Lets talk about Valkyr's Hysteria nerf, I mean "rework".

[Airwolfen]

O there is no "rework" to this. Its a nerf.
A good. old. nerf.

She had it coming. It just took way too long.

[DrakoKnight48]

2 hours ago, Emeraudes said:

yeah.. I don't think you know how to fully appreciate the warframe you're currently maining.

 

 

This video was made before this update. Two. I don't have most of these mods. Blind rage, rage. Primed continuity, or eternal war. 

[DrakoKnight48]

2 hours ago, Airwolfen said:

O there is no "rework" to this. Its a nerf.
A good. old. nerf.

She had it coming. It just took way too long.

Yep. its a nerf. I hate that it came now. Had I came sooner before I grew to lover her, I would be less disappointed than when I first played as limbo. 

[vazerd68]

i'll try to rephrase OP :

"You turned my noob-friendly, less-thinking-involved way of playing into a high-risk high-reward gameplay."

The presence of this type of gameplay is important. For some players, it's the only appeal of warframe.

imo, hysteria was OP (I didn't test past nerf). They way they went to nerf it is wrong. They could have reduced the damage or replaced the invincibility with a very high (>90%) damage reduction. OP was indeed robbed of his valkyr.

Edited May 31, 2016 by vazerd68
typo

[Emeraudes]

1 minute ago, DrakoKnight48 said:

This video was made before this update. Two. I don't have most of these mods. Blind rage, rage. Primed continuity, or eternal war. 

The video was made before the update, yeah... I don't think anything else about valkyr changed cept the one skill that isn't even used in that video. Point two is more valid, but that point also makes it understandable as to why you have issues taking on higher level targets.

So, Valkyr's hysteria was a crutch you used to bash your way into a field of play that you'd normally not be able to perform in until you farmed out the mods that you currently do not have.

[Evanescent]

It isn't even a nerf man.

[DrakoKnight48]

2 hours ago, Emeraudes said:

The video was made before the update, yeah... I don't think anything else about valkyr changed cept the one skill that isn't even used in that video. Point two is more valid, but that point also makes it understandable as to why you have issues taking on higher level targets.

So, Valkyr's hysteria was a crutch you used to bash your way into a field of play that you'd normally not be able to perform in until you farmed out the mods that you currently do not have.

The last part was spot on. I mainly used her because I haven't found the right gun I like using. Most of them are to weak or have bad recoil. I've been running T2S missions for the Soma prime receiver to drop. Its the last piece I need to drop. Yet because of low drop rates, I haven't had much luck. Mods on the other hand had been WORST. No good mod ever drops for me. No matter how many times I run a mission. 

[(XBOX)DancesInShadow]

I think we're all missing a pretty valid point here. These nerfs completely ignore your forma and arcanes. I honestly think thats whats got the community so up in arms right now and rightfully so. Yes we know she has other abilities, but.... that don't exactly make them useful. And now this new thing where you get the damage back if your in 20m of an enemy is total bs. If D.E. seriously had an issue with how Valkyr functioned, they would've "Fixed" her straight away after about a month or so of watching how players use her.

Like my energy drain on her is about .85, and is going to jump to about 1 to 3 per second when this update hits me, and that in particular is annoying because I don't have arcane energize to combat this. So as stated before, this nerf will completely ignore the work you've put into it. If The Angry Kitty had a nerf coming, this sooooo wasn't the way to do it. The enemy lvl scaling though.... that needs to be slapped by the wrathful power of the nerf hammer.

[Kastrel717]

11 minutes ago, DrakoKnight48 said:

The last part was spot on. I mainly used her because I haven't found the right gun I like using. Most of them are to weak or have bad recoil. I've been running T2S missions for the Soma prime receiver to drop. Its the last piece I need to drop. Yet because of low drop rates, I haven't had much luck. Mods on the other hand had been WORST. No good mod ever drops for me. No matter how many times I run a mission. 

Just farm some void and sell prime junk you will get some plat that you can use to buy mods since you dont have luck farming.I mean those mods go for about 10-20 plat unranked.BTW if you have no mods like that you cant really say you were prepared for high end missions.Warframe was too easy with  Valkyr.I mean come on since when are games like these meant to be played in godmode with no risk involved,even with that nerf she is still strong with her 2 and 3.

[DrakoKnight48]

2 hours ago, (XB1)DancesInShadow said:

I think we're all missing a pretty valid point here. These nerfs completely ignore your forma and arcanes. I honestly think thats whats got the community so up in arms right now and rightfully so. Yes we know she has other abilities, but.... that don't exactly make them useful. And now this new thing where you get the damage back if your in 20m of an enemy is total bs. If D.E. seriously had an issue with how Valkyr functioned, they would've "Fixed" her straight away after about a month or so of watching how players use her.

Like my energy drain on her is about .85, and is going to jump to about 1 to 3 per second when this update hits me, and that in particular is annoying because I don't have arcane energize to combat this. So as stated before, this nerf will completely ignore the work you've put into it. If The Angry Kitty had a nerf coming, this sooooo wasn't the way to do it. The enemy lvl scaling though.... that needs to be slapped by the wrathful power of the nerf hammer.

Agreed. Enemies reaching past 150 are a impossible to kill even when I had Hysteria toggled on. 

[DrakoKnight48]

2 hours ago, Kastrel717 said:

Just farm some void and sell prime junk you will get some plat that you can use to buy mods since you dont have luck farming.I mean those mods go for about 10-20 plat unranked.BTW if you have no mods like that you cant really say you were prepared for high end missions.Warframe was too easy with  Valkyr.I mean come on since when are games like these meant to be played in godmode with no risk involved,even with that nerf she is still strong with her 2 and 3.

When are games like this supposed to be played in God mod? Dude. Go on a high level mission like Rathuum, Alert missions that spam waves of enemies at you. I've been one shot so many times Its not funny watching your inaros get wrecked in one shot or a Rhino who has iron skin on for that matter.  Idk. I'm getting tired of grinding for items that won't drop. Sadly.

Edited May 31, 2016 by DrakoKnight48

[PickleMonster21]

Oh boy. You don't see anything wrong with making a few changes to an ability that grants you invulnerability for as long as you have the energy to do so that drains rather slowly with no downfalls? When I read about Valkyr's changes, I didn't want this to happen. But I was completely okay with it because balance is a thing that needs to be considered, in case you forgot about that little word there.

[Marthrym]

It's the expanding "bubble" that I find dumb and unjustly harmful for Valkyr. It's just nonsensical to me. The drain is not an issue IMHO; it could even be cranked up a bit, but the bubble? Stupid. And the day DE gets rid of cheap mechanics such as draining auras which offer zero counterplay other than staying out of range (and we can't see that range) to kill the myriad of enemies that use them from a "safe" distance, I'll be happy. Thing is, I don't think this is happening any time soon. DE has a terrible track record with challenge and fairness in Warframe as far as I'm concerned.

I am more of a Warcry/Eternal War user myself, Hysteria is more an "OH SH!T" button than an active playstyle for me. I only use it to safely revive teammates or when scaling goes crosseyed, which unfortunately is the vast majority of what the devs call "veteran content", like trials and sorties. they embody everything that is wrong with Warframe in terms of balance IMHO.

 

1 hour ago, NightBlitz said:

well, lets see...they're looking into the scaling problems, and things like bursas and nulls were originally added as a counter measure to things like hysteria and cc spam? do i need to explain more? it doesnt take much to see that major balancing is needed and this is just the start of it

They made that spam a thing when they refused to admit and correct their first blunder : their beloved enemy scaling is poorly thought out. It just breaks balance from the start. So obviously the only ways to counter it are to either kill swathes of enemies instantly, prevent them from hitting us even once or have gigantic damage mitigation capabilities. Hence the overpowered CC, defensive abilities and weapons they had to give us from then on, since they apparently couldn't bring themselves to cap scaling values to a reasonable level. And then seeing this cheesy trend developping, they started implementing mechanics that simply took away these tools without even considering for a moment that it was extremely unwise and wouldn't solve a damn thing in the long run. 2 years and a half later, look at the mess, the sheer amount of work they have to put out to fix their old mistake. They waited far too long, implemented far too many things that used this broken core as a base, and now we all pay for it.

Fix enemy scaling first, it's the root of the problem. Then, and only then, CC and weapon damage can be brought in line with it. Overpowered CC is just a consequence of an imbalanced scaling. They all revolve around what enemy scaling sets as "standards". Hysteria wouldn't even "need" complete damage mitigation if every grunt the AI throws at us had enough damage output to insta-gib any frame that doesn't benefit from heavy damage mitigation abilities, especially at close range. The devs are just tipping the scales even further away from balance by not taking care of this at the same time they make our own power less unrestrained. It's all nice and dandy that they "plan" on doing the same with the rest, but in the meantime, the mess just gets bigger and we have to put up with it.

 

Obviously this post will seem bitter, a rant that just bashes the devs. It is more or less that to be honest. I've been playing this game since 2013. I've seen the whole thing unfold before my eyes, and seen many other players make viable, reasonable suggestions, very detailed threads even, with solutions to this problem. They were largely ignored unfortunately, and many just left after that. So yeah, I am bitter now, my trust in DE's ability to create fair challenge has dwindled and is on its last legs. But I'm still here, because i've seen other things that still give me hope and keep me playing, like awesome quests (that I hope will be repeatable as soon as possible by the way), some very interesting lore (finally lol), and a gameplay that has become extremely engaging and addictive over the years, with genius-level ideas and concepts. I love the art, the ambiance, the theme of the game. That's why I'm still here. Also I really like the devs. I hate some of the things they've done, but I love these guys and gals.

Edited May 31, 2016 by Marthrym

[DrakoKnight48]

2 hours ago, PickleMonster21 said:

Oh boy. You don't see anything wrong with making a few changes to an ability that grants you invulnerability for as long as you have the energy to do so that drains rather slowly with no downfalls? When I read about Valkyr's changes, I didn't want this to happen. But I was completely okay with it because balance is a thing that needs to be considered, in case you forgot about that little word there.

Balance for who? When you go up against waves of Orokin Crewmen who can one shot you in an instant. Yeah, warfames are the ones who reeeeaally need balancing. Not the cheap one shot Crewmen. =/

[FrozenVoid]

Just use a Warcry build. Its much more interactive and fun to use.

 Hysteria is still the single most boring abillity in the game.

(Look I pressed 4 and am now rolling my face a few times over the keyboard, make a coffee and do my taxes... oh look I won)

[DeFragMe]

2 minutes ago, DrakoKnight48 said:

Balance for who? When you go up against waves of Orokin Crewmen who can one shot you in an instant. Yeah, warfames are the ones who reeeeaally need balancing. Not the cheap one shot Crewmen. =/

hm.. but i only tend to get onrshot on valkyr over level 200 .. might be me doing something wrong...

or the fact that i dont tend to play over ~150

[DrakoKnight48]

That's maybe how you play as her. But I don't sit around doing squat. I'm out there killing as many as I can till the mission is done. The warcry, I might give a try. If I have the mods. 

2 hours ago, FrozenVoid said:

Just use a Warcry build. Its much more interactive and fun to use.

 Hysteria is still the single most boring abillity in the game.

(Look I pressed 4 and am now rolling my face a few times over the keyboard, make a coffee and do my taxes... oh look I won)

 

[PickleMonster21]

1 hour ago, DrakoKnight48 said:

Look dude. All I want is for the percentage meter to be taken off. I'm gonna kill enemies using my other weapons haft the time. Then use Hysteria to kill a bursa in case one shows up. At least that's how I play the game. I certainly don't spam the thing 24/7. Ya gonna mix up the game-play somehow. 

If that's the case, where you're using Hysteria to destroy one high priority target, then this reword shouldn't bother you at all. But, I suspect that's not the case, hence, this thread.

 

45 minutes ago, vazerd68 said:

i'll try to rephrase OP :

"You turned my noob-friendly, less-thinking-involved way of playing into a high-risk high-reward gameplay."

The presence of this type of gameplay is important. For some players, it's the only appeal of warframe.

imo, hysteria was OP (I didn't test past nerf). They way they went to nerf it is wrong. They could have reduced the damage or replaced the invincibility with a very high (>90%) damage reduction. OP was indeed robbed of his valkyr.

a 90% damage reduction would basically be invulnerability still, because she'd still be gaining a lot more Health than she's losing.

 

2 minutes ago, DrakoKnight48 said:

Balance for who? When you go up against waves of Orokin Crewmen who can one shot you in an instant. Yeah, warfames are the ones who reeeeaally need balancing. Not the cheap one shot Crewmen. =/

Balance between Warframes. If you're going up against Orokin Crewmen who are one-shotting you, then you've reached your limit. It's as simple as that. And if you're using Hysteria to escape that one-shot fate, you're just prolonging the inevitable. EVENTUALLY, you will get one-shot by Orokin Crewmen anyway.

[Emeraudes]

11 minutes ago, DrakoKnight48 said:

When are games like this supposed to be played in God mod? Dude. Go on a high level mission like Rathuum, Alert missions that spam waves of enemies at you. I've been one shot so many times Its not funny watching your inaros get wrecked in one shot or a Rhino who has iron skin on for that matter.  Idk. I'm getting tired of grinding for items that won't drop. Sadly.

I've gone through rathum, 60 min long survivals and all that jazz. All without valkyr, without sewer camping and without trinity. When you finally get your gear, you'll have the capacity to, it's not a matter of having one skill that wasn't balanced to help you get past that hurdle DE purposely put in place.

[T7Alpha]

Tbh the fact that you were able to do end-game without any corrupt mods speaks for itself to how OP Valkyr was; most frames require those mods to even be used in sorties etc.
The trinity nerf is the real tragedy.
-equip Flame Repellant -

[DrakoKnight48]

2 hours ago, PickleMonster21 said:

If that's the case, where you're using Hysteria to destroy one high priority target, then this reword shouldn't bother you at all. But, I suspect that's not the case, hence, this thread.

 

a 90% damage reduction would basically be invulnerability still, because she'd still be gaining a lot more Health than she's losing.

 

Balance between Warframes. If you're going up against Orokin Crewmen who are one-shotting you, then you've reached your limit. It's as simple as that. And if you're using Hysteria to escape that one-shot fate, you're just prolonging the inevitable. EVENTUALLY, you will get one-shot by Orokin Crewmen anyway.

OK. On that last part you say it like you KNOW the game is unbalanced. Meaning there's no point on nerfing warframes when we're going up against cheap one shot Crewmen! How is that fair for us the players to get hit my something that powerful? As you said yourself in your previous comment, "balance is thing that needs to be considered".   

[(PSN)ToastyFairy01]

As far as I'm concerned, this nerf is far more tame than what it could of been. Rhino's Iron Skin was once complete invincibility for an amount of time, as was Blessing (though this old Blessing was far more problematic and broken than Iron Skin was), and both of those were changed. In terms of Blessings, the current could be renamed into something else and it would be completely able to be considered a new ability- that's how much it's been cut down. We all knew this was coming; it was merely a matter of "when".

 

Be grateful Hysteria isn't a corpse compared to what what it used to be. Although, when joining a PUG, the end mission screen was always a game "Spot the Valkyr". Maybe now the common Valkyr player won't press 4 to win.

[PickleMonster21]

7 minutes ago, DrakoKnight48 said:

OK. On that last part you say it like you KNOW the game is unbalanced. Meaning there's no point on nerfing warframes when we're going up against cheap one shot Crewmen! How is that fair for us the players to get hit my something that powerful? As you said yourself in your previous comment, "balance is thing that needs to be considered".   

Are you kidding me? If you're in a Survival/Defense and you get to the point where you're getting one-shot, that's your limit in an ENDLESS GAME THAT KEEPS ON RISING UNTIL YOU GET ONE-SHOT.

Edit: Oh, on that note, if you're getting one-shot as a Valkyr ANYWHERE on the Star Chart or even in T4, and in endless missions, anything under 10 minutes/waves, you need to reevaluate how you decided to mod Valkyr.

Double Edit: Oh, and if you're getting one-shot anywhere on the Star Chart or in T4, or anything under 10 minutes/waves in any Endless mission, you shouldn't be making a post about it since you clearly lack the mods and/or the ranks on said mod to last. If you're getting one-shot on the Star Chart and T4, and under 10 minutes/waves on Endless missions, you clearly should not be there as you are not properly equipped to be there.

Edited May 31, 2016 by PickleMonster21

[DrakoKnight48]

2 hours ago, Emeraudes said:

I've gone through rathum, 60 min long survivals and all that jazz. All without valkyr, without sewer camping and without trinity. When you finally get your gear, you'll have the capacity to, it's not a matter of having one skill that wasn't balanced to help you get past that hurdle DE purposely put in place.

Well. That's the way I've been playing and so far I've had no problem playing through on my own. As I said before. I've tried grinding for good gear. What do you think I've been doing since January of this year when I first started playing? All I've been doing is farming for good gear so I can become OP in missions. Yet time and time again I haven't been able to get any of the good weapons or mods to drop because of their low drop rates. I've checked the wiki. Everything to help me get good in the game, yet nothing is working.

[Emeraudes]

1 minute ago, DrakoKnight48 said:

Well. That's the way I've been playing and so far I've had no problem playing through on my own. As I said before. I've tried grinding for good gear. What do you think I've been doing since January of this year when I first started playing? All I've been doing is farming for good gear so I can become OP in missions. Yet time and time again I haven't been able to get any of the good weapons or mods to drop because of their low drop rates. I've checked the wiki. Everything to help me get good in the game, yet nothing is working.

There is a disparity here you won't fill in just a matter of months. Players have focus farmed for at least a year to get the level of gear you're hoping to get. Most players you see who can pull off outstanding survival records have done so through monetary investment or extreme amounts of time investment.

In short, you can consider paying to shorten the time you need to farm. That would probably be more in line with your effort to reward ratio.