No One Realises It Is A Farming Nerf

[TheBrsrkr]

*checks Braton Prime*

*checks AkBoltos and Pyrana*

*checks Scindo Prime*

I wasn't aware all my stuff got blanket nerfed to do 6 damage. The stats look the same. Maybe it's a bug on your end? Or maybe you shouldn't assume that every little change is some excuse to shake your fist at DE for wanting you to play the game? Maybe?

[PsychedelicSnake]

The fact that you guys require Saryn for farming as mandatory gameplay shows just how bad the "minmax/meta this meta that/H>Draco" community is.

Pretty much. We also have to take into account the total rework of the Starchart, which will undoubtedly do away with Draco. We're too busy focusing on the short term and not spending enough time in how it plays out in the long term.

[PainisDeWitt]

didnt answer the question at all and ive seen that too never said it doesnt happen. i am waiting for you to tell me how to play the game though

 

Your question has been answered, but I'll do it too.

There's not a "Right way" to play the game but Draco's meta is just stupid. I just said that you need to actually play the game like... there's a world out there besides Draco, y'know?

 

And, as I said before Saryn's rework is not a farming nerf... It's just a rework, nothing else

[Margnon]

It would actually be a lot easier to just list the ones that require no skill at all and still need a rework. Just start going through a mental list of abilities and you'll see what I mean pretty quickly. 

you are dodging the question. What defines no skill. Instant death? huge amounts of damage? is that the only criteria? because a nyx can easily nullify a big room with the press of a key. Is that OP? is chroma's armor OP? is decoy OP?

[swihart91]

ok draco is literally i place i go just to rank up new equipment so i can go back to having fun playing with what i actually like to use with my friends. its not like i go play this mission all day every day and is the only thing i know how to play. its a quick mindless way to grind out what you have to then go back to have fun with what you actually like doing

 

i dont like ranking up new stuff especially when it is an item like the new twin axes that came out and are complete garbage. i would much rather get rid of them as quick as possible especially when it uses 2 of my favorite weapons as is

Edited November 5, 2015 by swihart91

[PsychedelicSnake]

ok draco is literally i place i go just to rank up new equipment so i can go back to having fun playing with what i actually like to use with my friends. its not like i go play this mission all day every day and is the only thing i know how to play. its a quick mindless way to grind out what you have to then go back to have fun with what you actually like doing

"mindless way to grind"

 

That's the exact problem.

[swihart91]

Your question has been answered, but I'll do it too.

There's not a "Right way" to play the game but Draco's meta is just stupid. I just said that you need to actually play the game like... there's a world out there besides Draco, y'know?

 

And, as I said before Saryn's rework is not a farming nerf... It's just a rework, nothing else

and you are saying that but is it not directly effecting the efficiency at which she can farm, im not saying she cant do damage im strictly meaning the speed and efficiency at which she can farm

[Tesseract7777]

you are dodging the question. What defines no skill. Instant death? huge amounts of damage? is that the only criteria? because a nyx can easily nullify a big room with the press of a key. Is that OP? is chroma's armor OP? is decoy OP?

 

I'm not dodging the question. You asked an obvious bait question because you're going for the tired old "everything is op so nothing is op never adjust/nerf anything" argument, and setting up big strawmen for yourself to knock down. 

 

I answered your question, and if you think about it it should be obvious just how many skills are NOT like the previous miasma. I don't need to give you a full list because that's utterly ridiculous. 90%+ of the skills require way more skill to reach their full potential, I'm not going to list most of the skills in the game for you. Skill is defined by player input. How many button presses doesn't define required skill for an ability, it's about how much input is required from you to get it's full potential. Pre-change Mesa and Saryn required no input whatsoever for their ultimates to reach the ultimates full potential. This is something that will eventually be changed for all skills, and we all need to accept that. 

[swihart91]

"mindless way to grind"

 

That's the exact problem.

whats the problem with that, why wouldnt i grind a terrible weapon like the balsok out as quickly as possible they aren't good in the slightest and take 2 weapons to make as is so yes im going to grind them the quickest most mind numbing way possible so i dont have to realise i just speant argon on this terrible terrible weapon

[PsychedelicSnake]

whats the problem with that, why wouldnt i grind a terrible weapon like the balsok out as quickly as possible they aren't good in the slightest and take 2 weapons to make as is so yes im going to grind them the quickest most mind numbing way possible so i dont have to realise i just speant argon on this terrible terrible weapon

It's become increasingly clear as this thread has gone on that we're just going in circles at this point. It's obvious there's nothing anyone can say for anyone else to understand or change their mind, so I'm going to wash my hands of this madness.

[Margnon]

I'm not dodging the question. You asked an obvious bait question because you're going for the tired old "everything is op so nothing is op never adjust/nerf anything" argument, and setting up big strawmen for yourself to knock down. 

 

I answered your question, and if you think about it it should be obvious just how many skills are NOT like the previous miasma. I don't need to give you a full list because that's utterly ridiculous. 90%+ of the skills require way more skill to reach their full potential, I'm not going to list most of the skills in the game for you. Skill is defined by player input. How many button presses doesn't define required skill for an ability, it's about how much input is required from you to get it's full potential. Pre-change Mesa and Saryn required no input whatsoever for their ultimates to reach the ultimates full potential. This is something that will eventually be changed for all skills, and we all need to accept that. 

I can press 1 and be a monster with mirage, I can press 4 and last 40+ plus in survival with valkyr. I can press 3 and nullify a room with nyx. I can press 2 and negate all damage with limbo, I can press 2 with loki (you know the rest, hell, even his 4). I can press 3 and have a super shield with frost. If the difference between the op and good skills is that one kills the enemies for me, and the other one makes them piss easy to kill, is not that different. Hell, if we are going to get nit picky, melee is the only thing in this game that needs inputs to reach full potential.

Edited November 5, 2015 by Margnon

[Tesseract7777]

 Hell, if we are going to get nit picky, melee is the only thing in this game that needs inputs to reach full potential.

 

I'm not the one getting nit picky, and it's who you said that about melee, not me. I certainly don't agree. I'm going to agree to disagree. Your idea of how skill input works in this game is completely removed from how I see things. There is no point to further this conversation. I could have a long conversation explaining why most of those skills require a certain level of skill input to get their potential -- although some of what you mentioned also needs balancing -- but I don't think there would be much point. I think you would simply disagree saying that "everything is op" and that therefore nothing should ever be balanced. 

 

You are welcome to that opinion, but I don't think we will ever see eye to eye.  

[Margnon]

I'm not the one getting nit picky, and it's who you said that about melee, not me. I certainly don't agree. I'm going to agree to disagree. Your idea of how skill input works in this game is completely removed from how I see things. There is no point to further this conversation. I could have a long conversation explaining why most of those skills require a certain level of skill input to get their potential -- although some of what you mentioned also needs balancing -- but I don't think there would be much point. I think you would simply disagree saying that "everything is op" and that therefore nothing should ever be balanced. 

 

You are welcome to that opinion, but I don't think we will ever see eye to eye.  

nah, my opinion is not that everything is op. Hell, I have no opinion over this change, I didn't touch saryn after leveling her. I just want some consistency with these changes. For example, look at ember, she is practically the new saryn. Are they going to nerf her? Or at least a guideline.

[taiiat]

or even the fact i might not be able to catch up playing casually

oh, you certainly can. obtaining anything and completing any task in Warframe has only consistently gotten easier over the years.

 

the tasks what Players used to spend N hours doing, now Players do twice as much in 1/16 of the time/gameplay.

 

ok draco is literally i place i go just to rank up new equipment so i can go back to having fun playing with what i actually like to use with my friends.

you could also just not use Equipment that you dislike, and your problem is completely absolved already!

there's much to choose from.

 

what you're saying is "i have to level everything even if i don't like it for Mastery because because".

which is patently untrue and quite hilarious of you to say.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

what you're saying is "i have to level everything even if i don't like it for Mastery because because".

which is patently untrue and quite hilarious of you to say.

WRONG! DE locks content behind MR, so to use what you want to use, you have to use a whole lot more of what you don't.

[4G3NT_0R4NG3]

WRONG! DE locks content behind MR, so to use what you want to use, you have to use a whole lot more of what you don't.

 

I've gotten to a MR where I can use whatever I want by only leveling up things I liked.

 

I guess it really depends on how picky you are, or how much you're willing to experiment.

[NoPainNoPotato]

Saryn gets nerfed, ppl will just play excalibur instead, and if they nerf exc, the players will find a new map/frame, because thats how it works, everyone want to make the most out of their time. The question is, how many shi ti reworks that ruin frames diversity will it take to get to the farm speed that the devs want?

Edited November 5, 2015 by NoPainNoPotato

[REXO12]

people crying cause saryn is no longer like this 

 

now you have to place your molt spore it lash it watch the world burn around you

Edited November 5, 2015 by REXO12

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

I've gotten to a MR where I can use whatever I want by only leveling up things I liked.

 

I guess it really depends on how picky you are, or how much you're willing to experiment.

People were fine stopping at MR8 because there was nothing locked behind a rank higher than that . . . then they released MR 12 locked items. There is now a precedent for new gear being MR locked, never mind things like daily trades. So now, it feels like an obligation to level everything.

[dancingknight]

Just realize that Warframe is about farming. That is "literally" the whole point of the game. There is very little story and very limited variations in the gameplay. 

The point of the game is to collect, build, level and re-level. For this reason, DE does not want to make farming too easy because that is what the game is. 

The sooner you realize this, the better it is for you. Just play and try to have fun. 

[DiabolicalHamSandwich]

Yeaaaaa no....farming would be a distant side effect at best. Pilfering was a farming nerf, greedy pull was a multi layered nerf that farming was apart of. Those two are nerfs, if anything this was to adjust the nuke capabilities of the 4 and what you feel in the farms is a ripple~

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Just realize that Warframe is about farming. That is "literally" the whole point of the game. There is very little story and very limited variations in the gameplay. 

The point of the game is to collect, build, level and re-level. For this reason, DE does not want to make farming too easy because that is what the game is. 

The sooner you realize this, the better it is for you. Just play and try to have fun. 

If farming is the whole point, then why would you want to make it more tedious and less fun?  The only answer is to get people to pay real money to skip the tedium. DE doesn't want to make it too easy for your benefit. They want it to be tedious, so you will be more likely to spend platinum on it instead.

[dancingknight]

If farming is the whole point, then why would you want to make it more tedious and less fun?  The only answer is to get people to pay real money to skip the tedium. DE doesn't want to make it too easy for your benefit. They want it to be tedious, so you will be more likely to spend platinum on it instead.

Well, duh... Did I have to spell it out? You sure did.

 

And if you think farming isn't the whole point of the game, you're diluting yourself. 

[Tesseract7777]

Well, duh... Did I have to spell it out? You sure did.

 

And if you think farming isn't the whole point of the game, you're diluting yourself. 

 

The game is about having fun, not farming. Unless you just really love farming, I hope that isn't the whole game for you. Sounds pretty boring to me. 

 

Also it's "deluding" not "diluting". 

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Well, duh... Did I have to spell it out? You sure did.

 

And if you think farming isn't the whole point of the game, you're diluting yourself. 

The problem is that there needs to be a balance.  If you make everything so tedious that it becomes unfun to play, like a lot of these reworks, then instead of just bypassing the grind by paying, people just stop playing.