Suggestion for a Rework of Limbo

[Zoh_Veldae]

First and foremost, thank you very much for taking some of your time to read this post of mine.

 

I have played Warframe for quite a bit and I am thoroughly enjoying it so far. One of my definitive favorite Warframes to use right now is Limbo. Is it his gameplay mechanics? Is it is gentlemanly demeanor? Maybe a bit of both. But the more I play as him the more I notice that he, like many others, has flaws. And it's not simply "characteristic flaws", that is to say flaws that would actually make sense and give him an identity (ex.: Inaros having no shields, but still integrating that lack into his fighting style). No, what I feel as I play as Limbo are not simple flaws, but instead a lot of potential squandered.

The concept for this Warframe is wonderful. It's presentation, however, falls dramatically short of it.

Now, simply stating that he's lacking would by itself be just mindlessly venting at nothing. That is why I created this thread, in order to voice my opinion in an accessible, understandable and (semi)permanent way. And on this thread I will list what I feel are some core changes that should be done on the Warframe Limbo in order to make him achieve his full potential of gameplay.

 

1- Merge his first (Banish) and second (Riftwalk) abilities into a single skill: While the existence of both these skills allows for a greater degree of control as to who gets to be in the rift and who doesn't, the way Warframe skillsets are designed by nature doesn't allow much variety per Warframe without having to dilute it's abilities to their absolute minimum requirements in order to fit the "4 activated & 1 passive" template that has been chosen. To try and save ability space without harming the utility of Limbo, I would suggest merging his first two abilities into one and have them share their statistics with one another while functioning as a modal ability. For ease of use, I'd set it to have Limbo Banish the target by tapping the ability key and holding it for a brief moment to Riftwalk into the rift himself. Think of it in the same terms as the Sprint/Roll functions being by default mapped to the same Shift key, but easily both accessible according to the mode it's pressed as. As for the timer display, I suggest giving priority to the Riftwalk mode of the ability. This is because (in my experience) the Banish used on enemies would be too short-lived to matter as when Limbo banishes a single enemy, it's most likely to immediately kill it with a Knockdown Finisher. In addition, a Banish on Allies would already have the effect's timer displayed on the Squad side panel, so Limbo will always be in control of the situation.

2-Have his third ability (Rift Surge) have some effect outside of the rift: Rift Surge is hailed as one of the best scaling abilities the game has, capable of providing enormous increases in damage that make Limbo a force to be reckoned with in the right conditions. Its augment further increases this in an interesting way, making it even more deadlier. However, the ability itself feels incredibly one-dimensional (pardon the pun) if it's effects only manifest inside the rift. To correct this, I'd suggest adding an extra effect that would be present while Limbo is outside the rift. Ideally, it should be a damage reduction to attacks directed at Limbo. This way, he would be able to stand alongside his Tenno mates without having to run and hide in his private dimension while at the same time serving as an insurance should he eventually step out of the rift at the wrong time. Do note that these effects would never be present simultaneously as Limbo cannot be "almost nearly maybe" in the rift.

3-Allow players to pick up items and interact with the environment inside his Cataclysm ultimate ability: Now, this is not the same as saying "allow players in the rift to interact with the environment", that would make no sense flavor-wise. The very fact that we can revive a fallen teammate across dimensions is already grazing on the realm of "shenanigans", but it is a blessing to be able to do so (please do not change this). However, Cataclysm isn't simply sending a target into the rift, but instead a whole area. Logically, this would include everything inside that area. Item pickups, datamasses, control consoles, ramparts, everything. So it comes as a surprise that players are not capable of picking up items when they are clearly inside the area of the Cataclysm, or operate control consoles even though the object has been sent to the rift along with them. Most hilariously, even breakables are completely immune to damage within the Cataclysm. To correct it this way would tremendously help in Limbo's field manipulation while still retaining some validity lore-wise.

4-Make good use of the free space left by 1: If my first suggestion is implemented, an ability slot would be opened. This will give the developers one more chance to add something new to Limbo's repertoire. My suggestion is one of the following:

A: A short-range teleport, using the Operator's Void Dash as an example. It would allow for a nice degree of mobility while also tying into the story of The Limbo Theorem quest, possibly being the skill that Ordis refers to as a "rift jump".

B: A radial Area of Effect attack. Although Limbo isn't exactly geared towards being an assault-type of Warframe, its still a bit odd that he does not have some ability that allows for direct combat. And even thought his first ability and ultimate ability DO in fact deal damage to their targets, it still feels like it's an unintended side-effect of the ability rather than its main purpose. And while there DO exist Warframes which have no offensive abilities whatsoever (Trinity and Loki come to mind), their roles in battle are already well set and their skills tie into those roles perfectly (Trinity being a dedicated support-type while Loki is one of the best stealth-types). Limbo, however, seems to swing to no direction in particular, being able to at the same time support, deal damage, evade, defend, eliminate high-value targets, etc. So an offensive skill wouldn't be too out-of-place on Limbo's arsenal. What I imagine is something similar to the Archwing Odonata's Repel ability but on a much smaller scale. This would give Limbo yet another tool to protect himself from unwanted attention, even usable from inside the rift in order to clear an area to safely come out.

C: Surprise us! I don't want to seem presumptuous and tell the developers exactly what they should do. I'm sure there's a myriad of other unique effects that could be added here. Let your creativity run wild and add something interesting to this empty space!

5-Remove unit collision while inside the rift: One fact that has always bothered me more than it probably should when using Limbo is that we STILL have unit collision against enemies while we are in the rift. I have lost count to the times my ninja-like forward motion has been stopped by bumping into some aimless Grineer unit that just remembered he wanted to be in front of a door for no apparent reason (probably to check if the automatic opening system is still functional). If we are inside an alternate dimension and immune to attacks from the outside, it would be logical if we could travel through practically everything in the material plane. I'm not asking to be able to go through walls while in the rift (because that would be INCREDIBLY abused) but at least to be able to go through hostile units unimpeded. We're supposed to be ghosts while inside the rift, we should be able to benefit from that fact.

 

 

 

And for now, that is all I can recall. I could also add a suggestion to have his Cataclysm have some crowd-control effect on enemies, but then that would start impacting negatively on the utility of frames such as Frost and Nova so I shall refrain from such.

I am fully aware that this entire post can (and most likely will) be completely ignored in its entirety by the developers. But before any final decision is made for a rework of Limbo, I believe, as a player, I should also leave my input in the matter accessible to all.

My suggestions are not meant to completely re-make Limbo into something new. No, he is already great the way he was made. The only aim is to improve on the unused potential of this fancy man of a Warframe and make him truly shine on the battlefield instead of being left over as a niche gimmick.

 

Once again I thank the readers for taking some time to give attention to this post. I hope it is understandable and I am always open to any suggestions or differing points of view you may eventually have.

Have a good one.

Edited December 29, 2016 by Zoh_Veldae
Grammar

[BeefSauce]

I appreciate that you enjoy limbo and want to see him improved. 

I'd recommend watching the last devstream (if you haven't yet). There's actually a time-stamped link to what might interest you in another one of these limbo workshop threads. We are still in the speculation phase on exactly how (if?) what the devs said will be implemented.

Interestingly enough, some points you mentioned are touched on by the devs. For example, it was mentioned that limbo's roll might be changing into a teleport. There's speculation that rolling will also be how limbo enters and leaves the rift. I'm curious what your take away from the devstream will be (is?).

Edited December 29, 2016 by BeefSauce

[(PSN)mahoshonenfox]

Based on Devstream #84, they mentioned they are already reworking Limbo. Some of their plans involve making his Rift Walk be a passive instead of an ability; giving him a short range teleport instead of rolling; and the ability to stop time inside the rift.