Please, No Artifact-Mods. So Much Wasted Potential...

[Lumireaver]

We know for a fact that artifacts are these super secret holographic cube things that the two technically inclined enemy factions have to build crazy cool storage containers for. (Just so they can fly them around the system for no readily apparent reason... unless it's their intention to invite a cell of Tenno to raid them, but I digress.) Ever since Dojos dropped, I'd been expecting DE to build on that. (The whole 'artifact room' thing.)

 

Why don't we have crazy artifact libraries with giant retractable artifact slots. Everyone in the clan would throw a their artifacts into this library, and everyone in the clan would be able to select their artifacts from this shared pool. (Clanless people get to use the current system.) Artifact effects would level up based on the number of duplicates donated to the library.

 

I posted something similar but completely different on this subject here.

 

It's not that no one is interested, it's that no one posts in topics unless they're against the RNG, or dojo prices. (Because people feel that those issues are urgent and warrant two dozen different heated discussions.) Trust me, I know your pain. 

 

Anyway, I feel like artifacts could stand to be reworked a little. We constantly raid artifacts from raid missions. (And don't receive them as rewards for some reason...) So we know what artifacts look like. (Giant holographic cubes which for some reason tend to be kept in giant, airtight chambers.) We also know that merely possessing them imbues you with special powers. (Are enemies in raid missions affected by the artifact they posses? They should be.) So what are artifacts?

 

I would speculate that they're of Orokin origin, considering Lotus says so a billion times hourly in-game. They're probably something like books written in some kind of crazy mystical space ninja language. Similar to the Luminoth language. When I start thinking along that track, it makes me want to build a dojo library to keep these things.

 

As far as actual gameplay relevance is concerned, I suppose they could remain sweet little cumulative group-buffs. Some of them are unique, but most of them are extremely watered down mods. (For balance purposes, naturally.) Your suggestions for new ones are nice and flavorful considerin the nature of the Tenno (Which presumably has a lot in common with the Orokin...) However, it might also be interesting to create some kind of puzzle out of them. Acquiring collections these artifact "glyphs," and spelling whole "words" out of them. Completed puzzles could offer unique rewards along the lines of Orokin weaponry, or or just fill a dojo library progress bar so you can boast about your your library is complete.

 

 

 

[MetalGerbil]

why ask to not change the current system, then ask for a whole new radical change to the current system?

[Royce_Bracket]

This idea sounds decent, as long as the gains aren't too much, and there is a cap. The main problems are that thousand member clans will easily be able to do something like stack 500 Energy Siphons, and that it'll further increase the gap between clan members and clanless players.

[PlebbyMilliner]

Did you miss the Livestream where they said that they were updating the artifacts?

[Troublechutor]

You underestimate the ability of people to "farm" digital items in their spare time.  Also, artifacts are going to become mods of some kind.

[Lumireaver]

Did you miss the Livestream where they said that they were updating the artifacts?

 

That's precisely what I'm responding to, yeah.

[Brasten]

I don't see a reason for an "artifact" room at the Dojo level. There is little need to "share" from a pool of artifacts when eventually, and not very long, you will get a full set to pick from on your own. DE has already expressed interest in an Aura room to give minor boost to clan members (as set by the Warlords). Personally the fewer GAME mechanics tide to the Dojo the better. It isn't current state it's a cluster grope.

=====

I actually see advantages to replacing the current system with Mods and NOT giving us a dedicated artifact slot. Currently there is only one build type that would be negatively impacted and that would be Caster builds.

Warframe power spam currently needs upwards of 5 Mods to do right, plus Energy Siphon (ES) Artifact. Making Artifacts use Warframe Mod slots means that's now up to 6. Also that ES will likely replace Flow or Streamline on non-caster frames.

Face tanking only has 3 mods open to it, but two artifacts (Regeneration, Physique). If those two become Mods and DE doesn't put limit restrictions on them, then you could put them both on.

Go down the list of things you can focus one. Gun Combat, take two Scavenger artifacts for Ammo hungry DPS machines AND Rifle Amp. Also throw in Corrosive Ammo (the new mod)

=====

What this really does is show how HARD it is to play a dedicated Power User, and now little other non-power user builds have to work with.

Personally if DE wants to KISS then they should give us the extra slot (no functional change from the current system). If not they need to sit down and think about the next full set of Mod cards. Stuff like the Dual stat mods (not dualing). This includes looking at how the Mods on a Warframe influence it in three core game mechanics (powers, guns, melee).

Edited June 23, 2013 by Brasten

[Vyeth]

I don't see a reason for an "artifact" room at the Dojo level. There is little need to "share" from a pool of artifacts when eventually, and not very long, you will get a full set to pick from on your own. DE has already expressed interest in an Aura room to give minor boost to clan members (as set by the Warlords). Personally the fewer GAME mechanics tide to the Dojo the better. It isn't current state it's a cluster grope.

=====

I actually see advantages to replacing the current system with Mods and NOT giving us a dedicated artifact slot. Currently there is only one build type that would be negatively impacted and that would be Caster builds.

Warframe power spam currently needs upwards of 5 Mods to do right, plus Energy Siphon (ES) Artifact. Making Artifacts use Warframe Mod slots means that's now up to 6. Also that ES will likely replace Flow or Streamline on non-caster frames.

Face tanking only has 3 mods open to it, but two artifacts (Regeneration, Physique). If those two become Mods and DE doesn't put limit restrictions on them, then you could put them both on.

Go down the list of things you can focus one. Gun Combat, take two Scavenger artifacts for Ammo hungry DPS machines AND Rifle Amp. Also throw in Corrosive Ammo (the new mod)

=====

What this really does is show how HARD it is to play a dedicated Power User, and now little other non-power user builds have to work with.

Personally if DE wants to KISS then they should give us the extra slot (no functional change from the current system). If not they need to sit down and think about the next full set of Mod cards. Stuff like the Dual stat mods (not dualing). This includes looking at how the Mods on a Warframe influence it in three core game mechanics (powers, guns, melee).

 

So many of the artifacts have corresponding mods right now anyway.. It would be horribly redundant unless they find a way to differentiate say serration and the rifle damage artifact or whats the point? Stack more damage onto a single rifle? Doesn't sound like it's making anything harder to me.

[Lumireaver]

why ask to not change the current system, then ask for a whole new radical change to the current system?

 

For clarification, and for others who may have misunderstood or are otherwise oblivious for whatever reason. In Livestream #8 it was revealed that artifacts are going to be changed into mods, Steve and Scott haven't decided whether or not we'll be getting extra slots for them yet. Rather than having "artifact-mods," I've always thought it would make more sense to build on the dojo mechanics/game logic and give us our own artifact rooms. (That's why I posted this topic.)

 

This idea sounds decent, as long as the gains aren't too much, and there is a cap. The main problems are that thousand member clans will easily be able to do something like stack 500 Energy Siphons, and that it'll further increase the gap between clan members and clanless players.

 

Yeah, naturally. I presume they already have something in mind to cap artifact power, since they're the ones who suggested turning them into mods. I believe they intend to lower their base effectiveness and allow us to upgrade them to their current level, and possibly push them a little further. This could also work in tandem with clan tiers, which we're getting. IE: Shadow clans would only need to throw in 256 Energy Siphons to get it to level 3, while Moon clans would require many times that amount. 

 

 

I don't see a reason for an "artifact" room at the Dojo level. There is little need to "share" from a pool of artifacts when eventually, and not very long, you will get a full set to pick from on your own. DE has already expressed interest in an Aura room to give minor boost to clan members (as set by the Warlords). Personally the fewer GAME mechanics tide to the Dojo the better. It isn't current state it's a cluster grope.

=====

I actually see advantages to replacing the current system with Mods and NOT giving us a dedicated artifact slot. Currently there is only one build type that would be negatively impacted and that would be Caster builds.

Warframe power spam currently needs upwards of 5 Mods to do right, plus Energy Siphon (ES) Artifact. Making Artifacts use Warframe Mod slots means that's now up to 6. Also that ES will likely replace Flow or Streamline on non-caster frames.

Face tanking only has 3 mods open to it, but two artifacts (Regeneration, Physique). If those two become Mods and DE doesn't put limit restrictions on them, then you could put them both on.

Go down the list of things you can focus one. Gun Combat, take two Scavenger artifacts for Ammo hungry DPS machines AND Rifle Amp. Also throw in Corrosive Ammo (the new mod)

=====

What this really does is show how HARD it is to play a dedicated Power User, and now little other non-power user builds have to work with.

Personally if DE wants to KISS then they should give us the extra slot (no functional change from the current system). If not they need to sit down and think about the next full set of Mod cards. Stuff like the Dual stat mods (not dualing). This includes looking at how the Mods on a Warframe influence it in three core game mechanics (powers, guns, melee).

 

There's little reason unless you require something like a thousand artifacts. It helps to make artifact alerts something to actually want to do, as well. Plus it's shiny as hell, and shiny is always good. Also I don't recall anything about an aura room, but Steve did post about a Shrine which affects a polarity designated by the Warlords. That should be nice and shiny as well. I'm looking forward to it.

 

I personally don't mind if those three thousand member clans get everything within seconds of release, though I hope for DE's sake the clan tiers remedy that situation. (Burns through content too quick.) The way I see it, they're only burning their own interest in the game that much faster. I've got a three man clan. Haven't started my dojo yet, can't wait for more dojo features.

 

Yeah, I kind of wanted to chew out the "one build to rule them all" thing over here. The idea behind this thread is that certain 'Frames who cast a lot could be balanced alongside certain mods which casters greatly benefit from could be individually tweaked. So, completely hypothetically, if Ember's abilities were all chassis abilities, and the power-spam mods were all helmet mods, Ember could be balanced by A) putting unfavorable polarities in her helmet (intentionally a temporary solution, has the benefit of buffing forma for higher leveled play later on down the line), B) literally blocking slots (slot-block removal could also become a thing requiring it's own item, or not), and C) you could just make her abilities helmet abilities to start with and she'd have to chose if she wants to slot those abilities or spam her other powers instead. As they add more mods, more possibilities naturally open up. Also, please note that for a thing like this to work, everything would have to carefully balanced after a lot of deliberation, and the "Ember abilities are all chassis abilities" thing was only an example.

[Brasten]

So many of the artifacts have corresponding mods right now anyway.. It would be horribly redundant unless they find a way to differentiate say serration and the rifle damage artifact or whats the point? Stack more damage onto a single rifle? Doesn't sound like it's making anything harder to me.

I said that playing CASTER will get harder. Everying else actually benefits.

As for dupilcation:

Physique = Vitality but worse (why no one really uses it)

Enemy Radar = Enemy Sense (which is worse then the artifact)

Steel Charge... kinda, but it puts the extra melee, damage boost on the Warframe and not the weapons as a stacking "Aura"

Rifle AMP... see Steel Charge

Corrosive Ammo... not quite AP mods, is an "aura", and applies to all weapons. Also bigger armor value loss on higher level foes.

Shield Disruption and Infected interference... Frost Mods, split in two and nice after thoughts. Well Interfearance is nice as pure VS faction.

That's it. At best that's two truely redundant Artifacts.

Your can already stack Rifle Amp on Serration. People do that and make beastly rifles. Moving it to a Mod doesn't change that. Ditto Steel Charge. Both as Mods would inhance Gun play (not that it needs it over much). You could set up your Warframe with Amp, Scavanger, and Corrosive.

Yea, it would make almost all other builds EXCEPT casters easier.

[SynisterDoom]

well from what i understand its not that they'll become mod cards but "aura" cards. which im really hoping get they're own slot, not just a polarity.  

 

i dont know for sure but it sounds like the power that comes with them (i.e energy siphone giving you one energy point every, what is it, two seconds? more or less? will still do that. just instead of it being a card that you equip before a mission, its a card that makes your warframe all glowey) I dont know the details. but my mind already went crazy with it. check out this thread i posted for my ideas :3

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/67351-aura-system/#entry715002