Gender Roles?

[Diceros]

I feel like it's restricting to assign frames to just one gender. I don't make this request lightly either. I understand how much work would be involved. But it would be nice for my friend who wants to be a female rhino or my buddy who would enjoy being a male trinity. Would the Tenno make gender specific suits? If they would then I'll just shut my mouth now.

 

[DanPaul7]

Been asked many times.

The Tenno would and do make Gender specific suits.

Now shut your mouth. Only joking. But seriously, no.

[Dtexas]

Sorry to disappoint, but it isn't going to happen. If it does, will will prob on the very last things to do. Having gender swaps for frames kinda ruins the lore of the game where there is only supposed to be one of each frame (Lore wise).

Pretty sure DE has stated multiple times as well that Gender swaps are not happening as well.

Edited July 6, 2013 by Dtexas

[Anvildude]

There were originally plans for gender swaps.  Nyx was originally going to be the female form of Excalibur, hence the similarities in design.

 

I think if they had more archetypes across both genders, it might even things out- Male frames have 2 Tanks in Frost and Rhino, but no Tanks for females (aside from maybe Ember and Saryn)- Nyx is somewhat similar to Ash, I suppose- but Excalibur doesn't really have a female counterpart (fast slashy melee damage dealer), nor does Loki (trickster).  Volt's Elemental Wizard style is essentially mirrored by Ember, while Banshee converselly doesn't have a Male counterpart (unless you count Banshee as Loki's counter).

[theammostore]

The Tenno, from my perspective, actually do make gender specific suits. In my mind, what happens is only a certain amount of people in the Tenno culture, or Tenno sympathizers, or whatever, can by Nyx or Rhino or Mag etc.They have to be a certain personality type, build type, etc, and only then are they allowed to be Saryn or Loki or whomever they want.

 

So, in the game, we are simply swapping between several people, and when two or more of the same frame show up, it's just more people who are 'Loki,' or rather, the persona of 'Loki.'

 

See what I'm getting at?

[iCRIHFIELD]

Sorry to disappoint, but it isn't going to happen. If it does, will will prob on the very last things to do. Having gender swaps for frames kinda ruins the lore of the game where there is only supposed to be one of each frame (Lore wise).

Pretty sure DE has stated multiple times as well that Gender swaps are not happening as well.

 

Where does it say there is only one of each frame?

Not trying to instigate anything man, just honestly curious.

 

I'll hate it if it's that way, because then it's impossible to explain a team of 4 Rhinos wrecking things. I sort of hoped for the frames just being frames, tools that can be utilized by multiple people separately.

[ValhaHazred]

I apologize in advance, because I'm going to rage against the machine for a bit.

Sorry to disappoint, but it isn't going to happen. If it does, will will prob on the very last things to do. Having gender swaps for frames kinda ruins the lore of the game where there is only supposed to be one of each frame (Lore wise).

Pretty sure DE has stated multiple times as well that Gender swaps are not happening as well.

This is one of those things where I have to say "F*** the lore!"

I refuse to accept the frames are supposed to individuals. We build them with blueprints and can have more than one in-game at a time. Story should serve the gameplay, not contradict it.

I know that DE_Steve(or Scott I can't remember) said no. Or rather he said Spiderwoman doesn't have the same powers as Spiderman (AAAAARGHLBLARGLE)

The Tenno, from my perspective, actually do make gender specific suits. In my mind, what happens is only a certain amount of people in the Tenno culture, or Tenno sympathizers, or whatever, can by Nyx or Rhino or Mag etc.They have to be a certain personality type, build type, etc, and only then are they allowed to be Saryn or Loki or whomever they want.

 

So, in the game, we are simply swapping between several people, and when two or more of the same frame show up, it's just more people who are 'Loki,' or rather, the persona of 'Loki.'

 

See what I'm getting at?

Still less than ideal, but Caste Systems at least make sense. It's contradicted by bosses calling out our names and reference our Frames separately.

The current plan is to make separate frames with the same concept and naming scheme, but opposite sexed. A male fire-user named Blaze, a female trickster named Eris etc. I'd be OK with that if they didn't plan to give them separate powers. That's probably going to make things worse.

[Ghobe]

Where does it say there is only one of each frame?

Not trying to instigate anything man, just honestly curious.

I forget where they said it, but they said that each frame is a character(lore wise).

 

As to OP, they said that they will not implement straight up gender swaps, but they are not against having multiple genders having powers in similar areas with similar roles. So I'd say just give it time.

[Phatose]

I find this odd.

 

Really, take a good look at Ember,for instance.  If the main issue you have with seeing yourself as Ember is that it has breasts, and not that it looks like a cross between a rooster and one of the xenos from Alien, you have some very odd priorities.

[iCRIHFIELD]

I forget where they said it, but they said that each frame is a character(lore wise).

 

Bleh, I hope by that they mean there are still multiple of each kind of frame, just different individuals/characters inside.

I just feel like that's a little ridiculous if they're implying each Loki/Rhino/whatever frame is the same individual for each person playing the game.

 

Edit: Also they would have a hard time explaining how the Tenno operate in "cells" of four and have clans if there is only a literal handful of them.

Edited July 6, 2013 by iCRIHFIELD

[Tierria]

I'm okay with having male and female frames with the same theme, as long as they're not carbon copies of each other. Basically, they both take the same basic idea, and give it a unique spin. Like Ember's counterpart would be more of a long range "slow burn" rather than the inferno Ember's going for. Just an example of what I mean.

[theammostore]

Still less than ideal, but Caste Systems at least make sense. It's contradicted by bosses calling out our names and reference our Frames separately.

The current plan is to make separate frames with the same concept and naming scheme, but opposite sexed. A male fire-user named Blaze, a female trickster named Eris etc. I'd be OK with that if they didn't plan to give them separate powers. That's probably going to make things worse.

Well, what I'm suggesting is that the suits are suits and the people are people. Only certain people in the culture can be the persona of Loki, but not all of them are, they are still people with their own identities. That's the Tenno part. Then, the Warframe part is a second layer of personality, at the very least while on missions or on duty.

[Ghobe]

Bleh, I hope by that they mean there are still multiple of each kind of frame, just different individuals/characters inside.

I just feel like that's a little ridiculous if they're implying each Loki/Rhino/whatever frame is the same individual for each person playing the game.

 

Edit: Also they would have a hard time explaining how the Tenno operate in "cells" of four and have clans if there is only a literal handful of them.

From what they said each frame is a single person. There is only ONE of each frame and it's tied to the ONE person trained to use it.

 

As to 'odd to play a character in a ROLE PLAYING GAME', I believe you need to review what it means to play an RPG. Specifically the R.

 

EDIT: And keep in mind, the Tenno were extremely elite warriors trained to defend the universe and they've only recently been re-awoken.

 

And honestly I think it would be harder to explain why if there were millions of Tennos, why we don't just overrun any opponent using mass numbers instead /eyeroll

Edited July 6, 2013 by Ghobe

[iCRIHFIELD]

From what they said each frame is a single person. There is only ONE of each frame and it's tied to the ONE person trained to use it.

 

As to 'odd to play a character in a ROLE PLAYING GAME', I believe you need to review what it means to play an RPG. Specifically the R.

 

EDIT: And keep in mind, the Tenno were extremely elite warriors trained to defend the universe and they've only recently been re-awoken.

 

And honestly I think it would be harder to explain why if there were millions of Tennos, why we don't just overrun any opponent using mass numbers instead /eyeroll

 

Right, well I didn't mention anything about RPG's, not sure where you're getting that from bud, last time I checked Warframe wasn't an RPG either. I'm going off of the standpoint of if each person playing Loki is supposedly playing the same Loki then it becomes difficult to explain clans, Tenno cells, a zillion cryopod defense missions, and multiples of the same frame playing a mission. I just feel like it's a bad decision on DE's part to use that explanation.

 

Also as for Tenno overrunning everyone it could just be assumed that there is still more of everyone else than the Tenno(we don't have a number on how many tenno there are, or the numbers of Grineer/Corprus/Infested), on top of only a fraction of the Tenno awakening at the moment.

[ValhaHazred]

Also as for Tenno overrunning everyone it could just be assumed that there is still more of everyone else than the Tenno(we don't have a number on how many tenno there are, or the numbers of Grineer/Corprus/Infested), on top of only a fraction of the Tenno awakening at the moment.

Lets see, assuming an average population density of 20 people/km2 (which is super low btw, China is 140/km2), the inner system alone could support 159 billion people, and that isn't counting space stations, ships, and habitat domes. There's almost no limit depending on terraforming and micro-farming technologies.

The Grineer can replenish their numbers with rapid cloning technologies, the Corpus abduct and brainwash civilians and the Infected mutate the other factions.

If the Tenno = players we could kill non-stop for a thousand years and barely put a dent in those kind of numbers.

[Code_Grey]

Every thread on gender swapping is the same. There's the players against it, saying it's not in the lore etc. And then there's the people who somehow can't just accept that a Tenno is it's own character, not a blank slate. They have official bios and maybe even a backstory (I want to know what the development process was for the frames, how the Tenno inside were selected.)

 

Point is, Kyle Katarn is male. That's the official lore. Same should apply for Tenno. Just because you can't see their face doesn't mean they're not established characters.

[Doforcash]

well..u not the first one. STILL i never get tire of support this idea, IT'S JUST A SULT, NOT A PERSON

[Voltyr]

Every thread on gender swapping is the same. There's the players against it, saying it's not in the lore etc. And then there's the people who somehow can't just accept that a Tenno is it's own character, not a blank slate. They have official bios and maybe even a backstory (I want to know what the development process was for the frames, how the Tenno inside were selected.)

 

Point is, Kyle Katarn is male. That's the official lore. Same should apply for Tenno. Just because you can't see their face doesn't mean they're not established characters.

It doesn't really matter what the lore is though, does it? There's millions of Tenno running around forming gigantic clans which clearly clashes with the lore too, after all, so obviously the lore and the gameplay exist independently from each other in many ways. That is how DE have designed the game so far. So why would this same principle not apply to alt. gender warframes? The notion that the lore can be ignored by DE for one thing but not for another thing that their community desperately wants is absurd.

Edited July 6, 2013 by Voltyr

[arch111]

I thought a frame was a cybernetic shell.

Frame = you can build on it and add to it.

The appearance is more sculpted and possibly organic.

Is it not more plausable that Tenno is cyborgs, that is why they can jump between

female males and females.

The frame is unique to a certain tennos dna, but

But there are of course multiple frames of the same model.

Make sense? No? Why?

Anyways, where is all this lore? I want to know, but where do i find it?

[Dtexas]

DE mentioned that there is only one of each frame lore wise because they are people(or Tenno whichever you want to use) not just characters or classes like in other mmo games. This was mentioned either in one of the livestreams (#5,6 or 7) or it was mentioned at E3 during one of the interviews Steve did. (For gametrailers I think)

[Voltyr]

DE mentioned that there is only one of each frame lore wise because they are people(or Tenno whichever you want to use) not just characters or classes like in other mmo games. This was mentioned either in one of the livestreams (#5,6 or 7) or it was mentioned at E3 during one of the interviews Steve did. (For gametrailers I think)

Correct.

I wonder why those who oppose the idea of alt. gender warframes use that as an argument though? I mean, DE has broken their own lore on numerous occasions to benefit the game. For instance, in a Dojo you can walk around with like 10 of the same warframes. This is in direct conflict with their claim that warframes are single, unique characters. They did it all the same though, because it benefitted the game. Nobody would like having to queue for Dojo access just because there's another player with the same warframe in there, after all.

So similarly, what does it matter if there are alt.  gender warframes? Sure in canon they'd still be uniqe persons with their own bios and backstory, but in fanon they could be whatever they player wants them to be, much like how in canon there is only one of each frame but in game-terms there are many thousands.

Edited July 6, 2013 by Voltyr

[Code_Grey]

DE mentioned that there is only one of each frame lore wise because they are people(or Tenno whichever you want to use) not just characters or classes like in other mmo games. This was mentioned either in one of the livestreams (#5,6 or 7) or it was mentioned at E3 during one of the interviews Steve did. (For gametrailers I think)

 

This. That's what people are failing to understand. You can't genderswap Gordon Freeman for this reason. Can't make a Gruntilda Freeman.

[Xievie]

This shouldn't happen.

 

It's been talked to death about gender changing and giving the warframes voices, but where the hell is the creativity in that?

[Code_Grey]

Correct.

I wonder why those who oppose the idea of alt. gender warframes use that as an argument though? I mean, DE has broken their own lore on numerous occasions to benefit the game. For instance, in a Dojo you can walk around with like 10 of the same warframes. This is in direct conflict with their claim that warframes are single, unique characters. They did it all the same though, because it benefitted the game. Nobody would like having to queue for Dojo access just because there's another player with the same warframe in there, after all.

So similarly, what does it matter if there are alt.  gender warframes? Sure in canon they'd still be uniqe persons with their own bios and backstory, but in fanon they could be whatever they player wants them to be, much like how in canon there is only one of each frame but in game-terms there are many thousands.

 

 

Should DE only allow one of each frame to be logged on at any time too? Wouldn't be true to the lore if two Mags were in the galaxy at the same time. Team Fortress 2, there's only two of each class (One for each side, totalling eighteen.) But for gameplay reasons, more are allowed, deviating from the lore. And note, for -gameplay- reasons. Gender is cosmetic, by extension meaningless, by extension not a good excuse to deviate from the lore.

[Voltyr]

This. That's what people are failing to understand. You can't genderswap Gordon Freeman for this reason. Can't make a Gruntilda Freeman.

Don't know if that's a great example, but I get what you're trying to say. You can't change a character, because it would then no longer be the same character.

Now imagine that there'd be a Gruntilda Freeman as a skin in Half Life: Deathmatch though. Would that in any way impact the game? I think it would, but only in a positive way. Because in that enviroment, the lore ceases to be important. In that enviroment, characters aren't their unique selves because there is no story around them and they can be replaced with any other character that has the same abilities.In that enviroment, all it does is add an aesthetic choice for players.

And unless every mission is going to get a detailed story in which each character is utterly unique and irreplaceable, that is the enviroment that most of Warframe takes place in.