for me to decide.

[hypersplash]

The requested change seems good and more in line with reality i think. I see nothing wrong with that. I seriously doubt many people drop platinum for the weapons or warframes due to those prices who will be lost sales anyway if the craft them in foundry so why not make the barrier of entry lower? less money is better than no money. Its all in a digital space anyway so there is no cost to them.

 

Another thing they have to push out is the customization options already. Seriously, for a free to play game Warframe has totally no ways to customize other frames and weapons other than helmets and color. Come on DE. Add wonderful items that have no gameplay impact expect making use look badass so you can have more money! Within reason of course.

[Inhimilis]

One of the reasons I hate the high prices on stuff is that ones account gains pretty fast value once you have spent enough time in it, what will happen is account selling will become commonplace for ppl who cant be &#!'d to farm and want a cheaper alternative to the expensive market.

[Story4]

One of the reasons I hate the high prices on stuff is that ones account gains pretty fast value once you have spent enough time in it, what will happen is account selling will become commonplace for ppl who cant be &#!'d to farm and want a cheaper alternative to the expensive market.

 

Hmm interesting point, didn't think of that.

[Vyaldyn]

Its all in a digital space anyway so there is no cost to them.

There's no cost on the items, but the money we pay for those goes for covering servers (which probably cost thousands a month) and paying people's salary. They have a cost for a reason.

[HellishWind]

more sells means more money few sells for high price  is always less

[SymphNo9]

The problem probably isn't the database structure but the code required to roll through the logs checking all your platinum purchases and exclusive items in order to refund those after the reset is done. It needs extensive testing with loads of different accounts with different purchase history and exclusive items.

 

Yes and no. Where are the logs stored? In their database.

 

For the optional reset, it takes less than two seconds after you have confirmed, to virtually delete and create your account anew. During that process, the algorithm is probably looking for pointers regarding platinum purchases and vanity items, for a proper restore. Meaning, it is not the time complexity which is the bottleneck.

 

However, as Steve wrote in the original thread, they do not restore the 100 platinum gift which were given to CBT players. This implies either one of two things. a) They do not want to restore the gift, even if they could. b) The database has not logged them due to the core nature of how it is built.

 

I think we can safely assume it is more likely the latter. Which suggests it is more a database complexity rather than a time complexity.

[hypersplash]

There's no cost on the items, but the money we pay for those goes for covering servers (which probably cost thousands a month) and paying people's salary. They have a cost for a reason.

What i meant with the no cost is the price of the items. To keep their server running and salaries would cost the same whether the platinum prices are high or low. By lowering the prices i'm sure more people would be happy to pay. As it stands the prices are too high that people are not even buying them unless they put down money for the upper founder packages and stuff. I dont really see the reason to limit your market when it can be expanded for everyone at no cost to yourself. I may be wrong here though. Feel free to correct me if it does hurt them to lower and standardize the prices.

[Niryco]

I'm worried that DE will take all this feedback, make a knee jerk reaction and ruin their profits by accident. They need to make their own judgement on this case, it's pretty much the only situation where player feedback is unsafe. We don't know all the behind doors information, sales figures and profit margins. Everything in the market might be complete but that doesn't mean they have covered costs, who knows how much development costs and without a publisher supporting them a big step like this could break them if it goes wrong.

 

This i agree too as there is no substantial source to declare the statistically sales of the virtual goods and if the demand for the good were price inelastic, chances are increasing the prices would generate more profit. I think overall the devs most likely took a look at this post and said a no to any of these changes since probably a separate finance department are handling the profits so probably op may even be wrong here despite what seems to be a "good idea"

Edited May 28, 2013 by Jacate

[HellishWind]

DE employ this guy 

[Eurhetemec]

I always wonder if DE intend to refine the prices in the long run. It seems like currently, Warframe is priced in a way that is aimed almost entirely at whales (i.e. people who spend truly profligately), and rather antithetical to more "typical purchasers". I personally bought the Founder's Pack because I liked the game, and have been extremely reluctant to spend the actual platinum, simply because you seem to get so little bang for your buck when you buy anything non-cosmetic (cosmetic prices seem reasonable). This in turn makes the game less fun, which makes me play less, so I thus am even less likely to spend more on further platinum.

 

Whereas were weapons and frames more cheaply priced, I'd probably be on the third-level founder's pack or have bought plat on top of the second-level one.

 

I guess what I wonder is if it's more profitable to target the whales initially, because they do exist, especially in this sort of more "macho" game.

Edited May 28, 2013 by Eurhetemec

[BraveDude8]

DE employ this guy 

 

Going a bit far don't you think?

 

Details can be argued about later, but there has to be change.

[Vyaldyn]

What i meant with the no cost is the price of the items. To keep their server running and salaries would cost the same whether the platinum prices are high or low. By lowering the prices i'm sure more people would be happy to pay. As it stands the prices are too high that people are not even buying them unless they put down money for the upper founder packages and stuff. I dont really see the reason to limit your market when it can be expanded for everyone at no cost to yourself. I may be wrong here though. Feel free to correct me if it does hurt them to lower and standardize the prices.

I agree. To me, it just sounded like you were reasoning the price lowering with the lack of costs.

[Kantazo]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

[v3rninater]

I'd have to agree with this, simple facts, and would help during this off-season of people complaining about the Update 8 Void stuff.