The Not So Masterful Thief: Prop Lockers Are Lame

[TunaMayo]

Oh that's kinda cool. I figured you had to walk up to each one and try to open it, and that it would still be red even though it opened. It's nice that you can just walk by them instead.

 

And although I think it's lame that there are prop lockers, I don't think people should be so quick to call DE a S#&$ty company and that this is the fault of S#&$ty idea from the S#&$ty design council. Calm down. For all we know load times were being affected from having to process rooms full of real lockers so they saved some CPU time and made most of them props.

 

No one is slating DE for this, the props were probably just placed in the early stages of the game to fill up some space so tiles don't feel so empty with minimal programming required, fairly easily remedied i believe. 

 

I don't think you should be so quick to slate the Design Council either, the mod idea was a great one, 40% chance to open all lockers? material farming just got a lot easier!! Especially with four people with the mod on!!! 

 

How was anyone other than DE meant to know about the prop containers, if they are props that is.

 

I doubt a room full of real lockers would have any significant impact on your CPU, and if it did, why did they not care about my FPS when they made the Void!? I have a fairly decent rig, but after U8 i get fps drops to freezing point all the time and my fan goes haywire. I would like some confirmation on this, but -: I think the game isn't optimised for multiple cores yet in order to retain low min specs.

[Onite]

No one is slating DE for this, the props were probably just placed in the early stages of the game to fill up some space so tiles don't feel so empty with minimal programming required, fairly easily remedied i believe. 

 

I don't think you should be so quick to slate the Design Council either, the mod idea was a great one, 40% chance to open all lockers? material farming just got a lot easier!! Especially with four people with the mod on!!! 

 

How was anyone other than DE meant to know about the prop containers, if they are props that is.

 

I doubt a room full of real lockers would have any significant impact on your CPU, and if it did, why did they not care about my FPS when they made the Void!? I have a fairly decent rig, but after U8 i get fps drops to freezing point all the time and my fan goes haywire. I would like some confirmation on this, but -: I think the game isn't optimised for multiple cores yet in order to retain low min specs.

 

They worked before and there were more lockers in tiles before the latest updates. Its been purposely changed. What does that tell you?

[Volt_Cruelerz]

I hope the new images will make things a bit easier to understand now! 

 

Thank you! :)

[TunaMayo]

They worked before and there were more lockers in tiles before the latest updates. Its been purposely changed. What does that tell you?

Wait hat worked before? All the lockers?

[Onite]

Wait hat worked before? All the lockers?

Yes, in previous patches shortly after update 7. Often finding them green, there was also a much higher ratio of green lockers in each level. There were also more lockers in each level. So now here at U8, we're seeing less and less and less and less from lockers.

[Fiyabwal]

the lockers are props

you'll notice in infested missions on corpus ships many of the lockers are covered in the infestation
how they do this is to make those lockers props, and simply change the skin when it pops up as an infested tileset.

 

[Faethore]

Ok...now for the most important question in all this....where the heck did you get the Master Thief mod?!?! =b

[Kyte]

With the right lighting (like one of the locker buildings in Corpus surface missions) you can see the color difference between real lockers and the props. It's surprisingly obvious, check this out:

[Annnoth]

Not when the chance is 40%. The game is clearly coded to have some lockers that are "real" and it likely randomly chooses to have these real ones be green and openable or red and locked, while the rest are just "prop" lockers as OP called them.

 

This is sorta true. When walking into the room a few lockers appear green but change to red. It's the same lockers every time unless I can acutally open them leaving me to believe they are props.

[Cytobel]

It's very possible that the 40% applies to you, rather than the locker.  I think there is a base "luck" that a warframe has, and that this boosts that by the 40%, rather than applying it to the environment.

 

Other mods, like Flow for instance, seem to be similarily myopic in execution.  I think these are going to be reworked along with the rest of the mods when the Devs figure out exactly where they want base numbers / balances for warframes and weapons to be.

 

At least, that's what I hope happens.  Still, aside from pulling a foot into the stink that next-gen consoles are quickly becoming, the Devs have been farsightedly mindful, both of player needs and programing limitations in this stage of the beta.  I hope against hope they aren't rushed into releasing before the game balances out, and that they are given the necessary leeway to patch and update.

[Excitonex]

Ok...now for the most important question in all this....where the heck did you get the Master Thief mod?!?! =b

Try running corpus defense missions on Pluto. It's around a 3% drop rate there as wave rewards. My group got it the day of the hotfix =) Now if only there weren't so many prop lockers. Just remove them so I don't have to look at 'em, dang it!

[GrilledSalmonWithLemon]

Possibly the most useless mod.

[Caliocerion]

There's a glitch where Masterful Thief only give 10% at all levels.

[WARGAMES]

If the lockers are props, what good is this mod then? I would think due to this mod de has been underhanded about this mod's usefulness one would believe upon obtaining it. We should not have to find a company's underlying bullS#&$ that a mod is 90% useless when we imagined of the sprees of rampantly opening as many lockers as possible. But I suppose this is why regular maps have less fps issues while the void has a lot more fps issues.

[Ashnal]

Oh that's kinda cool. I figured you had to walk up to each one and try to open it, and that it would still be red even though it opened. It's nice that you can just walk by them instead.

 

And although I think it's lame that there are prop lockers, I don't think people should be so quick to call DE a S#&$ty company and that this is the fault of S#&$ty idea from the S#&$ty design council. Calm down. For all we know load times were being affected from having to process rooms full of real lockers so they saved some CPU time and made most of them props.

It might have been designed this way even before Master Thief was made to balance locker drops and aesthetics. If you think about it, that locker room has the highest density of lockers of any tile in the game. Lets say you've got your numbers tuned for tiles that have 3-5 unlockable lockers. There's a decent chance 1 or 2 of those are open per tile. One of your artists wants to make a locker room because it fits the aesthetic idea of the corpus ship. However this conflicts with your gameplay mechanic design that tiles should have 3-5 lockers. Solution? Let the artist make the room he wants, but only make a portion of the lockers unlockable to stay in line with the unlock rate per tile that all the other tiles have. Makes sense when you look at it from DE's perspective. I bet this was in place before Master Thief even came out. Master Thief just gave us a reason and method to test it.

[alphaMinus]

There's a glitch where Masterful Thief only give 10% at all levels.

 

Can you back that up with some evidence? I am very curious.

[Qb3rt]

The starting area lockers are partially hard-coded closed. The percentages work perfectly as intended for all other lockers. We figured this out within minutes of getting our MT-mods.

 

The reasoning is pretty obvious and completely justified.

Edited June 10, 2013 by Qb3rt

[Qb3rt]

Can you back that up with some evidence? I am very curious.

 

He can't because it's 100% false. I have mine maxed at 40% and outside of starting areas it definitely opens what feels like 50% of closed lockers.

 

The evidence I have is the countless number of times that it has worked for me twice in a row ... compared the sheer statistical improbability of that happening if it were bugged to cap at 10% (i.e. 1% of the time).

Edited June 10, 2013 by Qb3rt

[LWStriker9]

Is it possible that in certain tile sets DE set a hard limit on the amount of lockers that could be potentially opened at once?

 

Say you walk into a new room, there are N number of lockers, and DE only wants X number to ever be opened at once, there is no percentage chance that all of the lockers in the room could possibly be opened.

 

I noticed in the OP's test photo's, it seems like only 7 max lockers are ever open at once. If this is true, it wouldn't matter if some of the lockers are 'fake' or 'real', you would load the tile set, and have a 40% to open X number of lockers, even though there are N number in the room, and some of those may already be unlocked/green without the mod being needed.

[BETAOPTICS]

Somehow I had a feeling the change is so low it really does not make all that much difference to compensate the cost it has. The other mods are quite similar, when you get the shield resistant to ice levels, not only it is very situation depended and the rate it gives you protection is very low. that Redirection does the job as well if even better, then there is the case that like any alternative level effect, is quite low so the actual use is next to useless really.

[TennoSkoom]

lockers are prefabs, i'm pretty sure they all work fine, the problem you're seeing is that master thief doesn't seem to actually work at 40% when maxed out. I've tried this myself- results are indicative that even though it's maxed out for a 40% chance i really only seem to have a 10% chance.

[Notso]

Dang this is a shame. Props to OP for testing!

[IcarusNine]

Is it possible that in certain tile sets DE set a hard limit on the amount of lockers that could be potentially opened at once?

That wouldn't explain why a specific set of lockers NEVER OPEN.  In fact, the final number of lockers that are open is not even the point of this thread.

[Kyte]

So I've been using Master Thief for a while now at 10%, 20% and 30% (need more cores!) and I'm happy to report that most lockers are real, except that particular room and probably others with an unusualy high density of lockers, probably because otherwise there'd've been way too many open lockers even before the introduction of Master Thief.

 

Regarding the chances, they do feel 10-30%-ish to me, although I don't have hard data on that.

Edited June 11, 2013 by Kyte

[SoanoS]

To me it feels like only one out of four lockers in the whole level are real, and the rest are just painted on. I have my Master thief at 40% and this is rather frustrating as I have to facehug every single of them in hopes of getting it open, but in vain because the lockers aren't even real. The locker room just seems to highlight the underlying problem.

 

And yes, when I start in a mission in the locker room, some of the lockers are openable and green, some are red. But as soon as I approach them, they turn red. I'd assume these are the only ones that the 40% applies to.

 

I can't help but feel sorry for the bunc who wasted hundreds on platinum on mod packs in hopes of getting this mod, only to find out that the mod actually applies to one quarter of the locker on that particular tileset. I am sure these people are absolutely livid over this revelation, as they probably feel they only got 25% of "what it said on the package".

 

I was lucky enough to get this mod by farming a Corpus defense map but now that I think of it... Did i just waste my time, mods, mod capacity and credits on this? I kind of feel cheated.

 

I think DE should address this locker issue in a way that won't cause the players lose their trust for them.